The"Crap, it didn't happen..but it was awesome to think of" thread - Page 102 - Dallas-Mavs.com Forums

OneLove22 · 07-03-2012, 07:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jthig32

I almost wonder if this isn't a leak from the Nets trying to convince Deron that they will have the ability to improve. Is that crazy? It is, isn't it?

I could see it. They seem desperate.

CanadianMavsFan · 07-03-2012, 07:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OneLove22

Too many factors? As far as I can see this Howard trade is the one thing that would make me think he is going to Brooklyn. I'm not convinced the JJ trade will bring him there.

I'm aware I'm trying to talk myself into not believing this crap. Becoming a bit of a doomsayer. I've just had it with guys requesting trades to certain teams and forcing the hands of others, severely weakening the options they have.

It makes the league looks even worse than it already does in some people's eyes. 99% of the players in the league right now have ZERO class.

oilfieldtrash · 07-03-2012, 07:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JeffViggiano

Are we missing something? Everything for a week or so has been Nets, Nets, Nets... Not even a hint of Dallas. The Nets are now making a trade that appears to have Deron's approval. I mean why is he approving trades for a team that he won't be on? Writing has been on the wall but we're only seeing that wall through Blue tinted glasses I'm afraid. Lets just hear the official announcement so we can move on....

CapitanObvious · 07-03-2012, 07:22 AM

Sigh being a Mavs fan sure is frustrating sometimes

CapitanObvious · 07-03-2012, 07:27 AM

Quote:

The source noted that the Mavs could send the Magic some combination of the expiring contracts of Rodrigue Beaubois, Vince Carter, Dominique Jones and Brandan Wright, and rookies Jared Cunningham, Bernard James and Jae Crowder, plus draft picks and involve Ian Mahinmi in a sign-and-trade for Howard.

Read this somewhere. Its for d12. After this move. would there be room for D.will?

Bayliss · 07-03-2012, 07:37 AM

Steve Kyler ‏ @ stevekylerNBA
Hearing Dallas has been aggressive regarding Dwight Howard too... willing to give their entire draft to Orlando along with ending deals.

Underdog · 07-03-2012, 07:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jthig32

I almost wonder if this isn't a leak from the Nets trying to convince Deron that they will have the ability to improve. Is that crazy? It is, isn't it?

You're not the only one thinking this way...

Quote:

Tony Mejia: No, I don't believe deal w/ Brook Lopez as centerpiece and 3 future first-rounders in 20s gets it done for Dwight. Not unless KGB involved

Quote:

Michael Dugat: This has to be a posturing leak, right? For this to work, Orlando would be bending over backwards to help Nets at their own expense

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Ken Berger: The Brooklyn scenario isn't imminent, and it isn't the only one Orlando is working on, sources say

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Ryan Wolstat: If I get offered Al Horford and Jeff Teague plus picks, I take that and run. Waaaay better than what Nets can offer

Quote:

Ken Berger: Orlando GM Rob Hennigan also trying to engage the Hawks, Rockets, Lakers and possibly Mavs in Howard talks. Full-court press

CapitanObvious · 07-03-2012, 07:51 AM

If Dwight somehow end up in Dallas. Will there be cap room for Deron?

oilfieldtrash · 07-03-2012, 07:52 AM

You know I believe the mavs would be one of 3 teams that could win a title next year with D12. With Deron I think we're the fun to watch 50 win teams that loses in the second round.

FINtastic · 07-03-2012, 07:52 AM

I saw where Broussard corrected his tweet to show that it would involve 2013, 2015, 2017. Did I miss the CBA suddenly changing the rules to allow you to trade 1st rounders two years in a row or does Broussard still not know what he's talking about?

jthig32 · 07-03-2012, 07:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CapitanObvious

If Dwight somehow end up in Dallas. Will there be cap room for Deron?

No, because there's no way they trade for Dwight without also taking back Hedo or some other contractes the Magic want to unload.

Underdog · 07-03-2012, 07:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CapitanObvious

If Dwight somehow end up in Dallas. Will there be cap room for Deron?

If Dwight came to Dallas, it would be through a trade that gives up about the same cap space that we'd be getting back - so yes, there should be room for Deron, depending on how everything went down (assuming it goes down...)

jthig32 · 07-03-2012, 07:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FINtastic

I saw where Broussard corrected his tweet to show that it would involve 2013, 2015, 2017. Did I miss the CBA suddenly changing the rules to allow you to trade 1st rounders two years in a row or does Broussard still not know what he's talking about?

That rule only applies to future picks. The fact that the Nets traded their 2012 pick doesn't affect anything at this point.

CapitanObvious · 07-03-2012, 07:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Underdog

If Dwight came to Dallas, it would be through a trade that gives up about the same cap space that we'd be getting back - so yes, there should be room for Deron, depending on how everything went down (assuming it goes down...)

Thanks, I kinda suck with these money rules and numbers. I just go all balls crazy and cheer for the MAVS every game. (At home of course LOL)

FINtastic · 07-03-2012, 07:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bayliss

Steve Kyler ‏ @ stevekylerNBA
Hearing Dallas has been aggressive regarding Dwight Howard too... willing to give their entire draft to Orlando along with ending deals.

Does any of that really excite Orlando though? I think I'd rather take some of the hypothetical Nets deals, to be honest.

FINtastic · 07-03-2012, 08:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jthig32

That rule only applies to future picks. The fact that the Nets traded their 2012 pick doesn't affect anything at this point.

Okay makes sense.

jthig32 · 07-03-2012, 08:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FINtastic

Does any of that really excite Orlando though? I think I'd rather take some of the hypothetical Nets deals, to be honest.

No, it doesn't.

oilfieldtrash · 07-03-2012, 08:04 AM

I truly hope Deron didnt stiff us for the Brooklyn Nets and Joe Johnson. lol.

Murphy3 · 07-03-2012, 08:05 AM

Good God no.. It cannot excite the magic in the least. However, they should be able to manage more than what the Nets are offering although I do like Lopez.

Underdog · 07-03-2012, 08:06 AM

Quote:

Adrian Wojnarowski: For Nets-Magic to progress on a Dwight Howard deal, a 3rd team needed to take Kris Humphries in a sign-and-trade, league source tells Y!

So the Nets need to find TWO teams that are willing to bend over backwards to turn Brooklyn into an unbeatable powerhouse? Good luck with all that, fellas...

jthig32 · 07-03-2012, 08:06 AM

I feel pretty strongly that just this frenzy alone is enough to be the nail in the coffin on Deron. All this buzz is going to counter act any arguments the Mavs made yesterday about Johnson killing their ability to improve.

Kante · 07-03-2012, 08:07 AM

I don't want Howard in Dallas.

Five-ofan · 07-03-2012, 08:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FINtastic

Does any of that really excite Orlando though? I think I'd rather take some of the hypothetical Nets deals, to be honest.

Lopez resigned at what he's going to cost is a negative asset. Same for humphries. They'd honestly be better of letting Howard walk for nothing then taking the nets deal.

jthig32 · 07-03-2012, 08:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Five-ofan

Lopez resigned at what he's going to cost is a negative asset. Same for humphries. They'd honestly be better of letting Howard walk for nothing then taking the nets deal.

Hump has to end up somewhere else, according to Woj. I still agree that Lopez on a huge 4 year deal is stupid.

Five-ofan · 07-03-2012, 08:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jthig32

Hump has to end up somewhere else, according to Woj. I still agree that Lopez on a huge 4 year deal is stupid.

I just don't see it happening. If you make that trade you are guaranteeing that those picks are terrible picks. Deron Jj Wallace and Lopez is a decent but not special core. Add Howard to that mix though and it's among the best teams in basketball though. I still don't see how this trade works under the salary cap though.

jthig32 · 07-03-2012, 08:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Five-ofan

I just don't see it happening. If you make that trade you are guaranteeing that those picks are terrible picks. Deron Jj Wallace and Lopez is a decent but not special core. Add Howard to that mix though and it's among the best teams in basketball though. I still don't see how this trade works under the salary cap though.

The salary cap doesn't have anything to do with it. Would be an over cap deal. They have to match salaries.

DevinHarriswillstart · 07-03-2012, 08:25 AM

Oh goodie, more optimism this morning...not. Well the good news is that the NBA is ridiculously unpredictable so I guess we'll see...

If we got Dwight and not Deron, then I'd be fine with that. If both of them go to Brooklyn though...anything but that.

Skywalker · 07-03-2012, 08:43 AM

Murphy3 · 07-03-2012, 08:56 AM

Interesting..
Even if the Nets had Howard, Johnson, and Williams, I don't think the team is good enough late in the 4th quarter of games to win a title. As Mavs fans, we know how important it is to have a go to guy or two late in games. Howard isn't that guy in my opinion.

oilfieldtrash · 07-03-2012, 08:57 AM

This is gonna be good... Total chaos or jubilation.

endrity · 07-03-2012, 09:03 AM

Even Hollinger thinks this Howard to Brooklyn story is more smoke than fire.

Underdog · 07-03-2012, 09:09 AM

If Orlando is faced with losing Howard anyway, wouldn't a straight-up trade for Andrew Bynum still be the best offer on the table?

Underdog · 07-03-2012, 09:13 AM

Quote:

Bill Simmons: I'm stunned that Orlando isn't crazy about trading the league's 3rd best player for 3 non All-Stars and 3 crappy picks

Underdog · 07-03-2012, 09:22 AM

Quote:

Mike Fisher: details: #Mavs DO NOT have permission to talk directly w Dwight. Dallas (and others) talking to Orl, not to player

Well, at least we're talking to the decision-makers in this process...

dude1394 · 07-03-2012, 09:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Murphy3

Interesting..
Even if the Nets had Howard, Johnson, and Williams, I don't think the team is good enough late in the 4th quarter of games to win a title. As Mavs fans, we know how important it is to have a go to guy or two late in games. Howard isn't that guy in my opinion.

Wouldn't Williams be the guy?

Underdog · 07-03-2012, 09:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dude1394

Wouldn't Williams be the guy?

That's one-less "the guy" than he'd have in Dallas...

endrity · 07-03-2012, 09:36 AM

I am actually more stunned that few teams choose the OKC approach but instead try to save face by accepting crappy players and picks.

If you're Orlando, wouldn't it be best to just blow it up and get maybe one or two picks that you know will be good. Why accept players that will keep you mediocre but compromise your cap structure anyway?

I'd rather be sure to have 4-5 top 10 picks in the next 3 years than fill my team with the Kris Humphries of the world.

Bayliss · 07-03-2012, 09:39 AM

Quote:

I am actually more stunned that few teams choose the OKC approach but instead try to save face by accepting crappy players and picks.

If you're Orlando, wouldn't it be best to just blow it up and get maybe one or two picks that you know will be good. Why accept players that will keep you mediocre but compromise your cap structure anyway?

I'd rather be sure to have 4-5 top 10 picks in the next 3 years than fill my team with the Kris Humphries of the world.

Because OKC got really lucky in what they did. They drafted Durant, but STILL sucked. Then they got Westbrook. But still sucked. Then they got Ibaka and still sucked. Then they got Harden.

They sucked for about 5 years straight. Most teams that draft a player like Durant's caliber don't immediately get another lottery pick for awhile. (See the Cavs for instance....)

Murphy3 · 07-03-2012, 09:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dude1394

Wouldn't Williams be the guy?

He'd have to be.. but, I'd prefer that guy not be the point guard. I'd prefer the PG have another really good option. Dwight Howard is a beast, but he doesn't do all that much for me late in games. Joe Johnson's a nice player that's probably going to get to the Free Throw line less and less.. It's not like he gets there alot now as it is... So, he's going to be a spot up jump shooter? You've got Deron breaking down the defenses and dishing to a spot up jump shooter (which is important to have).. or dishing to Howard only to see him get hacked and miss free throws down the stretch? Who's the guy that consistently kills you late in games? Obviously no one does it night in and night out, but there are no Dirk's on that team.. no Bryant's.. No Durant's.. no Wade's or LeBron's (God I hate to say that). It's would be a very nice team that would get beaten late in games as the playoffs progressed.

endrity · 07-03-2012, 09:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bayliss

Because OKC got really lucky in what they did. They drafted Durant, but STILL sucked. Then they got Westbrook. But still sucked. Then they got Ibaka and still sucked. Then they got Harden.

They sucked for about 5 years straight. Most teams that draft a player like Durant's caliber don't immediately get another lottery pick for awhile. (See the Cavs for instance....)

Wasn't Ibaka part of the Westrbook draft? So that's three years of sucking. Actually two really, bottomed out to take Durant and then with him there were two more really bad years. After that they took off.

The point is though that most teams will suck for a bit even if they acquire that kind of talent. Cleveland didn't make the playoffs in a crappy East even with LeBron for two years straight. And they had much more veteran talent in their team.

But it was arguably the presence of that veteran talent that prohibited them from ever becoming great. After LeBron they never had another top pick because that veteran talent was good enough to keep them mediocre as LeBron was still growing, but never more than that to truly help him contend.

Unless you are getting 1997 Duncan (and who stays 4 years in school anymore really?) even the best talent will struggle for a couple of years