2008 Cowboys Off-season Thread - Page 12 - Dallas-Mavs.com Forums

ty · 04-27-2008, 02:41 PM

Barber's not going anywhere...

jthig32 · 04-27-2008, 02:42 PM

If the Cowboys were going to trade Barber they would've taken Mendenhall instead of Felix Jones. That seems fairly obvious based on Jerry's comments during the press conference yesterday.

Five-ofan · 04-27-2008, 02:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jthig32

If the Cowboys were going to trade Barber they would've taken Mendenhall instead of Felix Jones. That seems fairly obvious based on Jerry's comments during the press conference yesterday.

i agree with this. im just saying i think dan was VASTLY underestimating one of the cowboys assets when he talked about trading barber and a first for boldin.

Underdog · 04-27-2008, 02:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jthig32

If the Cowboys were going to trade Barber they would've taken Mendenhall instead of Felix Jones. That seems fairly obvious based on Jerry's comments during the press conference yesterday.

If Dallas was going to trade Barber, McFadden would be wearing a Cowboys jersey...

Male30Dan · 04-27-2008, 02:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Five-ofan

lt-agree
peterson-agree
westbrook-agree
parker-disagree dont like homerun hitters with a 4.1 ypc average. doesnt do alot for me
portis-hell no these days. 3.9 ypc? seriously
mcgahee-hell no. personally i think hes one of the most overrated backs in the league. mb3 has 2 less career tds than mcgahee. and mcgahee has a career 3.9 ypc
gore- dont want to gamble on those knees
jackson-no question whatsoever, i agree
taylor-agree though he has as many age and durability issues as anyone in the nfl
mcfadden-we really going to count a guy who has never played an nfl down and couldnt hold onto the ball in college?

if andre johnson had ever had anything resembling a qb or passing game hed be right there with to and moss for being known as the best receivers in the nfl.

id add brandon jacobs to your list of backs better than mb3 btw. and im planning on the next 3 years, and for 3 years id definitely take holt and probably harrison. as for james and lewis its a mute point since barber is better than both.

Parker, Portis, and McGahee are all better than Barber. I love me some Barber but Goddamn do you overrate his ass. He got all of his carries against guys that had played 2-4 series while he was fresh as a new born babies ass. Sure he averaged more per carry doing that, who wouldn't in that scenario. Gore is a gamble, but damn is he good when healthy and you know it. So you wouldn't have traded MB3 straight up to draft McFadden if it would have been accepted? You damn right I am counting him.

Don't you think that Boldin would be amazing too if you put him with Brady? Do you think Arizona has put many QBs in the hall of fame? Come on man.

Look, I love Barber for what he brings to the table. He is a change of pace back and a hell of a competitor. With that said, he is NOT a top 10 back. Maybe he proves to be next year, but right now that is just ridiculous, regardless of any bull shit pro bowl vote. Boldin is a damn stud and I would love to have him on the team when you look at our needs. That is why I would make the trade. Needs. We NEED a young stud WR and don't at RB with these two guys drafted. They are calling Barber and F. Jones already Thunder and Lighting. Just plug Choice in there for the Thunder and Get your new lightning with Boldin if you ask me.

Underdog · 04-27-2008, 02:46 PM

How many running backs made it to the Pro Bowl last year?

I noticed one of them was named "Barber"...

LonghornDub · 04-27-2008, 02:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chumdawg

If they said the same stuff about TO, they were wrong. Dude is a player.

Would I complain if the charlatan came to the Cowboys? No. I generally defer to Jerry Jones about all things Cowboys, and if it's good for him it's good for me. But in this case I'm quite happy that Jones didn't get duped by the sham that is Chad Johnson.

I guarantee if CJ came to the Cowboys, you'd get over that pretty fast. I have a feeling the ensuing 15-1 season and likely Super Bowl victory would change your mind.

Male30Dan · 04-27-2008, 02:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Five-ofan

i agree with this. im just saying i think dan was VASTLY underestimating one of the cowboys assets when he talked about trading barber and a first for boldin.

I don't at all. I absolutely don't. I think so many, (oh my god so many), vastly OVERRATE him. Hopefully I am wrong and hopefully he becomes a 1,500 yard back while still maintaining that amazing ypc he has. If so, pay the man his money. In the end, I think he is a part time back that thrives in that roll and he could never carry the load like so many on that list I provided while keeping that ypc average so high.

I guess we will all see though because this is all speculation. I just think with our team another stud WR joined with Jones and Choice would make us better than keeping Barber and starting TO and Crayton.

Male30Dan · 04-27-2008, 02:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Underdog

How many running backs made it to the Pro Bowl last year?

I noticed one of them was named "Barber"...

I KNEW someone was going to throw this out... Hahahaha... So did Roy Fucking Williams. Now go hide under your desk and slap yourself 10 good times.

Underdog · 04-27-2008, 02:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ProdigyDub

I guarantee if CJ came to the Cowboys, you'd get over that pretty fast. I have a feeling the ensuing 15-1 season and likely Super Bowl victory would change your mind.

There aren't enough downs in the game of football to get both Ownes & Johnson the amount of passes they'd want (even if we never ran the ball...)

Underdog · 04-27-2008, 02:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Male26Dan

I KNEW someone was going to throw this out... Hahahaha... So did Roy Fucking Williams. Now go hide under your desk and slap yourself 10 good times.

You knew someone would throw that out there because it's the only rational way to measure "talent" - it's not like anyone owed a backup RB a slot on the Pro Bowl squad...

Roy Williams slid in because he happens to play a weak position in the league - there's no shortage of talented running backs...

Male30Dan · 04-27-2008, 02:52 PM

Yeah, I would welcome Johnson, but I kind of agree. He is scary with TO.

Male30Dan · 04-27-2008, 02:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Underdog

You knew someone would throw that out there because it's the only rational way to measure "talent" - it's not like anyone owed a backup RB a slot on the Pro Bowl squad...

Roy Williams slid in because he happens to play a weak position in the league - there's no shortage of talented running backs...

Yeah, thats it. And the other 11 COWBOYS players all deserved to go, right.

JamesVE · 04-27-2008, 02:54 PM

Have I missed a newsflash somewhere? When/where did Barber demand or indicate that he would demand LT money?

LonghornDub · 04-27-2008, 02:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Underdog

There aren't enough downs in the game of football to get both Ownes & Johnson the amount of passes they'd want (even if we never ran the ball...)

You don't think decimating opponents by 20 points every week would curtail both of their individual desires a bit? It sure did with TO this year. He had a few games where he didn't catch many passes, but he didn't complain because the 'Boys won.

I don't know what Chad's current contract is, but I"m sure that he could exist here for 1 season without causing any major problems. And that'd probably be one Super Bowl victory, at which point we can get rid of him once he starts to inevitably become a nuisance.

Underdog · 04-27-2008, 02:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Male26Dan

Yeah, thats it. And the other 11 COWBOYS players all deserved to go, right.

Actually, yes...

Male30Dan · 04-27-2008, 02:54 PM

We are America's team. We get more recognition than any other team. Barber had 3 or 4 AMAZING plays and those three things got him into the Pro-Bowl. He has never had one thousand yards in his life but this son-of-a-B is a top 7 back. Damn guys, really?

Five-ofan · 04-27-2008, 02:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Male26Dan

Parker, Portis, and McGahee are all better than Barber. I love me some Barber but Goddamn do you overrate his ass. He got all of his carries against guys that had played 2-4 series while he was fresh as a new born babies ass. Sure he averaged more per carry doing that, who wouldn't in that scenario. Gore is a gamble, but damn is he good when healthy and you know it. So you wouldn't have traded MB3 straight up to draft McFadden if it would have been accepted? You damn right I am counting him.

Don't you think that Boldin would be amazing too if you put him with Brady? Do you think Arizona has put many QBs in the hall of fame? Come on man.

Look, I love Barber for what he brings to the table. He is a change of pace back and a hell of a competitor. With that said, he is NOT a top 10 back. Maybe he proves to be next year, but right now that is just ridiculous, regardless of any bull shit pro bowl vote. Boldin is a damn stud and I would love to have him on the team when you look at our needs. That is why I would make the trade. Needs. We NEED a young stud WR and don't at RB with these two guys drafted. They are calling Barber and F. Jones already Thunder and Lighting. Just plug Choice in there for the Thunder and Get your new lightning with Boldin if you ask me.

i already said id probably do it one for one. the problem i had is you said youd throw in a first which is just incredibly stupid. i agree about the pro bowl voting. i ignore it when i tell you how much roy williams sucks, so it would be hypocritical to use it now that it supports my argument. what the hell are you talking about when you mention brady? are you seriously saying youd take him over moss? and mb3 had a great game against one of the best front 7s in the business as the starter in the playoffs. he can play. mcgahee just isnt very good. and no i wouldnt have done the mcfadden trade straight up. i know im the only one but i wouldnt have. gore was amazing when norv turner was his offensive coordinator. just like every rb that has ever had norv as a coordinator was. see lamont jordan. portis doesnt do anything for me these days. i used to love him, but he has become injury prone and im not sure they wouldnt be better off benching him for betts. parker is a question of styles. id rather my number one back be the all around/between the tackles guy and my change of pace guy be the speed guy instead of reversing those roles.

Male30Dan · 04-27-2008, 02:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Underdog

Actually, yes...

Under the desk yet?

Male30Dan · 04-27-2008, 02:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Underdog

Actually, yes...

Marge called, can you pick up Bart from school today?

Underdog · 04-27-2008, 02:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ProdigyDub

You don't think decimating opponents by 20 points every week would curtail both of their individual desires a bit? It sure did with TO this year. He had a few games where he didn't catch many passes, but he didn't complain because the 'Boys won.

I don't know what Chad's current contract is, but I"m sure that he could exist here for 1 season without causing any major problems. And that'd probably be one Super Bowl victory, at which point we can get rid of him once he starts to inevitably become a nuisance.

I'd rather have a long-term solution like Roy Williams (UT) - no need to gamble on Johnson when we already have T.O., Pacman, and Tank to deal with...

Not that I'd complain if he came here...

LonghornDub · 04-27-2008, 02:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Underdog

I'd rather have a long-term solution like Roy Williams (UT) - no need to gamble on Johnson when we already have T.O., Pacman, and Tank to deal with...

Not that I'd complain if he came here...

Well hey man, nobody's gotta sell me on good Roy, for obvious reasons. I'm down. Boldin would be a similarly terrific addition.

Underdog · 04-27-2008, 02:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Male26Dan

Marge called, can you pick up Bart from school today?

I never seen you act like a bitch on this board before - Marion Barber really gets under your skin, huh?

jthig32 · 04-27-2008, 02:58 PM

Yeah, let's take it easy on the Barber love. Let's let him carry the load for a full game and still be able to pick up blitzes in the second half before declaring him top ten anything.

And let's please not use Pro Bowl to justify anyone's status. TNew made the Pro Bowl for the first time last season, no?

Male30Dan · 04-27-2008, 03:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Five-ofan

i already said id probably do it one for one. the problem i had is you said youd throw in a first which is just incredibly stupid. i agree about the pro bowl voting. i ignore it when i tell you how much roy williams sucks, so it would be hypocritical to use it now that it supports my argument. what the hell are you talking about when you mention brady? are you seriously saying youd take him over moss? and mb3 had a great game against one of the best front 7s in the business as the starter in the playoffs. he can play. mcgahee just isnt very good. and no i wouldnt have done the mcfadden trade straight up. i know im the only one but i wouldnt have. gore was amazing when norv turner was his offensive coordinator. just like every rb that has ever had norv as a coordinator was. see lamont jordan. portis doesnt do anything for me these days. i used to love him, but he has become injury prone and im not sure they wouldnt be better off benching him for betts. parker is a question of styles. id rather my number one back be the all around/between the tackles guy and my change of pace guy be the speed guy instead of reversing those roles.

But that is what I mean... Doing it 1 for 1 is a RIDICULOUS yes for this team. CRAZY! You would HAVE to give them the 1 or at LEAST a 2 to make them bite. Again, with this team and our pass mentality I would take my chances with a Choice/Jones RB tandem and TO/Boldin before I would with Barber/Jones/Choice at RB and TO/Crayton at WR, even if it meant losing the LAST first round pick in the draft while having a 2nd, two 3rds, and two 4ths next year.

Male30Dan · 04-27-2008, 03:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Underdog

I never seen you act like a bitch on this board before - Marion Barber really gets under your skin, huh?

No, I love him, but I hate dumb asses like you that over value a backup RB that may or may not be able to carry the load.

GuerillaBlack · 04-27-2008, 03:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Male26Dan

We are America's team. We get more recognition than any other team. Barber had 3 or 4 AMAZING plays and those three things got him into the Pro-Bowl. He has never had one thousand yards in his life but this son-of-a-B is a top 7 back. Damn guys, really?

I don't know. The America's Team moniker is kind of dying now don't you think? The bandwagoners jump on and off the Cowboys bandwagon throughout the season.

Underdog · 04-27-2008, 03:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Male26Dan

No, I love him, but I hate dumb asses like you that over value a backup RB that may or may not be able to carry the load.

When did I overvalue him?

I think I understand his value exactly - I'M not the person who claimed he's top-7, though I wouldn't give him up in favor of handing our running game over to rookies just so we can add to our already-stacked receiving corps...

Male30Dan · 04-27-2008, 03:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jthig32

Yeah, let's take it easy on the Barber love. Let's let him carry the load for a full game and still be able to pick up blitzes in the second half before declaring him top ten anything.

And let's please not use Pro Bowl to justify anyone's status. TNew made the Pro Bowl for the first time last season, no?

Sigh...

Glad you said full GAME, because that is all you could say, isn't it? My point is the Pro Bowl always picks guys non deserving and that whole bull shit pat yourself on the back award to rate players is ridiculous. Sure, some deserving players go that should have been on the team years before, (Newman), but for the most part it is a popularity contest. When you make 5-7 guys miss while taking yourself from out of the end zone back in and run 50 yards to get 10, you make the team.

jthig32 · 04-27-2008, 03:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Underdog

When did I overvalue him?

I think I understand his value exactly - I'M not the person who claimed he's top-7, though I wouldn't give him up in favor of handing our running game over to rookies just so we can add to our already-stacked receiving corps...

Our already stacked receiving corps??

Huh??

I don't think I would trade a first+Barber for Boldin, but come on. Our RB situation is now easily more deep than our WR group. RB's are much, much easier to find, and contirbute much, much sooner after being drafted.

Five-ofan · 04-27-2008, 03:06 PM

honestly when i evaluate football players i go by what i see and then check the stats when someone makes me question what my eyes tell me. i do think mb3 is a little overrated by a bunch of cowboys fans but im definitely not overrating him as much as you are boldin. you mention barber has never had to be "the man" thats a bigger problem for a receiver because you defend rbs the same way whether they start or not. you dont defend number 1 and number 2 receivers and boldin has always been a number 2 to fitz.(which isnt as big a deal because of TO here but in terms of evaluating him as a player its important)

Male30Dan · 04-27-2008, 03:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Underdog

When did I overvalue him?

I think I understand his value exactly - I'M not the person who claimed he's top-7, though I wouldn't give him up in favor of handing our running game over to rookies just so we can add to our already-stacked receiving corps...

Making yourself look more and more foolish all the time. Other than Chum, (sorry buddy, but you love you some Stanback and if he has caught more passes than I have fingers - on one hand - I would be very suprised), who here thinks our receiving corps are stacked?

Underdog · 04-27-2008, 03:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Male26Dan

Making yourself look more and more foolish all the time. Other than Chum, (sorry buddy, but you love you some Stanback and if he has caught more passes than I have fingers - on one hand - I would be very suprised), who here thinks our receiving corps are stacked?

Jerry Jones

GuerillaBlack · 04-27-2008, 03:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GuerillaBlack

I don't know. The America's Team moniker is kind of dying now don't you think? The bandwagoners jump on and off the Cowboys bandwagon throughout the season.

Actually, I take back what I said. The Cowboys, along with the Patriots, are "America's Teams". You either absolutely love them (so you watch), or absolutely hate them and want them to lose (so you watch).

By the way, Marion Barber's little brother got drafted by the Texans. Didn't know Marion had a little brother. He plays FS.

Five-ofan · 04-27-2008, 03:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Male26Dan

Sigh...

Glad you said full GAME, because that is all you could say, isn't it? My point is the Pro Bowl always picks guys non deserving and that whole bull shit pat yourself on the back award to rate players is ridiculous. Sure, some deserving players go that should have been on the team years before, (Newman), but for the most part it is a popularity contest. When you make 5-7 guys miss while taking yourself from out of the end zone back in and run 50 yards to get 10, you make the team.

i actually hated that run. he made like 2 yards and if he hadnt gone backwards he wouldnt have had to do all that stuff. and i agree about the pro bowl stuff. i think you are severely underrating the value of the draft pick at this point. players just dont bring number 1 picks these days. they damn sure dont bring an equivalent player and a number 1 pick.

jthig32 · 04-27-2008, 03:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Five-ofan

honestly when i evaluate football players i go by what i see and then check the stats when someone makes me question what my eyes tell me. i do think mb3 is a little overrated by a bunch of cowboys fans but im definitely not overrating him as much as you are boldin. you mention barber has never had to be "the man" thats a bigger problem for a receiver because you defend rbs the same way whether they start or not. you dont defend number 1 and number 2 receivers and boldin has always been a number 2 to fitz.(which isnt as big a deal because of TO here but in terms of evaluating him as a player its important)

Boldin had a pretty darn nice season while Fitz was still in college dude.

Male30Dan · 04-27-2008, 03:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jthig32

Our already stacked receiving corps??

Huh??

I don't think I would trade a first+Barber for Boldin, but come on. Our RB situation is now easily more deep than our WR group. RB's are much, much easier to find, and contirbute much, much sooner after being drafted.

It is a tough call, for sure. It is a lot to give up but I would do it because of how our team is now. That is the only position I would trade Barber and a 1st for to get a top 6-8 position player, but I would. I would absolutely do it for Barber and a 2nd, but I don't think Arizona would.

Oh, and with Arizona, it really is 1a and 1b. Fitz isn't THAT much better than Boldin. Their best years are absolute mirrors of each other.

Five-ofan · 04-27-2008, 03:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jthig32

Boldin had a pretty darn nice season while Fitz was still in college dude.

i know. he had one of the best rookie seasons by a receiver in a while other than moss. i still dont think hes remotely a top 6-8 receiver.

Male30Dan · 04-27-2008, 03:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Five-ofan

i actually hated that run. he made like 2 yards and if he hadnt gone backwards he wouldnt have had to do all that stuff. and i agree about the pro bowl stuff. i think you are severely underrating the value of the draft pick at this point. players just dont bring number 1 picks these days. they damn sure dont bring an equivalent player and a number 1 pick.

Well sure, it was a TERRIBLE decision, but that is what gets you into the Pro Bowl. Big plays like that which end up #1 on the Sportscenter Top 10. That pick will be the 32nd pick of the draft if the trade happens. I will give that HIGH second and Barber to get Boldin, but again, that is just my opinion.

Male30Dan · 04-27-2008, 03:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Five-ofan

i know. he had one of the best rookie seasons by a receiver in a while other than moss. i still dont think hes remotely a top 6-8 receiver.

But you think Fitz. is right? And was that not a time when he was THE man?