Artest

[ddh33]

Since his name keeps coming up, I thought I would throw out some various 2 team deals...

Stack and Jet for Artest and Kenny Thomas. I don't know if Sacramento wants Jet's contract, and I don't know if the Mavs feel like losing two of their top 7 for one player who has plenty of questions.

Josh, and Stack for Artest, Garcia, and Thomas. Dallas takes on a nasty salary to make this work, and they deal the best asset in the trade. That ought to be worth Garcia.

Josh and Bass for Artest and Garcia. The Kings get even more over-loaded up front with less depth in the backcourt. The Mavs get lighter up front and more overloaded at guard. So I'm not crazy about it. Throw in Eddie Jones and Shelden Williams, and you might have something...

Jet, Stack, and Eddie Jones for Ron, Kenny Thomas, and Shelden Williams. Bass could be added, but again, I think the Mavs are giving up too much in this kind of deal. Leaving Bass out of it makes it easier for me. You're still losing two rotational players, and you might only be getting one back though. That's steep. Substituting Garcia for Shelden appeals more to me, but it might be too much for the Kings.

Josh and Eddie Jones for Ron Artest, Garcia, Shelden Williams. Dallas is giving the best asset in this deal, and they are probably going to be spending some money, so they get more talent. The Kings are pretty deep up front with young players, and Shelden isn't their guy anyway. So they open up some minutes for kids like Hawes and Thompson, they get rid of Artest, and it costs them Garcia.

Maybe taking that idea and simplifying it, you could deal Josh and Eddie Jones for Ron and Salmons. Maybe the Kings like Garcia more than Salmons, so they cut off Salmon's extra years, and they come away with a respectable deal for Artest.

To simplify it even more, you might check into Josh for Artest and Garcia. If that was too rich for the Kings, they might be more interested in dealing Shelden Williams in Garcia's place.


So which deals did I miss or forget? What do you like, if any?

[jthig32]

We've kicked several scenarios around in another thread. Personally, I don't think the Mavs are trading Howard for Artest, and I don't think the Kings want Terry and his contract.

So really, you're looking at Bass and enough expirings to take back Kenny Thomas. If you can do that you might have a deal. So you'd be talking Bass, Stack, Jones, DG snt'd, and someone else like Magloire or JuHoward snt'd.

Josh and Stack plus maybe Jones for Artest, Garcia and Thomas has been discussed, and I think I would do that if I had to, but I really don't think the Mavs would even think about it.

[ddh33]

I could be talked in to a Josh for Artest deal. I would be reluctant, but I could be talked in to it. Of course, I would need more talent back from Sacramento to make it worth my while, and I wouldn't be eating their bad contracts. That's why I mentioned guys like Salmons and Garcia.

[jthig32]

Yeah, I'm not interested in sending Josh unless at the very least Garcia is coming back. But I just don't think the Mavs will even consider it.

[DevinHarriswillstart]

I hate to be the pessimist, but I doubt this happens.

Usually when we hear about the proposed trades they don't happen. Plus it has been said that the Kings aren't in any rush to move him so....

[Caseman]

Yeah, we heard about a sign-and-trade for Diop. Never happened. Wouldn't surprise me if this didn't happen either.

[rabbitproof]

The latest word being kicked around is Bass/Stack for Artest. This seems like a feeler, doubt Sacto even considers it but hopefully it opens up the phone lines.

I think the most likely scenario is beefing up the expirings to absorb Kenny Thomas.

[ddh33]

If Stein would have posted his article last night, he could have saved me some time. Forget about dealing Josh for Artest just about no matter what, it seems.

[bao_down1]

id would much rather give up stacks contract. I would rather have Howard and Artest playing.

bye Jet or stack. maybe both?

Kiid
Howard
Artest
Dirk
Damp/Diop

[SMC0007]

Cant do both without taking on something else salaries don't match

[MavsWiLLHaVeRinGs]

...oops

[chumdawg]

How about adding a Miller/Damp swap to the mix?

[Underdog]

Originally Posted by chumdawg

How about adding a Miller/Damp swap to the mix?

Are you trying to tank the deal?


[btw - if you could land Artest AND Miller while keeping Dirk and Kidd?... RINGS!!! (<---- In my best "DRAINAGE!!!" impression)]

[jthig32]

Originally Posted by chumdawg

How about adding a Miller/Damp swap to the mix?

Wouldn't really accomplish a whole lot. Assuming Damp's final year is as unlikely to be guranteed as we think it is, their contracts expire in the same year and Miller makes only slightly more than Damp.

[Underdog]

Originally Posted by jthig32

Wouldn't really accomplish a whole lot.

Except for a HUGE upgrade at the 5...

[jthig32]

Originally Posted by Underdog

Except for a HUGE upgrade at the 5...

Upgrade yes, huge, no.

Miller is a huge liability defensively. That takes away from his offensive game for me, even though he had a nice retrenching year last year.

[MavsWiLLHaVeRinGs]

Yeah Miller would be a HUGE upgrade at the 5 offensively. Last year he averaged 13.4 ppg (46% from the field) with almost 85% free throw shooting, with 9.5 rebounds a game. All of these stats are only slightly above his career stats. We'd still have Diop for Defense. Moot point though because no way in hell would that every transpire.

[Underdog]

Originally Posted by jthig32

Upgrade yes, huge, no.

Miller is a huge liability defensively. That takes away from his offensive game for me, even though he had a nice retrenching year last year.

But paired with Diop, he'd be a HUGE upgrade for this team (since Diop's & Damp's skillsets are redundant...)

[jthig32]

Originally Posted by Underdog

But paired with Diop, he'd be a HUGE upgrade for this team (since Diop's & Damp's skills are redundant...)

True, but in general I'm much more interested in defense from my center position since Dirk is not a shot blocker and generally saves himself for offense.

I'm willing to sacrifice defense for someone who scores in the block, but Miller generally gets his points with his mid range shot. If you're going to play someone who doesn't defend centers well, doesn't protect the rim particularly well and scores mostly from mid range you might as well play Bass at center.

Plus someone like Miller thrives playing a high post offense where he can hold the ball and hit cutters. That's Kidd's role on this team.

Don't get me wrong, I love Miller's game, and he's clearly an upgrade in overall talent over Damp. But I don't think he's a great fit for this team, really.

[Underdog]

Originally Posted by jthig32

True, but in general I'm much more interested in defense from my center position since Dirk is not a shot blocker and generally saves himself for offense.

I'm willing to sacrifice defense for someone who scores in the block, but Miller generally gets his points with his mid range shot. If you're going to play someone who doesn't defend centers well, doesn't protect the rim particularly well and scores mostly from mid range you might as well play Bass at center.

Plus someone like Miller thrives playing a high post offense where he can hold the ball and hit cutters. That's Kidd's role on this team.

Don't get me wrong, I love Miller's game, and he's clearly an upgrade in overall talent over Damp. But I don't think he's a great fit for this team, really.

But... But... But...


(you make a pretty good point...)

[bao_down1]

Originally Posted by jthig32

True, but in general I'm much more interested in defense from my center position since Dirk is not a shot blocker and generally saves himself for offense.

I'm willing to sacrifice defense for someone who scores in the block, but Miller generally gets his points with his mid range shot. If you're going to play someone who doesn't defend centers well, doesn't protect the rim particularly well and scores mostly from mid range you might as well play Bass at center.

Plus someone like Miller thrives playing a high post offense where he can hold the ball and hit cutters. That's Kidd's role on this team.

Don't get me wrong, I love Miller's game, and he's clearly an upgrade in overall talent over Damp. But I don't think he's a great fit for this team, really.

i agree

[MaVs 41 BaLler]

Stack and Jet

No trading bass. He's a young piece that this veteran team needs. We need bass behind dirk.
You know what Im going to find a brandon bass sig.
Could anyone make me a Bass signature?

[Underdog]

Originally Posted by MaVs 41 BaLler

No trading bass. He's a young piece that this veteran team needs. We need bass behind dirk.
You know what Im going to find a brandon bass sig.
Could anyone make me a Bass signature?

link

[MaVs 41 BaLler]

Originally Posted by Underdog

link

Hah. Of course i clicked it. But i didnt watch it i closed it when i saw the title.

[Underdog]

Originally Posted by MaVs 41 BaLler

Hah. Of course i clicked it. But i didnt watch it i closed it when i saw the title.

If Bass is still around when the season starts, I'll have him in my sig too...

[MaVs 41 BaLler]

Timeout what are all these rumors that are saying the Lakers are trying to get Artest?

[Underdog]

Originally Posted by MaVs 41 BaLler

Timeout what are all these rumors that are saying the Lakers are trying to get Artest?

post #103 & on

(welcome to a week ago...)

[dalmations202]

How about some fun!!

Successful Trade Scenario

Due to Chicago, Sacramento, and Dallas being over the cap, the 25% trade rule is invoked. Chicago, Sacramento, and Dallas had to be no more than 125% plus $100,000 of the salary given out for the trade to be accepted, which did happen here. This trade satisfies the provisions of the Collective Bargaining Agreement.
Trade ID #4730163

Chicago Trade Breakdown
Change in Team Outlook: 0.0 ppg, 0.0 rpg, and 0.0 apg.
Incoming Players
Brad Miller
7-0 C from Purdue
No games yet played in 2007/08
Outgoing Players
Kirk Hinrich
6-3 PG from Kansas
No games yet played in 2007/08

Golden State Trade Breakdown
Change in Team Outlook: 0.0 ppg, 0.0 rpg, and 0.0 apg.
Incoming Players
Kirk Hinrich
6-3 PG from Kansas
No games yet played in 2007/08
Outgoing Players
Al Harrington
6-9 PF / SF from St. Patrick's (HS)
No games yet played in 2007/08

Sacramento Trade Breakdown
Change in Team Outlook: 0.0 ppg, 0.0 rpg, and 0.0 apg.
Incoming Players
Brandon Bass
6-8 PF from Lousiana State
No games yet played in 2007/08
Eddie Jones
6-6 SG / SF from Temple
No games yet played in 2007/08
Jerry Stackhouse
6-6 SG / SF from North Carolina
No games yet played in 2007/08
Josh Howard
6-5 SG / SF from Wake Forrest
No games yet played in 2007/08
Outgoing Players
Francisco Garcia
6-7 SG / SF from Louisville
No games yet played in 2007/08
Ron Artest
6-7 SF from St. John's
No games yet played in 2007/08
Brad Miller
7-0 C from Purdue
No games yet played in 2007/08

Dallas Trade Breakdown
Change in Team Outlook: 0.0 ppg, 0.0 rpg, and 0.0 apg.
Incoming Players
Al Harrington
6-9 PF / SF from St. Patrick's (HS)
No games yet played in 2007/08
Francisco Garcia
6-7 SG / SF from Louisville
No games yet played in 2007/08
Ron Artest
6-7 SF from St. John's
No games yet played in 2007/08
Outgoing Players
Brandon Bass
6-8 PF from Lousiana State
No games yet played in 2007/08
Eddie Jones
6-6 SG / SF from Temple
No games yet played in 2007/08
Jerry Stackhouse
6-6 SG / SF from North Carolina
No games yet played in 2007/08
Josh Howard
6-5 SG / SF from Wake Forrest
No games yet played in 2007/08


Chicago gets a true center for Hinrich who they need to move.
GSW gets to move Harrington who has asked for a trade, for a true PG to run with Ellis and Maggette. He would be a Nellie special.
Sac gets Howard and Bass and expiring so they can rebuild
Dal gets a starting SG and SF and a 3/4 who has played for Carlisle in Ind.

Dallas
JKidd, Terry, JJB
Garcia, Wright, RTerry
Artest, Greene
Dirk, Harrington
Diop, Damp

With an Kidd, Terry, Garcia, Artest, Harrington, Dirk, Diop, Damp for the big 8 playoff members.

[MaVs 41 BaLler]

Woah. Thats too much to keep up with.

[mbaur]

It is creativ.

I would add Al Harrington and Damp from Dallas for Kenny Thomas from the Kings.

And last but not least the Mavs trade Kenny Thomas for Kaman with the Clippers, because they already have Camby now and with Thomas they become a PF :-)

[SMC0007]

Originally Posted by dalmations202

How about some fun!!

Successful Trade Scenario

Due to Chicago, Sacramento, and Dallas being over the cap, the 25% trade rule is invoked. Chicago, Sacramento, and Dallas had to be no more than 125% plus $100,000 of the salary given out for the trade to be accepted, which did happen here. This trade satisfies the provisions of the Collective Bargaining Agreement.
Trade ID #4730163

Chicago Trade Breakdown
Change in Team Outlook: 0.0 ppg, 0.0 rpg, and 0.0 apg.
Incoming Players
Brad Miller
7-0 C from Purdue
No games yet played in 2007/08
Outgoing Players
Kirk Hinrich
6-3 PG from Kansas
No games yet played in 2007/08

Golden State Trade Breakdown
Change in Team Outlook: 0.0 ppg, 0.0 rpg, and 0.0 apg.
Incoming Players
Kirk Hinrich
6-3 PG from Kansas
No games yet played in 2007/08
Outgoing Players
Al Harrington
6-9 PF / SF from St. Patrick's (HS)
No games yet played in 2007/08

Sacramento Trade Breakdown
Change in Team Outlook: 0.0 ppg, 0.0 rpg, and 0.0 apg.
Incoming Players
Brandon Bass
6-8 PF from Lousiana State
No games yet played in 2007/08
Eddie Jones
6-6 SG / SF from Temple
No games yet played in 2007/08
Jerry Stackhouse
6-6 SG / SF from North Carolina
No games yet played in 2007/08
Josh Howard
6-5 SG / SF from Wake Forrest
No games yet played in 2007/08
Outgoing Players
Francisco Garcia
6-7 SG / SF from Louisville
No games yet played in 2007/08
Ron Artest
6-7 SF from St. John's
No games yet played in 2007/08
Brad Miller
7-0 C from Purdue
No games yet played in 2007/08

Dallas Trade Breakdown
Change in Team Outlook: 0.0 ppg, 0.0 rpg, and 0.0 apg.
Incoming Players
Al Harrington
6-9 PF / SF from St. Patrick's (HS)
No games yet played in 2007/08
Francisco Garcia
6-7 SG / SF from Louisville
No games yet played in 2007/08
Ron Artest
6-7 SF from St. John's
No games yet played in 2007/08
Outgoing Players
Brandon Bass
6-8 PF from Lousiana State
No games yet played in 2007/08
Eddie Jones
6-6 SG / SF from Temple
No games yet played in 2007/08
Jerry Stackhouse
6-6 SG / SF from North Carolina
No games yet played in 2007/08
Josh Howard
6-5 SG / SF from Wake Forrest
No games yet played in 2007/08


Chicago gets a true center for Hinrich who they need to move.
GSW gets to move Harrington who has asked for a trade, for a true PG to run with Ellis and Maggette. He would be a Nellie special.
Sac gets Howard and Bass and expiring so they can rebuild
Dal gets a starting SG and SF and a 3/4 who has played for Carlisle in Ind.

Dallas
JKidd, Terry, JJB
Garcia, Wright, RTerry
Artest, Greene
Dirk, Harrington
Diop, Damp

With an Kidd, Terry, Garcia, Artest, Harrington, Dirk, Diop, Damp for the big 8 playoff members.

Nice thinking.

[MaVs 41 BaLler]

Shouldn't you then start harrington at center instead of putting him behind dirk.

[nikeball]

Originally Posted by MaVs 41 BaLler

Shouldn't you then start harrington at center instead of putting him behind dirk.

is that you don nelson?

[GermanDunk]

Originally Posted by MaVs 41 BaLler

Hah. Of course i clicked it. But i didnt watch it i closed it when i saw the title.

Don´t shut off the lovely tune, dude !

[MaVs 41 BaLler]

Originally Posted by nikeball

is that you don nelson?

Well he would have to play center at some time. I dont see him getting any minutes otherwise.

[dalmations202]

Originally Posted by MaVs 41 BaLler

Well he would have to play center at some time. I dont see him getting any minutes otherwise.

He is a legit backup for the 3 and 4....he'd get 20 a night.

[sike]

any conversation of Artest coming without Howard should be labeled as fantasy...

I just don't see how the Kings couldn't get more in return than a nice young player and cap relief.

Of course, I wouldn't have thought Camby would have gone so cheaply either....

[DevinHarriswillstart]

Originally Posted by sike

any conversation of Artest coming without Howard should be labeled as fantasy...

I just don't see how the Kings couldn't get more in return than a nice young player and cap relief.

Of course, I wouldn't have thought Camby would have gone so cheaply either....

Exactly and other teams aren't giving in to Sacramento's demands either. Lets not forget Artest has gone a little coo coo lately and can't keep his mouth shut. That KILLS a player's trade value. (something we should have learned with Kidd who also put the Nets in an awkward position)

I think too many people miss the point. The point is not whether Artest is better than Howard. The fact of the matter is Artest's market value doesn't warrant a Howard at this point so why give in?

[dude1394]

Artest makes it sort of tough imo. You can't trade him to a bad team because he'll go crazy. You also may not want to trade him to a team that "may" be on the cusp because he might go crazy.

He's a risk...

[MaVs 41 BaLler]

Something crazy is what the mavs need right now.