Krugman: Views Differ on Age of Planet

[dalmations202]

Originally Posted by EricaLubarsky

I never got this idea. We have a robot on Mars vaporizing rocks and doing mass spectroscopy. We have cures for hundreds of diseases based on the very idea of gene sequencing and evolution-- it's the reason we have flu shots. We have a space station orbiting the Earth. We have phones that talk to satellites. I guess it's easy to question smaller details of science but to say you have little faith in science is bewildering to me.

Just because Isaac Newton got some details wrong that Einstein corrected and Einstein is being proven wrong himself doesn't mean that gravity is up for debate.

If you want to believe in religion, then do that. It's just not going to be justified by science if it retains it's fundamentalist views. The Earth is not flat as they believed it was in Jesus' time. The earth isn't the center of the universe. Science isn't replacing God-- it's just discovering things about the world that paint God in a different light. If you are fighting science, I believe you are on the same side as the Catholic church that banned the teachings of Galileo. The church eventually realized that they couldn't pretend that Galileo was wrong anymore and moved on-- much like most of the religious leaders in the world-- just not in the US for some reason even though we are at the forefront of many scientific fields.

Much of what you are writing is true.

The problem is that science is wrong more often than not and that it is OK because we will just change it later.
Many people seem to think that science is God.

I am not fighting science. In fact, I believe that the basis of science is to figure out how things work.

I am not about evolution though -- and that is the current science hypothesis that was thoroughly destroyed by science, but still left being taught.
I just don't understand why some must have it "all the way".

As I stated, my father is a retired science teacher. I spent lots of time with lots of science books, and did lots of experiments. I have read massive amounts on peoples beliefs in "the origins".

The Origin of life is the "Big" question.

If we came from nothingness, and there is no future "afterlife", then why do things matter at all. Why offer my life to defend someone else -- if there is no "good or bad". Why is there Love and who can explain it? There can be no soul.

The ability of inventors to build things or understand is great "science", but it doesn't really explain anything.

IF God created man -- then he can make the rules, and you can have an afterlife, and you should act a certain way, and etc etc etc. It can explain the origin of life. It can explain emotions, love, and logical existence.

IF Man was created via nothingness then -- man makes the rules, and might makes right. There is no right or wrong, only what man thinks. You should never wake up wondering what happened when you killed someone -- because everyone will die anyway and it ends there. Hiding it from man is the only consequence. Rape, Theft, beating, and killing are just the way things are -- much like in the world of all other animals. Why are things different in the human world? How did logic evolve? How did Love evolve? What is true love?

Why do women have rights in America? Why aren't people kept as slaves? What changes the way that is "right and wrong"?

I know the answer, and will go to my grave for it.

Now back to the science vs religion. Science thought the earth was flat as well in Jesus day. Science changed, but so did religion to an extent. The earth isn't the center of the universe, but unless you are talking a specific religion ie Catholicism that I am not well versed in -- then I have never heard religion say earth was the center of the universe.

Have people done absolutely crazy things in the name of religion --- YES. The Crusades, Muslim terrorism, etc are easy to show that religion can be skewed just as much if not more than science. What is the difference in religion and a true Christian. Religion says you need to XXXXX -- A true Christian says -- It is done.

The problem with much science today --- in many cases -- is that they have an answer they are working towards, not trying to find the answer.

Not believing in God is a religion of its own. It is one called believing in Man and Science. I just don't have enough "Faith" in man -- because he keeps changing it to his own will of whatever fits "me" today.

IMO, it takes more outright Faith to believe their isn't a God than it does to be able to show that he exists. Now I am back to -- If there is a God -- and we were created by him --- then isn't he the one who gets to make the rules?

[Underdog]

Originally Posted by dalmations202

Many people seem to think that science is God.

Science is the nature of God, mathematics is the language of God... There's nothing in the Bible that contradicts that.

[Dirkadirkastan]

Originally Posted by dalmations202

If we came from nothingness, and there is no future "afterlife", then why do things matter at all. Why offer my life to defend someone else -- if there is no "good or bad". Why is there Love and who can explain it? There can be no soul.

Gosh, if this life is all I have, then it is the only thing that has importance at all. If we have time later for some divine agent to sort everything out, all this won't matter in the long run.

IF God created man -- then he can make the rules, and you can have an afterlife, and you should act a certain way, and etc etc etc. It can explain the origin of life. It can explain emotions, love, and logical existence.

If you're merely doing as you're told, then you cannot receive credit for any moral act. Divine command actually TAKES AWAY from morality, since your motivation is not genuine.

IF Man was created via nothingness then -- man makes the rules, and might makes right. There is no right or wrong, only what man thinks. You should never wake up wondering what happened when you killed someone -- because everyone will die anyway and it ends there. Hiding it from man is the only consequence. Rape, Theft, beating, and killing are just the way things are -- much like in the world of all other animals. Why are things different in the human world? How did logic evolve? How did Love evolve? What is true love?

Why are you such a fan of the bible then? Rape and slavery are ordinary commands. Logic is nowhere to be found.

Why do women have rights in America? Why aren't people kept as slaves? What changes the way that is "right and wrong"?

See above. Women certainly did not get their rights from the bible.

Have people done absolutely crazy things in the name of religion --- YES. The Crusades, Muslim terrorism, etc are easy to show that religion can be skewed just as much if not more than science. What is the difference in religion and a true Christian. Religion says you need to XXXXX -- A true Christian says -- It is done.

No True Scotsman, eh?

The problem with much science today --- in many cases -- is that they have an answer they are working towards, not trying to find the answer.

Not believing in God is a religion of its own. It is one called believing in Man and Science. I just don't have enough "Faith" in man -- because he keeps changing it to his own will of whatever fits "me" today.

I don't see that at all. Why would anyone have the burning desire to prove we evolved from apes? What's so inspiring about the eventual heat death of the universe? There's nothing about these ideas that seem contrived or would even fit a particular agenda.

On the flip side, I can certainly see the bias in wanting to believe we were divinely ordained as caretakers of the universe.

IMO, it takes more outright Faith to believe their isn't a God than it does to be able to show that he exists. Now I am back to -- If there is a God -- and we were created by him --- then isn't he the one who gets to make the rules?

You seem fully convinced that everyone just already knows deep down that God is watching them, so those that outwardly reject this universally known fact are simply in denial due to their personal desire to be "in control" and morally irresponsible.

Once you learn the truth, that many people genuinely do not believe a supernatural watchman/dictator exists, then hopefully you will start to take their arguments more seriously.