Texas Rangers Hot Stove Thread - Page 2 - Dallas-Mavs.com Forums

jthig32 · 12-20-2005, 03:07 PM

You've got to be Fing kidding me. Adam Eaton......

Young is better, younger and cheaper than Eaton.

Young put up good numbers in his first full years in a horrible park.

Eaton has been nothing but average in the NL in a pitchers park.

This is shockingly awful.

#1MavsFan · 12-20-2005, 03:11 PM

wow, could this trade be any worse? We basicly hand them Chris Young who we had signed for a couple more years Eaton who's on the downward side of his career and will bolt after 1 year? Not to mention we also just basically threw in Adam G. What was JD thinking?

jthig32 · 12-20-2005, 03:15 PM

I am in utter shock. I mean this can't be real, can it??

Keep in mind, I don't think Young is anything special. He's probably a solid #3 pitcher. But with the flip flop in leagues and parks, Young will put up better numbers than Eaton, AND we threw in Agon?????

I need a drink

aexchange · 12-20-2005, 03:20 PM

honestly, i didnt see anything real special out of young. he had a nice string of games early in the season and struggled significantly during the latter half of the season.

i think we still have to wait to see who the PTBNL is before making any judgements.

jthig32 · 12-20-2005, 03:31 PM

He was just fine last year. If he could repeat that kind of year every year we'd have been happy with him.

The point is, Eaton is essentially the exact same pitcher except in the NL, in a pitcher's park. He also costs 10 times more money (literally) and is a free agent after this year, while Young is under team control for three more years.

This doesn't even consider the fact that we also send our most tradeable asset in this trade as well, and also got back a 34 y/o bit reliever.

The PTBNL would have to be a freaking blue chipper, top 20 in baseball prospect to make this trade make sense, and the Padres don't have any of those.

Drbio · 12-20-2005, 03:32 PM

I'm not down on this trade at all either. I absolutely loved Chris Young, but I think that this is a clear upgrade in talent.

Drbio · 12-20-2005, 03:32 PM

The Texas Rangers have helped address their pitching woes by reaching agreement to acquire San Diego Padres right-handed pitchers Adam Eaton and Akinori Otsuka and a minor league prospect in exchange for right-handed pitcher Chris Young, first baseman Adrian Gonzalez and outfielder Terrmel Sledge, ESPN.com's Jerry Crasnick has confirmed.

Adam Eaton
Starting Pitcher
San Diego Padres

Profile
2005 SEASON STATISTICS
GM W L BB K ERA
24 11 5 44 100 4.27

The Rangers and Padres had been discussing a deal for Eaton for several weeks, but Texas was reluctant to part with young catcher Gerald Laird, The Dallas Morning News reported.

The main motivation for the Padres to deal Eaton was because they were far apart in negotiations on a new multi-year contract, and Eaton will enter the final year of his current deal in '06, Crasnick reports.

Eaton and his agent, Jim Lindell, were seeking a three-year, $27 million deal, while the Padres had floated an offer of three years and $17 million.

Eaton told ESPN.com last week that he was growing impatient over the Padres' unwillingness to "extend a hand" in contract talks.

"I feel like I've always been on the outside of their plans, and that's frustrating," Eaton said. "I feel like I'm being put off and put off, and that's not something anybody likes to have done to them."

In the aftermath of the trade, San Diego's starting rotation currently consists of Jake Peavy, Young, Woody Williams, Chan Ho Park and youngsters Clay Hensley and Tim Stauffer. The Padres have also been in talks with free agents Brett Tomko and Pedro Astacio.

The addition of Sledge and Gonzalez could make outfielder Dave Roberts expendable in a trade. Roberts, San Diego's left fielder last season, lost his center field job when the Padres acquired Mike Cameron from the New York Mets.

Eaton, 28, was 11-5 with San Diego last year, but pitched only 128 2/3 innings due to a middle finger strain.

Otsuka, 33, was 2-8 last season with a 3.59 ERA, striking out 60 batters in 63 2/3 innings. The Rangers, while still on the market for more bullpen arms, will likely slide Otsuka into a setup role.

Young tied a Rangers' rookie record by recording 12 wins last season, but stuggled later in the season with fatigue.

Gonzalez, who was the first overall pick by the Florida Marlins in the 2000 draft, batted .227 in 150 at bats for the Rangers last season. With Mark Teixeira entrenched at first base already, Gonzalez did not have much opportunity in Texas.

Sledge was acquired by the Rangers earlier in the month from the Washington Nationals.

jthig32 · 12-20-2005, 03:36 PM

PTBNL is a 19 y/o catching prospect. Yay.

How in the hell is this a "clear upgrade in talent" That makes zero sense.

I'll say again, Chris Young and Adam Eaton are the SAME PITCHER. Except that Young did it in the AL in a hitter's park, and Eaton did it in the NL in a pitcher's park.

Gimme a break. This is horrible.

Drbio · 12-20-2005, 03:38 PM

Ken Rosenthal of FoxSports.com reports that the prospect Texas is getting in the San Diego trade is catcher Billy Killian, the Padres' third-round pick in 2004.

aexchange · 12-20-2005, 03:39 PM

looks like laird or barajas is on the move for more pitching.

jthig32 · 12-20-2005, 03:39 PM

Guess we'll just add him to our stable of catchign prospects, along with Teagarden, our own 3rd round pick this past year......

Drbio · 12-20-2005, 03:39 PM

Eaton is better than Young at this point. Please understand that I really liked Young and am not jazzed that he isn't our #3 or #4 rotation guy, but that is the best he will ever be. Eaton is a #2 to #3 guy. if we land Millwood and trade Laird (it now appears) we may have something on the mound that has never been here before....a decent rotation.

jthig32 · 12-20-2005, 03:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by aexchange

looks like laird or barajas is on the move for more pitching.

He's 19 and hasn't played anyting above Low A ball yet. Somehow I doubt his aquisition affect Laird or Barajas. Not saying Laird wont' be traded, but this has zero effect on that.

Drbio · 12-20-2005, 03:40 PM

One thing is for certain.....we should get some enjoyable talk radio this week.

jthig32 · 12-20-2005, 03:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Drbio

Eaton is better than Young at this point. Please understand that I really liked Young and am not jazzed that he isn't our #3 or #4 rotation guy, but that is the best he will ever be. Eaton is a #2 to #3 guy. if we land Millwood and trade Laird (it now appears) we may have something on the mound that has never been here before....a decent rotation.

How do you come up with "better than Young"

Last year they put up identical seasons, and again you take into account park effect and league effects, and it's ridiculous.

They are, at best, the same pitcher, but Young is younger and cheaper, and under more control.

Drbio · 12-20-2005, 03:45 PM

In your opinion .....

Mine is that Eaton is a great pickup.

jthig32 · 12-20-2005, 03:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Drbio

In your opinion .....

Mine is that Eaton is a great pickup.

Yes, obviously we're speaking in opinions. But I'm giving stats to backup my opinion. My stats show that Eaton and Young are very similar pitchers. Exact same career ERA, in fact.

Young makes 400,000, Eaton makes 3.5 mil. Young is under control for at least three years, it may be more, not sure. Eaton is free after this year. Young's numbers will get better, Eaton's will get worse with the league/park switch.

What say you to this?

Drbio · 12-20-2005, 04:43 PM

I say that ballpark dynamics and proven longevity are factors. Young sprung to life on a middle of the road team and he faded BADLY at the end fo theyear. Eaton has been a reliable horse for years. He has been a guy that many teams have tried to obtain. Give me Eaton if I get to choose between the two, even though as I said before I really liked Young. Eaton is a better pitcher. Young is a one year wonder to date with a bad fade.

jthig32 · 12-20-2005, 04:50 PM

A reliable horse for years???? He has TWO years of pitching more than 180 innings. He has ONE year of above .500 in W's and L's. He's a league average pitcher.

Even if you believe he's a GREAT pitcher, he's free after this year, and the odds of us resigning him are remote.

Chris Young faded because of arm fatigue. He was a fregging ROOKIE PITCHER. That's what rookie pitchers do, they FADE. Chris Young was the best young pitcher this club had. He is exactley what we need, young, cheap arms that we control.

Drbio · 12-20-2005, 04:55 PM

I do agree that I hate that the Rangers traded a PITCHER who we had under long term control. That is something the Rangers have to do to be successful. Agree to disagree. I think Eaton is better....you like Young. I like Young, but he imho is not a better pitcher today (or probably tommorow) than Eaton.

One thought. It is usually a good thing when fans are split on trades. It means that talented people are being swapped. I cannot imagine that we could not have gotten a better return for Young/AG/Sledge than Eaton, but all in all not a bad trade.

jthig32 · 12-20-2005, 04:58 PM

I just don't understand people knocking Young as a "one year wonder" that faded in the second half.

That happensa lot with rookie pitchers. They pitch more innings than they ever have in their first full big league season. Do you expect rookies to come up and dominate all year?

As I said previously, I don't think Young was Ace material by any stretch. But raw numbers suggest he and Eaton are, at best, the same pitcher.

Drbio · 12-20-2005, 05:44 PM

Most reviews of the trade focus on Young/Eaton and are saying the Rangers have a #2 guy for a potential #3 guy. To me this is enough.

FahQ · 12-20-2005, 05:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Drbio

Most reviews of the trade focus on Young/Eaton and are saying the Rangers have a #2 guy for a potential #3 guy. To me this is enough.

A #2 guy that wants 3/27 million next year compared to a #3 that is locked up for 5 more years, who is 3 years younger, and has equal ERA in the TBiA. I'm not too thrilled.

jthig32 · 12-20-2005, 05:58 PM

Depends on who you listen to for said reviews.

From the Transaction Oracle:

Quote:

Texas Rangers - Acquired P Adam Eaton and P Akinori Ohtsuka and an unnamed prospect from the San Diego Padres for 1B Adrian Gonzalez, P Chris Young, and OF Termel Sledge.

Well, the Ranger front office gave away all the newfound-love they acquired last week in the clever Soriano for Wilkerson-Sledge swap. My best guess? The Rangers totally got Adam Eaton and Jake Peavy confused, thinking that they're landing the guy that finished in the top 10 in ERA the last two seasons and has 3 years until free agency rather than Eaton, who has put up a better-than-league-average ERA+ once in his career, during his 22-start rookie campaign.

Chris Young, despite wearing down the second half of the season, had a better year than Eaton has ever had in the majors. And he won't be a free agent until the winter of 2010.

In return for this downgrade in value (even if we call them equal in ability or call Eaton a bit superior, Young's cheaper for a long time and under team control), they trade a good, though not top-notch, 1B prospect and throw in a suitable starting outfielder/4th outfielder for the Pads bench. No doubt people will cry SALARY DUMP!!!! but if you can dump salary and get better, where's the downside?

Yes, Ohtsuka is a very valuable reliever and probably the more valuable commodity the Padres are giving up, but this is a lot of talent to send out of the system. Thumbs up for the Padres, making up somewhat for the Mirabelli-Loretta debacle. As an entertaining side dish to this trade, due to the extreme park differences between Chase and Petco, everyone in this trade except Chris Young will look a good bit worse than they are.

I challenge anyone calling him a #2 to show me when he's put up numbers that represent his status as a #2.

Plus, trading 5 years of a #3 at minimum level salary (around $500,000 a year) for 1 year of a #2 at 4-4.5 mil, and the opportunity to try to resign him after this year....give me the #3 all day long.

capitalcity · 12-20-2005, 06:07 PM

what the hell is going on? can somebody please explain how dealing pitching for pitching isn't moving sideways.

jthig32 · 12-20-2005, 06:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by capitalcity

what the hell is going on? can somebody please explain how dealing pitching for pitching isn't moving sideways.

Sideways is being nice. Trading 5 years for one guy for 1 year of another, similar guy, is moving backwards IMO.

Dooby · 12-20-2005, 06:25 PM

Terrible F'ing trade, IMO. Traded good young pitcher that you had locked up for years for pitcher that is a FA to be. Why on earth did we do this?

Compare Eaton and Young's stats. Virtually identical.

We will rue the day this trade was made.

FahQ · 12-20-2005, 06:36 PM

Check out Ohtsuka splits from Petco and everyone will be even happier. His road line for 2005 - 26 IP - 6.92 ERA.

Male30Dan · 12-20-2005, 08:15 PM

Vomit!

Male30Dan · 12-20-2005, 08:34 PM

Despite the article that follows this sentence....Vomit again!

http://www.sportsline.com/mlb/story/9108452

Rangers fill big hole with Eaton deal; Padres don't
Dec. 20, 2005
By Scott Miller
CBS SportsLine.com Senior Writer

Two things stand out about Tuesday's six-player Texas-San Diego trade:

Adam Eaton's hot start was ruined by a finger injury last season. (Getty Images)
The Rangers, who dealt Alfonso Soriano earlier this month without obtaining pitching in return, finally added a couple of key pieces to what has been a weakness for the past several seasons.

The Padres, ultra-thin behind the plate after losing free agent Ramon Hernandez, failed to wrangle catcher Gerald Laird in the deal.

Adam Eaton is not exactly Kevin Millwood or Jeff Weaver, two starters still ripe for the picking from this winter's free-agent tree. He does not have a glitzy resume. He has never crossed the 200 innings pitched threshold. He has only started as many as 30 games in a season twice, and a terrific beginning to his 2005 season was sabotaged by a finger injury.

Still, as long as that injury does not become chronic as he throws his curveball, Eaton -- and set-up man Akinori Otsuka, also obtained from San Diego along with minor-league catcher Billy Killian for right-hander Chris Young, first baseman Adrian Gonzalez and outfielder Terrmel Sledge -- will make the Rangers better.

Eaton, 28, was 9-2 with a 3.42 ERA before the break last summer and was on track to be one of San Diego's representatives to the All-Star game. Then he landed on the DL with a strained right middle finger on June 16 and didn't return until after the break.

What spurred the Padres to explore trading him was the fact that he is arbitration-eligible this winter, can become a free agent after next season and the club and Eaton's representative had made little progress in negotiations for a multi-year contract. He could command as much as $5 million for 2006 in arbitration this winter.

Texas has spent a good deal of time this winter attempting to arrange an Eaton deal, and in obtaining Otsuka as well, the Rangers have added a solid set-up man.

In dealing Otsuka, the Padres moved one of their last, solid trading chips. Several clubs had inquired about Otsuka this winter, with the New York Mets being among the most aggressive.

Young figures to join a San Diego rotation still in flux. The Padres are attempting to sign free agent Brett Tomko and are the preferred destination of Boston's David Wells, who has requested that the Red Sox trade him to a western team closer to his San Diego home.

Currently, with Eaton and Brian Lawrence (Washington) having been traded this winter, the Padres' rotation consists of Jake Peavy, Woody Williams, Chan Ho Park and Young.

Worse, the Padres' catching tandem is Miguel Olivo and Doug Mirabelli.

Young was 12-7 with a 4.26 ERA in 31 starts for the Rangers last season, tying the Texas record for victories by a rookie. Gonzalez, meanwhile, is a San Diego native who immediately becomes the heir to first base once Ryan Klesko's contract expires following the 2006 season.

Drbio · 12-20-2005, 08:51 PM

This is why they make all kinds of ice cream flavors. Some like some some don't.

Male30Dan · 12-20-2005, 09:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Drbio

This is why they make all kinds of ice cream flavors. Some like some some don't.

Some ice cream flavors are like "Poo on a stick" and only those with no taste buds can truly enjoy it!

endtroducing MASKED · 12-20-2005, 09:18 PM

hey, at least you guys didn't trade Andy Marte for EDGAR RENTERIA.

Murphy3 · 12-20-2005, 09:31 PM

...Bottom line...
The Rangers upgraded in talent/potential at the SP position, but their histories doesn't necessarily mean that the talent will be realized.. Eaton has the better arm..the better stuff. But, I don't know that he'll be a better pitcher than Young. Young's younger... You would hope that Eaton would have stepped up to this point to realize talent, but he hasn't.

Plus, Eaton only has a year left on his contract and he sounds as if he's going to be unwilling to sign back with Texas. This deal could turn out to be absolutely disasterous. It could be a good deal, but I would say that it has a higher percentage chance of biting the Rangers in the Ass.

ames7 · 12-20-2005, 09:31 PM

Quote:

Two weeks ago with rumours bounding, Eaton expressed mixed feelings about pitching in Arlington: “It's not conducive to my style of pitching; I'm a fly-ball pitcher. If I was to stay there, it'd have to be for crazy money. Granted, that is an offense that's going to put up some runs. You could take a Coors Field approach to the game."

VERY CONCERNING. This trade is really beginning to look terrible, particularly long term. Man am I going to be pissed if they can't somehow talk Eaton into resigning here.

Also, mark me down for "extremely skeptical" of the Kevin Milwood chase. I'll be shocked if they pull it off. Looks like he's going to ask for 5 years & we all know what "the owner's going to stop writing checks" Hicks thinks about that.

Murphy3 · 12-20-2005, 09:33 PM

The only reasons that I can think of that they might have made this trade are:

1. Eaton has better potential (but, at 28, will he ever realize this potential?)
2. They don't think that Chris Young will hold up physically. That's why he's been moved in the past... Don't think that he'll hold up over the long haul..

jthig32 · 12-20-2005, 10:55 PM

Murph has a point. I guess I should admit that this COULD turn out good, because clearly Eaton does have more upside. But it is very, very likely that Eaton, at this point never realizes his potential. Plus, it's even MORE likey that if he does realize that potential this year, we have no shot of resigning him. Zero. None.

We have a hard time signing/resigning pitchers that have a choice. Which is why it drives me crazy to give up a pitcher that has a little over a season under his belt, and is under team control until 2010.

Put it this way. Everyone loves Danks, Diamond and Volquez. And if any of them had been sent in this trade, I bet people would be going INSANE. Well, it'll be a success if 2 out of those 3 ever put up the type of season Chris Young put up this year. We all have higher hopes, but the fact is, the odds of even two of them realizing a full year of success on par with what Chris Young did are very long.

Male30Dan · 12-20-2005, 10:58 PM

Dry Heaves!!! Ugh...

jthig32 · 12-21-2005, 12:44 AM

From Tim Cowishaw:

Quote:

He was really good before the All-Star break. Injured and not so good after the break. Not good enough to get one of the team's three postseason starts against St. Louis, although former Ranger Pedro Astacio got into the mix.

If that doesn't depress you, I don't know what will.

Dooby · 12-21-2005, 08:15 AM

Here is a great quote from our new pitcher, Mr. Eaton:

"It's not conducive to my style of pitching; I'm a fly-ball pitcher," [Eaton] said. "If I was to stay there, it'd have to be for crazy money."