Playoffs 2011-12 Thread - Page 13 - Dallas-Mavs.com Forums

GhostFace · 06-22-2012, 12:47 AM

I feel like the NBA are gonna try and cover up what the Mavs did. The medias portrayal of the Heat as a bunch of humble champions is laughable. Two top 5 players and an all star to win a ring, how sad considering what Dirk did. Whenever they look back on LBJ's career, Dallas will always be the team that "humbled" him. Fuck that. We slaughtered them and even when we won we didn't get the credit we deserved and we probably never will. Only Maverick fans will know what we did. A love, hate relationship with the NBA.

Quote:

Originally Posted by howdoesmydirktaste

Dirk didn't need superstars to win a championship, just a team. He never jumped ship like Lebron or Garnett.

Nobody but Dallas fans really care, but our championship will always be considered "earned". Dirk did it with class.

I hope Durant grows. I do agree that OKC looked A LOT like they did against Dallas last year. I think the Spurs could have beat the Heat. We will never know.

I had no problems with Garnett and Allen leaving their original teams because they did it towards the end of their careers. Garnett was with the Wolves for 12 years, Allen with the Bucks and Sonics for 11 years.

BGMaverick9 · 06-22-2012, 12:57 AM

The 3 players for Miami definitely didn't brush last year under the rug. They all mentioned that last year was a humbling experience for them. Bosh said he thought about it every time he walked down the hallway when the cameras caught him crying. Wade said he watched Game 6 the night before Game 5 vs OKC. He said it was the Mavericks' time to win. James said it was a humbling situation and pushed him to come back as a different basketball player and a different person.

Dirkadirkastan · 06-22-2012, 01:01 AM

They certainly were different this year and they certainly earned it.

Still, their collective accomplishment isn't nearly as impressive as Dirk's individual one, and "they sacrificed their individual legacies for this" is a sickening distortion of their individual legacies.

EricaLubarsky · 06-22-2012, 01:21 AM

Quote:

This message is hidden because dude1394 is on your ignore list.

It was hard to make that decision with all the history around here, but I found it improved my D-M.com experience a lot. I advise that you follow suit, Dirka.

Dirkadirkastan · 06-22-2012, 02:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by EricaLubarsky

It was hard to make that decision with all the history around here, but I found it improved my D-M.com experience a lot. I advise that you follow suit, Dirka.

It wouldn't make his posts any more repetitive than they already are, that's for sure.

CaseyJones · 06-22-2012, 05:40 AM

Glad to see we all feel the same.
It sucks to see Wade happy and we all recognize that Wade earned nothing, actually the Heat didn't really EARN anything as far as I'm concerned. 3 superstars to win a title is just a disgrace to the NBA. LeBron and Wade will get more rings before its over and Dirk will probably retire with 1 maybe 2 if we're all lucky. Yet Dirk is the one who walked off for the trophy celebration to collect himself. Somewhat of a rant but I just hate seeing that Heat team break into another dance off like they're kings of the world for winning and thats the only reason they tried to win.

DevinHarriswillstart · 06-22-2012, 07:34 AM

Well for all of hoopla surrounding the Thunder, I know that we have a ring and they don't. Glass half full is always a wise choice.

Westbrook with an epic fail.

markus1234 · 06-22-2012, 08:12 AM

2012, three all stars, one ring. How exciting...

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dirkadirkastan

"they sacrificed their individual legacies for this".

what a piece of *****

howdoesmydirktaste · 06-22-2012, 08:40 AM

The Heat flat out beat the Thunder. They also had a ton of adversity to overcome. Of course, it is less impressive that they overcame adversity when you compare them to the Mavs run. When you're built to win not one, not two, not three, not four.......it should come easy. Then again these Heat will never smell the jocks of the Chicago Bulls of the 90s.

The Heat are the champions. No one is surprised. Just remember, the Mavs are the reason that it took them an extra year to do it. No one else gets to say that.

stoble · 06-22-2012, 09:47 AM

Damnit!

Okay, now that I got that out of the way. The Spurs needed to be in the finals. I think the Spurs would have made it much tougher on the Heat.

GhostFace · 06-22-2012, 11:57 AM

With Dallas not repeating this year I have all the butt hurt Rockets fans at my job calling Dallas' win last year nothing but a fluke, especially since Miami won. Arguing with Rockets fans is like arguing with a rock.

ibivibiv · 06-22-2012, 01:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GhostFace

With Dallas not repeating this year I have all the butt hurt Rockets fans at my job calling Dallas' win last year nothing but a fluke, especially since Miami won. Arguing with Rockets fans is like arguing with a rock.

I feel ya', my company has its two largest offices in Dallas and Houston... Until we won the title last year I had to endure a lot of smack talking.

Underdog · 06-22-2012, 01:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GhostFace

With Dallas not repeating this year I have all the butt hurt Rockets fans at my job calling Dallas' win last year nothing but a fluke, especially since Miami won. Arguing with Rockets fans is like arguing with a rock.

To be the best, you have to beat the best. The Mavs did that. Houston needed the best to walk away from the game for a couple seasons for them to win anything.

Plus, I'd happily take a "fluke" championship over the 15-20 years of irrelevance that Houston is currently weathering (with no clear end in sight...)

LonghornDub · 06-22-2012, 02:41 PM

I fail to see how "Miami won this year" gives any support to "the Mavs winning last year was a fluke." It's the opposite--the Mavs beat the most talented team.

Besides, you don't fluke your way into 16 playoff wins. It's such a stupid thought to begin with.

CaseyJones · 06-22-2012, 04:22 PM

I didn't see Ghostfaces comment before but its absolutely true. It may just be me but it seems like theres a lot more media involved in the Heat winning last night than there was when the Mavs won. Not only that but where was the talk about how humble Dirk, JET, Marion, Kidd, and Tyson were. All i hear about is how humble the big 3 are and how theyve just worked soooo hard to get those rings. Try falling short time after time after time in 10+ year period without switching sides to increase the chances of winning as opposed to hitting the gym and practicing and believing in your team.

CaseyJones · 06-22-2012, 04:43 PM

Just watched a press conference where Wade and LeBron talked about how everyone claimed the New York series was supposed to be tough.
They're so humble.

LonghornDub · 06-22-2012, 04:58 PM

Brooks's speech to OKC in the huddle with about 5 minutes left in the game was absolute class:

Quote:

"One last thing, guys. We're gonna treat them like they're the champions. After the game we're gonna walk and shake their hands and acknowledge all of them. They beat us fair and square. However how hard that hurts, they still beat us fair and square. Give them credit, get off the court, we'll meet back at the locker room."

Video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=27sg71i3kXs

KG, Rondo, and other clowns who run off the court like babies could learn a thing or two from this guy. It ain't about fake congratulations or pretending like you're happy. It's about honoring the spirit of competition. If you're not man enough to do that, my take is, you shouldn't be competing in the first place.

Great stuff.

GhostFace · 06-22-2012, 08:06 PM

http://espn.go.com/blog/dallas/maver...h-skip-bayless

Cubes vs Bayliess on the very same issue I was talking about, how Dallas will have to fight for credit because of what we did last season.

@ LonghornDub - awesome watch.

DirkFTW · 06-23-2012, 04:22 PM

LonghornDub · 06-23-2012, 06:44 PM

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Originally Posted by DirkFTW

I lol'ed so hard.

Big Boy Laroux · 06-23-2012, 10:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LonghornDub

KG, Rondo, and other clowns who run off the court like babies could learn a thing or two from this guy. It ain't about fake congratulations or pretending like you're happy. It's about honoring the spirit of competition. If you're not man enough to do that, my take is, you shouldn't be competing in the first place.

Great stuff.

Absolutely agree. I guess it happens in other pro sports, but you really notice it in the NBA - players just running off the court as soon as the game is over. I was always taught to shake the opponent's hand, win or lose.

chumdawg · 06-23-2012, 10:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Big Boy Laroux

Absolutely agree. I guess it happens in other pro sports, but you really notice it in the NBA - players just running off the court as soon as the game is over. I was always taught to shake the opponent's hand, win or lose.

I think there is more of a fraternity among these pros than we realize. I think most of them are pros first and [name the team] second. That's why the heartfelt hugs, the group prayers in football. (Hockey is different...for them, it truly is about respecting the opponent.)

Thus, the notion of "spirit of competition" is quaint but perhaps misguided. The guys who *won't* stay around to shake your hand are probably the biggest competitors of all. Maybe dicks, yeah...but probably pure competitors.

Dirkadirkastan · 06-23-2012, 11:09 PM

I guess baseball players are clowns and babies then.

GhostFace · 06-24-2012, 02:03 AM

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Originally Posted by Dirkadirkastan

I guess baseball players are clowns and babies then.

Cricket is for real men.

Big Boy Laroux · 06-24-2012, 07:58 AM

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Originally Posted by Dirkadirkastan

I guess baseball players are clowns and babies then.

I would classify baseball a little differently, simply because of the layout of the playing field. Dugouts aren't really that close together, pitchers are way out in another area. I personally would still like to see them shake hands, but it makes a little more sense that they do not

But in basketball? 10 players on the court at the end of the game, with benches only like 30 feet apart.

Big Boy Laroux · 06-24-2012, 08:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chumdawg

I think there is more of a fraternity among these pros than we realize. I think most of them are pros first and [name the team] second. That's why the heartfelt hugs, the group prayers in football. (Hockey is different...for them, it truly is about respecting the opponent.)

Thus, the notion of "spirit of competition" is quaint but perhaps misguided. The guys who *won't* stay around to shake your hand are probably the biggest competitors of all. Maybe dicks, yeah...but probably pure competitors.

I'm not sure what your first paragraph is addressing. I have no problem with hugs/prayers/etc. I only have issue with those that bolt off the court without addressing the opponent in some manner.

"Being competitive" is not an excuse for poor sportsmanship. Yes, I know it's a quaint idea that professional athletes can also be good sports. But I would like to see it.

chumdawg · 06-24-2012, 04:07 PM

What I'm thinking is that a lot of the pro athletes aren't near the "competitors" that we would like to think they are. I think a lot of them are just professionals, going about their jobs, and don't necessarily care a whole lot whether the team wins or loses. These are the guys who find it very, very easy to shake hands and hug and join in group prayers and such.

It's the guys who *won't* who are most likely to want to rip the opponent's heart out.

Big Boy Laroux · 06-24-2012, 04:24 PM

Yeah I'm not sure where the initial correlation of being competitive and being a good sport came from. I didn't make it.

The 2 are not directly related, not are they mutually exclusive. You can be competitive and a good sport, or one or the other, or neither. To me, it's a respect thing. If you dont respect your opponent, win or lose, that's ridiculous. But hey, as chuck once said, these guys aren't role models.

Big Boy Laroux · 06-24-2012, 04:26 PM

I see where the analogy was first made. To me, "honoring the spirit of competition" and "being competitive" are not the same thing.

chumdawg · 06-24-2012, 06:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Big Boy Laroux

I see where the analogy was first made. To me, "honoring the spirit of competition" and "being competitive" are not the same thing.

Yeah...I know what you are saying. But some competitors just can't turn it on and turn it off like that. I don't see it as that big a deal. What are we gaining by those handshakes, anyway? It's more a cultural thing than a sportsmanship thing, the way I see it.

I noticed a tweet by Artest that said, basically, bowing to the victors showed weakness. Take that for what it's worth, but I don't think anyone will deny that Artest is a fierce competitor.

There are a lot of angles to this. Brooks said "they beat us fair and square." What if you are someone who doesn't feel as though you were beat fair and square? You still want to congratulate the opponent?

Big Boy Laroux · 06-24-2012, 07:11 PM

so if it's obvious the opponent cheated, then they don't deserve any respect. If another team wins because of referees, direct your ire towards the refs, not the other team.

I know i'm taking a hopeful stance here, and i realize i'll never see a day where pro athletes exhibit the same sportsmanship we expect out of our youth. But that doesn't mean i'll stop expecting it of them.

And i'll teach all of my kids the same. I've already had to teach being a good winner and loser to my 4-year-old (candyland and chutes 'n' ladders

).

chumdawg · 06-24-2012, 07:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Big Boy Laroux

I know i'm taking a hopeful stance here, and i realize i'll never see a day where pro athletes exhibit the same sportsmanship we expect out of our youth.

But what I'm getting at is...I'm not sure that the thing we are expecting from our youth is sportsmanship. It's a nice social thing, to be sure, but is it a necessary condition for sportsmanship? I really don't think so. I think that being a sportsman means that you play fair, you play hard, and you respect and protect your opponent. That's it, nothing more. You don't have to host your opponent for a dinner party after the game. The game happens on the field/court, and when it's over it's over.

Big Boy Laroux · 06-24-2012, 08:53 PM

When did we go from shaking hands to a dinner party? I'm not asking for hugs or prayers - that's above and beyond (and you introduced that level to the conversation). Just a freaking handshake, maybe even saying "good game" (while still on the field/court). That's the basest form of being a good winner or a good loser.

Hightailing it to the locker room as soon as you've lost is not being a good loser.

Again, I recognize that I'm taking an idyllic stance. But acknowledging your opponent after a game is indeed a characteristic of sportsmanship.

LonghornDub · 06-24-2012, 09:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chumdawg

The guys who *won't* stay around to shake your hand are probably the biggest competitors of all. Maybe dicks, yeah...but probably pure competitors.

Quote:

Originally Posted by chumdawg

Yeah...I know what you are saying. But some competitors just can't turn it on and turn it off like that.

This is the single worst excuse for that kind of behavior. "I'm such a competitor, man, I just couldn't even go shake his hand after he beat me in fair competition. I just can't turn off my competitive nature"?

Give me a break. That's how a mentally weak "competitor" rationalizes not having the stones to face the guy who beat him.

BBL--you're spot on, both in your general view and in calling out some of the bizarre, off-the-mark comparisons being made.

chumdawg · 06-24-2012, 09:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Big Boy Laroux

When did we go from shaking hands to a dinner party? I'm not asking for hugs or prayers - that's above and beyond (and you introduced that level to the conversation). Just a freaking handshake, maybe even saying "good game" (while still on the field/court). That's the basest form of being a good winner or a good loser.

Hightailing it to the locker room as soon as you've lost is not being a good loser.

Again, I recognize that I'm taking an idyllic stance. But acknowledging your opponent after a game is indeed a characteristic of sportsmanship.

Fair enough. But it still strikes me as a meaningless gesture.

What is the verdict on Dirk leaving the court after a win? I never saw anyone criticize him for that.

chumdawg · 06-24-2012, 10:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LonghornDub

That's how a mentally weak "competitor" rationalizes not having the stones to face the guy who beat him.

This is so laughable. You think Kevin Garnett is mentally weak?

Plain and simple...the guy I would fear facing is the guy who *wouldn't* do the ceremonial handshake. YMMV.

LonghornDub · 06-24-2012, 10:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chumdawg

Fair enough. But it still strikes me as a meaningless gesture.

What is the verdict on Dirk leaving the court after a win? I never saw anyone criticize him for that.

Seems different to me in several respects, not the least of which being that Dirk acknowledged those guys in person a bit later (definitely Wade and LeBron, at least).

KG, on the other hand, ran off the court, wouldn't talk to anyone, skipped his media responsibilities, and (presumably) slinked out he wouldn't have to face anyone. He didn't do that because he's "a competitor" (although he is certainly a competitor). He did it because he's a poor sport and a sore loser.

Just like Artest, who you ironically seem to think is a good example to the contrary. This is the guy who clotheslined JJB in garbage time because he was upset that his team was getting run off its home court. Yeah, a real sportsman, that Artest.

LonghornDub · 06-24-2012, 10:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chumdawg

This is so laughable. You think Kevin Garnett is mentally weak?

He's one of the mentally weakest guys in the NBA, constantly overcompensating with ridiculous bravado and all sorts of nonsense. He's pulling the wool over your eyes with his tough-guy act. I figured you were sharper than that.

Ask Dirk or Tim Duncan (a couple truly mentally tough power forwards) what they think of KG. Duncan hates him--and he doesn't hate anyone. I'm sure Dirk feels about the same. He's a chump.

chumdawg · 06-24-2012, 10:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LonghornDub

He's one of the mentally weakest guys in the NBA, constantly overcompensating with ridiculous bravado and all sorts of nonsense. He's pulling the wool over your eyes with his tough-guy act. I figured you were sharper than that.

Ask Dirk or Tim Duncan (a couple truly mentally tough power forwards) what they think of KG. Duncan hates him--and he doesn't hate anyone. I'm sure Dirk feels about the same. He's a chump.

Here's a tip. Nobody gets all the way to hate for a guy who is among the mentally weakest in the league. The weakest, they just go away, on their own.

LonghornDub · 06-24-2012, 11:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chumdawg

Here's a tip. Nobody gets all the way to hate for a guy who is among the mentally weakest in the league. The weakest, they just go away, on their own.

I couldn't disagree more. We clearly have very different takes on what makes somebody mentally weak. As far as the NBA goes, KG is the absolute epitome of it.