My offseason idea - Dallas-Mavs.com Forums

ballin_boi · 05-05-2007, 11:21 AM

Trade Id: 3778207

Dallas Sends:
Jason Terry
Erick Dampier
3 2nd Round Picks

Indiana Sends:
Jermaine O'Neal

Indiana rebuilds, and I'm positive O'Neal would push to be moved to a contender.

C - O'Neal/Diop/MBenga
PF - Nowitzki/O'Neal/MBenga
SF - Howard/George/Stackhouse
SG - (Free Agent)/Stackhouse/Buckner
PG - Harris/(Free Agent)/Barea

Any ideas for free agent SG's and PG's?

DaRuLz · 05-05-2007, 11:27 AM

Indiana doesnt rebuild it self-destroys

StackAttack · 05-05-2007, 11:32 AM

I can see it happening. O'Neal desperately wants out of that situation, and JET's a fine player to get in return for him if your Indy, maybe even a player they could build around (alongside Granger, who's going to be a fine player in this league for years to come imo).

DelNegro · 05-05-2007, 11:41 AM

No way the Pacers take that deal. They've already got a bunch of bad contracts so they're not going to be interested in taking on two more.

ballin_boi · 05-05-2007, 12:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DelNegro

No way the Pacers take that deal. They've already got a bunch of bad contracts so they're not going to be interested in taking on two more.

Strangely enough I remember hearing them express some interest in Damp. Terry and the picks only sweeten the deal.

Ninkobei · 05-05-2007, 12:43 PM

well, I agree with you on two things: Get rid of the JET (and Stack), and trade our 2nd rounders for SOMETHING, ANYTHING (but preferably a first rounder)

DelNegro · 05-05-2007, 01:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ballin_boi

Strangely enough I remember hearing them express some interest in Damp. Terry and the picks only sweeten the deal.

The Pacers are rebuilding. Rebuilding teams want cap relief, which the mavs can't provide, first round draft picks, which the mavs can't provide, and young talent, which Dampier and Terry aren't. Swap Howard for Dampier in that deal and you probably get the Pacers attention.

jthig32 · 05-05-2007, 01:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DelNegro

The Pacers are rebuilding. Rebuilding teams want cap relief, which the mavs can't provide, first round draft picks, which the mavs can't provide, and young talent, which Dampier and Terry aren't. Swap Howard for Dampier in that deal and you probably get the Pacers attention.

He's right.

Damp has negative trade value right now. Really, he's more valuable to us than just about any other team.

A package with Terry at the center is not going to sniff O'Neal. You need to set your sights a whole lot lower.

SeattleMavsFan · 05-05-2007, 01:23 PM

ya we seem to be screwed this off season as we are over the cap and have too many large contracts right now. i'm sure cuban will think of something but I don't expect any moster deals to go down for the 2007-2008 season.

jthig32 · 05-05-2007, 01:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SeattleMavsFan

ya we seem to be screwed this off season as we are over the cap and have too many large contracts right now. i'm sure cuban will think of something but I don't expect any moster deals to go down for the 2007-2008 season.

Well, Jet is certainly not untradeable. He's just not going to be the main piece in a deal for someone like Jermaine O'Neal.

And if you want to try and go big, Harris has a ton of value right now, as does Josh, if you want to go really crazy.

I don't think I'd touch Josh though, I think he's the perfect SF to play next to Dirk.

Lor20 · 05-05-2007, 03:42 PM

yeah sadly i dont see a lot of chances either. the only player with any value and no overblown contract that the mavs could trade are josh,dirk, devin and diop and terry but other than terry they are all keepers. i would love to see a real PG but the only thing we can do is sign a MLE and i dunno if thats gonna attract anyone - even if u get onto a contender team. next season when bradley and finley are gone from our payroll we will have a chance for a new star again.

dalmations202 · 05-05-2007, 03:46 PM

For O'Neal Dallas should be willing to part with any asset except Dirk and Devin.

If they wanted Damp, Howard, and Terry..... you would still be fine.

Devin, Stack, George, Dirk, O'Neal....... would still be a scoring machine with even better D.

Control the frontline, and have at least one player that can get to the rim fast, and you can compete for the championship.

SeriousSummer · 05-05-2007, 04:08 PM

That's at least semi-realistic. You probably need to take back another player from Indiana (either Granger or Dunleavy, whatever balances the salary levels makes the most sense).

Then swap Harris for Ford or Calderon to have a better passing point guard, and you get something like this:

O'Neal-Diop-MBenga
Nowitzki-Croshere-Pops
George-Buckner
Granger (Dunleavy)-Stackhouse-Ager
Ford (Calderon)-Free Agent-Barrea

Could be a number of changes in the back up positions, but with Dirk & O'Neal up front and a good ball handler, you should be able to put something together--if Indiana bites on the deal.

Ninkobei · 05-05-2007, 04:38 PM

ah... HOWARD is a no-trade. he's our best player...arguably.

SeriousSummer · 05-05-2007, 04:40 PM

Maybe the Mavs best player, but I doubt it, but nowhere as good as J. O'Neal.

jthig32 · 05-05-2007, 04:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ninkobei

ah... HOWARD is a no-trade. he's our best player...arguably.

Uh no, no he's not, and it's not arguable.

StackAttack · 05-05-2007, 06:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ninkobei

ah... HOWARD is a no-trade. he's our best player...arguably.

No. He's not.

MavsWiLLHaVeRinGs · 05-05-2007, 06:35 PM

Mr. Billups, will you join the Mavs for the league minimum, please?

And no we don't trade Howard. Stop even suggesting it.

Ninkobei · 05-05-2007, 06:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by StackAttack

No. He's not.

well apparently he is because I am arguing it. who was the most productive player on the mavs vs the warriors? thats right josh howard.

jthig32 · 05-05-2007, 07:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ninkobei

well apparently he is because I am arguing it. who was the most productive player on the mavs vs the warriors? thats right josh howard.

Wow, that's a great argument for him being the best player on the team.

Bravo.

MavsWiLLHaVeRinGs · 05-05-2007, 07:08 PM

So I Guess Dirk is the worst player on the team, with his performance in that one series?

Ninkobei · 05-05-2007, 08:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MavsWiLLHaVeRinGs

So I Guess Dirk is the worst player on the team, with his performance in that one series?

I'd have to give that award to either george or buck...if thats your opinion then fine but I think it isnt the brightest one.

maybe you should give howard some credit for producing when the game mattered most. sure, dirk was doubled for most of the series..if avery could have found a way to get dirk open shots then things would look different. sure howard may not have reached dirk-superstar level yet, but when he is put into such a role - such as when dirk is injured - anyone can see that he isnt far off. and with the slump dirk has been in over the past month (how many times has he scored 30+ over that period of time?) the line between dirk and howard has been rapidly decreasing. from the mavs fan point of view this is a great thing though. with the progression of howard, and with dirk having the summer off to recouperate and hopefully rid himself of any bad vibe he may have locked in himself, next year might end up being our year.

nashtymavsfan13 · 05-05-2007, 10:43 PM

The posting these last few days has just gotten worse and worse....

ballin_boi · 05-05-2007, 11:00 PM

Well a guy can dream. Keep in mind though...

Vince Carter traded for practically/almost literally nothing.
Baron Davis traded for Speedy Claxton and Dale Davis

So I'm not giving up hope on acquiring any of... Pau, Jermaine, (and to a lesser extent) Allen, (much less) 'Shard or even Pierce until the trade deadline february '08.

MavsWiLLHaVeRinGs · 05-06-2007, 12:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ninkobei

I'd have to give that award to either george or buck...if thats your opinion then fine but I think it isnt the brightest one.

That wasn't my opinion, you said Josh Howard was the best player on the team because of his performance in this one series (stupid) so I said by that logic Dirk must be the worst since he performed so poorly in this one series?

Ninkobei · 05-06-2007, 12:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MavsWiLLHaVeRinGs

That wasn't my opinion, you said Josh Howard was the best player on the team because of his performance in this one series (stupid) so I said by that logic Dirk must be the worst since he performed so poorly in this one series?

he performed poorly yes but he certainly wasnt the worst! by any means. though there were a few passes he shouldnt have made, his O-rebounds made up for a lot.

also, this series carries a lot of weight...I dont care if dirk shoots 20% all year as long as he comes alive in the playoffs (IE: WHEN IT MATTERS).

edit: now it wasnt necessarily dirks fault that he didnt come alive...nelly had a good plan against him and dirk didnt get many good shots. but part of me wishes he could have been the "Lights Out" superstar that hits everything no matter what. but he didnt.

TruthbHeard · 05-06-2007, 12:53 PM

thats an insane trade that would collapse indiana more then the Murphy- dunlevy deal, Oneal for Dirk is probably the only way.

MFFL · 05-06-2007, 01:43 PM

I don't see any white players going to Indiana. They only take bad trades if they get white players.

Lor20 · 05-07-2007, 05:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SeriousSummer

O'Neal-Diop-MBenga
Nowitzki-Croshere-Pops
George-Buckner
Granger (Dunleavy)-Stackhouse-Ager
Ford (Calderon)-Free Agent-Barrea

cro and stack are free agents after this season. so we'd have nowitzki, pops,george, buckner as forwards - ugh - other than dirk they all stink offensively.
and ford-free agent-barea is horrible too.
this lineup would struggle to win 50 games. might work well against a few select teams in the playoffs, but can definetly not get a title.
we'd have like no backups other than at center.

dalmations202 · 05-07-2007, 06:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lor20

cro and stack are free agents after this season. so we'd have nowitzki, pops,george, buckner as forwards - ugh - other than dirk they all stink offensively.
and ford-free agent-barea is horrible too.
this lineup would struggle to win 50 games. might work well against a few select teams in the playoffs, but can definetly not get a title.
we'd have like no backups other than at center.

Huh, that team would compete for a championship.

Dirk is your forward, JO is a PF/C.... if Dirk isn't in the game, Diop comes in and JO moves over. Both are all-star type players. JO can run, and the lineup would be able to run with anyone, as well as put in a half-court set that forces people to double Dirk, JO, and allow multiple people wide open shots. JO is a better shot blocker and defender.

Control the frontline, have one person who can get to the rim and finish consistently, be able to defend both the three and the paint, and you can win it all.

aexchange · 05-07-2007, 07:04 AM

Larry Bird isn't Danny Ainge.

dalmations202 · 05-07-2007, 08:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by aexchange

Larry Bird isn't Danny Ainge.

Agreed, but I still think that keeping Dirk and pairing him with a center that has offense and defense is the best option. JO looks as good as you could get that possesses these abilities. You also still need to be able to be athletic enough to close out on defenders out at the arc, and get to the rim and finish fairly consistently.

The only other option I could see is getting a sure fire SG to stretch the D. He would have to be a shooter/slasher/defender. PPierce and RAllen are the only two I know of that might possibly be available. I think Boston if they get one of the top two picks doesn't move PPierce at all.

If Dallas could find a way to move Terry to Seattle (his hometown) for Ray Allen, it would be a coupe. In fact, they might even think of trying to get both Allen and Lewis. (ex:Allen, Lewis (resigned), Sene for say Damp, Terry, Howard)

The problem is that Avery is correct, can you get a vocal leader in the process? Dirk is the Troy Aikman of the team; awesome talent, good guy. He needs a Michael Irvin though -- that fiery leader that forces the team to go above an beyond expectations.

I know that Avery sees that leader as a PG because he was one, but I don't think it needs to be the PG --- but it does need to be a player that can handle the ball. I am not sure if RAllen would be that person or not, but he would at least sure up the SG position.

So I guess that if I were Donnie/Mark/Avery, I would be targeting JO, and if that wasn't possible then RAllen. The original trade listed would be wonderful for the Dallas Mavericks, IMO.... I just don't know if Indiana would go for it. At least Dallas isn't in the same conference.

mkat · 05-07-2007, 10:26 AM

is O'Neal consistent enought, though?

Five-ofan · 05-07-2007, 11:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dalmations202

For O'Neal Dallas should be willing to part with any asset except Dirk and Devin.

If they wanted Damp, Howard, and Terry..... you would still be fine.

Devin, Stack, George, Dirk, O'Neal....... would still be a scoring machine with even better D.

Control the frontline, and have at least one player that can get to the rim fast, and you can compete for the championship.

first off i dont remotely agree that that lineup is a scoring machine. You have no post player and 1 guy who can shoot. horrible combo.

Ninko to argue that josh howard is the best player on the mavs is just ridiculously stupid. They face nowhere NEAR the same amount of defensive attention. Dirk is without question a better player than josh howard. they arent even remotely in the same league.

dalmations202 · 05-07-2007, 11:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Five-ofan

first off i dont remotely agree that that lineup is a scoring machine. You have no post player and 1 guy who can shoot. horrible combo.

JO doesn't have a post up game? Every time I have watched him play he is a TD-lite. 15' and in player with good moves around the basket.

I'll admit I don't watch him all the time, but he is a 20 ppg player with good D from what I have seen.

Five-ofan · 05-07-2007, 11:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dalmations202

JO doesn't have a post up game? Every time I have watched him play he is a TD-lite. 15' and in player with good moves around the basket.

I'll admit I don't watch him all the time, but he is a 20 ppg player with good D from what I have seen.

no hes not a post player. hes a face up jump shooter which is why 2 of the last 4 years hes shot under 44% from the field. his post game is roughly the equivalent of dirks. it shows flashes every now and then and it should be good(though for different reasons, dirks because of his height and touch, jos because of his height and athletecism)

TruthbHeard · 05-07-2007, 12:30 PM

Bringing Oneal into Dallas is an exellent idea, he led the league in shot blocks if I recall, Having him and Diop in the backcourt would make this the best defensive club in the leaque:
How bout
Dirk+Terry=Oneal+tinsley

Diop/Dampier/Mbenga
Oneal/Crosure
Jho/George
Ager/Buck
Harris/Tinsley

Right now Im just worried that next year an athletic team will again dominate us like Pheonix or GS, so if 2 shot blockers are their no Amare, NO Duncan, or Dwade can ever get to the rim with these two guys starting, and with more depth than Indiana our Offense will be up their as well

Five-ofan · 05-07-2007, 12:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TruthbHeard

Bringing Oneal into Dallas is an exellent idea, he led the league in shot blocks if I recall, Having him and Diop in the backcourt would make this the best defensive club in the leaque:
How bout
Dirk+Terry=Oneal+tinsley

Diop/Dampier/Mbenga
Oneal/Crosure
Jho/George
Ager/Buck
Harris/Tinsley

Right now Im just worried that next year an athletic team will again dominate us like Pheonix or GS, so if 2 shot blockers are their no Amare, NO Duncan, or Dwade can ever get to the rim with these two guys starting, and with more depth than Indiana our Offense will be up their as well

you win the idiot of the day award.

mkat · 05-07-2007, 12:35 PM

give up dirk for o'neal? haha.. come on. we want both or no deal!

dalmations202 · 05-07-2007, 01:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mkat

give up dirk for o'neal? haha.. come on. we want both or no deal!

I must agree here.