2020 NBA Draft

[KillerLeft]

Originally Posted by mac222b

I’m one of the most adamant around here that we desperately need another secondary ball handler/ creator and I don’t think Brunson is the answer. I think Brunson is a good player on a good contract and still has room to improve but not a guy who can consistently get his own. KP just hasn’t been that efficient in the post or off the bounce. He seemed more efficient in the mid range against the Clipper and maybe that’s a harbinger of better things. But he lacks the quicks and explosion that give, say, Anthony Davis his space for wide open mid range shots. He lacks the strength and obviously the vision of Jokic. Hardaway? Seth? They should be 4th, 5th, 6th options. Brunson too.

I think teams are always going to scheme to get the ball out of Lukas hands and luckily we have RC who is crafty enough to counter.. But we desperately need a guy quick off the bounce who can make a team pay and also simply to give Luka some rest from the heavy useage. I like Burke but I worry about having/paying/playing so many small guys without the defensive chops of Lowrey and Van Vleet. With MLE the priority should be big long wings who can guard 3-5. Maybe we get one or two guys like that in the draft? Maybe we don’t love the options in FA and give Burke a chunk of the MLE? I just wonder about committing resources and minutes to Burke if you have already have smallish guards in Brunson and Seth not to mention what happens if we can’t offload Delon? Where will the minutes come from? Maybe we look to move Brunson in the right deal?

I think Burke was/is for us a smaller version of what Utah traded for in Clarkson. They were another team that lacked creators, even pre Bogdan injury. If they think he can give reliably give the team Clarkson like production for half the cost maybe that’s a good value? I think Clarkson gets someone’s MLE or close to it.

Yeah, I buy all of this. I don't know, it could've been a flash in the pan hot streak, but I just have a good feeling about Burke. I just feel like you lock him in and then move some of those other small guys out. But your point is taken, for sure.

[rimrocker]

Originally Posted by KillerLeft

Yeah, I buy all of this. I don't know, it could've been a flash in the pan hot streak, but I just have a good feeling about Burke. I just feel like you lock him in and then move some of those other small guys out. But your point is taken, for sure.

I still think a trade with the Sixers with Curry and Richardson being the center pieces is something that should be initiated by Donnie. Seems like there could be win-win situation because both players would fill needs of the other team.

They get a much needed veteran shooter and we get a legit 3-D wing who can handle the ball.

Would Curry/#18 for Richardson/#34 or #36 have any chance?

[mac222b]

Originally Posted by rimrocker

I still think a trade with the Sixers with Curry and Richardson being the center pieces is something that should be initiated by Donnie. Seems like there could be win-win situation because both players would fill needs of the other team.

They get a much needed veteran shooter and we get a legit 3-D wing who can handle the ball.

Would Curry/#18 for Richardson/#34 or #36 have any chance?

Could be. There is the variable of new coach in Philly. That could work in our favor or new coach could have a vision for how to use Richardson better.

[tap2390]

No way in hell I give up Curry + 18 for Richardson... I even hesitate to give up Curry alone. Curry + Jackson for Richardson + Thybulle, take it or leave it.

Philly doesn't have a lot of leverage when it comes to trade talks (especially for the statistically best three point shooter in the NBA) and IMO we should do everything in our power to keep #18 and lock up a decent player on a rookie deal.


Edit: Curry basically shot 60/50/100 in the playoffs. His stock is sky high and if we're going to ship him off we should demand a hell of a deal.

[sefant77]

yeah you dont throw away a top-3 shooter in the NBA on a bargain contract. Yes, his defense is pretty bad but your target should be to improve the overall defense so you find more spots to play Curry heavy minutes without trading points because of bad defense.

Richardson is an UFA next summer. If they want him, they can also just overpay him a few million each year. He wont walk away from additional 10m+ with his "limited" career earnings so far

[DevinHarriswillstart]

Or just draft a 3 and D guy? Shocking how many people are underestimating the value of the 18 pick in this draft. There are a TON of quality players that will be available then.

[EricaLubarsky]

Originally Posted by DevinHarriswillstart

Or just draft a 3 and D guy? Shocking how many people are underestimating the value of the 18 pick in this draft. There are a TON of quality players that will be available then.

To be fair, historically our odds aren't great with those picks. Outside the top 10, the odds of getting a strong player are fairly low.

18th
20% were starters or stars.
25% were role players with starting potential (5th man to 10th man)
55% were bench players or total busts.

31st
5% were starters or stars (no stars were drafted at 31)
50% were role players with starting potential (5th man to 10th man)
45% were bench players or total busts.

Probablly less than 50% with each pick that we'll get a player capable of starting for a playoff team, but uness we get a super sweet deal, I think it's the best wager we can make. You can flip a coin twice and get tails twice. We may very well fail with both picks, but if we get even one starter on a cheap deal out of those two picks, I think we have to go that way.

[DevinHarriswillstart]

Well there is no way covid doesn't affect the cap, and that means you're gonna have to get smart with contracts. That means taking the draft serious regardless of whether we're a playoff team or not. If 18 gets us a third star in a trader, then great, all the power to doing it. Otherwise, the talent available at that pick is definitely worth a shot. Bey, Terry, Lewis Jr are all going to be rotation players at the very least IMO. I just feel like you can easily get a Josh Richardson versus having to give up big value to get him.

[KillerLeft]

Originally Posted by DevinHarriswillstart

Well there is no way covid doesn't affect the cap, and that means you're gonna have to get smart with contracts. That means taking the draft serious regardless of whether we're a playoff team or not. If 18 gets us a third star in a trader, then great, all the power to doing it. Otherwise, the talent available at that pick is definitely worth a shot. Bey, Terry, Lewis Jr are all going to be rotation players at the very least IMO. I just feel like you can easily get a Josh Richardson versus having to give up big value to get him.

I think the league might actually take some risks in an effort to prevent the pandemic from affecting the cap. While it would seem logical to lower it, I've heard that they're very focused on preventing a future cap spike like the one that enabled Durant to sign with GS. It will be interesting how they handle this.

Just an aside, and not meant to argue your overall point. Obviously, being smart with talent acquisition is important, and that includes finding contributors on rookie contracts, even in normal cap situations.

[EricaLubarsky]

It's hard to imagine what will happen with viewership (profits) falling so much.

The biggest losses are nationally televised game viewership, which is fine for the regular season because they're making up the revenue with online/digital/a la carte packages, but now the the playoffs are here which means every game is nationally televised and the numbers are down precipitously (12% year over year) and it's not a one-year trend. We've been falling for four years despite fairly strong profits.

The NBA could try to correct for COVID by doing a future projection, but with four consecutive years of viewership shrinkage, it's hard to paint a rosey picture-- or even know where we're headed.

[KillerLeft]

Originally Posted by EricaLubarsky

It's hard to imagine what will happen with viewership (profits) falling so much.

The biggest losses are nationally televised game viewership, which is fine for the regular season because they're making up the revenue with online/digital/a la carte packages, but now the the playoffs are here which means every game is nationally televised and the numbers are down precipitously (12% year over year) and it's not a one-year trend. We've been falling for four years despite fairly strong profits.

The NBA could try to correct for COVID by doing a future projection, but with four consecutive years of viewership shrinkage, it's hard to paint a rosey picture-- or even know where we're headed.

I agree, that's an issue they're facing. I saw demo percentages the other day, and they were strong, so it seems like this is a result of cord cutting (fewer viewers for anything). I know I'm not paying for cable just to watch sports, when streaming is way more convenient and cheaper (for now).

I gotta think the sports world will figure out how to get over this hurdle, eventually. But yeah, it's currently a problem.

[DevinHarriswillstart]

It still baffles me how they can even keep track of viewership with regards to streamers. I just bought hulu live for a month then cancelled it once the Mavs season was over.

[KillerLeft]

Originally Posted by DevinHarriswillstart

It still baffles me how they can even keep track of viewership with regards to streamers. I just bought hulu live for a month then cancelled it once the Mavs season was over.

How was it? Worth the money? Did you get the FSSW feed, or the national feed?

[BPo001]

Shams Charania: The NBA and NBPA have agreed to push back key dates such as Oct. 16 draft, Oct. 18 free agency and 2020-21 season, sources tell @The Athletic @Stadium. New dates will be determined later. – via Twitter ShamsCharania

[DevinHarriswillstart]

Originally Posted by KillerLeft

How was it? Worth the money? Did you get the FSSW feed, or the national feed?

Both. It's really expensive (60 a month), but you can cancel or switch to the regular streaming anytime. In fact, since I was already a customer, I only had to pay for half the month when I singed up, and then the 60 after that.

Negative is the feeds do get interrupted. It's something that streaming live hasn't quite figured out yet.

[KillerLeft]

Originally Posted by DevinHarriswillstart

Both. It's really expensive (60 a month), but you can cancel or switch to the regular streaming anytime. In fact, since I was already a customer, I only had to pay for half the month when I singed up, and then the 60 after that.

Negative is the feeds do get interrupted. It's something that streaming live hasn't quite figured out yet.

$60 is too much.

[sefant77]

Draft moved Back to november 18th...aff

[tap2390]

Originally Posted by sefant77

Draft moved Back to november 18th...aff

[tap2390]

1) Anthony Edwards
2) James Wiseman
3) Isaac Okoro
4) Obi Toppin
5) Tyrese Haliburton
6) Killian Hayes
7) Deni Avdija
8) Patrick Williams
9) Devin Vassell
10) Tyrell Terry
11) Tyrese Maxey
12) Onyeka Okongwu
13) Saddiq Bey
14) Jahmius Ramsey
15) Kira Lewis
16) Josh Green
17) Precious Achiuwa
18) Isaiah Stewart
19) Aaron Nesmith
20) Cole Anthony
21) Immanuel Quickley
22) Desmond Bane
23) Theo Maledon
24) Tyler Bey
25) Paul Reed
26) Jalen Smith
27) Nico Mannion
28) Devin Dotson
29) Elijah Hughes
30) Robert Woodard

OFF MY BOARD: LaMelo Ball (talent not worth the hassle)

JUST MISSED THE CUT: Cassius Stanley, Jaden McDaniels, Tre Jones

[KillerLeft]

Man, I wholeheartedly agree about anyone whose last name is Ball. F that.

[EricaLubarsky]

Ball gives me Josh Howard.vibes

[KillerLeft]

Originally Posted by EricaLubarsky

Ball gives me Josh Howard.vibes

In a good way, or a bad way? That guy gave the team a lot before it went south.

[SMC0007]

As a life long TCU fan, gimmie Desmond Bane. At pick 18 it might be debatable but no way he is there at 31. Really good strong defender, elite level 3pt shooter, can distribute and has an extremely high motor. Immediately becomes the best defensive guard on the team.

[EricaLubarsky]

Originally Posted by KillerLeft

In a good way, or a bad way? That guy gave the team a lot before it went south.

Both.

Super skilled. Lots of motivation, but lacks social skills or leadership. May not have longetivity in the league because of attitude and ability to get along with others.

[KillerLeft]

Originally Posted by EricaLubarsky

Both.

Super skilled. Lots of motivation, but lacks social skills or leadership. May not have longetivity in the league because of attitude and ability to get along with others.

Yeah, I'll co-sign this. And, for perspective, I think Howard actually had a good career in college with a good coach, so he was far more likely to figure that stuff out than Ball, who has spent the last three years getting yanked off of any roster where the coach tried to teach him anything.

[mac222b]

Originally Posted by SMC0007

As a life long TCU fan, gimmie Desmond Bane. At pick 18 it might be debatable but no way he is there at 31. Really good strong defender, elite level 3pt shooter, can distribute and has an extremely high motor. Immediately becomes the best defensive guard on the team.

Just watched him some again. Main concern is slow and low release on 3’s. Doesn’t get much lift either. Concern against NBA close outs. Also he’s 6’5 or so but maybe not much wingspan. Do you think he can potentially guard 1-3 or just twos and threes? Hard to get a feel for how they move hips and feet from highlight reels. That he played for Jamie Dixon bodes well. Can’t play for him if you aren’t capable of playing tough, physical man to man defense, so there will be plenty of tape of him on that end. I watched his teams for many years at Pitt and his guys really get after it and compete defensively.

[mac222b]

Originally Posted by tap2390

1) Anthony Edwards
2) James Wiseman
3) Isaac Okoro
4) Obi Toppin
5) Tyrese Haliburton
6) Killian Hayes
7) Deni Avdija
8) Patrick Williams
9) Devin Vassell
10) Tyrell Terry
11) Tyrese Maxey
12) Onyeka Okongwu
13) Saddiq Bey
14) Jahmius Ramsey
15) Kira Lewis
16) Josh Green
17) Precious Achiuwa
18) Isaiah Stewart
19) Aaron Nesmith
20) Cole Anthony
21) Immanuel Quickley
22) Desmond Bane
23) Theo Maledon
24) Tyler Bey
25) Paul Reed
26) Jalen Smith
27) Nico Mannion
28) Devin Dotson
29) Elijah Hughes
30) Robert Woodard

OFF MY BOARD: LaMelo Ball (talent not worth the hassle)

JUST MISSED THE CUT: Cassius Stanley, Jaden McDaniels, Tre Jones

I’ve developed a crush on McDaniels. He really knows how to get to his spots and rise up with length. Like Michael Porter Jr. Uses the glass well. Potentially good defender and rebounder. Of course he’s not nearly as polished as Porter but he has gifts. Kind of guy that won’t get past OKC or Boston as we like to say around here. I could see Portland taking him as they go BPA and don’t mind waiting on young guys. He’s like a more skilled Bazley only less cerebral.

[sefant77]

I think Toppin is the last thing the Mavs need. Picking this year around #5-7 and i would probably take 14 other player ahead of him

[tap2390]

Originally Posted by sefant77

I think Toppin is the last thing the Mavs need. Picking this year around #5-7 and i would probably take 14 other player ahead of him

I’m higher on Toppin than most. He reminds me of a better all-around Aaron Gordon.

I really like Bane’s ability to catch and shoot off screens. I think he’s going to have a long 3&D career despite his negative wingspan and relative lack of explosiveness.

Not a huge Jaden McDaniels guy but the tools are definitely there. I’m just not sure I see him putting it all together.

[SMC0007]

Originally Posted by mac222b

Just watched him some again. Main concern is slow and low release on 3’s. Doesn’t get much lift either. Concern against NBA close outs. Also he’s 6’5 or so but maybe not much wingspan. Do you think he can potentially guard 1-3 or just twos and threes? Hard to get a feel for how they move hips and feet from highlight reels. That he played for Jamie Dixon bodes well. Can’t play for him if you aren’t capable of playing tough, physical man to man defense, so there will be plenty of tape of him on that end. I watched his teams for many years at Pitt and his guys really get after it and compete defensively.

I thought he was legit 6'6". His positioning, anticipation and activity defensively make up for any lack of wingspan. I specifically recorded all TCU games because of him the last 2+ seasons. Even in his highlight and scouting vids he is often defended by longer wings because it's hard to keep up with him off the ball. Best bet is to have those longer arms and close out because he runs off screens well and has as high of a motor as anyone I recall. I see him as a Ray Allen/ Brogdan type mix. If people are interested in a guy being high IQ and mature enough to roll into an NBA team, I'd bet on him. Especially with Luka running the offense.

I think he could take the best opposing offensive guard now and has potential to guard 1-3 but would be ready for high level longer wings after a CPL months. Much like Luka, you can use him earlier than a lot of other draftees, plug and play ready


Gotta love the porn music to this scout video. Lol
https://youtu.be/9R-9RwE7aOM


Look how much he runs off ball. Many times he is WIDE ass open for a 3.
https://youtu.be/47tczQYmpNs


He is a great example of the difference between having athleticism and being a highflyer. He CAN get up and throw it down but he has too many tools for that to be a focal point imo.
https://youtu.be/xqU_bcmSNWo

He has always had decent hops but most importantly he goes strong. Might not always posterize defenders but he is agressive enough to damn sure try and he has got a few .
https://youtu.be/eHUpbsiXfNY

[Scoobay]

Originally Posted by SMC0007

I thought he was legit 6'6". His positioning, anticipation and activity defensively make up for any lack of wingspan. I specifically recorded all TCU games because of him the last 2+ seasons. Even in his highlight and scouting vids he is often defended by longer wings because it's hard to keep up with him off the ball. Best bet is to have those longer arms and close out because he runs off screens well and has as high of a motor as anyone I recall. I see him as a Ray Allen/ Brogdan type mix. If people are interested in a guy being high IQ and mature enough to roll into an NBA team, I'd bet on him. Especially with Luka running the offense.

I think he could take the best opposing offensive guard now and has potential to guard 1-3 but would be ready for high level longer wings after a CPL months. Much like Luka, you can use him earlier than a lot of other draftees, plug and play ready


Gotta love the porn music to this scout video. Lol
https://youtu.be/9R-9RwE7aOM


Look how much he runs off ball. Many times he is WIDE ass open for a 3.
https://youtu.be/47tczQYmpNs


He is a great example of the difference between having athleticism and being a highflyer. He CAN get up and throw it down but he has too many tools for that to be a focal point imo.
https://youtu.be/xqU_bcmSNWo

He has always had decent hops but most importantly he goes strong. Might not always posterize defenders but he is agressive enough to damn sure try and he has got a few .
https://youtu.be/eHUpbsiXfNY

thanks for the vids
his release does look kind funky but his % was pretty high

he looks like he's built very solidly

[mac222b]

Originally Posted by tap2390

I’m higher on Toppin than most. He reminds me of a better all-around Aaron Gordon.

I really like Bane’s ability to catch and shoot off screens. I think he’s going to have a long 3&D career despite his negative wingspan and relative lack of explosiveness.

Not a huge Jaden McDaniels guy but the tools are definitely there. I’m just not sure I see him putting it all together.

Oh he has probably the biggest bust to star ratio in this draft. Could easily see him washing out. Was just reading an article about his techs and turnovers and how he was benched. They had a talented team and were pretty terrible.

On the other hand: he’s only 19, he has really nice handles for a guy with his length and athleticism. He has good footwork, a legit spin move. Nice touch from mid range. He has NBA range(he hit some deep 3s in the videos I watched). His rebound&blocks numbers were good. He has a little playmaking ability. Really reminds me of Porter Jr. or a larger, more athletic Middleton. Especially in the way he uses his handle and size and footwork to get to his spots at all three levels. I think he will have trouble finishing until he bulks up, he seems to shy away from contact. Character issues may keep him off our board, but I’m curious to see who takes him and how far he slides.

[BPo001]

The NBA has locked in Nov. 18 for the 2020 draft, sources told Adrian Wojnarowski.

[EricaLubarsky]

Originally Posted by BPo001

The NBA has locked in Nov. 18 for the 2020 draft, sources told Adrian Wojnarowski.

Booooo! it was originally planned for October 16th and thought it was just a month away

[tap2390]

Newest NBADraft.net mock has us ending up with Tyrell Terry and Isaiah Stewart. I can’t imagine the draft being much better than that.

[EricaLubarsky]

Originally Posted by tap2390

Newest NBADraft.net mock has us ending up with Tyrell Terry and Isaiah Stewart. I can’t imagine the draft being much better than that.

[mac222b]

Originally Posted by tap2390

Newest NBADraft.net mock has us ending up with Tyrell Terry and Isaiah Stewart. I can’t imagine the draft being much better than that.

Would be more than happy with that. People are sleeping on Terry.

[DevinHarriswillstart]

Give me Terry or Lewis.

[SMC0007]

Terry has a ton of potential. Just hope no one expects him to be NBA ready defensively.

[EricaLubarsky]

Is it crazy that I just want a Terry on this team at all times?