Summer 2012 Assets

[Five-ofan]

Originally Posted by KillerLeft

Unless Williams signs here, I'd say there's very little chance Haywood gets amnestied, and even if they lock Williams up...it's still iffy.

Cuban won't want to pay the guy to play for another team, trust me. I'd say DoJo and Roddy are both more likely candidates.

Why would we amnesty dojo or roddy? They both make peanuts

[dude1394]

I'm quite sure killer doesn't mean amnesty, just eliminate their salary.

[KillerLeft]

Originally Posted by Five-ofan

Why would we amnesty dojo or roddy? They both make peanuts

The same reason they'd amnesty Haywood: to get slightly under the cap, or better still - to get under the tax threshold, which is even more of an issue now that they've wasted a tax year on Lamar Odom. Yuck.

In a tax or no tax situation, dropping Jones or Beaubois off of the books could potentially save quite a bit. And remember, as bad as Haywood was this year, he's not in danger of falling out of the rotation any time soon, even if they sign a new starter (please, please, please).

Cuban is going to look long and hard for an alternative to paying tons of money for an experienced player to go contribute to another team while also having to pay MORE money to replace that player on THIS team. With Jones or Beaubois, he won't have that issue - it'll be just like the Fernandez/Brewer trade in a way.

[Five-ofan]

Originally Posted by KillerLeft

The same reason they'd amnesty Haywood: to get slightly under the cap, or better still - to get under the tax threshold, which is even more of an issue now that they've wasted a tax year on Lamar Odom. Yuck.

In a tax or no tax situation, dropping Jones or Beaubois off of the books could potentially save quite a bit. And remember, as bad as Haywood was this year, he's not in danger of falling out of the rotation any time soon, even if they sign a new starter (please, please, please).

Cuban is going to look long and hard for an alternative to paying tons of money for an experienced player to go contribute to another team while also having to pay MORE money to replace that player on THIS team. With Jones or Beaubois, he won't have that issue - it'll be just like the Fernandez/Brewer trade in a way.

There is no chance whatsoever either of those two gets amnestied. The amnesty will be Haywood or if we were lucky enough to trade him, Shawn Marion

[KillerLeft]

Originally Posted by Five-ofan

There is no chance whatsoever either of those two gets amnestied. The amnesty will be Haywood or if we were lucky enough to trade him, Shawn Marion

I agree that an amnesty of Marion or Haywood is possible, but not likely. There would have to be a specific "home run" type of move waiting in the wings to motivate a Cuban money flush of that magnitude.

For Williams AND Howard? Sure, of course he'd do it to get that done, but that doesn't mean the Cubes is itching to pay that kind of money for a guy to play on another team - especially once you realize he'd have to DOUBLE his losses in order to replace either of those guys on THIS roster.

This is one of those myths that came about in an off the cuff, fly-by-night article attempting to illustrate the possibility of doing something really, really big (I think they called it 3D, lolz). The really, really big possibility has since dissipated, but for some reason people still think it makes sense to take the same drastic measures...for what - Chris Kaman? Nope.

As for the two players I mentioned, Beaubois and Jones, I agree there isn't much incentive to amnesty them right now. They're both relatively cheap when examined individually.

However, if somehow this payroll nears the tax level again next season (there are ways that could happen) and one of those guys figures to be outside of the regular rotation...yeah, using the amnesty tool on him would be highly plausible. It COULD get them under the tax threshold, which saves them the dollar for dollar tax - that's REAL LIVE MONEY, not salary cap "monopoly money."

Further, as we all know, the Mavs have just wasted a tax year by absorbing Lamar Odom's contract with their trade exception, so using the amnesty on Jones or Beaubois (again, if certain factors dictate that it's advantageous to do so) could reset the "repeater" tax countdown, and thereby save Cuban MILLIONS of dollars.

So yeah...I can't say I agree with your "no chance whatsoever" assessment, sorry. I will concede that a lot can change between now and the end of July, so anything is possible. If I had to guess today, I'd guess that neither Haywood nor Marion gets the amnesty axe.

[balldontliez]

i'll bet you haywood gets amnestied killer

[KillerLeft]

Originally Posted by balldontliez

i'll bet you haywood gets amnestied killer

We'll see, pal.

DLord, myself and a guy I know who works for the Mavs all disagree with you.

[balldontliez]

Originally Posted by KillerLeft

We'll see, pal.

DLord, myself and a guy I know who works for the Mavs all disagree with you.

if they keep rewarding a bum like that then i'll have lost all faith in them.

i hated the contract at the time, but after acquiring tyson i was like hey, well maybe they knew what they were doing, a wood is just a big insurance policy, but you can't be satisfied with him as your starter...i mean you can but you aint gonna win nothing

[jthig32]

Originally Posted by KillerLeft

I agree that an amnesty of Marion or Haywood is possible, but not likely. There would have to be a specific "home run" type of move waiting in the wings to motivate a Cuban money flush of that magnitude.

For Williams AND Howard? Sure, of course he'd do it to get that done, but that doesn't mean the Cubes is itching to pay that kind of money for a guy to play on another team - especially once you realize he'd have to DOUBLE his losses in order to replace either of those guys on THIS roster.

This is one of those myths that came about in an off the cuff, fly-by-night article attempting to illustrate the possibility of doing something really, really big (I think they called it 3D, lolz). The really, really big possibility has since dissipated, but for some reason people still think it makes sense to take the same drastic measures...for what - Chris Kaman? Nope.

As for the two players I mentioned, Beaubois and Jones, I agree there isn't much incentive to amnesty them right now. They're both relatively cheap when examined individually.

However, if somehow this payroll nears the tax level again next season (there are ways that could happen) and one of those guys figures to be outside of the regular rotation...yeah, using the amnesty tool on him would be highly plausible. It COULD get them under the tax threshold, which saves them the dollar for dollar tax - that's REAL LIVE MONEY, not salary cap "monopoly money."

Further, as we all know, the Mavs have just wasted a tax year by absorbing Lamar Odom's contract with their trade exception, so using the amnesty on Jones or Beaubois (again, if certain factors dictate that it's advantageous to do so) could reset the "repeater" tax countdown, and thereby save Cuban MILLIONS of dollars.

So yeah...I can't say I agree with your "no chance whatsoever" assessment, sorry. I will concede that a lot can change between now and the end of July, so anything is possible. If I had to guess today, I'd guess that neither Haywood nor Marion gets the amnesty axe.

I'm in agreement that Haywood being amnestied isn't nearly as likely as many are making it. And I think there's about a 1% chance that Marion gets amnestied.

The problem with your scenario, though, is that it would probably be fairly easy to move either of those guys rather than amnesty them. In the case of Roddy, especially, I just don't see any scenario where he's amnestied. There are plenty of teams that would take on Roddy's contract.

Jones would be marginally harder to move, but I find it hard to believe that some team wouldn't take him on, maybe even taking a second round pick as incentive.

I'd say the ONLY way they use the amnesty on Jones or Roddy is if Haywood and Marion are traded this off season. If they're not maybe you don't amnesty one of them this season, but you sure as hell want to keep that amnesty provision in your back pocket,

One thing you seem to be overlooking: The amnesty provision has to be used by July 18th. The Mavs aren't really going to have the clear picture you're describing by then.

I also think it's very, very, very unlikely that the Mavs are in the luxury tax next season, or even close to it, really.

[BGMaverick9]

If they don't use the amnesty on Roddy or Jones this year (which I would expect to be the case), why would they do it next summer? Unless I'm totally missing something, they can just nix the team option on Jones and likely just rescind the QO for Roddy if you really want to rid yourself of their deals.

[KillerLeft]

Originally Posted by jthig32

I also think it's very, very, very unlikely that the Mavs are in the luxury tax next season, or even close to it, really.

I agree, it's highly unlikely.

[KillerLeft]

Originally Posted by BGMaverick9

If they don't use the amnesty on Roddy or Jones this year (which I would expect to be the case), why would they do it next summer? Unless I'm totally missing something, they can just nix the team option on Jones and likely just rescind the QO for Roddy if you really want to rid yourself of their deals.

Yeah, the amnesty option doesn't make a lot of sense for either of those guys after this summer, and it only makes sense this summer if tax implications come up which is an unlikely scenario...just throwing out possibilities that could be plausible with a couple of the right breaks.

I stand by my opinion about Haywood/Marion though, even with Haywood's poor play this season. Cuban does not want to amnesty anyone with that big of a contract if he can avoid it.

[jthig32]

Originally Posted by BGMaverick9

If they don't use the amnesty on Roddy or Jones this year (which I would expect to be the case), why would they do it next summer? Unless I'm totally missing something, they can just nix the team option on Jones and likely just rescind the QO for Roddy if you really want to rid yourself of their deals.

Yeah, that's not what I meant. I worded that entire post poorly.

What I meant to say is that if Haywood (and to a lesser extent, Marion) is still on the team next season, you can pretty much guarantee that they won't use the amnesty on Jones or Roddy. You'll want to keep the amnesty in tact, in case you want to use it on Haywood NEXT off season. Or the one after that.

Basically I'm saying that Haywood' contract has the potential to become much more cumbersome if you burn your amnesty on a piddling contract like Roddy or Jones.

[oilfieldtrash]

Originally Posted by KillerLeft

Yeah, the amnesty option doesn't make a lot of sense for either of those guys after this summer, and it only makes sense this summer if tax implications come up which is an unlikely scenario...just throwing out possibilities that could be plausible with a couple of the right breaks.

I stand by my opinion about Haywood/Marion though, even with Haywood's poor play this season. Cuban does not want to amnesty anyone with that big of a contract if he can avoid it.

I'm not liking the new fiscally responsible Cuban. If eating Haywoods contract helps the team then Haywood should be gone. Of course it's not my money.

[KillerLeft]

Originally Posted by jthig32

Basically I'm saying that Haywood' contract has the potential to become much more cumbersome if you burn your amnesty on a piddling contract like Roddy or Jones.

I buy this logic...and then closer we get to the end of Haywood's contract the easier it gets to swallow that money.

[Kidd Karma]

Originally Posted by oilfieldtrash

I'm not liking the new fiscally responsible Cuban. If eating Haywoods contract helps the team then Haywood should be gone. Of course it's not my money.

It helps when he has the ring under his belt. But this has more to do with "rebuilding" a team with a centerpiece and maintaining flexibility until you get that centerpiece. It's only been one season, a lockout shortened one at that and wouldn't be surprised he'd keep that flexibility one more season in an effort to keep things open for Howard. the standard right now is OKC and it's Big 3.

[Underdog]

Originally Posted by KillerLeft

I buy this logic...and then closer we get to the end of Haywood's contract the easier it gets to swallow that money.

Exactly.

Plus, Cuban isn't going to amnesty Haywood until Dwight Howard decides to join Dirk and Deron in summer 2013...

[BGMaverick9]

Originally Posted by jthig32

Yeah, that's not what I meant. I worded that entire post poorly.

What I meant to say is that if Haywood (and to a lesser extent, Marion) is still on the team next season, you can pretty much guarantee that they won't use the amnesty on Jones or Roddy. You'll want to keep the amnesty in tact, in case you want to use it on Haywood NEXT off season. Or the one after that.

Basically I'm saying that Haywood' contract has the potential to become much more cumbersome if you burn your amnesty on a piddling contract like Roddy or Jones.

I wasn't referencing your post to give my opinion lol.
The basis for my thought was it seems like an awful waste to use the amnesty on Roddy or Jones, simply for the dollar amount.

[jthig32]

Originally Posted by BGMaverick9

I wasn't referencing your post to give my opinion lol.
The basis for my thought was it seems like an awful waste to use the amnesty on Roddy or Jones, simply for the dollar amount.

Ah, I missed the part of KL's post that talked about next year.

[OneLove22]

Azubuike is an intriguing player for us. I hope he's back!

[Scott McGuire]

Originally Posted by OneLove22

Azubuike is an intriguing player for us. I hope he's back!

I believe he was signed for next year. We have a team option on him for the minimum and this season was just letting him get out on the court for a few minutes. Azubuike Wright and Dirk are the only people I think you can guarantee will be on the roster next year. Although Wright could be traded if someone offered too much.

[OneLove22]

Originally Posted by Scott McGuire

I believe he was signed for next year. We have a team option on him for the minimum and this season was just letting him get out on the court for a few minutes. Azubuike Wright and Dirk are the only people I think you can guarantee will be on the roster next year. Although Wright could be traded if someone offered too much.

I know he will be back for next year, but I mean back as playing like his old self. I hope he recovered fully. He had game!

[CaseyJones]

My only opinion is to trade Roddy, DoJo, Mahinmi, and Haywood. Keep Brandan Wright and JET.

[Scott McGuire]

Originally Posted by OneLove22

I know he will be back for next year, but I mean back as playing like his old self. I hope he recovered fully. He had game!

Ohhh. I get it now. I didn't read into that. I thought you just meant physically back and not back to what he was.

In that case, I hope he's back too.

[nowhereman]

Am I off-base here? I thought you had to use the amnesty provision within two seasons (meaning we would have to cut haywood/whomever before the end of next season).

[jthig32]

Originally Posted by nowhereman

Am I off-base here? I thought you had to use the amnesty provision within two seasons (meaning we would have to cut haywood/whomever before the end of next season).

Nope. There is no time limit on the amnesty provision, other than the naturally limiting fact that all contracts that can potentially be amnestied will expire in no more than four years.

[nowhereman]

Originally Posted by jthig32

Nope. There is no time limit on the amnesty provision, other than the naturally limiting fact that all contracts that can potentially be amnestied will expire in no more than four years.

Sweet - thanks for the info. I'm not sure why I thought there was a two year window in which the team had to use it.

[Kidd Karma]

Originally Posted by nowhereman

Am I off-base here? I thought you had to use the amnesty provision within two seasons (meaning we would have to cut haywood/whomever before the end of next season).

It's the length of the CBA, but I don't think anyone had more than a 6 year deal last season. Plus it has to be used during the offseason. Here's a link to Coon's explanation:

http://www.cbafaq.com/salarycap.htm#Q67

[CaseyJones]

Mavs eyeing Jeremy Lin
Article

[CaseyJones]

CJ Miles also talking Mavs

[OneLove22]

Originally Posted by CaseyJones

Mavs eyeing Jeremy Lin
Article

Please no. He is going to get overpaid.

[OneLove22]

Originally Posted by CaseyJones

CJ Miles also talking Mavs

I would be in favor of signing CJ Miles.

[grndmstr_c]

Originally Posted by CaseyJones

Mavs eyeing Jeremy Lin
Article

Poopsworld still crap.

[purplefrog]

Ben and Skin talked (today) about a trade where Lam-Lam + Matrix + #17 pick +Wright + Roddy go to the Hawks for Josh Smith and Zaza Pachulia. They thought that Smith would help lure DWill to Dallas. Might have to amnesty Haywood or trade Zaza in order to make the cap space work for DWill.

[DevinHarriswillstart]

Originally Posted by purplefrog

Ben and Skin talked (today) about a trade where Lam-Lam + Matrix + #17 pick +Wright + Roddy go to the Hawks for Josh Smith and Zaza Pachulia. They thought that Smith would help lure DWill to Dallas. Might have to amnesty Haywood or trade Zaza in order to make the cap space work for DWill.

How much sf does Smith play these days?

[mavs777]

Originally Posted by purplefrog

Ben and Skin talked (today) about a trade where Lam-Lam + Matrix + #17 pick +Wright + Roddy go to the Hawks for Josh Smith and Zaza Pachulia. They thought that Smith would help lure DWill to Dallas. Might have to amnesty Haywood or trade Zaza in order to make the cap space work for DWill.

Hawks would say no to that, while Smith may have demanded a trade he is pretty much only going to be traded for an all star talent untill they may absolutley have to trade him (trade deadline).

[mavs777]

Originally Posted by DevinHarriswillstart

How much sf does Smith play these days?

none, he would kill spacing.

[Kidd Karma]

Originally Posted by purplefrog

Ben and Skin talked (today) about a trade where Lam-Lam + Matrix + #17 pick +Wright + Roddy go to the Hawks for Josh Smith and Zaza Pachulia. They thought that Smith would help lure DWill to Dallas. Might have to amnesty Haywood or trade Zaza in order to make the cap space work for DWill.

Originally written up here this morning, with Pierce possibility as well:

http://mavericks.scout.com/2/1187144.html

[jthig32]

Yeah, I don't really see how any of those scenarios are in any way realistic. You can't say you're going to help a team shed salary by trading Odom and then send Marion and his two year deal with it.

[BGMaverick9]

Originally Posted by mavs777

Hawks would say no to that, while Smith may have demanded a trade he is pretty much only going to be traded for an all star talent untill they may absolutley have to trade him (trade deadline).

They're Atlanta. It doesn't matter if they get a loot in return or not, they'll still be underachievers.