Bulls Trade

[dalmations202]

Originally posted by: Male22Dan
If Howard stays, (of course he will), I NEVER see Jamison starting for us... I would also swap Fortson and AD in your depth chart... Other than that, this lineup is BEAUTIFUL... [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif[/img]

I think next year, either Jamison is starting, or he is traded. I may be wrong here, but I don't think he sits behind a guy that is a rookie this year.

[Male30Dan]

Why, he is now!

[dalmations202]

Originally posted by: Male22Dan
Why, he is now!

Although he has adjusted to being a 6th man. I would think that he would rather be a starter. Especially if there isn't another former All-star at that position. He might be fine with it, but I think I would start him, if I were the coach.

[Male30Dan]

I have always wished he would get started, but I think what he brings to the table offensively he takes away defensively... I love the guy when you consider his class and attitude though...

[dalmations202]

Changing the subject just a little bit.
If you had the chance to trade Walker/Delk or Walker/Najera, would you rather trade them for Chandler/AD or for Rasheed Wallace?

[Male30Dan]

Tough question...

Probably Rasheed due to his offensive and defensive talents...

But if Chandler never had health problems, I would have chose the Chandler/AD trade!

[dalmations202]

So Priority #1 of trades this offseason, if possible ? ? ?

Trade 1
Plan A) Try a sign and trade - Walker/Delk or Najera for Rasheed Wallace, if this doesn't work
Plan B) Try to trade Walker/Najera or Delk for Chandler/ADavis , if this doesn't work
Plan C) Try and trade Walker/Najera or Delk for Dampier/NVE

Trade 2
Plan A) Trade Delk if still here for Darrell Armstrong, if this doesn't work
Plan B) Trade and extra or two for Brent Barry
Plan C) Sign and Trade for Jon Barry

Exceptions:
LLE to Daniels, and MLE to TAG if possible.

Strange Trades:
Jamison to Bobcats for the #4 - yes....but only if it is a #4 or higher pick.

Anyone got better ideas on plans for the offseason? Better options?

[Male30Dan]

Trade 1A, not gonna happen... He is NY bound...
Trade 1B, possible, but unfortunately, Paxson unlikely to bite
Trade 1C, much more likely if GS does not want to keep Dampier after he demands his huge contract

Trade 1 preference: 1A, 1B, 1C
Trade 1 possibility: Only 1C truly possible with 1B a far second, (1A impossible)

Trade 2A, Despite age, I am ALL for this trade
Trade 2B, Dont know how you get him here, but with Armstrong, dont know that I want him unless Daniels leaves
Trade 2C, Brent Barry, Michael Finley, Jon Barry, Marquis Daniels, Steve Nash, Darrell Armstrong, Jon Stephanson??? Too many guards!

Trade 2 preference: 2A, 2B (only if Daniels leaves), and no need for 2C even with his good shooting
Trade 2 possibility: 2A is very possible, 2B unlikely unless good bait is given (rookie or draft pick?), 2C likely possible, but do we need?

Exceptions, LLE to Daniels is likely what will happen; MLE to Tag is what I hope happens

Strange Trades, Jamison for #4 is a bad trade unless you then use the #4 and Walker for even better trade bait, (but Walker is gone). I dont think you get better than Jamison in this weak trade at the #4 position!!!

[dalmations202]

Originally posted by: Male22Dan
<cut for space>
Trade 2A, Despite age, I am ALL for this trade
Trade 2B, Dont know how you get him here, but with Armstrong, dont know that I want him unless Daniels leaves
Trade 2C, Brent Barry, Michael Finley, Jon Barry, Marquis Daniels, Steve Nash, Darrell Armstrong, Jon Stephanson??? Too many guards!

Trade 2 preference: 2A, 2B (only if Daniels leaves), and no need for 2C even with his good shooting
Trade 2 possibility: 2A is very possible, 2B unlikely unless good bait is given (rookie or draft pick?), 2C likely possible, but do we need?
<cut for space>

I only do Trade 2B, if trade 2A doesn't work. I only try for Trade 2C if trade 2A, and Trade 2B don't work.
Who else, if Dallas doesn't get Armstrong, or a Barry, or NVE, would be a good shooting vetran backup PG that Dallas might aquire.

[Male30Dan]

Possibly Tinsley if you want to replace shooting for tempo...

You can look at a ton of guys... I mean I could pick one guy per team almost... How about that ol spark plug Rafer Alston... [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif[/img]

[dalmations202]

So for the offseason we should have a plan. "LOL... I am as good a GM as A-Rod was a GM for the Rangers."

IMO - of course this may change by next week.

Plan A -
#1 Sign Rasheed Wallace in a sign and trade that moves Walker.
#2 Sign Daniels to the LLE and Ostertag to the MLE
#3 Trade for Darrell Armstrong or another veteran PG who can defend, push, and shoot.
#4 Resign Nash - this should be automatic, not #4 on the list, but should wait till after the expansion draft so they don't have to use a spot on him.

Plan B - (used only if Plan A doesn't work)
#1 Trade Walker/Delk or Najera for Chandler/AD - to me this trade makes sense for both parties
#2 Sign Daniels to the LLE and Ostertag to the MLE
#3 Trade for a veteran PG who can shoot, defend the quick PG's, and push the ball - Maybe a Barry if not
#4 See #4 above

Plan C - (used only if both plans above fail)
#1 Trade Walker/Delk or Najera for Dampier/NVE
#2 Sign Daniels to the LLE and Ostertag to the MLE
#3 Do a sign and trade for Chris Anderson to defend the quick 5's
#4 See #4 above

Plan D - Call and see if you can get Shaq w/o giving up Nash/Dirk
Plan E - Call and see if you can get TD w/o giving up Nash/Dirk
Plan F - Call and see if you can get KG w/o giving up Nash/Dirk
Plan G - Hold all your cards, and wait till the trading deadline to see if they "Gel" with a summer together.

[Male30Dan]

Can I get plan D, E, or F???

The other plans look like crap compared to them... What were you thinking putting A, B, and C above them??? [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-wink.gif[/img]

[dalmations202]

Originally posted by: Male22Dan
Can I get plan D, E, or F???

The other plans look like crap compared to them... What were you thinking putting A, B, and C above them??? [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-wink.gif[/img]

True, I just think the others are more likely to happen. But I must admit, with Cuban, anything is possible. You are probably correct though and D, E, and F should be ABC.

[Male30Dan]

I was just joking man... Nothing is going to pry those three away, (especially not to a power like Dallas that could diminish the other teams' chances at winning it all)...

I like the order of A, B, and C... Good list put together... We will just see what happens... Hopefully we will do well in the playoffs and STILL have big changes in the offseason...

[dalmations202]

Originally posted by: Male22Dan
Hopefully we will do well in the playoffs and STILL have big changes in the offseason...

Now there is a thought that I really like. NEVER stop trying to improve the club no matter how you finish.

[Male30Dan]

Well, with all of the movement we did this past off-season after being only 1 and 1/2 game from the NBA Finals, I think we can expect some major shakeups after our finish this year!!!

[dalmations202]

Originally posted by: Male22Dan
Well, with all of the movement we did this past off-season after being only 1 and 1/2 game from the NBA Finals, I think we can expect some major shakeups after our finish this year!!!

Moves don't bother me, in fact they are welcome. I just hope they are the "right" moves this time. I keep thinking back to what they needed to add to this team that was in the WCF to win it all.

1) SF that could defend, and give some post-type scoring - Artest should have been this person............
2) Athletic Center that could defend, rebound, and block shots without stalling the offense.
3) Big Center to bang with Shaq

Moves made. #1 - got rid of the backup PG and aquired a SF that couldn't defend, but could give the post-type scoring
#2 - added a PF that moved people out of position, eliminated one of the shotblockers, and set down the big C they have.
#3 - drafted a SF that can defend a little, but needs time to develop.
#4 - got rid of the role playing scrap guys like Griff, Bell

Now, they need more than they did need.
1) Athletic Center that can defend, rebound, and block shots without stalling the offense
2) Removal of the PF that puts people out of position
3) Big Center to Bang with Shaq
4) Backup PG

Make moves, but make the correct moves.

[Male30Dan]

Amen buddy... Amen!

Preaching to the choir!

[Stressboy]

I still think that big things can happen with the expansion draft if and that is a big IF the bobcats would be willing to take Jamison for #4. The reason is that we could get them to pick NVE or Stoudamire in the expansion draft and trade them to us during the Jamison exchange. When they pick up our new backup PG, they could also get GS or Portlands #1. I can easily see the bobcats with 2 more top 15 picks after trading #4.

There is also the possibility of some serious 3 ways going down using the draft and the bobcats. The ability to waive players could make some of these 1 year players like NVE or Stoudamire real options if a lot of teams started throwing the 3 mil around.

[dalmations202]

Originally posted by: Stressboy
I still think that big things can happen with the expansion draft if and that is a big IF the bobcats would be willing to take Jamison for #4. The reason is that we could get them to pick NVE or Stoudamire in the expansion draft and trade them to us during the Jamison exchange. When they pick up our new backup PG, they could also get GS or Portlands #1. I can easily see the bobcats with 2 more top 15 picks after trading #4.

There is also the possibility of some serious 3 ways going down using the draft and the bobcats. The ability to waive players could make some of these 1 year players like NVE or Stoudamire real options if a lot of teams started throwing the 3 mil around.

I am guessing that their will be lots of smoke about this, but very little fire. When it is said and done, I am expecting them to draft, and pick up inexpensive players. I can see the idea of Jamison, but seriously doubt it happening. There are just too many NC and Duke alumni in the NBA right now that would put people in the seats for them to take a maxed out guy, IMO.

I hope you are correct with the 3 way stuff going down, provided that the Mavs actually get their NEEDS this off-season and not just another "good" basketball player.

[Stressboy]

dalmations,

I assume by fire, you mean very little for Jamison. The article that discussed that scenario gave a decent argument given the disgruntled nature of their fan base, but I agree that it is probably not the most likely scenario. I do think that the bobcats would be stupid not to eat some salary money to get draft picks. They need to figure out how much they are willing to spend per pick and then go out and make it happen. Washington, Phoenix, GS, Portland, New York, Chicago, Seattle and Miami would all be willing to give up picks to cut salary and teams like Philly, Orlando maybe, Seattle and maybe NJ might be teams willing to deal real talent for picks/flexibiliy.

Laettner for Washington and Potapenko for Seattle are guys that might be free and could get you top 14 picks plus 3mil for helping clear cap now. Those are two guys that have 1 year deals left and are not max guys. NVE, Cliffard Robinson, are guys that might be there with just two years left. Are you willing to lose 6mil this year to get a top 10 pick if you are a new franchise?

Let's look at trading Finley to chicago, going through the bobcats.

The bobcats agree to pick Robinson if they get 3mil (this is first part of 3 way)
The bobcats agree to pick NVE if GS gives them 3mil + #1 unprotected this year, lets say #9 for sake of argument, plus GS agrees to follow-up trade.
The bobcats agree to pick Jahiadi White for 3mil + #6 this year.
The bobcats agree to pick Booth for 3mil + #10 this year.
The bobcats agree to pick up Laettner for 3mil + #7 this year.
The bobcats agree to trade NVE for Jamison and 3mil + agreed upon follow-up trade involving Dallas/Chi part 2 of 3 way.
They pick low level players the rest of the way.


Chicago trades Pippen/Fizer/Crawford/Chandler and gets Finley and they got rid of robinson and kept their pick.
bobcats trade #4 to dallas and receive Crawford/Fizer (2 restricted free agents, but they own their rights)
Dallas trades Finley and gets #4/Pippen/Chandler

The bobcats cut Robinson/White and are out only 6-10 mil or so over 2-3 years given that they received 18mil in cash.
They keep Laettner since he is a duke guy and only has 1 year or they cut him for a loss of 6 mil.

So the bobcats have Crawford/Fizer/Jamison/Laettner/#6/#7/#9/#10/rest of guys picked up in expansion draft.
Dallas essentially trades Finley/Jamison and gets NVE/#4/Pippen/Chandler

I just realized that I made a very complicated scenario so that I could trade Finley for Pippen/Chandler and I would not make that trade straight up. If they would only take on jamison if we did all this then this becomes more reasonable, but it does show you what can be done if the bobcats are really creative. The cool thing is that Dallas is one of the few teams that can be that partner to help facilitate things like this because we can help them pick up a high dollar guy to get concessions from other teams and trade them a good player.

Stressboy

[dalmations202]

Originally posted by: Stressboy
dalmations,

I assume by fire, you mean very little for Jamison. The article that discussed that scenario gave a decent argument given the disgruntled nature of their fan base, but I agree that it is probably not the most likely scenario. I do think that the bobcats would be stupid not to eat some salary money to get draft picks. They need to figure out how much they are willing to spend per pick and then go out and make it happen. Washington, Phoenix, GS, Portland, New York, Chicago, Seattle and Miami would all be willing to give up picks to cut salary and teams like Philly, Orlando maybe, Seattle and maybe NJ might be teams willing to deal real talent for picks/flexibiliy.

Laettner for Washington and Potapenko for Seattle are guys that might be free and could get you top 14 picks plus 3mil for helping clear cap now. Those are two guys that have 1 year deals left and are not max guys. NVE, Cliffard Robinson, are guys that might be there with just two years left. Are you willing to lose 6mil this year to get a top 10 pick if you are a new franchise?

Let's look at trading Finley to chicago, going through the bobcats.

The bobcats agree to pick Robinson if they get 3mil (this is first part of 3 way)
The bobcats agree to pick NVE if GS gives them 3mil + #1 unprotected this year, lets say #9 for sake of argument, plus GS agrees to follow-up trade.
The bobcats agree to pick Jahiadi White for 3mil + #6 this year.
The bobcats agree to pick Booth for 3mil + #10 this year.
The bobcats agree to pick up Laettner for 3mil + #7 this year.
The bobcats agree to trade NVE for Jamison and 3mil + agreed upon follow-up trade involving Dallas/Chi part 2 of 3 way.
They pick low level players the rest of the way.


Chicago trades Pippen/Fizer/Crawford/Chandler and gets Finley and they got rid of robinson and kept their pick.
bobcats trade #4 to dallas and receive Crawford/Fizer (2 restricted free agents, but they own their rights)
Dallas trades Finley and gets #4/Pippen/Chandler

The bobcats cut Robinson/White and are out only 6-10 mil or so over 2-3 years given that they received 18mil in cash.
They keep Laettner since he is a duke guy and only has 1 year or they cut him for a loss of 6 mil.

So the bobcats have Crawford/Fizer/Jamison/Laettner/#6/#7/#9/#10/rest of guys picked up in expansion draft.
Dallas essentially trades Finley/Jamison and gets NVE/#4/Pippen/Chandler

I just realized that I made a very complicated scenario so that I could trade Finley for Pippen/Chandler and I would not make that trade straight up. If they would only take on jamison if we did all this then this becomes more reasonable, but it does show you what can be done if the bobcats are really creative. The cool thing is that Dallas is one of the few teams that can be that partner to help facilitate things like this because we can help them pick up a high dollar guy to get concessions from other teams and trade them a good player.

Stressboy

I agree that their are many things that could be done, but the fire wasn't "very little for Jamison". What I meant by the fire is that there will be lots of talk about things that could/should be done, but in the end very little will happen. I would not trade Jamison and 3 mill to Charlotte for NVE, but might if the rest of the plan were in place for me to secure NVE, the #4 and Chandler. What happens if Charlotte backs out on only a part of the deal. Or Chicago decides to back out. Lots can happen (smoke) but I am guessing little will (fire).

I also realize that when you get more complicated, the less likely it is to happen.

[Max Power]

Stressboy - you have done some amazing work on those scenarios. Hopefully, the Bobcats have someone as sharp as you running their front office. The only kink in your plan is the lack of luxury tax next year. It is doubtful that there will that much movement on players with short contracts. A Golden State will be unlikely to pay someone to take NVE off their hands when it won't affect the bottom line anyway.

[Stressboy]

Dalmations,

You may very well be right, but this draft is a once in a franchise moment and they could really clean up. It is different from other expansion drafts because of the cap that was not there in the past. If they don't do some stuff like this then they are idiots and their fans should be really pissed.

Max,

If NVE were taken then GS would be under the cap and could pursue a big time free agent. Also since he is going to get waived after next year when they have a team option, they would love to save 10 mil and get a disgruntled guy off the team. They already have enough youth on that team what they need is the ability to go get a good vetren. Most of the guys that I listed were taken to help teams like phoenix and washington get under the cap, not avoid luxary tax.

Stressboy

[Poindexter Einstein]

DALM ... Rasheed in essence cannot be acquired in a S-N-T ... if DET had the cap room required to do such a trade, he would end up in DET. He is almost certain to be someone's MLE acquisition, unless DET picks him over Okur. And PS - Sheed isnt going to resign for money in the Walker range, so the Walker/Delk scenario for him in a SNT is about $10 million (or more) apart in salary match.

MALE ...I dont agree that Sheed is a done deal to the Knicks. I agree that NY wants him, but I am not persuaded they have him locked up. Wasnt Mourning a "done deal" to Dallas last summer, til it actually came time to sign on the dotted line? I know the high taxes and the crappy team are attractive for a player, but maybe he might want something better :-)

[dalmations202]

Originally posted by: Poindexter Einstein
DALM ... Rasheed in essence cannot be acquired in a S-N-T ... if DET had the cap room required to do such a trade, he would end up in DET. He is almost certain to be someone's MLE acquisition, unless DET picks him over Okur. And PS - Sheed isnt going to resign for money in the Walker range, so the Walker/Delk scenario for him in a SNT is about $10 million (or more) apart in salary match.

PE,
So if Denver, who has cap space, wanted Fortson and Najera, who's combined salaries are ~?.?M, and we want Rasheed (who might want more than the MLE, and to come to Dallas) then they couldn't sign the UFA to a ?.?M contract, and trade him to Dallas for Fortson, Najera and say Dallas's 2nd round pick? I guess the Walker/Delk thing is out because if someone had enough space to sign Sheed to that kind of money, they would keep Sheed, instead of Walker/Delk.

[Poindexter Einstein]

DALM ... Yes if Denver wanted to sign him and use him as a trade chip for the future they could do so, but they would have to keep him for a while - which means they wont have their desired players in training camp, and if they dont want Sheed they are stuck with him anyhow for about 1/3 of the season. The only immediate sign-and-trade for a free agent is via his original team - otherwise, once he signs, he cant be traded to another team for several months or til Dec 15, whichever is later.

Fyi, the term "sign-and-trade" is a technical term used to refer to a player being signed BY HIS ORIGINAL TEAM and then traded immediately to another team. There are specific rules that permit and guide such a transaction. When you use the term S-N-T, your term refers to that specific type of transaction and no other - thus, with Sheed, it would require DET to use cap space and then trade him away.

"I guess the Walker/Delk thing is out because if someone had enough space to sign Sheed to that kind of money, they would keep Sheed" ....The Walker/Delk thing is out because no one wants to pay Sheed that much. Also, cap constraints around the league will likely keep him to the MLE of 5.xx. Walker/Delk will be 17.xx this year.

[dalmations202]

Originally posted by: Poindexter Einstein
DALM ... Yes if Denver wanted to sign him and use him as a trade chip for the future they could do so, but they would have to keep him for a while - which means they wont have their desired players in training camp, and if they dont want Sheed they are stuck with him anyhow for about 1/3 of the season. The only immediate sign-and-trade for a free agent is via his original team - otherwise, once he signs, he cant be traded to another team for several months or til Dec 15, whichever is later.

Fyi, the term "sign-and-trade" is a technical term used to refer to a player being signed BY HIS ORIGINAL TEAM and then traded immediately to another team. There are specific rules that permit and guide such a transaction. When you use the term S-N-T, your term refers to that specific type of transaction and no other - thus, with Sheed, it would require DET to use cap space and then trade him away.

"I guess the Walker/Delk thing is out because if someone had enough space to sign Sheed to that kind of money, they would keep Sheed" ....The Walker/Delk thing is out because no one wants to pay Sheed that much. Also, cap constraints around the league will likely keep him to the MLE of 5.xx. Walker/Delk will be 17.xx this year.

I guess I was mistaken. I thought he only could not be a part of a multi-player trade, if Denver signed him. I just thought they had to only trade him, and not with a package of other players. Thanks for the rules update. They always seem to get in the way somehow.

[MikeB]

This is a quote from Sean Deneney of the Sporting News:

The Bulls will put PF Tyson Chandler on the market this summer, but any team that wants him will be asked to take on one of the salary drags on the roster-- PF Antonio Davis, PF Jerome Williams or SF Eddie Robinson. "Tyson has a ton of talent, but they'd like to get a cap break if they move him," says one Eastern Conference general manager. . . .

Where do we sign?
Antonio Davis doesn't have much left if any...but I'd take Williams and/or Robinson along with Chandler for Walker (and Delk?).

[dalmations202]

Originally posted by: MikeB
This is a quote from Sean Deneney of the Sporting News:

Where do we sign?
Antonio Davis doesn't have much left if any...but I'd take Williams and/or Robinson along with Chandler for Walker (and Delk?).

You could do Williams or Robinson, Fizer, and Chandler for Walker, but Dallas doesn't have the room on the roster for it presently. Will after Best and Williams are gone though. ADavis/Chandler for Walker/Delk is still the best trade with Chicago IMO. AD may not have much left, but since he will be Dirk's backup, he isn't going to get too many minutes anyway, and he does bring some attitude. Chandler/Bradley are definately a defensive upgrade at the 5. I don't know if Williams, Robinson, or Fizer really are a major upgrade for the Mavs defensively, but I don't think their offensive games in Nellies system would allow for much playing time.

[ddh33]

This whole thread got started off my own premise for dealing with Chicago. At the time, it hadn't come out that Chicago would be as interested in dealing Davis...

But there is no doubt that if you want one of Chicago's young bigs, you better be ready to take back some contracts.

Jerome Williams and Eddie Robinson with Chandler
Davis and Chandler
I would do either deal as long as Walker was the primary piece being sent out.

But I wonder why everyone thinks Chandler would come in here and start from the get go? He doesn't even start for Chicago...

Now, in fairness, I think he will continue to develop - and that is why I want him...but don't expect too much. Besides, Davis would be a Nellie-favorite...

[dalmations202]

Originally posted by: ddh33
This whole thread got started off my own premise for dealing with Chicago. At the time, it hadn't come out that Chicago would be as interested in dealing Davis...

But there is no doubt that if you want one of Chicago's young bigs, you better be ready to take back some contracts.

Jerome Williams and Eddie Robinson with Chandler
Davis and Chandler
I would do either deal as long as Walker was the primary piece being sent out.

But I wonder why everyone thinks Chandler would come in here and start from the get go? He doesn't even start for Chicago...

Now, in fairness, I think he will continue to develop - and that is why I want him...but don't expect too much. Besides, Davis would be a Nellie-favorite...

I can answer this one. He is Big, can defend (at least a little), is not named Bradley, and can jump a little. Mainly I think he will play some D without having the offense run through him, but not bog the offense down by being slow. Bradley should start, but always let's Nellie down with fouls against the quick teams, and gets pushed around by the Bigger teams, or he is in Nellies doghouse for no apparent reason. Bradley isn't quick enough to play the 5 some nights. Dirk gets in foul trouble when he plays the 5, and gets beat up, so it hurts his offense. Williams is gone, and not that quick. Fortson, and Najera really are not 5's. Who does that leave to start at the 5 who would be better than Chandler? Especially if you are not looking for him to have to carry the team on offense . Chicago needs the offense, but Chandler could be like Big Ben if he wants to. Just clean the glass and get the trash points on O, and block shots on D.

[dalmations202]

Thought I'd just continue this one instead of starting another Bulls Trade thread..........

Chicago trades: C Eddy Curry (14.7 ppg, 6.2 rpg, 0.9 apg in 29.5 minutes)
PF Tyson Chandler (6.1 ppg, 7.7 rpg, 0.7 apg in 22.4 minutes)
PF Jerome Williams (6.2 ppg, 7.0 rpg, 1.1 apg in 24.1 minutes)
PF Antonio Davis (8.8 ppg, 8.4 rpg, 1.7 apg in 32.1 minutes)
Chicago receives: SG Michael Finley (18.6 ppg, 4.5 rpg, 2.9 apg in 38.6 minutes)
PF Antoine Walker (14.0 ppg, 8.3 rpg, 4.5 apg in 34.6 minutes)
Change in team outlook: -3.2 ppg, -16.5 rpg, and +3.0 apg.

Dallas trades: SG Michael Finley (18.6 ppg, 4.5 rpg, 2.9 apg in 38.6 minutes)
PF Antoine Walker (14.0 ppg, 8.3 rpg, 4.5 apg in 34.6 minutes)
Dallas receives: C Eddy Curry (14.7 ppg, 6.2 rpg, 0.9 apg in 73 games)
PF Tyson Chandler (6.1 ppg, 7.7 rpg, 0.7 apg in 35 games)
PF Jerome Williams (6.2 ppg, 7.0 rpg, 1.1 apg in 68 games)
PF Antonio Davis (8.8 ppg, 8.4 rpg, 1.7 apg in 80 games)
Change in team outlook: +3.2 ppg, +16.5 rpg, and -3.0 apg.

TRADE ACCEPTED



Would you trade Finley and Walker to Chicago for Curry, Chandler, Williams, Davis, and their #1 round (if it is not in three picks)?

Lineup:
Curry, Chandler, Bradley, Fortson?
Nowitzki, Davis, Najera
Howard, Jamison
Daniels
Nash

#1 pick ?

[MavsFanFinley]

Would you trade Finley and Walker to Chicago for Curry, Chandler, Williams, Davis, and their #1 round (if it is not in three picks)?

This is so one-sided for the Mavs it's not even funny. Of course, the Mavs organization and fans would do this trade in a heartbeat.

Can you explain to me why Chicago would? They're dangling Chandler for sure, but they are NOT going to give up both he and Curry AND their number 1 pick for Finley and Walker.

Let's be realistic please.

[dalmations202]

Originally posted by: MavsFanFinley

This is so one-sided for the Mavs it's not even funny. Of course, the Mavs organization and fans would do this trade in a heartbeat.

Can you explain to me why Chicago would? They're dangling Chandler for sure, but they are NOT going to give up both he and Curry AND their number 1 pick for Finley and Walker.

Let's be realistic please.

K, Chandler has back problems. Curry has basically been a bust from what Paxson has said. Finley and Walker are veterans who have been All-Stars. Dallas is taking back salary in AD and Jerome Williams. Chicago has said it doesn't need another young to train.

I do not want Finley to go (and don't think he will). But if I am GM'ing the Mavs, I would not trade two former All-Stars for a bag of nothing either. You call this one-sided. I am not so sure it is as one sided as you are thinking.

Why would Chicago do this trade? add two veteran former all-stars who still have game. Admittedly If Chicago hasn't given up on Curry, and Chandler, then they probably wouldn't do it. If they have, then a lineup of Hinrich, Finley, Walker is not a bad start. Especially since Finley and Walker are hometown, and might put a few more people in seats. They would get a year to see if they could make Walker work, if not, then he would be traded/gone. If so, maybe a hometown discount.

From a Dallas perspective. You get two young BIGs. But you take on two more players with big long contracts that will not get that much playing time. One of the Bigs has known back problems, the other has motivation problems. One of the Vets is definately on the downside of his career (age). The other is a backup at best. Is this really as one-sided for Dallas as put out there to begin with? ?

If Walker and Fin play to All-Star level (big IF), and the two young Bigs really are busts, this is one-sided for the Bulls not Dallas. And a Draft pick is hit/miss - always has been.

[madape]

I doubt they'd give up three bigs without getting one in return. I'd also question whether we'd want three bigs. I say pick the guy you like and forget about the other one. Curry doesn't fit this team in my opinion. He's too slow. He doesn't protect the basket that well. He doesnt grab a whole lot of boards. We need a more athletic, active, shotblocker, rebounder type.

I say give offer them Finley for Chandler and Davis. Keep Walker. Slide Daniels into the starting two spot. He looks like the future to me. Find a veteeran backup swingman somewhere else. Guys like Giricek, Dooling, Glover, Mercer, and Stevenson are all free agents who could be relatively cheap.

[MightyToine]

Originally posted by: madape
I doubt they'd give up three bigs without getting one in return. I'd also question whether we'd want three bigs. I say pick the guy you like and forget about the other one. Curry doesn't fit this team in my opinion. He's too slow. He doesn't protect the basket that well. He doesnt grab a whole lot of boards. We need a more athletic, active, shotblocker, rebounder type.

I say give offer them Finley for Chandler and Davis. Keep Walker. Slide Daniels into the starting two spot. He looks like the future to me. Find a veteeran backup swingman somewhere else. Guys like Giricek, Dooling, Glover, Mercer, and Stevenson are all free agents who could be relatively cheap.

WOW! That's one vote in FAVOR of keeping Walk. [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-shocked.gif[/img]


Didn't think there was ANYONE here that wants that. Including yours truly. [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-happy.gif[/img]

[dalmations202]

Since people don't believe that they will give up all three Curry, Chandler, Davis.

Would Chicago do this? Just to get rid of their contracts, etc and headaches?

Chicago trades: SF Eddie Robinson (6.7 ppg, 2.0 rpg, 1.1 apg in 20.1 minutes)
PF Jerome Williams (6.2 ppg, 7.0 rpg, 1.1 apg in 24.1 minutes)
SF Scottie Pippen (5.9 ppg, 3.0 rpg, 2.2 apg in 17.9 minutes)
PF Tyson Chandler (6.1 ppg, 7.7 rpg, 0.7 apg in 22.4 minutes)
C Eddy Curry (14.7 ppg, 6.2 rpg, 0.9 apg in 29.5 minutes)
Chicago receives: PF Antoine Walker (14.0 ppg, 8.3 rpg, 4.5 apg in 34.6 minutes)
SG Michael Finley (18.6 ppg, 4.5 rpg, 2.9 apg in 38.6 minutes)
Change in team outlook: -7.0 ppg, -13.1 rpg, and +1.4 apg.

Dallas trades: PF Antoine Walker (14.0 ppg, 8.3 rpg, 4.5 apg in 34.6 minutes)
SG Michael Finley (18.6 ppg, 4.5 rpg, 2.9 apg in 38.6 minutes)
Dallas receives: SF Eddie Robinson (6.7 ppg, 2.0 rpg, 1.1 apg in 51 games)
PF Jerome Williams (6.2 ppg, 7.0 rpg, 1.1 apg in 68 games)
SF Scottie Pippen (5.9 ppg, 3.0 rpg, 2.2 apg in 23 games)
PF Tyson Chandler (6.1 ppg, 7.7 rpg, 0.7 apg in 35 games)
C Eddy Curry (14.7 ppg, 6.2 rpg, 0.9 apg in 73 games)
Change in team outlook: +7.0 ppg, +13.1 rpg, and -1.4 apg.

TRADE ACCEPTED

Would Dallas do it? What if the 1st Round draft pick were included?

Assuming Pippen will retire. Chicago will get rid of contracts and players, for two solid vets. Dallas would get 2 Bigs.

I am not sold on the idea, but curious what everyone else thinks.

Or maybe even:

Chicago trades: PF Antonio Davis (8.8 ppg, 8.4 rpg, 1.7 apg in 32.1 minutes)
SF Eddie Robinson (6.7 ppg, 2.0 rpg, 1.1 apg in 20.1 minutes)
PF Tyson Chandler (6.1 ppg, 7.7 rpg, 0.7 apg in 22.4 minutes)
PF Marcus Fizer (7.8 ppg, 4.4 rpg, 0.9 apg in 16.0 minutes)
Chicago receives: PF Antoine Walker (14.0 ppg, 8.3 rpg, 4.5 apg in 34.6 minutes)
SG Michael Finley (18.6 ppg, 4.5 rpg, 2.9 apg in 38.6 minutes)
Change in team outlook: +3.2 ppg, -9.7 rpg, and +3.0 apg.

Dallas trades: PF Antoine Walker (14.0 ppg, 8.3 rpg, 4.5 apg in 34.6 minutes)
SG Michael Finley (18.6 ppg, 4.5 rpg, 2.9 apg in 38.6 minutes)
Dallas receives: PF Antonio Davis (8.8 ppg, 8.4 rpg, 1.7 apg in 80 games)
SF Eddie Robinson (6.7 ppg, 2.0 rpg, 1.1 apg in 51 games)
PF Tyson Chandler (6.1 ppg, 7.7 rpg, 0.7 apg in 35 games)
PF Marcus Fizer (7.8 ppg, 4.4 rpg, 0.9 apg in 46 games)
Change in team outlook: -3.2 ppg, +9.7 rpg, and -3.0 apg.

TRADE ACCEPTED

?????

[MavsFanFinley]

I'm still coming back to why Chicago would give away all it's size plus it's #1 draft pick. They give away two 7 footers (Chandler/Curry) for Finley and Walker? Not gonna happen.

Finley for Chandler/Davis is a doable scenerio for both sides though.

[madape]

Hell yeah keep walker. The man is smooth. I like his skills. I think they compliment Dirk and Nash. If he can learn how to use his skill effectively, he'll be one of our best and most beloved players. He just needs some time to learn his role, and he needs a coach who doesn't change his role every two months. Walker seems to really be buying into the team aspect lately. He's been rebounding, distributing, and keeping off the perimeter. Defferring to his teammates is a hard thing to do for a guy headed into free agency.

Give the man time to adjust. It took over a year for Nick to finally click with this team, and Walker is much more talented than Nick.

I want Chander badly. I would give up either Finley or Walker to get him. But if given a choice, I'd rather keep my three time all-star power forward entering the prime of his career than my aging, injury-prone shooting guard who's never been able to dribble or get to the foul line.