Do you think we'll make a major trade before the deadline? - Page 11 - Dallas-Mavs.com Forums

mac222b · 01-07-2011, 12:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BGMaverick9

I can say right now that the players don't believe it's necessary to do a deal...they want to see Dirk and Roddy back and they feel that could make them good to go.

i think if you phrased it to Dirk, Kidd or Tyson as "if we can add S-Jax, Prince, Iggy, etc. for what amounts to basically Butler's expiring contract, next year's 27th pick in the draft and DoJo or Mahinmi and some of Cuban's $ would you welcome that?" i think it would be met with a resounding "Hell Yeah!"

that's not to say those deals will be available. just saying...

i mean shoot, if the Kings were really content to dump Casspi or Landry for next to nothing we shouldn't jump on that because of chemistry?
this team even with Dirk back is woefully thin at the 3,4.
Miami is humming along right now but i guarantee you they're in line for Troy Murphy or any other usable vet that gets bought out.

grndmstr_c · 01-07-2011, 12:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BGMaverick9

I can say right now that the players don't believe it's necessary to do a deal...they want to see Dirk and Roddy back and they feel that could make them good to go.

Whether or not getting Dirk and Booby back makes them good to go, I can definitely see the argument for waiting to get them back before deciding what the team really needs. I think it's clear after a game like tonight's (as if any of us needed reminding), that the team needs somebody besides Dirk who can go out and manufacture offense. Caron wasn't capable of doing that with notable efficiency, I don't think, but he at least had a go-to move that he could use to reliably get himself a shot attempt that he was comfortable with, and that's something that can't be said for any of the currently healthy players on the roster. If Booby is able to pick up that slack, the need for a Martin - or even a Jackson - is dramatically reduced, and a trade for a guy like Prince, or perhaps even an opportunistic use of the MLE or a TE, could be more than sufficient to ensure contention. If not, then you probably have to shoot for Jax at a minimum, and hope that his boneheaded tendencies can be reigned in, or that a good deal for a better player presents itself.

Either way, for the moment you wait and watch and hope for a little overdue luck on the health-front.

BGMaverick9 · 01-07-2011, 12:56 AM

It just seems like that's going to be the overall plan, wait to get healthy, do whatever it takes to stay healthy and be opportunistic with a small deal if it presents itself. The front office loves the team and is confident that they can find a way to make it work, with a simple tweak.

That's not to say that they'll pass up a golden opportunity if it presents itself.

mac222b · 01-07-2011, 01:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BGMaverick9

It just seems like that's going to be the overall plan, wait to get healthy, do whatever it takes to stay healthy and be opportunistic with a small deal if it presents itself. The front office loves the team and is confident that they can find a way to make it work, with a simple tweak.

That's not to say that they'll pass up a golden opportunity if it presents itself.

Well they've put together something really nice and if that's the plan it makes sense to trust them on it. The last few moves had worked out really well in this team's favor. Maybe they have a smaller move targeted that they think will add just enough quality depth at the 3,4 without adding a huge ego or breaking the bank. That would be one tick against a guy like Stephen Jackson. Either way I hope we get every one back healthy. If we do this team can make some noise come playoff time.

sefant77 · 01-07-2011, 01:03 PM

Another aspect why i like Jax for Butler+Dojo/pick/roleplayer/cash

You can give him actually Butlers role, start him with Stevenson, move Marion to the bench because he worked together with Terry from the bench.

We would be able to play the same style and substitution pattern that was so sucessful before the injuries.

LonghornDub · 01-07-2011, 02:27 PM

If we want to get one of the Bobcats guys, we should just remind MJ that Kobe will tie his six championships if the Lakers win the thing again. That should get MJ's ridiculous ego going...maybe trick him into making a bad decision.

sefant77 · 01-07-2011, 02:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LonghornDub

If we want to get one of the Bobcats guys, we should just remind MJ that Kobe will tie his six championships if the Lakers win the thing again. That should get MJ's ridiculous ego going...maybe trick him into making a bad decision.

rep

BGMaverick9 · 01-07-2011, 03:16 PM

I'll be headed to Frisco to observe the Legends game...if Donnie is there, I'll try to talk to him.

Kidd Karma · 01-07-2011, 04:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LonghornDub

If we want to get one of the Bobcats guys, we should just remind MJ that Kobe will tie his six championships if the Lakers win the thing again. That should get MJ's ridiculous ego going...maybe trick him into making a bad decision.

Haha, no need, I think Butler's contract for Jax long term has him salavating. I think we'll toss in 3 million and the right to swap 2nd rounders. He'll probably buyout Butler and Butler will probably just have us monitor his rehab etc.

Thomas86 · 01-07-2011, 06:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sefant77

Another aspect why i like Jax for Butler+Dojo/pick/roleplayer/cash

You can give him actually Butlers role, start him with Stevenson, move Marion to the bench because he worked together with Terry from the bench.

We would be able to play the same style and substitution pattern that was so sucessful before the injuries.

Maybe something like Jackson and Shaun Livingston for Butler, cash and pick that works.

Mavs get a SF in Jackson and a real back up PG in Livingston to save Kidds legs for the playoffs.

grndmstr_c · 01-07-2011, 06:35 PM

Just saw a hoopshype headline about Granger. Probably nothing, and the asking price is likely to be too high, but it has nonetheless made me go, 'Hmm'.

dude1394 · 01-07-2011, 07:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by grndmstr_c

Just saw a hoopshype headline about Granger. Probably nothing, and the asking price is likely to be too high, but it has nonetheless made me go, 'Hmm'.

Double hum..that dudes a load.

BGMaverick9 · 01-07-2011, 07:31 PM

you've clearly got to see what Indiana says.

The question is: do you throw a CP3/Melo Offer at them?

deamon · 01-07-2011, 07:50 PM

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lLyHS...eature=related

grndmstr_c · 01-07-2011, 08:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BGMaverick9

you've clearly got to see what Indiana says.

The question is: do you throw a CP3/Melo Offer at them?

I don't consider Granger to be on the Cp3/Melo-level, but on the other hand he certainly doesn't come up wanting in comparisons to Iggy or Martin, for example. He's especially intriguing to me because he'd be such an outstanding positional fit, and doesn't have an obvious weakness (c.f., Iggy's shooting, Martin's defense, or SJax's brain).

BGMaverick9 · 01-07-2011, 09:24 PM

Yeah, he just kind of seems like he would be out of the optimal price-range. For Indy, he IS a Melo or CP3 so they would demand that kind of package.

grndmstr_c · 01-07-2011, 09:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BGMaverick9

Yeah, he just kind of seems like he would be out of the optimal price-range. For Indy, he IS a Melo or CP3 so they would demand that kind of package.

Not if he keeps playing like he did tonight

Big picture, though, here's the tough question (which may or may not be the right one). If a:

Kidd/JJB
Stevenson/JET
Butler/Marion
Dirk/Marion
Chandler/Haywood

rotation is good enough to win a title, can't the same be said (with somewhat greater confidence) for a rotation that switches out Butler for Granger?

xrobx · 01-07-2011, 09:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by grndmstr_c

Not if he keeps playing like he did tonight

Big picture, though, here's the tough question (which may or may not be the right one). If a:

Kidd/JJB
Stevenson/JET
Butler/Marion
Dirk/Marion
Chandler/Haywood

rotation is good enough to win a title, can't the same be said (with somewhat greater confidence) for a rotation that switches out Butler for Granger?

seeing as how granger is one of the best SF's in the nba, i would argue that we would have an even better chance than we did before the butler injury

BGMaverick9 · 01-07-2011, 10:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by grndmstr_c

Not if he keeps playing like he did tonight

Big picture, though, here's the tough question (which may or may not be the right one). If a:

Kidd/JJB
Stevenson/JET
Butler/Marion
Dirk/Marion
Chandler/Haywood

rotation is good enough to win a title, can't the same be said (with somewhat greater confidence) for a rotation that switches out Butler for Granger?

This year, the concerns I had with Butler mainly had to deal with any issues he might have had with roles being unknown at first. Then he was getting yanked in 4th quarters, rightfully so, to have Marion be a defensive presence. I was just concerned if he would be upset and rock the boat...it actually turned out to be the total opposite.

Your question leads me to a question though. Obviously Butler is out of the equation with your situation....but how many other pieces are out based on that rotation?

Thomas86 · 01-09-2011, 08:36 AM

Quote:

The Mavs are taking a patient approach in their evaluation of what, if anything, needs to be done in the wake of Caron Butler's season-ending knee injury. Team officials, including owner Mark Cuban, believe there is no need to panic and want to wait until Dirk Nowitzki and Rodrigue Beaubois return from injuries before making any major moves. It is clearly understood, however, that Cuban has no interest in carrying an $85 million payroll into the postseason only to get bounced in the first round for the fourth time in five years.

Two names that are expected to be on the Mavs' radar if and when Cuban and GM Donnie Nelson decide they need to add a piece to make a championship push are Andre Iguodala and Stephen Jackson. Each would be a useful addition, but someone will have to convince Cuban that taking on such a financial commitment would all but guarantee a trip to the Finals. Iguodala, though a solid wing defender who would thrive on a team where he wouldn't have to be the primary scorer, is a long shot considering the $44 million he has left over the next three seasons. The Sixers thus far have found no takers for Iguodala, who could use a fresh start with a contender.

http://www.cbssports.com/nba/story/1...-spending-less

deamon · 01-09-2011, 11:55 AM

We don't have time to wait another year. Dirk, Chandler, Kidd, Marion, all are veterans, we need another piece now. In PO perspective I prefer better defender than scorer, so my choice is Iggy.

tcat075 · 01-09-2011, 12:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LonghornDub

If we want to get one of the Bobcats guys, we should just remind MJ that Kobe will tie his six championships if the Lakers win the thing again. That should get MJ's ridiculous ego going...maybe trick him into making a bad decision.

I'll give you Jackson! I've give you Wallace! Take the whole team! WHOLE TEAM! JUST GIVE ME BRIAN CARDINAL!!!!

BGMaverick9 · 01-09-2011, 12:57 PM

Interesting trade ideas from a Charlotte perspective

http://queencityhoops.com/blog/

tcat075 · 01-09-2011, 01:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BGMaverick9

Interesting trade ideas from a Charlotte perspective

http://queencityhoops.com/blog/

I think Cuban would make a deal like this, but would the Knicks really give up Turiaf without getting a big man back in return? Sure, I guess they add Terry, who can play some point, but they've got a good enough offense, what they need is defense. Losing Turiaf and adding Terry weakens their defense even more.

BGMaverick9 · 01-09-2011, 01:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tcat075

I think Cuban would make a deal like this, but would the Knicks really give up Turiaf without getting a big man back in return? Sure, I guess they add Terry, who can play some point, but they've got a good enough offense, what they need is defense. Losing Turiaf and adding Terry weakens their defense even more.

I don't know if you saw but there are two old ideas below that one...

41mvp · 01-09-2011, 01:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BGMaverick9

http://queencityhoops.com/blog/

No Way!!

Underdog · 01-09-2011, 01:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BGMaverick9

Interesting trade ideas from a Charlotte perspective

http://queencityhoops.com/blog/

I like any trade that brings back Crash & Jax, but I don't see Charlotte (or New York) going for any of those proposals... Seems like Butler's expiring contract would HAVE to be included if the Bobcats are shedding salary.

But if we could somehow get those guys in a Mavs uniform, we'd arguably have the sexiest starting 5 in the league - on a good day, Kidd/Jax/Crash/Dirk/Chandler would pretty much be an all-star caliber lineup... Assuming we retain guys like Matrix, Roddy and Haywood for depth, we'd definitely be poised to make a championship run...

EDIT: damn, just noticed how BIG that squad would be!

tcat075 · 01-09-2011, 01:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BGMaverick9

I don't know if you saw but there are two old ideas below that one...

Number one is a bad trade for us (get Wallace, but give up Stevenson and JET?), number two makes more sense, but still is a butt-load of money to take on for the next couple of years. I don't know...I still can't decide how much better of a team Wallace and Jackson will make us. I think we'd be championship caliber, but I still go back and forth a little.

tcat075 · 01-09-2011, 02:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Underdog

I like any trade that brings back Crash & Jax, but I don't see Charlotte (or New York) going for any of those proposals... Seems like Butler's expiring contract would HAVE to be included if the Bobcats are shedding salary.

But if we could somehow get those guys in a Mavs uniform, we'd arguably have the sexiest starting 5 in the league - on a good day, Kidd/Jax/Crash/Dirk/Chandler would pretty much be an all-star caliber lineup... Assuming we retain guys like Matrix, Roddy and Haywood for depth, we'd definitely be poised to make a championship run...

EDIT: damn, just noticed how BIG that squad would be!

I'm surprised it wasn't included. Its a trade chip now, and I'm sure any deal with Charlotte would include it.

sefant77 · 01-09-2011, 03:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tcat075

Number one is a bad trade for us (get Wallace, but give up Stevenson and JET?), number two makes more sense, but still is a butt-load of money to take on for the next couple of years. I don't know...I still can't decide how much better of a team Wallace and Jackson will make us. I think we'd be championship caliber, but I still go back and forth a little.

Its a butt-load of money and "too much change" trading Terry away.

Cuban, Dirk etc are too much in love with Terry, so im pretty sure it will be either a minor trade or maximum Butler+roleplayer.

ReDirkulous Tyme · 01-09-2011, 04:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sefant77

Its a butt-load of money and "too much change" trading Terry away.

Cuban, Dirk etc are too much in love with Terry, so im pretty sure it will be either a minor trade or maximum Butler+roleplayer.

I would give up terry in a heart beat if we could avoid giving up Roddy. If we have the ability to possibly get 2 guys that are of the same caliber as AI and Crash then I wouldn't think twice. Trust me, I am factoring in the fact that he is one of, if not the biggest emotional/physical leaders on this team, in addition to the fact that he's a fan favorite. But here's the facts. Jason Terry is a jump shooter, albeit a good one, he no longer has the quickness to get his shot off against the best defensive teams in this league. There are reasons he is great during the regular season, yet has seemed to disappear in the playoffs the last few years. Most teams are not in-sync enough, or talented enough defensively to effectively defend Jet during the regular season. However, when you get to the playoffs, virtually every team you play in the later rounds is a defensive juggernaut. Against these defensive-minded teams, Terry just can't get good looks. We all know the Mavs don't keep Jet around for his defensive, and if he can't perform offensively in the playoffs, we need to trade him while he still has some trade value.

We may not even be able to get rid Terry, he may not have a lot of trade value. But I do know that his trade value is higher now than it will be at almost any point in the future. I think that when Roddy comes back he will be able to do anything Jet can do, and do it better. He won't be the leader that Jet is, but his performance will more than make up for Jet's absence, if we actually did have the ability to get rid of him.

I'd also really try to see if we can get rid of Stevenson right now. Don't get me wrong, I have absolutely LOVED what he has brought to the team this year. His 3pt shooting is absolutely ridiculous. However, in all reality, Stevenson's shooting WILL come back to earth, the only question is when. Right now, his trade value has never been higher. Teams have seen him as a legitimate 3 point threat, and he has been a lock down defender. I'm willing to bet that for once in the last 4 years, teams are seeing Stevenson as a possible asset, instead of the liability that we assumed him to be when we got him from Charlotte.

Take this post with a grain of salt, this is obviously completely speculation based on a far-from-sober fan's observations.

BGMaverick9 · 01-09-2011, 10:33 PM

http://espn.go.com/blog/dallas/mavericks

Quote:

The Dallas Mavericks are getting closer to making a roster move in the wake of Caron Butler’s season-ending knee injury … albeit a minor roster move.

The Mavs plan to sign former first-round draft pick Sasha Pavlovic to a 10-day contract this week, according to a source close to the situation.

Dallas doesn’t play again until Wednesday, when it visits the Indiana Pacers after a three-day break.

Pavlovic has been looking for a new team since the summer after averaging just 3.7 points in limited minutes last season in 71 games with Minnesota. The 27-year-old is regarded as a small forward with decent size and a proven 3-point stroke, but likewise considered suspect defensively.

The Serbian swingman, drafted No. 19 overall pick in the 2003 draft by the Utah, spent one season with the Jazz and five with Cleveland before the Cavaliers dealt him to Phoenix in the Shaquille O’Neal trade in June 2009. Pavlovic never played for the Suns, signing a one-year contract with Minnesota in the summer of 2009 after the Suns bought him out.

Dallas waived Steve Novak last week to make room to add a player.

Rick41 · 01-09-2011, 10:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BGMaverick9

http://espn.go.com/blog/dallas/mavericks

I was about to put this up.

BGMaverick9 · 01-09-2011, 10:57 PM

My initial thoughts on Sasha:

The guy is extremely erratic with his perimeter shot, if he's confident he'll make a ton of baskets. The swings are way too up and down when it comes to that. He's somewhat injury prone. He's still a decent option on the break.

Despite the issues, you're not going to find many guys with recent experience being a viable rotation piece on an NBA Finals team (Cleveland). Experience wise, he's got to be one of the best guys on the market.

sefant77 · 01-09-2011, 11:04 PM

Best case to fill maybe a minor role UNTIL Roddy is healthy.

Is he a solution for keeping championship chances alive? No.

Our roster with Butler + the Roddy wildcard had serious championship chances.

Our roster without Butler + healthy Roddy + Sasha: No.

BGMaverick9 · 01-09-2011, 11:06 PM

Based on the player, they're targeting a scoring presence instead of a defensive presence.

EricaLubarsky · 01-09-2011, 11:10 PM

Ugh. Without Dirk we need creators and without Butler we need guys that can both create and score within an offense.

If this is the only move, then color me terribly disappointed. As a 10-14 man you could definitely do worse, but its a lateral move at the end of the bench that does nothing to address Butler being taken out of the picture other than dropping a 4 (Novak) for a 3ish player

clutch#41 · 01-09-2011, 11:11 PM

he might play 5mins tops as a Mav. i dont understand carlisle and not trusting our younger guys. give DOJO more mins or even call up joe alexander from the d league.

BGMaverick9 · 01-09-2011, 11:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by clutch#41

he might play 5mins tops as a Mav. i dont understand carlisle and not trusting our younger guys. give DOJO more mins or even call up joe alexander from the d league.

He did play Jones 30+ minutes in his first two games, so it's not like he's totally banished him.

Honestly, as a proven product...I think you're hard-pressed to find another option on the open market as a 10-day contract.

EricaLubarsky · 01-09-2011, 11:17 PM

there sure aint a lot of talent available for guaranteed cash even. We still havent even spent the MLE because there just isnt anyone out there waiting for cash.

If we make a move significant enough to bring us back to top 1-3 in the league, it will be via trade for sure other than the far outside chance that Billups gets waived and we pick him up.