The NO major trade camp - I'm in.

[CadBane]

Originally Posted by DirkFTW

That's what she said.

Yikes, SMC's right that you should have clarified you were talking about his basketball knowledge cause that could really be ambiguous!

Lol, seriously. Does SMC think the "he's solid" is in reference to his f'ing cooking skills? Use some common sense. What the f**k else would I be talking about.

[fluid.forty.one]

Originally Posted by CadBane

Again, you're too sharp with this analogy thing.

In your mind, apparently, opinions on something as subjective as colors is the same as widely regarded and held beliefs.

Saying blue is better than green IS NOT an equal opinion to saying Matt Carroll is a better basketball player than Kobe Bryant.

Third time the charm?

Opinions on announcers are going to be a LOT less concrete than that, come on. With basketball you have stats and such to go on. It would be a lot harder to argue that MC is a better basketball player than Kobe since Kobe has won more and has better stats in every category....

Arguing about announcers is more like arguing about your favorite comedian or musician. It's totally different depending on what your taste is. Some people like hard metal, some people like jimmy buffet. Some people find Charles to be an idiot, some people find him to be hilarious. Some find him to be both. It's their opinion. Just like your favorite color.

edit: classic cadbane meltdown made my day a lot better, thanks.

[LonghornDub]

Originally Posted by CadBane

Again, you're too sharp with this analogy thing.

In your mind, apparently, opinions on something as subjective as colors is the same as widely regarded and held beliefs.

Saying blue is better than green IS NOT an equal opinion to saying Matt Carroll is a better basketball player than Kobe Bryant.

Third time the charm?

First time was the charm. Second time was still the charm. Third time would also be the charm. My analogy is apt. Your (mis)recognition of what I'm analogizing to is the problem.

I don't know why you keep talking about Matt Carroll. The analogy has nothing to do with player evaluations (which involve objectively comparable statistics). You were comparing announcers on the basis of their announcing qualities, which is of course entirely subjective.

There's a widely held belief that Kobe Bryant is better than Matt Carroll because there is a well-accepted set of irrefutable statistics supporting that proposition. I'll wait for you to link me to the comparable statistics for NBA announcers.

[CadBane]

Originally Posted by jthig32

I feel like the Mods, and myself in particular, have been more than fair to you since you were allowed back.

You brought this on yourself. If you want to keep up the martyr complex and pretend that everyone butts heads with you for some reason other than your incredibly grating personality, then go ahead.

Lmao, what a crock of shit, Thig.

I was allegedly banned for personal insults, which were used in retaliation, yet other users have carte blanche to to fling them at me unprovoked.

Check the very first post on Page 4, but hey, I guess it's okay as long as I don't say it.

[fluid.forty.one]

Originally Posted by LonghornDub

First time was the charm. Second time was still the charm. Third time would also be the charm. My analogy is apt. Your (mis)recognition of what I'm analogizing to is the problem.

I don't know why you keep talking about Matt Carroll. The analogy has nothing to do with player evaluations (which involve objectively comparable statistics). You were comparing announcers on the basis of their announcing qualities, which is of course entirely subjective.

There's a widely held belief that Kobe Bryant is better than Matt Carroll because there is a well-accepted set of irrefutable statistics supporting that proposition. I'll wait for you to link me to the comparable statistics for NBA announcers.

This.

We should make Announcer-Reference.com

[CadBane]

Originally Posted by LonghornDub

First time was the charm. Second time was still the charm. Third time would also be the charm. My analogy is apt. Your (mis)recognition of what I'm analogizing to is the problem.

I don't know why you keep talking about Matt Carroll. The analogy has nothing to do with player evaluations (which involve objectively comparable statistics). You were comparing announcers on the basis of their announcing qualities, which is of course entirely subjective.

There's a widely held belief that Kobe Bryant is better than Matt Carroll because there is a well-accepted set of irrefutable statistics supporting that proposition. I'll wait for you to link me to the comparable statistics for NBA announcers.

http://www.google.com/search?q=mark+...ient=firefox-a

[CadBane]

Originally Posted by fluid.forty.one

Opinions on announcers are going to be a LOT less concrete than that, come on. With basketball you have stats and such to go on. It would be a lot harder to argue that MC is a better basketball player than Kobe since Kobe has won more and has better stats in every category....

Arguing about announcers is more like arguing about your favorite comedian or musician. It's totally different depending on what your taste is. Some people like hard metal, some people like jimmy buffet. Some people find Charles to be an idiot, some people find him to be hilarious. Some find him to be both. It's their opinion. Just like your favorite color.

edit: classic cadbane meltdown made my day a lot better, thanks.

Sorry, but it is a WIDELY held opinion that Mark Jackson is a terrible announcer. You can hold the opinion that he's not, but it is simply a fact that he is one of the most loathed announcers in the NBA.

[fluid.forty.one]

Originally Posted by CadBane

Van Gundy is the best in the game.

http://www.google.com/search?q=mark+...a2885925ea8ae0


See how that works? It doesn't make your opinion wrong or stupid. At all.

Best part is that most of the positive comments that come up in that search, also speak positively about Mark Jackson.

[fluid.forty.one]

Some other "obviously correct opinions because they came up in a google search"

http://www.google.com/search?sourcei...a2885925ea8ae0

Best EVERRRRRR!!!!!

[LonghornDub]

Originally Posted by CadBane

http://www.google.com/search?q=mark+...ient=firefox-a

It's weird, because I could have sworn I asked for "irrefutable" and "objective statistics." It seems I must have accidentally keyed in "anecdotal Google-search evidence." Admittedly, typing is not my strong suit.

Here's an exercise. Pick something you like. I don't care what. The Mavs, your favorite band, your favorite movie, your favorite hot female celebrity. Whatever. Punch that bad boy into Google, add the word "sucks" on the end, and hit search.

"Widely held" opinion incoming.

[CadBane]

What I'm saying is arguing colors as analogous to commentators is NOT accurate. Period.

Yes, announcers might be more subjective than NBA players, but it's a hell of lot less so than colors.

You want me to start a poll on this site as proof?

[nowhereman]

[LonghornDub]

Originally Posted by CadBane

Yes, announcers might be more subjective than NBA players, but it's a hell of lot less so than colors.

No, it's really not. Both evaluations involve several layers of subjectivity, starting with which qualities are most important and ending with a personal weighing of those qualities. But I don't expect you to see that. I fully expect you to continue thinking that the problem is with the analogy and not your horrifically skewed perception of what's a "fact" and what isn't.

And for what it's worth, there's a strong irony in you, "CadBan," extolling the value of the "widely held" opinion.

[Male30Dan]

Originally Posted by CadBane

Lmao, what a crock of shit, Thig.

I was allegedly banned for personal insults, which were used in retaliation, yet other users have carte blanche to to fling them at me unprovoked.

Check the very first post on Page 4, but hey, I guess it's okay as long as I don't say it.

I call a spade a spade Cad... I also offer normal conversation without the need to jizz on my screen everytime a player's name I love is uttered while literally raging hell anytime that same person is not spoken of like a God.

You choose to act like a mental midget, get called out for it, then sit there wondering why poor wittle Cadbane gets his feewins huwt with no one running to your defense.

Grow up bro.

[Underdog]

Originally Posted by CadBane

What I'm saying is arguing colors as analogous to commentators is NOT accurate. Period.

Yes, announcers might be more subjective than NBA players, but it's a hell of lot less so than colors.

You want me to start a poll on this site as proof?

Isn't a poll 100% subjective, or has the definition of "subjective" changed recently?

Also, claiming that a preference in announcers is more subjective than a preference in colors is completely inaccurate too, since subjectivity is non-incremental by definition (only objectivity can be measured incrementally, by definition...)

[rabbitproof]

The bias towards announcers center around their opinion about Dirk.

Thus, it is NOT subjective.

[Mav Addict]

Getting deep in here...All these big words is giving me a headache

[CadBane]

You guys are hilarious. I could tell you most people think grass is green and you'd argue it's yellow.

[LonghornDub]

Originally Posted by CadBane

You guys are hilarious. I could tell you most people think grass is green and you'd argue it's yellow.

Do you honestly not understand how this is entirely different than what we're talking about? There's no value judgment involved in your (ridiculous) example. No assessment of good or bad. "The grass is green" is not the same as "green grass is pretty" or "green grass sucks and is overrated."

[CadBane]

Originally Posted by LonghornDub

Do you honestly not understand how this is entirely different than what we're talking about? There's no value judgment involved in your (ridiculous) example. No assessment of good or bad. "The grass is green" is not the same as "green grass is pretty" or "green grass sucks and is overrated."

Do you not honestly understand that colors are not analogous to announcers?

Do colors receive awards for their job?

Are colors actually ranked?

Announcers ARE. This is a JOB. There IS criteria for what makes a good one and a bad one. There ARE awards for announcers based on their skill.

Do you realize that?

Sure it's an opinion, but saying it's as subjective as colors is FALSE. An announcer is a JOB just like an architect. Are you going to say that arguing Frank Gehry is a better architect than whoever designed your house is just as subjective as liking one color to another?

Do you not honestly understand this?

[tsar]

Lol this thread has completely derailed and turned into a e-peen measuring contest. A mod should just close it.

[DevinHarriswillstart]

Ignore button folks.

[jthig32]

Originally Posted by CadBane

Do you not honestly understand that colors are not analogous to announcers?

Do colors receive awards for their job?

Are colors actually ranked?

Announcers ARE. This is a JOB. There IS criteria for what makes a good one and a bad one. There ARE awards for announcers based on their skill.

Do you realize that?

Sure it's an opinion, but saying it's as subjective as colors is FALSE. An announcer is a JOB just like an architect. Are you going to say that arguing Frank Gehry is a better architect than whoever designed your house is just as subjective as liking one color to another?

Do you not honestly understand this?

The fact that there are subjective awards and subjective criteria for something does not make it less subjective.

You berated someone for having an opinion on a very subjective matter. You berated someone for liking the work of someone that many, many people enjoy.

But WE'RE the ones that are argumentative and looking for a fight. Right? It's all everyone else's fault, right?

[CadBane]

Originally Posted by jthig32

The fact that there are subjective awards and subjective criteria for something does not make it less subjective.

You berated someone for having an opinion on a very subjective matter. You berated someone for liking the work of someone that many, many people enjoy.

But WE'RE the ones that are argumentative and looking for a fight. Right? It's all everyone else's fault, right?

I didn't berate anyone for their opinion. Maybe you should read the original post that started it all. Another poster berated me for allegedly not liking anyone but Dirk. But hey, you have a history of turning a blind eye to the instigator, nothing new.

[Rick41]

It's Cadbane's mission to go out and derail EVERY THREAD POSSIBLE.

I don't have a problem with you personally, but just STFU man, for the sake of the board.

[DirkFTW]

Originally Posted by CadBane

You guys are hilarious. I could tell you most people think grass is green and you'd argue it's yellow.

Lol, it is. In the fall.

[LonghornDub]

Originally Posted by CadBane

Do you not honestly understand that colors are not analogous to announcers?

Do colors receive awards for their job?

Are colors actually ranked?

Announcers ARE. This is a JOB. There IS criteria for what makes a good one and a bad one. There ARE awards for announcers based on their skill.

Do you realize that?

Sure it's an opinion, but saying it's as subjective as colors is FALSE. An announcer is a JOB just like an architect. Are you going to say that arguing Frank Gehry is a better architect than whoever designed your house is just as subjective as liking one color to another?

Do you not honestly understand this?

You miss the mark again. We aren't comparing people in different rungs of jobs, like the world-famous architect who collects millions per job versus the young graduate who's just making his way. We're comparing the top announcers on the NBA's two primary networks. They all have the exact same job at the exact same level. There are no similar criteria on which to compare them. You conceded as much when I asked you for objective criteria and you gave me a Google search.

It's gonna baffle some people why I waste so much time with you, but frankly, it's cause I'd like to see you stick around without alienating yourself from almost everyone here all the time. You offer some real value here, but you constantly negate it by blatantly ridiculing people who carry different opinions than you. And what's worse, you usually do so on matters that are firmly within the realm of reasonable disagreement. Like who is the best NBA announcer.

And that's the point of the color analogy, which has been spot on this entire time. You are so firmly convicted in your own opinions that you don't even realize what's a fact and what isn't.

It's sad, man. I mean that. Wake the hell up.

[xrobx]

http://www.google.com/#hl=en&sugexp=...40f95b1b9c7c0d

[CadBane]

Originally Posted by LonghornDub

You miss the mark again. We aren't comparing people in different rungs of jobs, like the world-famous architect who collects millions per job versus the young graduate who's just making his way. We're comparing the top announcers on the NBA's two primary networks. They all have the exact same job at the exact same level. There are no similar criteria on which to compare them. You conceded as much when I asked you for objective criteria and you gave me a Google search.

It's gonna baffle some people why I waste so much time with you, but frankly, it's cause I'd like to see you stick around without alienating yourself from almost everyone here all the time. You offer some real value here, but you constantly negate it by blatantly ridiculing people who carry different opinions than you. And what's worse, you usually do so on matters that are firmly within the realm of reasonable disagreement. Like who is the best NBA announcer.

And that's the point of the color analogy, which has been spot on this entire time. You are so firmly convicted in your own opinions that you don't even realize what's a fact and what isn't.

It's sad, man. I mean that. Wake the hell up.

A young graduate designed your house?

[LonghornDub]

Originally Posted by CadBane

A young graduate designed your house?

Oh, I don't live in a house, per se. You ever driven through Italy, TX on I-35E? I live in that Monolithic dome community down there. The one with the big dome caterpillar out front.

This is me: http://www.monolithic.com/topics/homes

[mac222b]

Originally Posted by LonghornDub

Oh, I don't live in a house, per se. You ever driven through Italy, TX on I-35E? I live in that Monolithic dome community down there. The one with the big dome caterpillar out front.

This is me: http://www.monolithic.com/topics/homes

a young Donald Judd?

[LonghornDub]

Originally Posted by mac222b

a young Donald Judd?

If only.

[SMC0007]

Originally Posted by CadBane

I didn't berate anyone for their opinion. Maybe you should read the original post that started it all. Another poster berated me for allegedly not liking anyone but Dirk. But hey, you have a history of turning a blind eye to the instigator, nothing new.

Well fwiw, JThig messaged me after your ban was lifted, asking me not to attack you and that we should all give you a chance to be around if you choose to attempt keeping the peace. So I wouldn't say he turns a blind eye, If anything they may allow certain people to linger around for a bit too long.

Maybe you are confused about who is the instigator in most of the skirmishes that you are involved in. If you could tone down your "rebukes" towards other peoples opinions a bit, most of these wouldn't happen. I don't mind reading your posts that are serious basketball posts or funny posts in general. It's just that you seem to feel the need to hammer down any disagreement and personally attack them, wether thru a post or by P.M. I think there's a place for cad here but come on, try harder to fit in. If you have no interest in that, why stick around? I mean you obviously want to be here or you would have stayed away after the ban, perhaps you could start by finding more posts you can agree with or some other positive stuff, perhaps I could F off...i know

[Male30Dan]

Originally Posted by LonghornDub

Oh, I don't live in a house, per se. You ever driven through Italy, TX on I-35E? I live in that Monolithic dome community down there. The one with the big dome caterpillar out front.

This is me: http://www.monolithic.com/topics/homes

My wife and I chuckle every time we drive by that huge caterpillar. I bet they actually are nice homes that are cheaper on your pocket book though.

[ReDirkulous Tyme]

Originally Posted by LonghornDub

You miss the mark again. We aren't comparing people in different rungs of jobs, like the world-famous architect who collects millions per job versus the young graduate who's just making his way. We're comparing the top announcers on the NBA's two primary networks. They all have the exact same job at the exact same level. There are no similar criteria on which to compare them. You conceded as much when I asked you for objective criteria and you gave me a Google search.

It's gonna baffle some people why I waste so much time with you, but frankly, it's cause I'd like to see you stick around without alienating yourself from almost everyone here all the time. You offer some real value here, but you constantly negate it by blatantly ridiculing people who carry different opinions than you. And what's worse, you usually do so on matters that are firmly within the realm of reasonable disagreement. Like who is the best NBA announcer.

And that's the point of the color analogy, which has been spot on this entire time. You are so firmly convicted in your own opinions that you don't even realize what's a fact and what isn't.

It's sad, man. I mean that. Wake the hell up.

You know, while I don't COMPLETELY disagree with you dub, I will say that I think you overlook a couple things in your assessment of Cadbane. I mean you do realize that virtually everyone always ragging on Cadbane for his insults is a hypocrite, correct? I have seen just as many, if not more posts insulting Cadbane, to ALMOST the same degree as he insults them, and I rarely see recognition of said posts. It seems to me as if the only person who really gets hated on for his written abuse of other members is Cadbane.

In addition, I can actually relate to his frustrations. Although everyone is completely and 100% entitled to their own opinion, the fact is, many of these opinions are absolutely idiotic and just plain wrong. I know the problem I have, and I think the problem Cadbane has, is the fact that it really aggravates us when we see other members spewing incomprehensible bullshit, and other members actually accepting this. The retaining of one's opinion is not my concern, but the spreading of that belief is. This may seem a bit harsh, and I'm sorry. I just hate seeing one of the most knowledgeable (at least basketball wise) posters on here getting continuously assaulted by every long-term member as soon as he calls someone out.

I'm sure you guys know the concept of a vicious circle. I'll let ya'll apply it to your interactions with Cadbane.

[DTown All Day]

Originally Posted by dirt_dobber

I do LOVE the current chemistry and makeup of this team. I say let's roll with what we got!

yea lets finish the season who we started with it. i know its part of the bizz to get traded but it must be so challenging to up and move after adapting to cwrtain individuals and players.

[LonghornDub]

Originally Posted by ReDirkulous Tyme

You know, while I don't COMPLETELY disagree with you dub, I will say that I think you overlook a couple things in your assessment of Cadbane. I mean you do realize that virtually everyone always ragging on Cadbane for his insults is a hypocrite, correct? I have seen just as many, if not more posts insulting Cadbane, to ALMOST the same degree as he insults them, and I rarely see recognition of said posts. It seems to me as if the only person who really gets hated on for his written abuse of other members is Cadbane.

In addition, I can actually relate to his frustrations. Although everyone is completely and 100% entitled to their own opinion, the fact is, many of these opinions are absolutely idiotic and just plain wrong. I know the problem I have, and I think the problem Cadbane has, is the fact that it really aggravates us when we see other members spewing incomprehensible bullshit, and other members actually accepting this. The retaining of one's opinion is not my concern, but the spreading of that belief is. This may seem a bit harsh, and I'm sorry. I just hate seeing one of the most knowledgeable (at least basketball wise) posters on here getting continuously assaulted by every long-term member as soon as he calls someone out.

I'm sure you guys know the concept of a vicious circle. I'll let ya'll apply it to your interactions with Cadbane.

If you aggregate several posters, sure, people are just as rude to Cad as he is to them. But no single person consistently ridicules people like he does. He is treated differently because he, as an individual, has a history of behaving a certain way. No other individual has a similar history.

I sorta like the guy. He's pretty smart, and he's not afraid to disagree with someone (a quality I appreciate).

But if the argument is that he's unfairly been given a certain rap around here, that's just not the case. Everybody starts here with a clean slate. You don't earn the reputation of being an asshole unless you post like an asshole.

[jthig32]

Originally Posted by LonghornDub

If you aggregate several posters, sure, people are just as rude to Cad as he is to them. But no single person consistently ridicules people like he does. He is treated differently because he, as an individual, has a history of behaving a certain way. No other individual has a similar history.

I sorta like the guy. He's pretty smart, and he's not afraid to disagree with someone (a quality I appreciate).

But if the argument is that he's unfairly been given a certain rap around here, that's just not the case. Everybody starts here with a clean slate. You don't earn the reputation of being an asshole unless you post like an asshole.

Correct. It's not like people don't disagree around here, and disagree vehemently.

Ribosoma and I got into a hard core disagreement when he first got here. Dan and I routinely get short with each other.

But we don't all act like complete assholes every single time we disagree with someone, so we still can hold civil conversations.

If someone around here is universally disliked, there's a reason for it, and it's not because we're all banding together or experiencing group think.

[LonghornDub]

Originally Posted by jthig32

Correct. It's not like people don't disagree around here, and disagree vehemently.

Ribosoma and I got into a hard core disagreement when he first got here. Dan and I routinely get short with each other.

But we don't all act like complete assholes every single time we disagree with someone, so we still can hold civil conversations.

If someone around here is universally disliked, there's a reason for it, and it's not because we're all banding together or experiencing group think.

I got into several disagreements with chum and murph when I was new here and they were both veterans of 3+ years. I was defending Stackhouse in my first few hundred posts here against Murph, the ultimate Stackhouse hater and a board vet since 2001. Somehow I survived.

[sefant77]

Yeah lockerroom and chemistry but Wallace for Butler/Jones/1st?

Hell yes. Wallace isnt an Artest/JR or some other crazy douche...