What is security?

[Charlie Brown]

Could someone explain to me how 15 million dollars for 3 years is not security? That's what Lewis's agent keeps saying and it bugs the hell out of me. Do you guys think NBA players are just spoiled or would you guys also think the same thing if you were in the same position as a Rashard Lewis.

I mean . . . I wonder what the first NBA player to make a million a year thought when he signed his contract . . . I'm sure he wasn't worried about his financial SECURITY.

Stuff like this makes me hate sports. Baseball's the worst. But basketball's closing in.

[Blonde Bomber]

They live on an whole different level than us.
You would act different if you were to step into there shoes.


You have to look at in our terms. If you were working for a company making around 80,000 a year, which is decent bread to live on, and there are other people in your company making 100,000 that contribute the same or less than you do. You would be pissed and want more money.

Also, the whole security issue.

People do not understand that most of these players do not spend all there money on themselves. They have family and friends they take care of with there riches, Charities and other foundations that they support and fund. A lot of them give back to there communities. And trust me none of us would live the way we do now if we were fortunate to become millionares.

The way I look at it is if its out there to get...go for it.
Because nothing is gaurenteed in life.

And before we go and put down all the players today..in sports(Jerryism).
Lets start by looking at the people who are willing to pay these outlandish salaries. It all starts with the owners.

I think your gripe is at the wrong people.

[pepperfletch]

The security of 60 to 75 million GUARANTEED is what the agent is talking about. The true security is that the agent get 10% of either, Dallas 1.5 vs Seasttle 6 to 7.5 million, wouldn't you feel more secure if you were his agent?

I agree players make an embarassing amount of money, but it is we fans and TV networks who provide the funds both owners and players fight over. We need to pull back for a few years and see what effect that has, but alas I see noway sports nuts like those of us on websites will ever do that do you?

[Charlie Brown]

yeah,

i know we are the ones who fund these leisure activities in excess and that's why i only go to about one to two games a year. although, i know that every game i watch on tv and hear on the radio helps their advertising revenue.

i'm just annoyed that ticket sales keep increasing every year and the only ones i can afford are the $8 or $15 seats which are very high up. but then, let's say you have a family and want to buy food along with the tickets, then costs can become sky high just to watch a freakin "game."

i do know that it all starts with the owners, but i think both sides are to blame. greey owners and self-serving athletes lead to so much bickering over money in every contract, trying to add bonuses there, incentives here, that it makes me wonder whether players play for the game or for the money these days.

i know it's all a business, but i think us making a decision on $80,000 and a six figure salary has more ramifications then someone deciding between 5 mil a year versus 8 mil a year. i mean . . . take the excitement of a person winning a million dollar lottery and multiply that by five and that's the feeling players should get when they sign a mid-level exception . . . but they still want more. i don't necessary blame the players for wanting more, but instead the system that keeps increasing the market year after year that in the end, hurts the blue-collar fans out there that work hard to make a buck.

on a side note, it especially irks me to see sports and movie celebrities gain the limelight, fame, and money while teachers, doctors, and scientists, etc. make much less while they're actually doing more for society IMO. but this is not an attack on celebrities themselves, because i'm sure if that doctor was 7 foot tall, he would rather play basketball and make millions there. but still, i think these celebrities should not take for granted their situation and stop bickering over money and just play the game.

[dude1394]

If you can't afford to go to the games, then that is unfortunate, but I don't begrudge cuban selling tickets for as much as he can get. His job is to maximize revenue. Now luckily he also likes a rowdy bunch in the arena so he has to make concessions there a little bit.

As to the dollars the atheletes get... Let's see number one unca' sam takes 40% off the top and his agent takes 10% off the top. So he already only has 30 million. They also should try to maximize their revenue for themselves, their kids, their kids kids, family etc. I don't begrudge bill gates and I don't begrudge Rashard. Just wish I could hoop like that so I could make those bucks as well.

I am sure that most of them are pretty philantrophic and someone has to buy luxury cars so normal people have jobs making luxury cars. It's a bigger pie and everyone benefits.

[NYMavFan]

welcome to capitalism

there's really no point in complaining about how much money sports stars/movie stars make compared to other more "noble" professions like doctors, teachers, etc. they get paid so much because WE (as a collective whole) are willing to pay for it. the market is there, and so they simply take what is available to them. it doesn't matter if we feel moral outrage at the fact that rashard is going to make millions of dollars more than a great surgeon who saves lives. the truth is simply that we as americans value entertainment much more than anything else, hence the outrageous salaries.

i mean, i don't see any of us going to a discussion board to talk about that great doctor or teacher we met last week. nope, we're spending our free time coming here to talk about rashard and his millions

[Big Boy Laroux]

<< someone has to buy luxury cars so normal people have jobs making luxury cars. It's a bigger pie and everyone benefits. >>



ha ha. well put.

[Charlie Brown]

<<
i mean, i don't see any of us going to a discussion board to talk about that great doctor or teacher we met last week. nope, we're spending our free time coming here to talk about rashard and his millions >>



and i think there's something inherently wrong about that.

but anyways, i understand everyone's points. it's the arguments i always come across when i try to talk about this. but i didn't really want to debate in length about this on a message board. not a big fan of typing out my opinions, especially if it requires thought. i'd rather talk about it. i usually come to message boards to get away from thinking so much at work . . . hence any dumb trade proposals. [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif[/img]

but in any case, i guess you must realize i'm not a big fan of capitalism, but that's the society we live in and that's fine with me for now. but i was just trying to get everyone's general impressions on whether they would also bicker over $5 mil versus $8 mil or so if they were in Rashard's shoes. that's all.

i personally think i wouldn't, but i guess i won't fully know unless i was in his shoes. i'd actually sign for the $5 mil and ask the owner to give away the difference to charity so that the owner doesn't pocket it. something like that.

another thing that annoys me, just from a basketball standpoint, is guys like garnett who take up like half the salary cap, and continue to complain about not having a winning team. why doesn't he take a pay cut so that it frees management to surround him with better players. that bugs me, too.

but oh well. i'm temporarily assuaged by the fact that the players on the mavericks are generally good people, according to couple mavs insiders i know. i don't think i'd enjoy basketball much if i was living in portland, for example.

btw, i can afford season tickets . . . but i just choose not to buy them. although i wouldn't mind sitting one playoff game courtside . . . hmm.

[Usually Lurkin]

<< but in any case, i guess you must realize i'm not a big fan of capitalism >>


will you please send me your paychecks? [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif[/img]



<< i'd actually sign for the $5 mil and ask the owner to give away the difference to charity so that the owner doesn't pocket it. something like that. >>



a promise like that from an owner might be tougher to negotiate than cash. might be easier to negotiate the cash, then donate it as you'd like. Or just start a new charitable organization. Or buy an island and start your own socialist utopia. With more money, you could make sure more people are living the lifestyle you think they should.

[seelenjaeger]

I join the boat - actually i think if you are this young, and &quot;might&quot; be able to score big contracts (or even those around 3 million) at WILL during the next 10 years, security is the least thing to care about ...

take ONE of those 2 offers, no matter what, and don´t have to work anymore YOUR WHOLE LIFE even IF you retire after one of them - that´s security.

It´s a winning situation anyways, it just takes some smartness to realize.

Smart would be signing with Dallas and dedicating some of the money to charity just to make clear it wasn´t about money but loyalty and style you kicked Seattle ... the jackass art of making enemies.

[jacktruth]

If you asked me what I think I should make, I would answer, &quot;as much as I can get.&quot;
I don't know about you, but I would rather have 60 million than 15 million. If I get injured in 3 years and can't come back. I still have 60 million.

[seelenjaeger]

well, having 15 or 60 mills for the rest of your life isnt so much difference - at least for us &quot;normalos&quot; and our simple ways of spending money ...

just think about it ... if you carry this money to a bank and get only 3 percent interest, you´ll make around 500 k bucks a year without your treasury decreasing. this means you can spent 1.5 k per day for the rest of your life ... now THAT`s a full time job if you´d ask me.

j

[dude1394]

Let's say however that you are truly alturistic. You believe in helping the neighborhood and city where you grew up. You want to start investments there because no one else will. Not saying rashard would do that, but 60 million versus 15 million gives you a LOT of options in life. In both cases you will hopefully not ever need money again (unless you put it all in Lucent, Enron or WorldCom Stocks) but that is like saying if we won the lottery we would only take half and let the state keep the rest.

In Rashards ( and mine) mind, he does a lot better with that money than the supersonics.

[Usually Lurkin]

what a sweet dream, seelenjaeger.

But if someone were to say I could either have 15 mil, or 60 mil. All else being equal, I'd have to take the 60.

But all things aren't equal here. For the sake of security, you've got 100% chance of 60mil, or 100% chance at 15 mil + 85% chance at 100mil. (85% is my guess at the possibility of injury or Cuban pulling a seattle)

So do you wager 45mil for an 85% chance at 100mil?

[seelenjaeger]

well, actually my point is this:

15 mill or 60 mill is the same if you think along security

100 mill (by maxing out and your advertising money increase with a ring) and 60 mill is the money issue if it works out fine

a ring, is a ring, is a ring

period

[Usually Lurkin]

oh I see, your talking about personal lifetime financial security. good point. I was thinking job/contract security.

[seelenjaeger]

another thing ... those &quot;60 mill&quot; in seattle are not 60 mill in dallas - it´s more likely around 45 ...

not that it would matter

[Usually Lurkin]

<< another thing ... those &quot;60 mill&quot; in seattle are not 60 mill in dallas - it´s more likely around 45 ... >>



how so? aren't both states free of state income tax?

[seelenjaeger]

if i get it right - no

[Drbio]

Washington has a state income tax.

[Nellie]

Somebody in another thread (I can't recall who and am too lazy to go look) stated that Rashard's offer from the Sonics is up to 70mil now.

[Drbio]

That's not entirely correct. The Seattle offer is for 60 and has incentives that could reach up to 70.

[NYMavFan]

I'm pretty sure I read that with incentives, it's up to 75 mil. someone correct me if i'm wrong.

[seelenjaeger]

hardly possible to correct you in this issue, since we don´t know what you read ... [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-wink.gif[/img]