Dal/DET - Dallas-Mavs.com Forums

dalmations202 · 10-05-2010, 07:08 AM

Successful Trade Scenario
Congratulations on a successful trade.
Trade ID #5708567
Dallas Trade Breakdown
Change in Team Outlook: -0.7 ppg, -0.8 rpg, and -0.5 apg.

Incoming Players
Richard Hamilton
6-7 SG from Connecticut
18.1 ppg, 2.6 rpg, 4.4 apg in 33.7 minutes
Ike Diogu
6-8 PF from Arizona State
No games yet played in 2009-2010
Outgoing Players
Jason Terry
6-2 PG from Arizona
16.6 ppg, 1.8 rpg, 3.8 apg in 33.0 minutes
DeShawn Stevenson
6-5 SG / SF from Washington Union (HS)
2.2 ppg, 1.6 rpg, 1.1 apg in 15.4 minutes

Detroit Trade Breakdown
Change in Team Outlook: +0.7 ppg, +0.8 rpg, and +0.5 apg.

Incoming Players
Jason Terry
6-2 PG from Arizona
16.6 ppg, 1.8 rpg, 3.8 apg in 33.0 minutes
DeShawn Stevenson
6-5 SG / SF from Washington Union (HS)
2.2 ppg, 1.6 rpg, 1.1 apg in 15.4 minutes
Outgoing Players
Richard Hamilton
6-7 SG from Connecticut
18.1 ppg, 2.6 rpg, 4.4 apg in 33.7 minutes
Ike Diogu
6-8 PF from Arizona State
No games yet played in 2009-2010

Thoughts from both Dallas side, and Detroit's side.
If Detroit is in rebuilding mode, this saves some cash with Terry being a possible 3.4 buyout, and Rip having 2 more years.
Dallas gets a legit SG and a backup PF (yes it has to wait till late Dec).

Just curious about some thoughts of others.

Male30Dan · 10-05-2010, 06:45 PM

Does Rip accept 6th man minutes or do you bring Roddy off the bench in this situation?

mavs777 · 10-05-2010, 07:23 PM

Roddy off the bench as 6th man

tcat075 · 10-06-2010, 06:49 AM

why would we go trade for Diogu? We could have signed him and didn't.

dalmations202 · 10-06-2010, 06:55 AM

Roddy would be the first 1 or 2 off the bench, IMO. He has got to play some 1 at his size.

Rip is a legit SG - at least with his size, but he is on the downside. If you limited his minutes, I think he would be the SG that is needed. With Kidd and Rip being older, you should have lots of minutes for Roddy and DoJo.

Caron and Matrix hold up the SF. Dirk and Diogu hold up the PF, and you keep all 4 Bigs.
JJB as the 13th man.

I think it would make them a more balanced team - still not sure they would be good enough, but it IMO would make them much more versatile.

41mvp · 10-06-2010, 01:43 PM

this tread is bullshit.

Underdog · 10-06-2010, 01:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 41mvp

this tread is

"Tread"?

Did you get some bad tires or something?

41mvp · 10-06-2010, 02:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Underdog

"Tread"?

Did you get some bad tires or something?

sorry my mistake ,,Trade" your language is difficult

Underdog · 10-06-2010, 02:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 41mvp

sorry my mistake ,,Trade" your language is difficult

Gotcha - wasn't sure if you meant "trade" or "thread" (or maybe just "tread", I dunno!)

dalmations202 · 10-06-2010, 03:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 41mvp

this tread is bullshit.

please explain why?

Does Detroit do it? Why or Why not?
Does Dallas do it? Why or Why not?

I was just questioning others thoughts on it.

mac222b · 10-06-2010, 04:34 PM

i think this team would really miss Jet's 3 point shooting. everyone's down on him but he's still a guy that can carry a team for stretches, as well as stretch the defense. and Rip's contract is rather onerous even though the last year isn't guaranteed. Rip's also been breaking down physically. whatever you want to say about Jet he is at least durable and tough.

41mvp · 10-06-2010, 11:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dalmations202

please explain why?

Does Detroit do it? Why or Why not?
Does Dallas do it? Why or Why not?

I was just questioning others thoughts on it.

I always want trade Terry.But in this time Hamilton for Terry this isn't good idea.We want Melo this player will be the best choice for us.

2k mavs · 10-14-2010, 12:10 AM

the mavs need to trade for rudy fernandez

41mvp · 10-14-2010, 01:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 2k mavs

the mavs need to trade for rudy fernandez

probably not.Fernandez in Dallas I don't see that!!!

wilmtalk · 10-14-2010, 05:34 PM

I realize these trades are interresting and fun to put together but practically RC doesn't even know how the pieces that are here now will fit together. I would give it a half a season to see how this group works. Then would be the best time to see which adjustments need to be made through a trade and which players are most expenable in order to make that happen.

itsgotime · 11-08-2010, 01:11 PM

Here's a Dallas - Detroit trade that could work especially after seeing the start for the Mavs and what is really lacking:

Dallas out:
JET, Butler, JJB

Detroit out:
Stuckey, Rip, Prince

We take on a lot more money, but pick up players that IMO would fit much better on this team. It allows Kidd to actually get 30-32 mpg with no problem because Stuckey is good enough to play that many minutes. JET to Rip is mostly a wash with an emphasis on a different type of game for Rip. Butler to Prince is an upgrade on defense while I'm not sure it's a large downgrade on O. Marion and Prince as our 3's is pretty defensively stout.

Kidd/Stuckey/Roddy/DoJo
Roddy(if he proves his ability)/Rip/Stuckey/DoJo
Prince/Marion
Dirk/Marion/Mahinmi
Chandler/Haywood/Mahinmi/Ajinca

Roddy has to be a go to scorer type if this is gonna work. Rip in a backup role fits fine, he can be a focal point like JET is now for offense. I like Marion in the backup 3 and 4 role where he'll see time on the floor with both Dirk and Prince. Very similar to how they do it now, Butler comes out for Marion, a couple minutes later Butler comes in for Dirk, replace Butler with Prince and it works great.

KillerLeft · 11-08-2010, 01:18 PM

I suppose Hamilton is still a usable player, but honestly - is he that much better than Terry? I don't think so, personally. Plus, and this is a big one, can Hamilton guard PG's? No? Well, then he won't work in tandem with Jason Kidd, will he?

Look, I know Terry is no defensive stalwart, but at least he plays the PG position (on defense). Whoever plays with Kidd MUST be able to do this. Period.

itsgotime · 11-08-2010, 01:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KillerLeft

I suppose Hamilton is still a usable player, but honestly - is he that much better than Terry? I don't think so, personally. Plus, and this is a big one, can Hamilton guard PG's? No? Well, then he won't work in tandem with Jason Kidd, will he?

Look, I know Terry is no defensive stalwart, but at least he plays the PG position (on defense). Whoever plays with Kidd MUST be able to do this. Period.

If you look at the proposed lineup, Kidd and Rip don't play on the court as much with Rip coming off the bench.

Another thing, with Chandler/Haywood and Prince/Marion in there to roam the lane of those penetrating guards, the need to contain them is lessened, not that we can just be nonchalant about it, but our defense at the 3 and 5 positions are pretty dang good after this trade, IMO.

Also, Rip is no slouch on D and is a sure upgrade to JET on that end. His length allows him to be a factor even if his man passes by him.

sefant77 · 11-08-2010, 02:09 PM

Hamilton declined pretty fast and his contract is a long trainwreck.

I think i prefer to have Terry, so ugly is Hamiltons contract.

itsgotime · 11-08-2010, 05:09 PM

I think the differences between Butler/Prince and Rip/JET are small enough for the swap of the 4 of them is pretty much a wash. The real win in this trade is the swap of JJB for Stuckey, and that, to me, is worth the extra money you have to pay Rip over the next 3 years.

At the rate this year has started out, JET's contract will not be Stack-like, meaning we have him for this and another year. That makes Rip a bit easier to swallow IMO as well.

sefant77 · 11-08-2010, 11:32 PM

Stuckey is worthy like 60 million? Paying Rip 30 million after next season + the same in LT.

itsgotime · 11-09-2010, 11:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sefant77

Stuckey is worthy like 60 million? Paying Rip 30 million after next season + the same in LT.

If you're going to throw numbers out there, maybe you should get them correct. Rip's last year is unguaranteed according to Shamsports. How much is unguaranteed and how it is written up to get it guaranteed is what I'm unsure about.

JET at this point is going to have his next year guaranteed.

With that in mind and just going with Rip's last year's full salary the difference is $18.5 million. That number goes down by the amount of the contract that is unguaranteed with Rip, assuming the trade doesn't go all that well and they want to unguarantee the contract.

Even if the Mavs were to somehow sit JET enough this season to void the unguaranteed part of JET's contract he's still owed $5 mil for next season, so the biggest number it can be is $23.5 mil.

Stuckey isn't worth that much more in salary, but then again, Dirk was paid less than he could have, we didn't use our MLE this year, so we are paying less this year than we were last year in total salary. Quite a bit less.

As far as play, Stuckey would be a large upgrade to JJB on the court. Our defense would be quite a bit better as well, and our offense would not suffer that much, if at all.

In the same way as bringing in Brand (in a Phi/Dal trade for Iggy) to back up Dirk so Dirk didn't have to play so many minutes, Stuckey would be the same thing for Kidd. That means a more rested Kidd for the playoffs.

A more rested Kidd in the playoffs is worth the cost IMO.

Edit: Oh, and BTW, getting rid of playoff shrinking JET while adding guys who shine in the playoffs mostly also helps the team and makes the trade lopsided for Dallas.