Rangers Francisco Arrested

[Drbio]

Report: Rangers RHP Francisco arrested


September 14, 2004
OAKLAND, CALIFORNIA (TICKER) -- KGO Radio in San Francisco is reporting that Texas Rangers reliever Frank Francisco was arrested and released on bail after hurling a chair that hit two fans in the stands during Monday night's game against the Oakland Athletics.

Major League Baseball is investigating the incident and will likely take disciplinary action against Francisco.

The incident occurred in the right field box seats near the Rangers bullpen in the top of the ninth inning. Texas reliever Doug Brocail was screaming at a male fan and had to be restrained by bullpen coach Mark Connor. Other relievers also had to be held back before Francisco threw a chair into the stands. The chair hit one man in the head, then bounced and struck a woman on the side of her head.


The woman was taken to a hospital where she was treated with facial lacerations and a broken nose and filed charges with the Oakland police.

Francisco and Brocail refused to speak to the media after Monday's game.

Francisco, 25, was named American League Rookie of the Month for August.

[u2sarajevo]

Teammates bailed him out.

This is a bad.

[u2sarajevo]

Weigh in with your opinions here.

[u2sarajevo]

If anyone comes across a digital version of the altercation, or any of the events leading up to it.... let me hear from you!!!

[Murphy3]

There is no excuse for throwing a chair into the stands.....HOWEVER, it is being reported that the Rangers had previously complained about the situation but nothing was done. So yes, blame lies with Francisco and perhaps Almanzar, but it likely falls heavily on the A's organization as well for not taking care of the situation before it escalated to this level. Even if the Rangers didn't request something to be done previously, there's no excuse for security guards and ushers on the scene to not take control of what was going on before it escalated to this point. The fans had been going at it with the bullpen for quite awhile...it wasn't an incident that just occurred out of the middle of nowhere.

[dalmations202]

Originally posted by: Murphy3
There is no excuse for throwing a chair into the stands.....HOWEVER, it is being reported that the Rangers had previously complained about the situation but nothing was done. So yes, blame lies with Francisco and perhaps Almanzar, but it likely falls heavily on the A's organization as well for not taking care of the situation before it escalated to this level. Even if the Rangers didn't request something to be done previously, there's no excuse for security guards and ushers on the scene to not take control of what was going on before it escalated to this point. The fans had been going at it with the bullpen for quite awhile...it wasn't an incident that just occurred out of the middle of nowhere.

That depends on who is writing up the article......some seem to write it is the fans fault, some the security, and some Francisco.....funny how one happening can be written up by different people showing blame to different places.

[Murphy3]

Well, from watching the game, I can definitively tell you that one fan in particular could be seen yelling obscenities at Ranger pitcher virtually every time the bullpen was shown.

But like I mentioned, the blame assuredly lies with the fans, the Rangers pen, and the A's organization. No one group is solely responsible although Francisco probably went further overboard than anyone else (no, I do not know whether or not any objects were thrown by the fans or whether or not they threw any punches or anything...so that could change).

If the security/ushers simply would have done their job, this incident would not have occurred. If the fans would not have acted like asses, this would not have happened. If Francisco would not have thrown a chair into the stands, obviously, this would not have happened.

If and when Francisco is sued, I believe that the Rangers should look to immediately go after the A's organization for not taking care of the situation before it escalated.

[dalmations202]

Question:

I didn't see it last night, went to bed in the 8th. Was something actually thrown at the bullpen players? I have read where Buck says there was, and I have read where some say there wasn't. If the bullpen was defending itself, then although I can't defend throwing a chair wildly into the stands, I can understand the reaction.

If fans throw things at players, and the security didn't stop it (why would they admit they saw it now - so why believe everything you read), then WOW. These players are up on a stage, and pumped up with adreline, and then someone threatens their life/livelyhood by throwing something at them. Doesn't surprise me at all that they might throw something back.

Let's face it, people say/do things in a crowd, that they would never do alone. Most of these fans who say/do these things have a little bit of liquid courage, and alot of stupidity thinking they can get away with it because they are in the crowd.

The worst part of all of it, the lady and gentleman who got hurt, probably had absolutely nothing to do with it. The bullpen players who finally blew up and reacted to what happened; will probably lose both money, and maybe time. The idiots who started it (I am assuming fans; by all accounts the fans started the mouthing), and pushed it, will have nothing at all happen to them. So punish the innocent, punish the victim, and let the perpetrators go free.............so much sense for the world today.

[mary]

You can justify it all you want, this is an embarassing thing to happen to this organization. I don't doubt that this guy probably said something completely over the line that went above and beyond normal outfield ribbing. I don't doubt that security would've/could've/should've done something to prevent this incidenct from escalating.

But none of that really matters because in the public's eye, this will be a black mark against the TEXAS RANGERS - not against Oakland security, and not against some unknown, faceless fan, because eventually all of the details will be forgotten. But it WILL be remembered that Frankie Francisco picked up a chair a flung it into a crowd of people and broke a woman's nose. I was embarassed for them last night and its so unfortunate that this season and this young team has to be marred by such an ugly incident.

I'm a little disheartened this morning by the media/Ranger fans trying to use the circumstances to excuse/sugar coat what Francisco did. Its was really, really stupid and WRONG. He didn't just do something to defend himself or his teammates - no, he threw a friggin chair into a crowd of people. Its bad enough a woman's nose was broke, it could've been worse. What if the chair had hit a child or caused more serious damage than a broken nose? Francisco didn't just go after the guy, he did something that had a high probability of inflicting damage on a third party. Again, its just really, really stupid and the fact that situation should've been handled differently by Oakland security does nothing to change that.

BTW, could Josh and Tom have been a little bit MORE homerish about the incident last night? I realize they work for the Rangers, but if the same thing had happened a Ameriquest Field, they would've been all over the players for their behavior. They claimed they just wanted to wait for more "information" on the incident, but lets get real - when has that ever stopped them before from making harsh remarks about players/fans. Remember the baseball/little kid incident earlier in the year? Tom Grieves completely went off on THAT guy and that kid wasn't even injured. But I guess since the offending party is a beloved member of the Texas Rangers Bullpen, and the victim is a fan of a rival team, let's just give him a free pass on this one....wait for more "information".....yeah..right.

[dalmations202]

Originally posted by: mary
You can justify it all you want, this is an embarassing thing to happen to this organization. I don't doubt that this guy probably said something completely over the line that went above and beyond normal outfield ribbing. I don't doubt that security would've/could've/should've done something to prevent this incidenct from escalating.

But none of that really matters because in the public's eye, this will be a black mark against the TEXAS RANGERS - not against Oakland security, and not against some unknown, faceless fan, because eventually all of the details will be forgotten. But it WILL be remembered that Frankie Francisco picked up a chair a flung it into a crowd of people and broke a woman's nose. I was embarassed for them last night and its so unfortunate that this season and this young team has to be marred by such an ugly incident

Well written, and unfortunately too truthful.............

[sike]

to murph: I see it way different

the blame/responsibility lies on Francisco who threw the chair. Sure the security, ushers, and by extension the A's organiszation are reasons or factors this incident occurred, but the fault lies on he who throws the chair. No ammount of cursing or threats take away a player's responsibility to not physically harm a fan. Francisco would have well been in his wrights to scream back at the fan (though this would have been see as classless too) but to take a verbal situation and make a physical altercation is, well, criminal. I feel sorry for the kid, and I think he will still be a good piece in the Ranger's future....but he screwed up BIG on this one.

[Murphy3]

Originally posted by: mary
You can justify it all you want, this is an embarassing thing to happen to this organization. I don't doubt that this guy probably said something completely over the line that went above and beyond normal outfield ribbing. I don't doubt that security would've/could've/should've done something to prevent this incidenct from escalating.

But none of that really matters because in the public's eye, this will be a black mark against the TEXAS RANGERS - not against Oakland security, and not against some unknown, faceless fan, because eventually all of the details will be forgotten. But it WILL be remembered that Frankie Francisco picked up a chair a flung it into a crowd of people and broke a womean's nose. I was embarassed for them last night and its so unfortunate that this season and this young team has to be marred by such an ugly incident

I think it'll be remembered, but I don't see it as being a huge deal to way this team is looked at in the future. What do you remember about Rod Dibble? Do you remember him throwing a ball into the stands or do you remember him being a fruitcake/brilliant closer? I remember him throwing the ball into the stands, but only vaguely..very vaguely...the same with Albert/Joey Belle. Hell, Francisco isn't nearly the name that either that either of those two, and they seemed to move passed the incidents. Like most things, it'll blow over for the most part.

I'm sorry, but most people don't have the attention span to really hold that against a team or a player for a long time. As an indictment of our society, just look at the disinterest shown by many already when the National Anthem is played at baseball games. Yes, directly after 9-11, everyone took off their hats and truly reflected upon what the song meant and what it meant to be an American. Go to a game now and you'll see an alarming amount of people sitting down, talking or not removing their caps during the anthem. People forget whether we like it or not. I was at the game on 9/12 where the Rangers did all kinds of tributes to police officers, fire fighters, and the victims of 9-11. Honestly, there were more people disinterested in the proceedings than those interested.

And yes, it is Francisco's fault and you cannot justify what he did. However, that does not mean that others aren't at fault as well or that the situation could have easily been avoided.

[sike]

Go to a game now and you'll see an alarming amount of people sitting down, talking or not removing their caps during the anthem.

SCREW THEM!

And yes, it is Francisco's fault and you cannot justify what he did. However, that does not mean that others aren't at fault as well or that the situation could have easily been avoided.

yup

and you are correct...people will forget soon..probably by next season...IF they don't show it all the time.....

[Murphy3]

Originally posted by: sike
to murph: I see it way different

the blame/responsibility lies on Francisco who threw the chair. Sure the security, ushers, and by extension the A's organiszation are reasons or factors this incident occurred, but the fault lies on he who throws the chair. No ammount of cursing or threats take away a player's responsibility to not physically harm a fan. Francisco would have well been in his wrights to scream back at the fan (though this would have been see as classless too) but to take a verbal situation and make a physical altercation is, well, criminal. I feel sorry for the kid, and I think he will still be a good piece in the Ranger's future....but he screwed up BIG on this one.

Sike, I don't believe you'll find me saying anywhere that there is any justification for what occurred. Francisco should be and will be suspended likely for at least the rest of the season. However, I am saying that there's plenty of blame to go around. The A's should have had the fans removed long before the incident occurred. Once again, this is not justification for Francisco's actions, it's blame for the A's lack of action taken. I would be shocked if the A's organization was not reprimanded by MLB and/or sued by one of the parties involved.

Now, just because I'm placing some blame elsewhere does not mean that I'm lessening just how wrong Francisco was in this situation. Personally, the guy probably had it coming, but even if he did have it coming and if the woman were not hit, Francisco should still be fined and suspended for at least the remainder of the season.

[sike]

No one group is solely responsible although Francisco probably went further overboard than anyone else

maybe I read this the wrong way....I would say that dispite all the factors that go into play in one making a decision(whether well and thought our and based upon reason or spontaneous and based upon emotions), the responsibility for the decision still lies at the feet of the one who made it. To me it sounded like you were dividing the responsibility into groups...and though there may have been certain groups fail to do their job in this instance...the ultimate responsibility for the action lies at Francisco's feet. Correct me if I mistreated your words murph...are you dividing responsibility for the action itself or just expounding that they were factors leading up to the action where other groups failed to do their job?

[Murphy3]

No one is solely responsible for the situation as a whole. Sure, each person is solely responsible for their own actions, but the situation involved much more than just a thrown chair..

[sike]

then we disagree, while I see the failings of others as major factors leading to Frankie's choice, I do not see them as taking any of the liability or ethical responsibility for Frankie's foolsihness! Are they factors, yes...are they responsible for a chair flying into a lady's face? No. because that choice was solely Francisco's....we must be held accountible for our actions.
you seem to be agreeing with and disagreeing at the same time murph...
maybe I should clairify my query: who is responsible for that lady having a broken nose?

[u2sarajevo]

Francisco is solely responsible for the broken nose.... but I don't think that was his intended target, nor his intention in the first place.

edit: But I would fully support a long suspension... even if it were for the rest of the season.

[Rhylan]

Every player in the MLB needs to realize that he's got two acres of green grass to retreat upon if he's being threatened or provoked by a fan.

If stadium security didn't do enough last night, don't you think they would've been forced to if the bullpen guys had picked up their chairs and sat down on the other side of the foul line? Certainly seems better than picking up a chair and tossing it the other way.

[dalmations202]

I guess I am the only one of the opinion that all of them should be suspended.

I mean, the fans involved-- banned for the year, the security guards- replaced, and the player(s) -- suspened for the rest of the season.

If you suspend the player only, you send the message that you can intimidate players anytime as a fan, and it will give your team an advantage if you can just get them to react. Why shouldn't fans do it more? Wrong message.

Don't suspend the player, and the whole nation will be upset -- regardless of the "whole story" which has yet to come out.

Why weren't bullpen players kicked out of the game last night? ? With 20 minutes to figure it out, I would think that player(s) would be ejected, unless there is more to it than what has been written by the MSM. Why did the Oakland people almost decide to forfeit the game to the Rangers, and then decide there would be too much uproar from the fans if they did? Why didn't the lady with the broken nose press charges right away? This screams of "their is much more to this story than has been written".

[Murphy3]

Originally posted by: sike
then we disagree, while I see the failings of others as major factors leading to Frankie's choice, I do not see them as taking any of the liability or ethical responsibility for Frankie's foolsihness! Are they factors, yes...are they responsible for a chair flying into a lady's face? No. because that choice was solely Francisco's....we must be held accountible for our actions.
you seem to be agreeing with and disagreeing at the same time murph...
maybe I should clairify my query: who is responsible for that lady having a broken nose?

Once again, you apparently aren't getting what I'm saying. Sike,

each person is solely responsible for their actions

.....

Each person is solely responsible for their actions. Almanzar is responsible for throwing a punch. The fans are responsible for whatever they did. Francisco is responsible for throwing the chair....

However, no one person is solely responsible for the entire incident BECAUSE the incident encompassed more than just a thrown chair. Is Francisco responsible for Almanzar throwing a punch? No. Is Francisco responsible for the fans actions? No. Is Francisco responsible for throwing a chair? Yes.

[capitalcity]

When the courts get involved whats gonna happen to Fransisco?

Is he even a citizen? - can't somebody lose their work visa over a criminal offense?

If the MLB wants to make an example of the kid there is a possibility we'll never see the guy in the majors again.

[Murphy3]

Originally posted by: dalmations202
I guess I am the only one of the opinion that all of them should be suspended.

I mean, the fans involved-- banned for the year, the security guards- replaced, and the player(s) -- suspened for the rest of the season.

If you suspend the player only, you send the message that you can intimidate players anytime as a fan, and it will give your team an advantage if you can just get them to react. Why shouldn't fans do it more? Wrong message.

I can agree with much of this ALTHOUGH we must first find out what exactly occurred before fans start getting banned from the stadium, and before security guards get canned. One of the umps said that there had been complaints about the fans last night while the Oakland organization is denying this currently.

[Murphy3]

If the MLB wants to make an example of the kid there is a possibility we'll never see the guy in the majors again.

The players' union is much to strong for this to occur.

[capitalcity]

Originally posted by: Murphy3

The players' union is much to strong for this to occur.

agreed. But whats the unions recourse against deportation?

For Fransisco's sake i hope this one incident doesn't destroy his career. - He'll need to be employed to pay for all his legal fees.

[Murphy3]

Are they sure that 'it' was indeed a woman?

[sike]

murph said: Each person is solely responsible for their actions.

great, we are saying the same thing then.

Almanzar is responsible for throwing a punch. The fans are responsible for whatever they did. Francisco is responsible for throwing the chair....

once again...same page.

However, no one person is solely responsible for the entire incident BECAUSE the incident encompassed more than just a thrown chair.

ahh the incident...in its entirety...good clarification

Is Francisco responsible for Almanzar throwing a punch? No. Is Francisco responsible for the fans actions? No. Is Francisco responsible for throwing a chair? Yes.

is the security responsible in any way for Francisco throwing a chair? No. Are the A's responsible in any way for Francisco throwing a chair? No. Could the security and subsequently the A's done a better job? Yes. Seems like we are saying the same thing after all Murph.

[sike]

Originally posted by: Murphy3

The players' union is much to strong for this to occur.

exactly, you don't take a guys career away for one stupid move, even one as stupid as this.

[capitalcity]

Originally posted by: Murphy3
Are they sure that 'it' was indeed a woman?

hmm, well oakland isn't that far from berkley [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-wink.gif[/img]

[Murphy3]

Originally posted by: sike

great, we are saying the same thing then.

once again...same page.

ahh the incident...in its entirety...good clarification

is the security responsible in any way for Francisco throwing a chair? No. Are the A's responsible in any way for Francisco throwing a chair? No. Could the security and subsequently the A's done a better job? Yes. Seems like we are saying the same thing after all Murph.

Should the A's face some stiff penalties for not addressing the situation before it escalated? Of course. Yes, Francisco is responsible for throwing the chair, but that does not potentially lessen the responsibility of the A's. It is just as unacceptable to not address a situation involving the fans and players 'if' the Rangers did indeed complain about the fans before the main incident occurred.

[sike]

'if' the Rangers did indeed complain about the fans before the main incident occurred.

true and good point. Plenty of people made mistakes here.

[Caliente]

Originally posted by: sike

exactly, you don't take a guys career away for one stupid move, even one as stupid as this.

Why not? If I threw a chair at anybody while I was at work I would be fired.........oops, sorry, I must have confused the REAL world with the SPORTS world............

[Murphy3]

I hate that argument. You can't take the 'real world' scenario and apply it to sports. I'm sorry, but in the real world, if security guards and/or police men were in the area and aware of a group of people yelling and screaming obscenities at a much smaller group of people, the situation would be broken up or there would at least be some type of police barricade to keep the incident from escalating.

So guess what, we have to keep the sports world and the 'real world' separate. Their jobs aren't the same. How often do you have people screaming obscenities at you at work? How often do you have reporters digging up your family history or following you around taking pictures of you whenever possible?

Sure, none of this justifies what happened, however there is a huge difference between what they have to endure with their job and what the normal population must endure.

On a side note, he could lose his job because of this. However, if he does, virtually every other team in MLB would be interested in picking him up.

[mary]

Here are some pics of all hell breaking lose, including the inevitable mug shot. I don't think it can be said enough - I wish like hell this hadn't happened and as the day has worn on, I've become even more pissed off that Francisco could do something this incredibly stupid.

[mary]

This image makes me wish they would just throw the bastard off the team right now.

[Murphy3]

Originally posted by: mary
Here are some pics of all hell breaking lose, including the inevitable mug shot. I don't think it can be said enough - I wish like hell this hadn't happened and as the day has worn on, I've become even more pissed off that Francisco could do something this incredibly stupid.

I've become slightly less pissed at Francisco ....... Yes, Francisco deserves to be severely punished but I can't say that I have any sympathy for the lady or her husband.

[shelleylovinmavs]

I know in a baseball game heckling is allowed, but there is a point where a line is crossed. I don't know what is said, but one has to think for it to escalate that far that some derogatory things were said. I know if that same person was on the street and had that said to their face, the wouldn't hesitate to throw a punch.

I don't believe what Frankie did was right, but I can understand his anger although he misdirected it in a way that is unacceptable. I just wonder how severe the punishment will be.

[sike]

Originally posted by: Murphy3

I've become slightly less pissed at Francisco ....... Yes, Francisco deserves to be severely punished but I can't say that I have any sympathy for the lady or her husband.

No matter how many times her punk husband put down Francisco or his sainted mamma they (especially the lady) did not deserve this....I have sympathy but I'd have more sympathy if I did not think they would be well compensated for the kid's foolishness.

[Chiwas]

Originally posted by: mary



This image makes me wish they would just throw the bastard off the team right now.

Off the Majors.

[Murphy3]

The guy deserves to be suspended. However, the jackass husband and wife should be banned from the stadium for the next year or so. There's no place for either action.

As for the fans..like I said, I have no sympathy for the white trash. I also don't have alot of sympathy for the guy that threw the chair. She got hit in the head with a chair? Oh well. She'd probably get hit upside the head with a chair on Jerry Springer sometime the next week or two. She'll get over it. The money she receives along with the plastic surgery will only make her near rich and possibly even a little better looking.