Surprise.....Civil suit filed against Kobe.....

[NYCdog]

Apparently she's getting cold feet about a criminal trial....Filing a civil suit would allow her to drop the criminal trial, thus virtually sparing Kobe jail time.

Another note about this......... with a civil suit, she is no longer protected by the rape sheild law.

Thus, all evidence of her past, as well as her identity, will become public.

So look for all sorts of gory details to spill out into the media soon after regarding this case and Kate Faber.

------------------------------------------
Lawyers ask for $75K in compensatory damages

Kobe accuser's lawyers launch attack vs. judge
Attorneys for the woman ...


Tuesday, August 10, 2004


Associated Press
DENVER -- The 20-year-old woman accusing Kobe Bryant of rape filed a federal civil lawsuit against the NBA star Tuesday, seeking unspecified damages for pain, suffering and "public scorn, hatred and ridicule."




The attorneys asked for a jury trial and compensatory damages of at least $75,000, with punitive damages to be determined later.


With the filing, the woman's attorneys backed up a threat they made a week ago. A criminal case requires a higher standard of proof to convict -- beyond a reasonable doubt -- and punishment can involve prison time. A civil case has a lower standard of proof -- a preponderance of evidence -- and punishment is usually a monetary award.


Bryant 25, has pleaded not guilty to felony sexual assault. He has said had consensual sex with the woman, then 19, at the Vail-area resort where she worked last summer. The Los Angeles Lakers star faces four years to life in prison or 20 years to life on probation, and a fine of up to $750,000 if convicted. Jury selection begins Aug. 27.


Bryant's defense attorney, Pamela Mackey, did not immediately return a message seeking comment and neither did the woman's attorneys, John Clune and L. Lin Wood. All attorneys in the case were reminded by the judge last week that a sweeping gag order is in place.


However, the woman's attorneys laid out generally the same case against Bryant as have Eagle County prosecutors: That Bryant attacked her in his room at the Cordillera resort, causing her emotional and physical problems that linger to this day.


"The conduct of defendant Bryant demonstrates willful, reckless and intentional criminal conduct and that entire want of care that raises a conscious indifference to consequences," the attorneys wrote.


Prosecution spokeswoman Krista Flannigan said the civil lawsuit changes nothing for prosecutors.


"We are still moving forward," she said. She declined comment when asked whether the civil case could complicate the effort to win a conviction.

[LRB]

This is no surprise with all the leaks about her identity by the judge and the judges refusal to stop posting documents on the internet where the links have occured 3 times in the past. She needs the money to protect herself from threats. Hope she gets every last dime of Shobe's money including the diamond on his wife's finger.

[Drbio]

There is big fat check signed by showbe behind all of this you can be sure.

[TripleDipping]

Not something we wouldn't expect out of a superstar's case.

Still leaves a bad taste in my mouth, nevertheless.

[sike]

$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$
kobe is playing next season just a mil or so lighter in the pocket.
what a skank.

[u2sarajevo]

I am not shocked at all. I think it was becoming increasingly obvious to everyone that Kobe's law team had already produced enough reasonable doubt in the public already. I don't know why anyone ever bothers prosecuting rich celebrities anyway. They always win.

I think our judicial system works "most" of the time. But I question whether or not it works in the case of a high-profile celeb.

[Male30Dan]

Originally posted by: sike
what a skank.

Dude, I dont know how necessary that is...

[sike]

Originally posted by: Male23Dan

Dude, I dont know how necessary that is...

sure.....chase the money instead of justice....I suppose its her right...but from what I hear (papers/radio) this is a very strange move for a rape victim...let the rapist go free for a little(actually a lot) money. how about this.....they both are skanks.

[Male30Dan]

She hasnt yet dropped her criminal case solely for the civil case; however, if she does, maybe I can agree with you!!! As of now, she is trying to put Showbe behind bars and put a few pennies, (billion of em or so), in her pocket!

[sike]

she will not win the criminal case now. (experts agree the DA'a chances of winning [which were rather small] have just taken a great hit)
she has sacrificed justice for cash.
don't ever sacrifice justice!
is it her choice? sure....is she proving her skank status? yup.

[Male30Dan]

Well, I dont know that anyone really knows whether or not she will win, (despite their EXPERT tag).

With that said, yeah I think she hurt her chances with this due to her having a reason to lie - financial gain...

[jayC]

I thought they dropped the rape shield law regardless of the civil suit. I heard that Kobe groped some waitress at Shaq's house in Orlando.

[gruppy]

Am I missing something, but couldn't she file the civil case against Kobe after criminal case was finished. Wasn't it the way prosecution did against O.J.?

[LRB]

Originally posted by: sike

sure.....chase the money instead of justice....I suppose its her right...but from what I hear (papers/radio) this is a very strange move for a rape victim...let the rapist go free for a little(actually a lot) money. how about this.....they both are skanks.

Sike, her physical safety was in danger that's why she needs the money to buy protection. Unfortunately the Judge's office kept "accidentally" releasing confidential information on her via the internet. Despite "accidentally" doing this 3 times, the judge refused to stop posting documents on the internet. I would find it hard to believe that Kobe wasn't bribing someone to make these accidents. With the judges office releasing confidential information that damaged her case and she and her lawyers and the DA being under a gag order unable to respond, the criminal case became a lost cause. It also allowed sicko fans to get her name and be able to make threats against her personally. It is extemely sad that the judge refused to insure that the rape shield laws were upheld. It seems that rich celebrities like Kobe have more rights that ordinary citizens.

[sturm und drang]

With it becoming increasingly obvious each day that the criminal case is going nowhere, a civil suit is the only remaining option to achieve some vestige of justice. Also, in a civil suit they can force Kobe to testify – something that wasn't going to happen in the criminal case.

Calling the accuser a "skank" is sickening. You know, there's a reason experts estimate that less than 25% of all rapes get reported. I think you've just reminded us all why it takes such courage to come forward.

[DubOverdose]

Wouldn't it be funny if all of Kobe's new contract went to home girl?

[LRB]

Originally posted by: DubOverdose
Wouldn't it be funny if all of Kobe's new contract went to home girl?

Funny as in ha ha, no. Funny as in ironic justice, definitely.

[sike]

Originally posted by: sturm und drang
With it becoming increasingly obvious each day that the criminal case is going nowhere

pure conjecture

a civil suit is the only remaining option to achieve some vestige of justice

.
if justice = cash, then i agree totally.

hey I think Kobe is more than likely a rapist...don't get me wrong. I just find it strange that justice is once again (most likely) going to be thrown aside for the almighty dollar.

[mary]

Originally posted by: sturm und drang
With it becoming increasingly obvious each day that the criminal case is going nowhere, a civil suit is the only remaining option to achieve some vestige of justice. Also, in a civil suit they can force Kobe to testify – something that wasn't going to happen in the criminal case.

Calling the accuser a "skank" is sickening. You know, there's a reason experts estimate that less than 25% of all rapes get reported. I think you've just reminded us all why it takes such courage to come forward.

That's exactly what I thought about when I read this thread. I guess some things will never change.

And Sike, justice is not being thrown aside for the almight dollar. Justice is being thrown aside because this case as been completely botched by the courts, with the "mistaken" release of confidential files to the public.

[Drbio]

Sikey my friend...I have to agree with S&D and mary here. It takes ENORMOUS amounts of courage and thick skin to come forward. I think her of more as a hero than anything else. Certainly skank is out of line.

[Male30Dan]

Shame on you sike... Shame on you indeed!!!

[sike]

Originally posted by: Male23Dan
Shame on you sike... Shame on you indeed!!!

well said dan. well said indeed!!!

maybe I've gotten a totally wrong picture of this young woman...maybe, as doc says, she is a hero...maybe, as Mary says, she is just seeking justice anyway she can...maybe, as I say, she is a victim...maybe, as you all say, I am totally out of line....I will say this though, I predicted this from day one. I knew this would not go away without a civil case seeking millions in reparations. Maybe their is nothing wrong with that...maybe their is everything right with that....but I hate the idea of Kobe walking free if he is guilty...I also hate the idea of this young woman (dispite her seemingly questional moral fiber) taking money and thinking she has received justice. the message is simple...get raped by a millionaire take him for a few million and get over it....THIS IS NOT JUSTICE.

i do apologize for the "skank" comment, I did not mean to minamize this young woman's stature as the victim.

[Male30Dan]

Originally posted by: sike

well said dan. well said indeed!!!

Sarcastic little alien you! [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-wink.gif[/img]

I knew this would not go away without a civil case seeking millions in reparations.

Actually it is for just over 700,000

[LRB]

Sike, ideally Kobe's fame and millions wouldn't shield him from being justly tried as it apparently has. It's a flaw in our system and one not eaisly corrected.

Ideally in my mind Kobe would be given a just trial. If he was found guilty he would serve at least the next 20 years behind bars. If found guilty, then he'd be free to go.

If he was guilty, I'd love to see him stripped of all his money and put into a victims fund to benefit all victims of rape and other violent crimes. Maybe the victim will donate the excess money that she doesn't need for medical treatments and protection to a charity that does this. I don't expect this, but it would be the correct move IMO. But I still don't necessarily blame her if she keeps the money. It must be an awful feeling to have been violated with a crime like rape and then essentially be raped again by the system in the way it's treated her. Now she finds out that criminal justice is denied to her essentially because Kobe is a rich and famous. That's horrible.

Of course there is the possibility that she's lying and making this all up, but I think that it is incredibly small compared to the possibility that Kobe did indeed rape her.

[Epitome22]

I think Kobe's defense has put forth more than enough reasonable doubt that speaking of him as a criminal off-hand is unjust. I was originally behind this woman, but the newer evidence has led me to seriously doubt or question her believability. The sole remaining factor that kept me on the fence was the fact that she did not opt for civil suit, and instead pressed charges against him. Well it looks like the cash was on her mind.


Free Kobe from this burdensome trial and leave this skank to her own devices. If only there was a way to sue or press charges for false accusal.

[Drbio]

Epitome- calling this woman a skank exposes you as a jackass for the reasons listed above.



To set the civil parameters straight, according to ESPN, the civil suit seeks compensatory damages of no more than $75K and asks for punitive damages related to pain and suffering, public scorn, etc.

[LRB]

Originally posted by: Epitome22
I think Kobe's defense has put forth more than enough reasonable doubt that speaking of him as a criminal off-hand is unjust. I was originally behind this woman, but the newer evidence has led me to seriously doubt or question her believability. The sole remaining factor that kept me on the fence was the fact that she did not opt for civil suit, and instead pressed charges against him. Well it looks like the cash was on her mind.


Free Kobe from this burdensome trial and leave this skank to her own devices. If only there was a way to sue or press charges for false accusal.

Somehow this doesn't surprise me at all Epitome. You seem like the type who would be against rape victims rights. Of course reasonable doubt only means that a jury can't convict, it hardly proves Kobe innocent. Add to the fact that the "leaked" evidence has been in Kobe's favor but the victim, her lawyers, and the prosecution are under gag order to reply to it. So you're just hearing one side.

Now she only goes to civil suit after being severely abused by the court which "accidentally" leaked personal and confidential information to the public on 3 seperate occasions.

Make no mistake, Kobe if he gets off will do so because of his wealth and fame, even if by some chance he's innocent, which he's not. It's possible that he may not have raped the girl, but in no way is Kobe innocent. At the very least he's an adulter.

But even if falsely accused Kobe has the money to take care of and protect himself. His accuser does not. What we will see if this criminal trial goes forth is the accuser and not the accused being put on trial. In fact that is already what's happened. Fortunately for Kobe there are a lot of sexist bigots who always look for any excuse to blame the woman. Thanks Epitome for keeping the dream true to form. [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-disgusted.gif[/img]

[sturm und drang]

Epitome22 wrote:

"I think Kobe's defense has put forth more than enough reasonable doubt"

Well I for one can tell you how just how much weight this carries with me. World, take note! Epitome22 has declared Kobe innocent. It must be so. The kangaroo court has spoken: jury be damned! Epitome has spoken.

This is yet another unfortunate reminder that even the most well-intended rape shield laws don't shield victims from the assinine epithets and slurs hurled by misogynist cretins.

[Epitome22]

Originally posted by: Drbio
Epitome- calling this woman a skank exposes you as a jackass for the reasons listed above.

She is/was a skank whether she was raped or not. In fact the prosecution must be thinking that if she had made even a few conscientious objections to sitting on every penis that was presented to her, their case would have been a whole lot smoother. I feel sorry for REAL rape victims and the effect this trial will have on their future endeavors to bring perpetrators to justice.

[Epitome22]

double post

[mary]

Edit: Forget it, you're not worth it.

[Epitome22]

[quote]
Originally posted by: LRB

Somehow this doesn't surprise me at all Epitome. You seem like the type who would be against rape victims rights.

I find this statement wildly inappropriate. If we are to operate at the level you set the parameter at, then you seem like the type who likes to see rich successful black athletes go to jail for having sex with white women.


[quote]
Originally posted by: LRB

Of course reasonable doubt only means that a jury can't convict, it hardly proves Kobe innocent.

No it doesen't prove Kobe innocent, but as long as reasonable doubt exists, it doesen't "prove" Kobe guilty either.

[quote]
Originally posted by: LRB

Add to the fact that the "leaked" evidence has been in Kobe's favor but the victim, her lawyers, and the prosecution are under gag order to reply to it. So you're just hearing one side.

That's correct. Who knows? maybe the prosecution has "nail in the coffin" esque evidence that is equally unbenificial to Kobe. But the information that has been put forth by the defense seems pretty damning to the girl, and the recent attempts by the prosecution to postpone the trial indefinitely seems like a last ditched attempt to save face.


[quote]
Originally posted by: LRB

Make no mistake, Kobe if he gets off will do so because of his wealth and fame, even if by some chance he's innocent, which he's not. It's possible that he may not have raped the girl, but in no way is Kobe innocent. At the very least he's an adulter.

Very well then, try him for adultury. There's a heck of alot of difference between rape and adultury. There's been alot of heroic and noble men AND women throughout history who were guilty of adultury at some point or another. His "adultury" has no bearing on this matter.



[quote]
Originally posted by: LRB

But even if falsely accused Kobe has the money to take care of and protect himself. His accuser does not.

And he should be thankful he has that money. There is a HUGE stigma attached to even being ACCUSED of a crime like this, even if you are aquitted or the charges are proven false.


[quote]
Originally posted by: LRB

What we will see if this criminal trial goes forth is the accuser and not the accused being put on trial. In fact that is already what's happened. Fortunately for Kobe there are a lot of sexist bigots who always look for any excuse to blame the woman. Thanks Epitome for keeping the dream true to form. [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-disgusted.gif[/img]

And unfortunately for Kobe there's alot of people out there with serious psychological hangups who like to see people go to jail then for no other reason than that they are rich and successful and are adulturers. I don't have your psychological hangups about wealthy and successful people, your crude assimilations of rape and adultury nor hangups about black athletes fornicating with white women. I'm an American and as an American, I abide by a little thing called the "presumption of innocence" something that exists in our country specifically because of the prevalence of false accusations. "The indictment or formal charge against any person is not evidence of guilt. Indeed, the person is presumed by the law to be innocent." I simply grant kobe that courtesy the same as I would to any American citizen.

[Epitome22]

Originally posted by: sturm und drang
Epitome22 wrote:


Well I for one can tell you how just how much weight this carries with me. World, take note! Epitome22 has declared Kobe innocent. It must be so. The kangaroo court has spoken: jury be damned! Epitome has spoken.

I was merely expressing my opinion. Never did I even insinuate that my opinion was substantial, should influence or have any bearing on the actual result of the trial. In fact this is plainly evident, more than enough people in this very forum have already given their verdicts in this case with much less eloquent gusto. I'm merely attacked because I didnt tow a disturbing line in this forum that wishes to convict Kobe for no other reason than he is a rich and successful black athlete who cheated on his wife and is not a fondly thought of Basketball player (in a basketball forum)

Originally posted by: sturm und drang
Epitome22 wrote:

This is yet another unfortunate reminder that even the most well-intended rape shield laws don't shield victims from the assinine epithets and slurs hurled by misogynist cretins.

Their is absolutly no validation to accuse me of being a misogynist for saying "I think Kobe's defense has put forth more than enough reasonable doubt"

If we are going to operate at this level then, This is yet another unfortunate reminder that even the most well intentioned civil rights legislation won't shield innocents from the assinine epithetes and slurs hurled by racists and people with serious class issues.

Note: You seem terribly bitter. Perhaps you should seek therapy to try understand where your puzzling resentment of rich black athletes stems from.

[sturm und drang]

Epitome22 wrote:
"Note: You seem terribly bitter. Perhaps you should seek therapy to try understand where your puzzling resentment of rich black athletes stems from."

Hmmmm. I don't think I need to seek therapy to understand where my resentment of misogynists who slander rape accusers comes from. In fact, from many of the posts in this thread, I'd say I have good company.

This has nothing whatsoever to do with race, though I appreciate your red-herring attempts to make it seem racially-motivated. This has everything in the world to with what this woman has been put through. If you think a woman would voluntarily subject herself to this kind of scrutiny for a couple of bucks, you're sorely misguided.

The fact of the matter is that Kobe will walk free. At worst, he'll have to pay a few bucks to compensate for her lawyer fees. He'll go on playing basketball, making tens of millions of dollars a year. Unscathed.

As for the accuser: her life has been ruined. And she will never, ever get it back.

[Epitome22]

Originally posted by: sturm und drang
Hmmmm. I don't think I need to seek therapy to understand where my resentment of misogynists who slander rape accusers comes from. In fact, from many of the posts in this thread, I'd say I have good company.

There you go with that misogyny again. Tell me, is your repeated referral of me as a "Misogynist" based on my well known and read treatises about the lack of effective women in the work place, or the more productive political processes of yesteryear when women weren't allowed to vote? Or is it based solely on the fact that I dared to question the automated guilt placed by some on the accused? I do not slander rape accusers and if I do it has little to do with the fact that they are accusing someone of rape.

Originally posted by: sturm und drang

This has nothing whatsoever to do with race, though I appreciate your red-herring attempts to make it seem racially-motivated. This has everything in the world to with what this woman has been put through. If you think a woman would voluntarily subject herself to this kind of scrutiny for a couple of bucks, you're sorely misguided.

Oh I see, so we are not determining the verdict of the case based on facts and evidence, we are determining the case based on empathy for the tribulations the woman has been put through, and conjecture and supposition based on whether she would subkect herself to public scrutiny if she wasn't being truthful. That makes me glad that people much more qualified and with a fuller understanding of the law than you (or I for that matter) actually determine these decisions.

Originally posted by: sturm und drang
The fact of the matter is that Kobe will walk free. At worst, he'll have to pay a few bucks to compensate for her lawyer fees. He'll go on playing basketball, making tens of millions of dollars a year. Unscathed.

As for the accuser: her life has been ruined. And she will never, ever get it back.

If the woman really was raped then I feel sorry for her, otherwise, Kobe SHOULD be able to go on and lead a relatively happy life and the woman in question. That's what innocent people are entitled to do.

[sturm und drang]

Misogynist? Hell yeah! When you say stuff like

"if she had made even a few conscientious objections to sitting on every penis that was presented to her.."

about a possible rape victim, I'll label it misogynist. Every day of the week and Sunday. Are women not allowed to have sex? Does the fact that she wasn't a vestal virgin at the time of the incident mean she wasn't raped? Is it even possible to rape a "skank"? You know she was asking for it.

And we all wonder why rape is so criminally under-reported. What a mystery.

[kg_veteran]

There's a good reason for rape shield laws. A woman's sexual history has absolutely no bearing on whether she consented to sex on a PARTICULAR occasion, any more than a poor driver's driving record has bearing on whether they were negligent in a PARTICULAR car accident. It's irrelevant, and the defense wants to introduce that evidence for the sole purpose of smearing the name of the accuser, so that in essence the accuser will be on trial rather than the accused. As S&D pointed out, if they're a skank or a whore, how can they really be raped? Right? I mean, we all know that they want to be bent over a chair and physically injured during intercourse, right?

It's sickening to me to hear such nonsense. It's equally sickening to have to listen to the accusation that people on this board think Kobe's guilty because he's rich and black. Their OPINION couldn't have anything to do with the evidence that we know about, could it? Nah, they just want all rich, black people to go to jail.

Sad.

[LRB]

Posted by Epitome22

I find this statement wildly inappropriate. If we are to operate at the level you set the parameter at, then you seem like the type who likes to see rich successful black athletes go to jail for having sex with white women.

Oh, so I get it now. The girl must be lying because she's poor white trash and Kobe is a successful black athelete. Somehow I new that you'd play the race card in this one. Kobe is black so he must be innocent. You must be about as big a bigot as they come. [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-disgusted.gif[/img]

Very well then, try him for adultury. There's a heck of alot of difference between rape and adultury. There's been alot of heroic and noble men AND women throughout history who were guilty of adultury at some point or another. His "adultury" has no bearing on this matter.

Actually it does have bearing. Just as much if not more than the girl's sexual history. It has bearing on Kobe's character. Certainly he shouldn't go to jail just for commiting adultery. However he placed himself in this position by at the very least commiting adultery. Had he kept his pants on, he would not be in this mess.

And he should be thankful he has that money. There is a HUGE stigma attached to even being ACCUSED of a crime like this, even if you are aquitted or the charges are proven false.

The stigma is nothing compared to that of being a rape victim. This young women's life is totally wrecked. There are few possible things that could be worse than to be raped and then put on trial for having been raped. Nothing Kobe will experience in soley being accused of being a rapist will compare with what this young woman will go through for having the audacity to not lay down and take it like a whore as you obviously feel that she should have.

And unfortunately for Kobe there's alot of people out there with serious psychological hangups who like to see people go to jail then for no other reason than that they are rich and successful and are adulturers. I don't have your psychological hangups about wealthy and successful people, your crude assimilations of rape and adultury nor hangups about black athletes fornicating with white women. I'm an American and as an American, I abide by a little thing called the "presumption of innocence" something that exists in our country specifically because of the prevalence of false accusations. "The indictment or formal charge against any person is not evidence of guilt. Indeed, the person is presumed by the law to be innocent." I simply grant kobe that courtesy the same as I would to any American citizen.

The percentage of those charges which are brought which are false are extremely small compared to legitimate charges. When you consider rape the percentage of women who bring false charges is ridiculously small. And all I've called for is for justice to be done. However when you're rich, you can simply out spend the prosecution to get the verdict you want. Couple that with someone who is famous who manipulates the media to taint the jury pool with half truths. That's exactly what Kobe has done.

Now if you were simply defending Kobe I could respect that. But you have judged this woman guilty and called her the most reprehensible of names. It's yet to be shown if any of the trash Kobe's team has been saying about her is true. She's under a gag order and cannot defend herself in public. However misogynist and bigots like you can't wait to publicly humiliate and trash her reputation. Under our system the person accused of rape is legally presumed innocent until proven guilty. However you seem to believe that the alledged victim of rape is guilty until proven innocent.

[FishForLunch]

Why is she protected while most of you guys on this board are ripping into Kobe none of you know that he raped her. What if Kobe was telling the truth, that he did not rape her, will you guys then call her names then.

[kg_veteran]

Originally posted by: FishForLunch
Why is she protected while most of you guys on this board are ripping into Kobe none of you know that he raped her. What if Kobe was telling the truth, that he did not rape her, will you guys then call her names then.

You're right about one thing. Nobody KNOWS whether Kobe raped her or not. We weren't there. We're all offering our OPINIONS. But I haven't heard anybody saying Kobe must be guilty because he's a rich, black athlete. I've heard people opine that he was guilty because of physical evidence, because of the circumstances, and various other reasons related to evidence that has come forth during the course of this story. That's the difference here. People are saying the accuser is lying, but NOT because of any evidence related to the incident itself; rather, they're looking at smear tactics used by the defense concerning this girl's prior sexual exploits and thinking the worst of her because she had a promiscuous past.

That's what's wrong.