07-05-2012, 02:00 PM
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#1
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Diamond Member
Join Date: Jul 2004
Posts: 6,526
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Would a star free agent ever come here?
Who was the last big name/star free agent to ever play in a city outside of LA, South Florida, New York, Chicago?
Nash...
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07-05-2012, 02:11 PM
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#2
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Member
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 219
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Probably not, unless they are born and grew up here... (SCNR)
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07-05-2012, 02:14 PM
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#3
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Moderator
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Austin, TX
Posts: 17,873
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Quote:
Originally Posted by conjurer
Probably not, unless they are born and grew up here... (SCNR)
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Too soon.
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John Madden on Former NFL Running Back Leroy Hoard: "You want one yard, he'll get you three. You want five yards, he'll get you three."
"Your'e a low-mentality drama gay queen!!" -- She_Growls
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07-05-2012, 02:44 PM
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#4
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Guru
Join Date: May 2002
Posts: 40,410
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It's a tough question. They just don't move that much when,they are good. Most just get resigned or traded. Only recently have you seen the Carmelo game all over. You can trade me but I won't sign there. I would sort of like to see that challenged.
Okay...well trade you to x, they'll have virus rights and you can give up 20mill or so to move, you bad, jump.
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"Yankees fans who say “flags fly forever’’ are right, you never lose that. It reinforces all the good things about being a fan. ... It’s black and white. You (the Mavs) won a title. That’s it and no one can say s--- about it.’’
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07-05-2012, 03:14 PM
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#5
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Platinum Member
Join Date: May 2006
Posts: 2,675
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1st of all the lockout was a waste of time. Nothing has changed (maybe in the future).
And maybe i am wrong but the NBA seemed much more balanced when Dirk entered the league...right now it is predictable as hell. OKC vs. MIA...for the next 5yrs or so. Too many all-NBA guys are on the same team.
Last edited by markus1234; 07-05-2012 at 03:23 PM.
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07-05-2012, 03:16 PM
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#6
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Diamond Member
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: now, here
Posts: 7,720
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History says hell no.
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watch your thoughts, they become your words
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07-05-2012, 03:18 PM
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#7
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Guru
Join Date: May 2001
Location: sport
Posts: 39,434
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Quote:
Originally Posted by markus1234
1st of all the lockout was a waste of time. Nothing has changed (maybe in the future).
And maybe i am wrong but the NBA seemed much more balanced when Dirk entered the league...right now it is predictable as hell. OKC vs. MIA...for the next 5yrs or so.
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Well, the NBA wasn't that far removed from Jordan winning a title whenever he actually decided to play basketball.. So yeah, it was pretty damn balanced shortly before Dirk came in. Then you had some Lakers dominance..Spurs dominance..
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07-05-2012, 03:37 PM
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#8
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Golden Member
Join Date: Dec 2011
Posts: 1,534
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Cuban thinks so. He's even betting another year of dry powder on it.
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07-05-2012, 03:43 PM
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#9
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Golden Member
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 1,230
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the cuban from a few years ago who was wheeling and dealing id say any star would come here. now i dont see it. might as well start rebuilding now. im good with it.
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07-05-2012, 03:44 PM
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#10
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Guru
Join Date: May 2001
Location: sport
Posts: 39,434
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Honestly, I don't think the Mavs are looked at that favorably right now by players around the league because of the way they broke up the championship team... that and it's Dirk, Marion and a bunch of scrubs.
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07-05-2012, 03:53 PM
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#11
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Golden Member
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 1,230
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does anybody else think that cuban might be running a little low on cash?
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07-05-2012, 04:08 PM
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#12
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Member
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Big D
Posts: 556
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Next season is gonna be painful. Real painful.
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A clear night in big D. Thousands of fans ready...anxiously awaiting his arrival.
The signal high in the Dallas sky calls for one person, and one person alone......... #41
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07-05-2012, 06:12 PM
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#13
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Inactive.
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Scottsdale, AZ
Posts: 43,084
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Only way star free agents move is extra money. Teams usually give their guys enough that they can't be topped. Redd was low-balled. Nash was low-balled. There are reports that we offered deron less than max and couldn't compete with my in raises and years anyway.
All things being equal? Perhaps but it's rare. Guys taking less to stay here? Extremely rare? Guys COMING here for less? Unheard of.
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07-05-2012, 06:23 PM
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#14
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Diamond Member
Join Date: Jul 2004
Posts: 6,526
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So then why the hell are we keeping our powder dry for Sammy superstar? The only way we're going to get back to the top is to build it through trades or grow it from a seed.
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Last edited by Windmill360; 07-05-2012 at 06:25 PM.
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07-05-2012, 06:49 PM
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#15
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Member
Join Date: Apr 2007
Posts: 286
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Not even a washed-up superstar would wanna sign here
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07-05-2012, 07:22 PM
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#16
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Diamond Member
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: now, here
Posts: 7,720
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Quote:
Originally Posted by clutch#41
does anybody else think that cuban might be running a little low on cash?
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Makes you wonder how he did with the recession?
Hopefully better than he did with the FB stock.
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watch your thoughts, they become your words
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07-05-2012, 07:33 PM
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#17
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Member
Join Date: Nov 2006
Posts: 171
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No, I don't think we can attract a 'star' just yet, I know the one title puffed up egos for a bit but really we are still a second tier team. We need to treat big FA's as a plan B. we should work on honing on prior patterns of success. Trades and taking chances. Look at Nash and dirk, they weren't anything amazing when we got them but we took a chance on potential. Build on those types of successes.
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07-05-2012, 07:42 PM
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#18
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Golden Member
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 1,349
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Yesterday I was laughed at when I suggested this. Just look through our history, it proves no one wants to either come here, or doesn't think Dirk is good enough to help them win, although Dirk has proven it.
Now that Mark has blown up the team, people want out.
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07-05-2012, 08:01 PM
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#19
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Guru
Join Date: May 2001
Location: sport
Posts: 39,434
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The Mavs haven't really had a combination of being an extremely competitive team and having the cap space available all that often. I don't think there's all that much evidence to go on other than this year.. a year after they had actually decided that tyson chandler wasn't the type of free agent that they'd like to spend money on.
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07-05-2012, 08:05 PM
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#20
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Diamond Member
Join Date: Jul 2004
Posts: 6,526
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Its not that they dont think dirk is any good. I think they admire dirk a lot and respect him. But i thunk Fish also hit on something where he said Dirk is not part of "da Club". Most of these stars grew up knowing eachother playing AAU ball and whatnot. Dirk was in the German army. Dirk doesnt go out and socialize with these guys during the summer, he spends his time in Germany or elsewhere. Outside of basketball Dirk watches Wimbledon. Nothing wrong with any of the above, but its not what attracts athletes from our culture.
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07-05-2012, 08:07 PM
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#21
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Guru
Join Date: May 2001
Location: sport
Posts: 39,434
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I don't really buy into the not in da club thing.
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07-06-2012, 01:24 AM
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#22
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Guru
Join Date: Dec 2002
Posts: 17,057
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What superstar in their right mind would want to come to the current train wreck that is the Dallas Mavs. Especially when they'd have to do so for less money that staying where they are now, or the same money as going to a more competitive team. Dirk is great now, but will soon be declining. Marion is very good, but declining. The rest of the team would be hard pressed to beat some D league rosters. We'll probably be a lottery team or at best a very low seed that will be outed in the 1st round this coming year. And Maverick management has proven to be completely clueless on getting quality players added to the roster since the championship. We have virtually no tradable assests and we draft like crap even if we get a decently high draft pick. In fact we'd probably trade a top 10 pick for 4 forth round picks and a snow cone machine.
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Never argue with an idiot. They will drag you down to their level and beat you with experience.
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07-06-2012, 01:32 AM
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#23
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Diamond Member
Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 8,841
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You have to ask yourself what 1st tier free agent has ever come to the city of Dallas? Do we have to go back as far as Deion?
I love Dallas as a city and i'm sure more people would if they visited him from another city. But it just doesn't compare in regards to NY and LA in regards to entertainment. Its going to have to take a special player to want to play here. Someone like a Kevin Durant who clearly doesn't mind playing in Oklahoma or a Dirk Nowitzki. Not many of those guys out there.
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07-06-2012, 01:34 AM
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#24
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Diamond Member
Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 8,841
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Windmill360
Its not that they dont think dirk is any good. I think they admire dirk a lot and respect him. But i thunk Fish also hit on something where he said Dirk is not part of "da Club". Most of these stars grew up knowing eachother playing AAU ball and whatnot. Dirk was in the German army. Dirk doesnt go out and socialize with these guys during the summer, he spends his time in Germany or elsewhere. Outside of basketball Dirk watches Wimbledon. Nothing wrong with any of the above, but its not what attracts athletes from our culture.
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This a huge underrated part of the "problem". There's a core of guys that like playing with each other there is no one on this roster who is apart of that culture.
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07-06-2012, 03:29 AM
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#25
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Banned
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Italy
Posts: 1,003
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ibivibiv
No, I don't think we can attract a 'star' just yet, I know the one title puffed up egos for a bit but really we are still a second tier team. We need to treat big FA's as a plan B. we should work on honing on prior patterns of success. Trades and taking chances. Look at Nash and dirk, they weren't anything amazing when we got them but we took a chance on potential. Build on those types of successes.
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is that so easy??? no man...that's our big problem.
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07-06-2012, 05:20 AM
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#26
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Member
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: California
Posts: 348
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I don't think its so much the city as its the roster.
The big free agents want to win a championship or make a lot of money. These guys see Dallas and they don't see a championship caliber roster like they do in Miami or LA. They don't see a huge contract like they do in Brookyn.
It's not the city so much as its the $$$ and the roster.
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07-06-2012, 06:54 AM
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#27
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Platinum Member
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Budapest, Hungary
Posts: 2,209
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dtownsfinest
You have to ask yourself what 1st tier free agent has ever come to the city of Dallas? Do we have to go back as far as Deion?
I love Dallas as a city and i'm sure more people would if they visited him from another city. But it just doesn't compare in regards to NY and LA in regards to entertainment. Its going to have to take a special player to want to play here. Someone like a Kevin Durant who clearly doesn't mind playing in Oklahoma or a Dirk Nowitzki. Not many of those guys out there.
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But there will be times when the Los-Angeles and New-York based teams will be set, or even successfull at the moment, and there still will be available top tier talent, that can't go there. You don't necessarily have to chase a top FA all the time obviously, but if you can create cap space, you try it every time. It's not like we're gonna do this every year, this was the first time Cuban tried it in the last 10 years. But you gotta try it, especially when your star player is 34 years old. It's a no brainer, really. Gotta find that next guy, because you won't ever win in this league without him, or maybe once in every 30 years, like the Pistons did, but maybe they are the only team in the history of the NBA who won it without one? They're certainly the only one since the early 80's, so the last 30 years.
Last edited by Budapest Maverick; 07-06-2012 at 06:56 AM.
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07-06-2012, 07:36 AM
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#28
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Member
Join Date: Jun 2002
Posts: 123
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The problem is that you usually need a guy of Dirk's caliber to win a championship.
History says that players of that caliber usually don't move to other teams and if they do so (like Kareem, Shaq, Lebron), they go to the "glamour teams".
For the Mavs, that means they have to draft this type of player or they won't get him. And if they have one, they need to maximize this opportunity, because it might be a long time until they get the next one.
And that's where Cuban's strategy was extremely stupid: you just don't take unnecessary risks which can result in wasting some of the remaining years of Dirk's prime.
When they decided to let Chandler go, I thought that they had some kind of absolute guarantee from Deron that he was going to sign in Dallas no matter what. Turns out they just had a 50% or less chance to get him. And now the rest of Dirks prime is wasted. Great job.
It took the mavs about 20 years to get a first-tier superstar. How long will it take till they luck into the next one?
Last edited by stuportremens; 07-06-2012 at 07:38 AM.
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07-09-2012, 02:57 PM
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#29
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Diamond Member
Join Date: May 2006
Location: DC
Posts: 4,712
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Ugh
Quote:
Bruce Arthur @bruce_arthur
If Dwight Howard goes to Brooklyn, nine of the 12 members of the 2008 Olympic team will play in New York, LA, or Miami.
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Quote:
RT @TyLawson3 Good game between Dallas and Portland. Good thing we didn't end up getting Dallas. Coach Karl lost his mind.
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07-09-2012, 03:02 PM
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#30
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Golden Member
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: norcal
Posts: 1,490
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What this mean is that now, 8 of the 12 members of the 2008 Olympic team play in New York, LA, or Miami? 67% ain't no joke.
I hope you're happy, David Stern.
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Help me, Roddy-wan Beaunobi, you're my only hoop.
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07-09-2012, 03:14 PM
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#31
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Member
Join Date: May 2002
Posts: 288
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I bet those 3 guys named Durant, Westbrook, and Harden are going to be conspiring about how to force their way onto the same team during the whole London Olympics.
I'd also watch to see if they recruit anyone from Spain during the US-Spain game.
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07-09-2012, 03:33 PM
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#32
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Member
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Toronto
Posts: 708
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NBA is just becoming disgusting a league that had so much promise only a few years ago has turned ugly ever since the culmination of the Boston big three. Teams don't rebuild like they used to, instead great players complain once they are drafted and then force their way onto super teams.
Hell, Kevin Love is already starting now with the Wolves. How long before he joins Chicago, LA, New York, or Miami in order to reduce what parity is left in the NBA? This is not a good product folks.
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07-09-2012, 03:34 PM
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#33
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Diamond Member
Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 6,549
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CanadianMavsFan
NBA is just becoming disgusting a league that had so much promise only a few years ago has turned ugly ever since the culmination of the Boston big three. Teams don't rebuild like they used to, instead great players complain once they are drafted and then force their way onto super teams.
Hell, Kevin Love is already starting now with the Wolves. How long before he joins Chicago, LA, New York, or Miami in order to reduce what parity is left in the NBA? This is not a good product folks.
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Love to LA for Gasol will be the next big rumour
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07-09-2012, 03:41 PM
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#34
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Diamond Member
Join Date: May 2006
Location: DC
Posts: 4,712
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mac222b
Love to LA for Gasol will be the next big rumour
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Minnesota screwed itself over by stiffing Love on his contract extension. Won't be surprised at all when he eventually bolts in free agency or attracts Melo style trade drama.
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Quote:
RT @TyLawson3 Good game between Dallas and Portland. Good thing we didn't end up getting Dallas. Coach Karl lost his mind.
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07-09-2012, 03:47 PM
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#35
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Diamond Member
Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 6,549
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nowhereman
Minnesota screwed itself over by stiffing Love on his contract extension. Won't be surprised at all when he eventually bolts in free agency or attracts Melo style trade drama.
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That was one of the strangest decisions, or non-decisions, of recent years.
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07-09-2012, 03:57 PM
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#36
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Guru
Join Date: May 2001
Location: sport
Posts: 39,434
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Shawn Bradley.. anyone? He's still tall. He's not really old yet. I suppose he's probably about a year or so older than Kidd and probably equally as productive at this point.. Anyone?
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07-09-2012, 04:20 PM
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#37
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Moderator
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Austin, TX
Posts: 17,873
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Kevin Love seems like kind of a dillhole. He said today (paraphrasing), "[The Wolves need to put more pieces around me,] I believe in greatness surrounding itself with greatness."
__________________
John Madden on Former NFL Running Back Leroy Hoard: "You want one yard, he'll get you three. You want five yards, he'll get you three."
"Your'e a low-mentality drama gay queen!!" -- She_Growls
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07-09-2012, 04:25 PM
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#38
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Guru
Join Date: May 2002
Posts: 40,410
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Murphy3
Honestly, I don't think the Mavs are looked at that favorably right now by players around the league because of the way they broke up the championship team... that and it's Dirk, Marion and a bunch of scrubs.
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The Mavs are the only "contending" team that is stripping down, everyone else is building up. Unless cubes is right and in 2-3 years those teams are hemorrhaging money, this will be on of the biggest screw-ups in sports history.
__________________
"Yankees fans who say “flags fly forever’’ are right, you never lose that. It reinforces all the good things about being a fan. ... It’s black and white. You (the Mavs) won a title. That’s it and no one can say s--- about it.’’
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07-09-2012, 04:31 PM
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#39
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Guru
Join Date: May 2002
Posts: 40,410
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stuportremens
The problem is that you usually need a guy of Dirk's caliber to win a championship.
History says that players of that caliber usually don't move to other teams and if they do so (like Kareem, Shaq, Lebron), they go to the "glamour teams".
For the Mavs, that means they have to draft this type of player or they won't get him. And if they have one, they need to maximize this opportunity, because it might be a long time until they get the next one.
And that's where Cuban's strategy was extremely stupid: you just don't take unnecessary risks which can result in wasting some of the remaining years of Dirk's prime.
When they decided to let Chandler go, I thought that they had some kind of absolute guarantee from Deron that he was going to sign in Dallas no matter what. Turns out they just had a 50% or less chance to get him. And now the rest of Dirks prime is wasted. Great job.
It took the mavs about 20 years to get a first-tier superstar. How long will it take till they luck into the next one?
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It could be never actually.
__________________
"Yankees fans who say “flags fly forever’’ are right, you never lose that. It reinforces all the good things about being a fan. ... It’s black and white. You (the Mavs) won a title. That’s it and no one can say s--- about it.’’
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07-09-2012, 04:31 PM
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#40
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Moderator
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Austin, TX
Posts: 17,873
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dude1394
this will be on of the biggest screw-ups in sports history.
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Slight overreaction.
__________________
John Madden on Former NFL Running Back Leroy Hoard: "You want one yard, he'll get you three. You want five yards, he'll get you three."
"Your'e a low-mentality drama gay queen!!" -- She_Growls
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