Cowboys offseason Thread

[dirno2000]

It's pretty much assumed that SD is going to franchise him and force a trade...like Buffalo did with Peerless Price.

[kg_veteran]

I just skimmed this thread, so forgive me if this has already been addressed, but...

Dirno, I agree with you that we have a ton of holes, but how can QB not be at or near the top of your list?

[dirno2000]

Because I have no idea how Parcells feels about Henson. Everyone assumes that because Parcells didn't play Henson this season, he isn't in the plans for 2005. I'm holding out hope, but if I'm wrong then QB would be pretty high on the list. There are just too many question marks right now for me to make an assessment of our needs at the position so I just left it off.

I'm just hoping we don't run Vinny out there as a starter again.

[Murphy3]

I look d'line high in the draft..particularly DE. I try and pick up a DT in free agency if possible

One thing that'll affect this will be whether or not the 'boys decide to go with a 3-4. Can you do that with LaRoi Glover?

[kg_veteran]

Because I have no idea how Parcells feels about Henson. Everyone assumes that because Parcells didn't play Henson this season, he isn't in the plans for 2005. I'm holding out hope, but if I'm wrong then QB would be pretty high on the list.

I think you have to assume that Parcells doesn't see Henson as part of the future in Dallas. If he were, he would have run him out there, for at least a game or two.

As for Vinny, if they trot him out there, it will signal that Parcells has officially lost it.

And that Jerry has lost his cajones.

[endtroducing]

I've watched Rogers for four years and he is a supreme athlete. He can be sent on blitzes and hold his own with lineman, he can run a legit 4.3 (I believe he did a year ago), and he shut down every WR he matched up against. He's also great supporting the run...if you can watch any of the film from this season, you'll see that Rogers was dominant in every aspect of his game...guess that's why he won the Thorpe.

He would be a great pick at #20, and one of the biggest steals of the draft...he seems to be undervalued right now. A good WR that is also flying under the radar right now is Fred Gibson from UGA...he should be available at #10 in the second round. also, if Thomas Davis is available in the late first round, he would be a great pickup...very similar to Roy Williams.

[Dooby]

Would you trade both firsts for Matt Leinert? Even though this team has holes all over, I would.

[Murphy3]

Originally posted by: Dooby
Would you trade both firsts for Matt Leinert? Even though this team has holes all over, I would.

I think it'll take more than that to get him from San Fran. You'll have to throw a hell of alot at San Fran to get Leinart. But, I'd probably make that move if it was a possibility.

[Speedy]

Does anyone know if Alex Smith is throwing his name into the draft?

[FilthyFinMavs]

Originally posted by: Dooby
Would you trade both firsts for Matt Leinert? Even though this team has holes all over, I would.

I wouldn't. If the way Bill treated Henson last season is any indicatioin of how he plans on treating all of our young qbs then I don't have any faith in Bill developing a quarterback. I wouldn't even draft a qb in this draft. I'd either go with Henson or sign a free agent qb whose a significant upgrade over what we have now and I hope Bill will do both. Didn't we trade our 3rd rounder for Henson? That would mean we would be using 3 picks on a qb this year if we were to trade two of our first rounders to the 9ers. I don't see why the 9ers wouldn't take both of our picks though. They have even more holes to fill than we do and 2 first rounders is a nice start on fixing those holes.

[dirno2000]

I think you have to assume that Parcells doesn't see Henson as part of the future in Dallas. If he were, he would have run him out there, for at least a game or two.

I'm not ready to assume that yet. Mostly because coming into the season, I didn’t think that we should play Henson under any circumstance. As the season grew progressively worse, I like many Cowboys fans was anxious to see the future. That being said, I think it was best to let Drew sit the whole season. Have rookies played right away and had some success, sure, but like Chutch, this is no average rookie. He's been away from the game for fours years. I suspect that a year watching a seasoned veteran will help him down the line. I agree with Bill when he says you can ruin a guy by throwing him out there too soon and I just refuse to believe that he looked at this kid for a couple of months and concluded, "he'll never play for me". Remember that Pennington sat for a year and a half before seeing the field on a regular basis, and that was after four years at Marshall. I’m just not ready to write of Henson yet.

[dirno2000]

he can run a legit 4.3 (I believe he did a year ago),

If he's a legit 4.3 guy, he probably won't last to 20. Not doubting you, but there’s a reason pro scouts bring their own stopwatches to pro day.

I like Gibson as a big play receiver. A big guy who seems to have untapped potential. He’s either a value pick or a guy that will frustrate you for the next three years. Chraphonso Thorpe is another name to keep an eye on in the 2nd to 3rd round. Big play receiver whose value dropped due to an injury his junior season.

If Davis comes out, he’ll be gone well before the late 1st round…possibly top ten.

[dirno2000]

Originally posted by: Speedy
Does anyone know if Alex Smith is throwing his name into the draft?

yes

[dirno2000]

Here's an interesting scenario. What do you think Flozell Adams could pull in a trade? Maybe he's one of the ones they have been talking about who weren't "playing up to their contract" or something like that. I remember hearing Bill say in a recent press conference that Rogers (or was it Peterman? I always get them confused) is really better on the left side...and that that might impact their future decisions on the OL.

Well if Larry Allen was only going to bring a third, could Flozell bring more than that?

[Speedy]

Originally posted by: dirno2000

yes

Thanks Dirno. Do you know of a good site to see where he is projected to go in the draft?

[Ninkobei]

Originally posted by: XERXES
Kitna might be 32- but he has been a backup for most of his NFL carrer - yet has played extremely effectively as a starter. He has light tread on his tires. He might be 32 - but I'd submit he's 27-28 in NFL years.

Also, before you go proclaiming how great our 2nd round pick might be (and that he might be in the league for 15 years) take a good look at all the success we've had with 2nd round picks. I think I'd rather take a known commodity thank you very much.



Julius Jones. Flozell Adams. LARRY ALLEN, 2nd round 17th PICK!!! Dat Nguyen and Coakley, 3rd round pick. Dallas didn't draft him but he's a good player, Quincy Morgan 2nd round.


Also, Kitna has had success much more recently that Vinnie and I'd rather have him than Kurt Hutchison...I mean Warner. Plus, Brees is a pipe dream.

Any other points I can refute?

I wouldn't call that an actual refute. More of your opinion of the matter, now here is mine. Yes it is true that Kitna had a good year last year. He also had a top notch WR Chad Johnson and Corey Dillion/Rudi Johnson(who had three 150 yard games) to compliment him.

[dirno2000]

Originally posted by: Speedy

Thanks Dirno. Do you know of a good site to see where he is projected to go in the draft?

There are a few VERY preliminary mocks on the net, but I haven't seen any that have him going in the 1st round...a lot can change in four months though.

[Max Power]

Originally posted by: dirno2000
Because I have no idea how Parcells feels about Henson. Everyone assumes that because Parcells didn't play Henson this season, he isn't in the plans for 2005. I'm holding out hope, but if I'm wrong then QB would be pretty high on the list. There are just too many question marks right now for me to make an assessment of our needs at the position so I just left it off.

I'm just hoping we don't run Vinny out there as a starter again.

QB is going to be the #1 priority in the offseason. I read the perfect summation of the Parcells/Henson situation: Big Bill is here to pick apples not plant trees.

Parcells will not develop a QB - we need a veteran.

[dirno2000]

I read the perfect summation of the Parcells/Henson situation: Big Bill is here to pick apples not plant trees.

If that's truly the case, why is he being so conservative with Jerry's money? He could have went on a spending spree this past summer and saddled the club with a group of high priced veterans that we would be paying after he's long gone. For example, he could have traded away our #2 pick for 30 year old Corey Dillon. He could have overpaid Troy Vincent or Bobby Taylor for a quick fix at corner. That theory just doesn't hold true if you look at positions other than quarterback.

[Just211]

IMO this draft changes if Bill switches to 3-4. Then I could see them drafting LB D.Johnson at 11, CB M.Jackson or Rogers at 20, and DE Tuck in the 2nd(or another LB). Tuck could be converted to a 3-4 OLB, and they'd have to sign a bigger DT to play nose, and move Glover to DE. And if Hunter is healthy I could see him at FS, and move Roy up to SS. I know switching to 3-4 seems hard to do, but except for Dat(and Coakley{whose probably gone}), all the other pieces could fit. And it'll be very interesting to see if BIll does it.

Only thing is it wouldnt leave much room to improve the Offense, so who knows. Either way I think Bill is through piecing this team together, and is ready to do it his way, no exceptions.

[Max Power]

We will overspend. Probably not this offseason but the next one. Parcells is just waiting until he thinks he is only a couple of players short of winning it all.

I think Parcells just got cute last year and thought the Boys were better than they were. I'm betting that he thought the team would move into the lower elite level of clubs this season and then make the final push THIS offseason. Unfortunately the Boys played poorly and wasted a year.

[dirno2000]

We will overspend. Probably not this offseason but the next one. Parcells is just waiting until he thinks he is only a couple of players short of winning it all.

That's when we should spend money. By that time Parcells will have had four drafts and hopefully built a solid foundation.

I'm just saying that he could have saved himself a lot of headaches by signing high priced vets at key positions last summer and instead he chose to gamble on his young guys...came back to bite him in the ass, but it wasn't the move of a coach who only wanted to pick apples.

[dirno2000]

***Breaking News***

John Jacques is reporting that Larry Lacewell has been removed as director of scouting. Long overdue of you look at his draft record and it probably would have happened a while ago if he wasn't such a close friend of Jerry's.

[chumdawg]

Originally posted by: kg_veteran

I think you have to assume that Parcells doesn't see Henson as part of the future in Dallas. If he were, he would have run him out there, for at least a game or two.

As for Vinny, if they trot him out there, it will signal that Parcells has officially lost it.

And that Jerry has lost his cajones.

KG, I see this completely the other way. If he *does* think Henson is the future, he'd be more apt to protect him this year. Bill just flat doesn't like throwing young QB's out there if he doesn't have to. Witness how long he let Phil Simms ride the pine and learn.

From there it follows that if Henson is indeed the basket they are putting their eggs in for the future, a veteran stopgap would be necessary, perhaps even to start the season next year. So if Bill trots Vinny out there, things may actually be going according to the grand plan.

[dirno2000]

IRVING - The Cowboys have compiled a list of players they plan to send to NFL Europe. And while the names are familiar, quarterbacks Drew Henson and Tony Romo are not among them.

According to a source, the Cowboys plan to send defensive tackle Willie Blade, linebacker Marq Cerqua, linebacker Kevin DeRonde, safety Woodrow Dantzler and running back Keylon Kincaide to NFL Europe.

Blade and Cerqua are former Cowboys who signed one-year deals with the team Friday. Dantzler, another former Cowboy, is expected to sign Monday.

DeRonde and Kincaide are already under contract.

The deadline for allocating players to NFL Europe is Jan. 29. DeRonde is the only player who has been submitted.

Cowboys coach Bill Parcells talked during the 2004 season about sending Henson or Romo or both to NFL Europe to gain experience. Henson returned to football last season after playing baseball for three years in the New York Yankees organization. He played in two games. Romo has not seen any action since making the Cowboys team as a rookie free agent in 2003.

The Cowboys have expressed interest in bringing back 2004 starting quarterback Vinny Testaverde. There is a question of whether he would come back as a starter or a backup. Parcells has said it's possible either Henson or Romo could be the starter in 2005.

Staying in Dallas will allow the backup quarterbacks to spend more time with quarterbacks coach Sean Payton and offensive coordinator Maurice Carthon. It also allows the pair to work with the backs and receivers during the off-season program and in minicamps.

Blade, a third-round pick of the Cowboys in 2001, returns for a third time. He started 14 games for the Cowboys in 2003 before getting in Parcells' doghouse for poor work habits. He was released before training camp last season and played in five games for Jacksonville last season before being released.

Cerqua finished the 2001 season with the Cowboys after being released by Tampa Bay. He played briefly with Chicago in 2002 and spent the 2003 season on Indianapolis' practice squad. Cerqua was out of football last season.

Dantzler was cut by the Cowboys before the 2003 season, a move Parcells later said he regretted. The Cowboys have been trying to re-sign Dantzler since. Dantzler spent 2003 with Atlanta but was injured for much of 2004.

[sike]

I still think Woody Dantzler has game....I hope he proves it in Europe and comes back to a nice career in the NFL.

[dirno2000]

Notice that Willie Blade is back in the fold too....proof that athletic fat guys are like left handed pitchers and big centers...there's always somebody willing to take a chance on them.

[Jamisonite]

Its doesnt hurt us any to send Blade over to Europe and see if he can really play. Better for us to take another chance on him than for someone else to do it and him suceed

[capitalcity]

Originally posted by: dirno2000
Notice that Willie Blade is back in the fold too....proof that athletic fat guys are like left handed pitchers and big centers...there's always somebody willing to take a chance on them.

Or - proof that Parcells is a pompous ass whose 'my way or the highway' attitude cost us a proven run stopper this past season.

[FilthyFinMavs]

^^^^Yea I was just about to say that Blade was solid when he was here but as usual if you don't play by Parcells rules then your out the door.

[dirno2000]

Originally posted by: capitalcity

Or - proof that Parcells is a pompous ass whose 'my way or the highway' attitude cost us a proven run stopper this past season.

Blade has been cut by five teams now...Dallas twice (once under Campo), Houston, NY and Jacksonville. Obviously he has some committment issues and Parcells isn't the only coach who realized it and got fed up with him..

[dirno2000]

From Dan Pompie's Inside Dish

-----------------------------------------

Talk about the Cowboys wanting to change to a 3-4 defense is more than speculation.

There isn't enough talent on Dallas' defensive line to support a 4-3, and the easy solution is to run a scheme that requires fewer linemen. Some believe DT La'Roi Glover wouldn't fit in a 3-4, but Cowboys coach Bill Parcells, who has a long history with the 3-4, envisions the 285-pound pass-rushing specialist as a nose tackle — believe it or not. The plan to change defenses is contingent upon the Cowboys securing a pass-rushing outside linebacker, possibly a free agent but more likely a 2005 draft pick. The Cowboys already have one possible pass-rushing outside linebacker in Kalen Thornton, an undrafted rookie last season who is better suited to a 3-4.

[Jamisonite]

I think glover would be better suited as the other end opposite ellis

[Dooby]

Glover's too small for a noseguard and too slow to be a DE. Glover has said he has never, ever played nosetackle dating back to his pop warner days. The 3-4 conversation terrify me. If you recall, Jerry said similar stupid things some years ago. I think it was the Chan years. What Jerry meant is that he was too dumb to find a way to get a second defensive tackle.

[FilthyFinMavs]

I agree Jamisonite. I think the only possible solution for Glover to succeed in the 3-4 is to switch him to DE. Problem is i'm not how he's going to react to that because like Dooby said he's not fast enough to be a DE.

[capitalcity]

It seems La'roi doesn't fit into the traditional 3-4 position of nosetackle, and it's also assumed that he's not fast enough to play DE. But I think Glover can make the switch work, in either position, so long as he's willing to accept the challenge. He's a professional, and an All-Pro, so he probably realizes the defense needs to be retooled.

When you watch today's NFL defenses, especially the well well coached units; Pittsburgh, Philly, New England, etc., you watch as blitzing LB's, moving DL's, and shifting DB's all rush around in coordinated pre-snap movements. All this movement detracts from the traditional positional assignments (read: Zone Blitz). If you get a group to buy into the system it can work like a machine - balancing out the physical limitations of the players involved.

I believe in Zimmer's ability to outscheme most other offensive coordinators. But we still need the personel (read: Derrick Johnson).

DJ will be a top tier pass rusher within the next 2-3 seasons - I pray it happens in Dallas. He is a hybrid, and although he'll be listed as a LB he could spend most of his time crowding the line of scrimmage. Should this be the case - when Glover lines up at "DE" he'd still be fighting through a Guard & Tackle doubleteam. Now how is that any different from now?

Our DB's are young and vulnerable - any front "4" pass rush will immediately take some pressure of them. More importantly this will allow Roy Williams to crowd the box and fly to the football - i.e. play to his strengths. A shift to the 3-4 could help the cornerbacks immensely - yet the secondary remains a question mark with a hole at safety.

3-4 or 4-3?
Regardless, the defense needs to be addressed with BOTH first rounders. Once we know who will be suiting up the decision will be clear.

[Jamisonite]

Dooby you are incorrect. Look at the succesful 3-4 defenses in the league and look at their ends. Pitsburgs ends have never gotten more than 5 sacks a game. Your job in the 3-4 is not to get to the quarterback but to stop the run. Glover would be a good fit in 3-4

[chumdawg]

Mickey says Mo Carthon is heading to Cleveland to be the offensive coordinator. Wonder who replaces him here.

[dirno2000]

They'll probably just give Payton the title and hire a new RB coach.

[Dooby]

Originally posted by: Jamisonite
Dooby you are incorrect. Look at the succesful 3-4 defenses in the league and look at their ends. Pitsburgs ends have never gotten more than 5 sacks a game. Your job in the 3-4 is not to get to the quarterback but to stop the run. Glover would be a good fit in 3-4

I am incorrect? What an odd thing to say. I said that Glover was too small to play nose tackle. Officially, Glover is listed at 282 lbs. The best nose tackles in the game are Keith Traylor (Pats), Kelly Gregg (Ravens) and Casey Hampton (steelers). They weigh 340, 310 and 325 respectively. Seth Payne (Texans) weighs 315; Grady Jackson (Packers ) weighs 340. Hmmmm, he gives up 30 lbs to most nose tackes in the league. I would say that makes him small.

So you know, I actually did the work for you. So you know there are a couple of nose tackles weighing less than 300 lbs, but none are opening day starters. A couple got starts due to injury.

So I guess you are saying want him to be an end opposite Ellis? Eeeeeee. It is harder to be an end in a 3-4 than in a 4-3. You still have to be fast even if you are just trying to cover the run because you have to plug up both sides of the tackle.