Has the Vince Young era begun? - Dallas-Mavs.com Forums

dirno2000 · 10-04-2003, 06:06 PM

Gutty performancy by the freshman QB. Mack Brown still doesn't trust him to throw the ball over the middle, but when he's in the game the offense moves. I'm waiting to see how that ankle feels in the morning, but if he can go against OU, it looks like he may be the starter.

ames7 · 10-04-2003, 06:11 PM

He kind of looked like he was limping a little toward the end. Hope he's good. Good for him, that was a nice showing.

Murphy3 · 10-04-2003, 06:28 PM

well, mock has done nothing to lose the job, that's for sure.
young looked good today because he was mostly called on to run. but, he had a couple of nice throws.

we'll see. if the o'line looks like crap like they did today, young would be the better choice. but if not, i'd continue to start mock and bring in young from time to time as a change of pace

u2sarajevo · 10-04-2003, 06:44 PM

Vince Young has won my support. That was a gutsy performance. I feel confident in saying that if Mock had played the entire game, we probably would have lost.

Roberson... man that guy is quite an athlete. Did you see that run for a TD? Awesome....

dirno2000 · 10-04-2003, 06:54 PM

No he hasn't. He hasn't thrown an interception all year, but if the offensive line can't pass block, he's going to struggle.

I wish they would have let Young throw the ball more against Tulane and Rice. I has a gun, but he needs experience reading college defenses.

steponhens · 10-04-2003, 07:37 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by: Murphy3
well, mock has done nothing to lose the job, that's for sure.

How about not moving the ball at all today. The only time he got any pass yards was on an underthrown ball and the defender fell down. He constantly had balls batted down at the line and was late when he had open recievers. Granted, the o-line was awfull, but he can't get away. Vince Young can. While Mock may not have lost the job, Young definately won it.

steponhens · 10-04-2003, 09:07 PM

Also, I would like to give credit to Mack Brown. This was the first time I have ever seen him in the face of an official, not shutting down the offense, and making gutsy moves. I never thought I'd see the day he kept Young in, kept trying to throw the ball in the second half, and go for a fourth down conversion when a field goal will tie it up, ala Houston. I think Texas will come out and finally beat OU because the coach at least showed me flashes of guts this week.

Murphy3 · 10-05-2003, 12:21 AM

stephones, mock will struggle if the horns don't block at all...obviously, the more mobile QB will have more of a chance.

but, it is just one game. mock has been VERY solid. He's among the top rated QB's in all of college football...yet remember, he's just starting his college career as a starter.

if the line plays decent ball, mock will be a very good QB. perhaps young will as well

but, i'd rather have Mock with time throwing to this set of receivers if he gets time. I'd much rather having mock throwing to the receivers at this point.

Chicago JK · 10-05-2003, 12:27 AM

Hopefully UT will handle this quarterback situation better then they handled Simms/Applewhite.

Young is definately the future and may be the present, but I hope Mack doesn't put Young out there if he isn't quite ready. OU's Defense is awesome and even a great qb could struggle.

With that being said the limited time I seen Young play, he is an amazing prospect. He has a rocket for an arm, but I want to see more of his touch on shorter throws.

Fah Q · 10-05-2003, 12:59 AM

if the line plays decent ball, mock will be a very good QB. perhaps young will as well

Do you think the O-line will hold up against OU? I don't.

I say next week UT should let it all hang out, if they start Young what do they have to lose?
The season, thats what they lose.

But that being said, I want they best athletes on the field next week playing OU

I want V Young and S Young out there as much as possible. I want them to show a little bit of the option (it has worked for many teams in the past) , I want them to be conservative and run the ball down OU throats.

If the Longhorns don't win next week they wont get BCS bid, but if they do they are almost assured of one considering if you can beat OU you can beat anyone.

QCarFan · 10-05-2003, 11:42 AM

There's no doubt who the better QB is, and that guy is definitely V. Young. Mock should be on the sidelines holding a clipboard wearing a ballcap like Chad Hutchinson at all times, except when someone needs a towel or water.

steponhens · 10-05-2003, 01:19 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by: Murphy3
but, it is just one game. mock has been VERY solid. He's among the top rated QB's in all of college football...yet remember, he's just starting his college career as a starter.

Yeah, it's only one game, but I thought Mock played decent against Arkansas. He has played good against terrible teams. Remember, he struggled against NMS. Rice, Tulane, and NMS don't exactly scream defense at you. K-State and OU do. If Mock did nothing to K-State what can you expect from him to an even better D.

Also, Young should start this week bc OU has really struggled recently with running QB's(Brad Smith, Reggie McNeal). If Mack wants to avoid another Simms-Appelwhite controversy put in Young. Appelwhite accomplished stuff before Simms played. Mock has done absolutely nothing. Put in the future.

QCarFan · 10-05-2003, 02:26 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by: steponhens

Quote:

Originally posted by: Murphy3
but, it is just one game. mock has been VERY solid. He's among the top rated QB's in all of college football...yet remember, he's just starting his college career as a starter.

Yeah, it's only one game, but I thought Mock played decent against Arkansas. He has played good against terrible teams. Remember, he struggled against NMS. Rice, Tulane, and NMS don't exactly scream defense at you. K-State and OU do. If Mock did nothing to K-State what can you expect from him to an even better D.

Also, Young should start this week bc OU has really struggled recently with running QB's(Brad Smith, Reggie McNeal). If Mack wants to avoid another Simms-Appelwhite controversy put in Young. Appelwhite accomplished stuff before Simms played. Mock has done absolutely nothing. Put in the future.

i agree with everything there, good post

dirno2000 · 10-05-2003, 03:22 PM

Vince Young is the future, no doubt. I don't have a problem with them starting him, if you let him run the complete pro style offense. If he's going to run the option and QB draws on 1st and 2nd down, that's negating the strength of our team, the receiver core.

When you start Mock, the defense has to prepare to stop Roy, BJ, and Sloan. If you start Young and give the Defense a week to prepare for a running QB, it could be a different story.

grbh · 10-06-2003, 09:45 AM

Other than the line issue another reason to play Young this season is because the Horns are not that good. I think Mock probably gives the Horns a better chance to win this year. Unfortunatly I think they are going to lose at least 3 games this season.

Might as well groom Young for next season.

dirno2000 · 10-06-2003, 09:47 AM

They have one loss. You may be right, but do you want to tell Roy Williams that we're going to mail in the rest of the year.

Murphy3 · 10-06-2003, 10:03 AM

sometimes certain types of players match up better with certain defenses. the texas line blocked no one all day..so, it made sense to use young. however, Mock has had a very successful season.

now, is young the future? quite possibly. is mock destined to be a backup for the remainder of this year and next? quite possibly. however, it might be just a bit early to hand over the reigns to young completely. I think young should get significant PT vs the sooners.

yes, young did the horns to 10 points..and mock led the team to 7.

i would hardly say that last weeks performance alone is enough to warrant benching mock.

if young tears up oklahoma while in the game..then maybe it's time to consider young as the permanent starter and heir to the throne. but dear God, get a little perspective from time to time

dirno2000 · 10-06-2003, 10:17 AM

Quote:

To hear Longhorn fans talk about him, he could be the first quarterback in history to throw a deep ball, sprint downfield and catch it himself.

Ivan Maisel

Murphy3 · 10-06-2003, 10:17 AM

young is a VERY young player.
use patience and caution.

i believe that he will be unlike anything that UT has ever seen at their QB position. allow mock to start against OU and see how things go..use young according to your normal QB rotation. if young's having much more success, then ride him a bit more.

but be patient. don't throw him to the wolves just yet. allow him to have the safety net of being the backup QB for now. let things progress as they are currently. if young outright wins the QB job in the next two weeks, that is wonderful. but don't rush it with these two kids. there's no reason to do so.

u2sarajevo · 10-06-2003, 10:19 AM

....and also, to the point that the grbh made that we are not that good. What do you base that assumption off of? We beat K-State, the 14th ranked team in the nation. If you are not a good team you don't win games like that.

I guess you are saying that because we lost to Arkansas, who is currently the 8th best team in the nation.

Were we over-rated at the beginning of the season? Yes. Are we a bad team? HELL NO.

As to the quarterback issue, I think this year warrants game situation decision. Certainly moreso than the Applewhite/Simms controversy of a couple of years ago. My Longhorn heart grew big for Young this weekend, that performance was very gritty. I thought for sure his ankle was broke, did you see that play? That was ugly. And then he came back in and led us to victory.....

But Mock has shown that he has something to bring to the table also. I am excited that we have the ability to throw in two effective QB's. The real question is can both of them share the limelight? If not, it may force us to make a decision between the two. And for that, I will trust Brown to make the right decision.

dirno2000 · 10-06-2003, 10:20 AM

I couldn't agree more. Don't allow OU to game plan for only Vince Young. KSU gave up 28 points to Cal. He's never seen anything like that OU defense.

Murphy3 · 10-06-2003, 10:49 AM

sure, of course you might be forced to make a decision. but don't make it this week. leave mock as the starter and bring young off of the bench. it's an amazing contrast. both players can be incredibly effective.

let things develop as they currently are. these guys are close friends and the horns could end up with 2 quarterbacks that are very, very effective.

but let things progress.

like i've told many people in the past, i believe young will be the next closest thing to what mike vick did a few years back in college football. Young looks like he's running at a different speed than everyone else. he's extremely fluid with a plus arm.

but let things progress like they currently are. make OU prepare for two QB's

dallas_esq · 10-06-2003, 01:32 PM

Young is the QB, he has a chance to become a legend like Applewhite did. Basically, a Texas QB has one job, beat OU. That's why a certain Simms boy is forever unwelcome in Austin.

dirno2000 · 10-06-2003, 01:37 PM

Good move. Keep them guessing.

[/quote]Brown: Both Mock, Young will play against Oklahoma
Coach won't name a starter and won't talk about it for the rest of the week

AMERICAN-STATESMAN STAFF

Monday, October 6, 2003

Texas Coach Mack Brown on Monday refused to name a starting quarterback for Saturday's game against Oklahoma, saying that both Chance Mock and Vince Young would play.

Brown said he would not say anything more about Saturday's starter this week.

"As long as the two of them are getting along, then you can play two," Brown said. "Those guys are handling it well."[/quote]

Murphy3 · 10-06-2003, 01:41 PM

Quote:

Young is the QB, he has a chance to become a legend like Applewhite did. Basically, a Texas QB has one job, beat OU.

umm... no. The Texas faithful wouldn't be happy if they went 10-2 but beat OU. They expect a national championship. Nothing less will be acceptable for Mack Brown. Now, no, i'm not necessarily talking about this year..but they expect one soon..very soon.

grbh · 10-06-2003, 01:45 PM

Let me explain, and I miight be wrong only time will tell. And let me clarify something first. By not that good, I mean in comparison with the teams of the last two years. I don't think the will be in the top 10 at the end of the season.

I think the goal for UT every year is a national championship. IMO opinion that isn't happening this year.

The O-line and D line are weak this year.

I believe Texas will lose to OU. i hope I am wrong, but I doubt it.

I also think Texas will lose to 1 of the following:
Nebraska (Home)
Texas A & m (Road Game)
OK State. (Road Game)

That is 3 losses with a bowl game to play.

So my contention is play the guy who most think is the future of the program. More time now will make him a better QB next year.

I am not trying to knock Mock, but I see him as more of a caretaker than playmaker.

In addition after watching tape of the K State game I feel pretty confident OU is going to throw the kitchen sink at Mock almost every play. If that is going to happen I think Young is going to be the better choice this weekend.

grbh · 10-06-2003, 01:47 PM

Plus the schedule is more favorable for the Horns next year.

No Nebraska, no K state.

steponhens · 10-06-2003, 05:26 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by: Murphy3
like i've told many people in the past, i believe young will be the next closest thing to what mike vick did a few years back in college football. Young looks like he's running at a different speed than everyone else. he's extremely fluid with a plus arm.

If you remember correctly, Mike Vick brought VT to the title game as a redshirt freshman, exactly what V Young is right now. Young may have only led Texas to 10 points, but his first drive would have been a td if the coaches let him throw at least once on the drive. Another drive was clearly going to be a td, but Benson fumbled inside the 20. The team moved much better with V Young in the game. It opened many holes for Benson. I don't know for sure, but the only times the Texas running backs got anything going at all was when Young was in. I don't disagree with not anouncing a starter untill the weekend, but VY should definately get the most pt.

Murphy3 · 10-06-2003, 05:49 PM

i'm saying be patient with young..allow things to progress like they currently are.

i'm not saying that he CAN'T be the starting QB by the end of the season.

Mock has done just about everything to keep the job..so make OU and the next few teams prepare for two drastically different qb's. allow young to find his way like he currently is.

but one pretty good game versus a good team isn't enough to throw young into the lineup as a full time starter over mock..especially when this weeks game is against OU.

I fully expect young to have a better game than mock...but, it's in UT's best interest to start mock and force OU to plan for both.

dallas_esq · 10-06-2003, 07:35 PM

You are right Murph, nothing less than a National Championship will satisfy. But if you can't do that, you need to win two games, OU and A&M.

Murphy3 · 10-07-2003, 07:29 AM

yes, i know i'm right

dirno2000 · 01-05-2006, 02:29 AM

I think Vince is gone but what an era it was...you can't overstate what he did for the program.

Drbio · 01-05-2006, 09:04 AM

Honestly...I think he plays in Austin again next season.

grbh · 01-05-2006, 11:42 AM

I hope your right doc, but I just can't see it happening. His stock couldn't be higher right now. I know I know you could say the same thing about Leinert last year, but I see him as an exception.

Drbio · 01-05-2006, 11:59 AM

As a Baylor fan, I hope I am wrong.

I've just heard too much about him staying to believe he wants out. I really think he felt slighted by the Heisman snub and wants to prove he is the best. I think he stays and goes for the Heisman.

Five-ofan · 01-05-2006, 12:45 PM

If he steps on a cfb field next year he wins the heisman because the dumbasses didnt give it to him this year. I think he is gone though. We all know im a huge UT fan but he isnt gonna top that game last night. Greatest individual performance in a game of this magnitude ever. I would love to see him back but I doubt he is. He left no doubt as to who the best player on the field and in cfb this year was though. If he is gone vince, good luck and from all of longhorn nation (I am transferring there) we love you and wish you the best.

BTW on the bush/vince debate thing. Bush is a poor mans Barry sanders or gale sayers. There is honestly no one to compare vince to. I dont want to overreact because even though im a huge UT fan its dangerous to rate players on one game (see vick vs Fla state in 2000) but I really dont see how you pass on him if you are a gm. Too much talent. He will be GREAT qb at the next level.

DubOverdose · 01-05-2006, 01:20 PM

Could you imagine Vince going to the Texans? Eventhough they don't need a QB, he'd be a huge fan favorite and pull so much support for the Texans.

Drbio · 01-05-2006, 01:40 PM

I think he should stay. He is an amazing athlete and I am sure a lot of you are about to get pissed, but I doubt seriously he will be a good quarterback in the NFL. First of all, he will be drafted by a crappy team with no offensive line in all likelihood. If he gets to play he will be running for his life. I just see him as a Danny Wuerffel type story. Great college quarterback, poor NFL quarterback.

The Heisman is his to lose.

Five-ofan · 01-05-2006, 01:43 PM

His downside is mike vick. I mean he is a better runner and he is already a better passer so at worst he is vick if he doesnt get hurt. I think vick sucks so that isnt saying alot but he will start in the nfl for a long time whether he goes pro this year or next. I think hes gone though.

Five-ofan · 01-05-2006, 01:54 PM

BTW, funny coincidence of the bcs system is that with all the pac 10/big 10 history, the greatest rose bowl player ever is from the big 12. Just an interesting sidenote.