Chandler for PJ Brown and JR Smith almost done? - Dallas-Mavs.com Forums

MavsFanFinley · 07-03-2006, 11:55 PM

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=2508889

NBA front-office sources told ESPN.com on Monday night that the Bulls were close to shipping Tyson Chandler to the Hornets for P.J. Brown and J.R. Smith.

fluid.forty.one · 07-03-2006, 11:55 PM

Ben Wallace makes a lot more sense now. I'm now officially scared of the bulls.

nashtymavsfan13 · 07-04-2006, 01:08 AM

The Bulls are going to be a great team next year. As fluid forty one said, getting Ben does make a lot more sense now.

rakesh.s · 07-04-2006, 01:13 AM

Good trade for the bulls. Chandler is basically a fragile Dampier. PJ Brown is a tough guy and JR Smith is a write-off. He isn't going to play much with all the depth the Bulls have on the perimeter.

If the bulls are going to make a run, it'll have to be next year, or the year after, because all those young guys' rookie contracts are up and there's no way they're going to sign ALL of them.

HexNBA · 07-05-2006, 04:31 PM

Pretty much a done deal now according to ESPN . John Paxson for executive of the year?

MavsFanFinley · 07-05-2006, 04:34 PM

The Bulls didn't want JR Smith so I wonder who they get for him.

nah-vit-ski · 07-05-2006, 05:04 PM

Marc stien reports that Chi and NO/Okc now have a verbal agreement to send Chandler to NO for P.J. Brown and guard J.R. Smith.

Five-ofan · 07-05-2006, 06:08 PM

Well this makes the ben wallace move make more sense but i much prefer chandler to pj brown.

nashtymavsfan13 · 07-05-2006, 06:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nah-vit-ski

Marc stien reports that Chi and NO/Okc now have a verbal agreement to send Chandler to NO for P.J. Brown and guard J.R. Smith.

This makes the Ben Wallace signing look that much better.

Dtownsfinest · 07-06-2006, 04:53 PM

Great deal for the Bulls. For the Hornets i'm not sure. Chandler may flourish. Both teams ended up pretty good. Bulls and Hornets are both having great offseasons.

Five-ofan · 07-06-2006, 04:53 PM

IMO the hornets are the most improved team of the offseason so far.

Tokey41 · 07-07-2006, 01:17 AM

I would have rather signed Wallace than Peja... Chicago is easily the most improved team, good for them though getting rid of Chandler for a veteran big man and a young talented trading piece (or maybe they'll trade someone else...) they have youth, depth, and options. I envy them.

fluid.forty.one · 07-07-2006, 01:35 AM

I'm not so sure the hornets are going to be that good next year. Chandler is really overrated, and so is peja (in my humble opinion). I guess we'll see next year though.

Chicago is the most improved team this offseason either way.

nashtymavsfan13 · 07-07-2006, 02:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fluid.forty.one

I'm not so sure the hornets are going to be that good next year. Chandler is really overrated, and so is peja (in my humble opinion). I guess we'll see next year though.

Chicago is the most improved team this offseason either way.

The Hornets will be pretty good next year, I'd say a borderline not making the playoffs team. I agree with you that Chandler is overrated, but I don't think Peja is that overrated. Don't get me wrong, the Hornets over paid him, and yes he doesn't do much at all apart from being a good shooter, but I would say he's one of the top ten, maybe even five shooters in the league.

nashtymavsfan13 · 07-07-2006, 02:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Five-ofan

IMO the hornets are the most improved team of the offseason so far.

I would still have to go with the Bulls. They get what they needed badly, a defensive presence at the 5 in Ben, then trade an unneeded, overrated Chandler for a solid PF and JR Smith, who I think has very good potential. They are going to be very good next year.

Five-ofan · 07-07-2006, 01:42 PM

Anyone want to do an avatar bet or anything on the hornets vs the bulls who is the better team next year? I bet the hornets are within 5 wins of the bulls if not better than the bulls(the 5 wins has to do with the conference) Anyone?

nashtymavsfan13 · 07-07-2006, 01:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Five-ofan

Anyone want to do an avatar bet or anything on the hornets vs the bulls who is the better team next year? I bet the hornets are within 5 wins of the bulls if not better than the bulls(the 5 wins has to do with the conference) Anyone?

What do you mean by an avatar bet?

Nash13 · 07-07-2006, 01:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Five-ofan

Anyone want to do an avatar bet or anything on the hornets vs the bulls who is the better team next year? I bet the hornets are within 5 wins of the bulls if not better than the bulls(the 5 wins has to do with the conference) Anyone?

I too think the Hornets are going to be better. They got Peja and BJAX for nothing and they got Chandler for a player they didn't want and a player that didn't want to be there. They just need to sign a few FAs for the frontcourt, and they'll be straight.

Five-ofan · 07-07-2006, 02:06 PM

It just means if im right i get to pick an avatar for you and if you are right you get to pick an avatar for me.

fluid.forty.one · 07-07-2006, 02:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nashtymavsfan13

The Hornets will be pretty good next year, I'd say a borderline not making the playoffs team.

Isn't that where they were last year?

nashtymavsfan13 · 07-07-2006, 02:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fluid.forty.one

Isn't that where they were last year?

They were for awhile, but then they fell pretty hard the second half of the year.

nashtymavsfan13 · 07-07-2006, 02:25 PM

These are the teams that are definetly going to make the playoffs next year:

Mavs, Spurs, Suns, Clippers

Contending for a playoff spot will be:

Kings, Rockets, Grizzlies, Lakers, Hornets, Jazz, Nuggets

It's going to be very tough for the Hornets to make it, and if they do they'll be 8th seed.

Dtownsfinest · 07-07-2006, 02:27 PM

The reason I think the Hornets will have a good year is not necessarily because of their free agent acquistions though they will help. I'm basing this on Chris Paul. That guy may already be a top 5 point guard in this league. If not, he's 6 or 7. He'll be even better this year.

fluid.forty.one · 07-07-2006, 02:30 PM

Ok so hornets go from almost making the playoffs, to almost making the playoffs.

Chicago goes from 7 seed to (ESPN prediction, take it for what it's worth) 2nd seed possibly next year, behind the heat (which for the record I think both of those predctions are off.. either chicago will click and be 1, or fall behind the heat and pistons... heat wont be first either way)

Still you have to say Chicago is the most improved team so far.

Five-ofan · 07-07-2006, 03:04 PM

I agree that chris paul is a top 5 pg(he is 3rd imo if you dont count AI as a point) I also love peja and Tyson chandler. The upgrade from wallace to chandler is nowhere near what some of you think it is. Yes it is an upgrade but its not a big one. I think ty thomas will be terrible and despite the fact that we are on a mavs board and thus a group of people who for whatever reason have dreamed of scenarios for pj brown for years, he is just a guy. Smith does have talent but i dont see how he plays there. is he gonna take kirks minutes? Gordons? Dengs? Nocionis? thomas's(they have to give him some minutes)? They have too many guys for him to get signifigant pt. Overall i think you have a team that was already a top 3 defensive team in the league that was bad offensively to being a team that is probably top 2 in the league defensively and bad offensively in a league that favors offense. I dont see that being that huge of an upgrade.

The hornets on the other hand added imo the best pure shooter in the nba to go along with a great point and a solid player in david west that they already had. Then they traded a guy with talent who was in their doghouse(sound like anyone we know?) and a decent pf who is retiring after this year for a very good athletic defensive big man. Im not sure they will make the playoffs because the west is SO stacked but they will win 44 games or so next year. Imo the west playoffs go like this
1.Dal/Sa
2.Phoenix/clips(i think this is almost as much of a tossup as dallas/sa depending on the moves they make)
3.Denver(god that division is bad, i dont like this team but i cant pick anyone else either)
4.Dal/SA
5. Houston(assuming they are healthy they scare me more than anyone but SA)
6. Clips/phoenix
7.Lakers/grizz/hornets/kings/Utah
8.Lakers grizz/hornets/kings/Utah

So they are in a five way battle for 2 spots. Can they get there? Maybe im not sure but im quite certain they would be a top 4 seed if they were in the east.

Tokey41 · 07-07-2006, 11:29 PM

I really would take that bet Five, Hornets arent going to win anything next year, they improved but are still in the toughest division (true enough the Bulls are in the second toughest though). And head to head when they play? I'd take the Bulls 8 out of 10 times.

Im not saying the Hornets arent improved because thats just ridiculous... Peja is a terrific shooter and Chandler isint that bad a pick up for that team, not to mention their really good draft picks. But Wallace in my opinion is an excellent upgrade, sure they were both defensive big men but Wallace just seem like he plays with more heart. Thomas will be like Chandler at least, at best he will be much much more. He has potential, and with Wallace on his team he could learn a lot, and PJ and JR? Forget about it... for Chandler thats a steal for them, especially when the Thomas draft is taken into consideration.

Bulls will make the playoffs with a way better record than the Hornets, because like you said... the West is stacked and the Hornets although improved just arent improved enough. 1-8 In the west: DAL, PHX, DEN, SA, SAC, LAC, HOU, UTA
1-8 In the east: MIA, CLE, NJ, DET, CHI, ORL, MIL, (this one may be wishful thinking) but TOR

Edit: and for those who think I forgot about Indiana... I didnt, thats just a question mark like the Raps to me right now, best of luck to Quis though.

nashtymavsfan13 · 07-07-2006, 11:34 PM

I'd have to agree with Tokey, Bulls > Hornets

Five-ofan · 07-07-2006, 11:41 PM

So you will take the bet that the hornets arent within 5 wins? Or are you wanting to do it straight up? As for thomas vs chandler, chandler is 5 inches taller and every bit as athletic at least. Not that it is necesarrily that useful but if everyone in the nba jumped and touched as high a point as they can im pretty sure that chandler would touch the highest point.(lebron and smith are the only people i think might beat him) that isnt that important as thomas flat out wont get pt if this team is trying to be good.

So then it becomes Chandler vs ben. Chandler is as good a rebounder(if not better) and almost as good a shot blocker. Pj brown is just a guy. I think the bulls underachieved a little especially early in the season so i think they have a slight built in improvement while the hornets overachieved early so they have a slight built in downgrade but peja is better than wallace as well as being a better fit and chandler is better than pj as well as again being a better fit. You would take chicago in a matchup 8 of 10 times?
Paul- Kirk Paul is better though i love kirk
BG-Mason BG is better despite being possibly the most overrated player in bball
Peja- nocioni/deng Peja is better than either
West-brown West is SIGNIFIGANTLY better
Chandler-Wallace Wallace is slightly better but its not like he is gonna score either so i dont think there is any effective difference against each other.

If you are agreeing to the 5 win differential than we have a bet. If the hornets are within 5 wins of the bulls, i get to pick your avatar and vice versa.

Tokey41 · 07-08-2006, 05:04 PM

Deal. Chandler is athletic but to say hes overall better than Wallace? Wallace is a guy that proved in Detroit at his age he can still play significant minutes and make a defensive impact all by himself. I dont usually like to use stats but it proves the point judging by last year...

Ben 7.3 points (at 51%), 11.3 reb, 1.78 steals, 1.9 assists and 2.21 blocks are a major defensive improvement (and almost everywhere else) in contrast to... 35 min in contrast to Chandler 5.3 points (at 56%), 9 rebounds, 1 assist, 1/2 a steal, and 1.32 blocks... 27 min. Wallace had some good numbers on a good team, now we will see what he can do when he is the unanimous all star on a new team.

We need to see Thomas in the NBA before we can assume anything but based on his college career he does play with a lot of passion and energy. Chandler just seemed to lack effort at times and he was banished to the bench often. Maybe a new team will give him some new life as well. That said there are three reasons why I think the Bulls are going to be better: depth, youth, and conference. Bulls are ready to contend in the east and the west is simply too stacked for NOK. As for PJ, he may be a vet but his 7.3 boards a game and good defense is something that will help any team, adding JR Smith is just more young depth.

You comparison of the teams is in a broad sense almost like comparing Phoenix to Dallas, sure PHX has the better starting five but Dallas beats them out with their deep bench. The Hornets got some good draft picks but they wont be huge factors next year imo, they are not deep at all.

Five-ofan · 07-10-2006, 08:00 AM

True the bulls are deeper. That goes without saying. I know per minute stats can be misleading but per minute chandler grabs more boards(generally your rebounds per minute are how you measure a rebounder) and blocks almost as many shots. Is he better than wallace? No. Is he darn close to being as good? yes. As for all by himself, you might want to note that they have the best defensive 4(sheed) and the best defensive starting 1(billups). Prince is also right there among the best defensive 3s. He doesnt do anything by himself. My point simply was, the bulls were already great defensively. Its not like they are gonna go from being the raptors to the spurs defensively. They are going from the bulls to well the bulls. The problem with all their depth is that they only have 2 players who can play both offense and defense(Kirk and Nocioni) One who can play just offense(Gordon). That aint gonna get it done. As for JR smith, i ask again how exactly does he get on the court??? Hes not taking gordons minutes. Hes not taking Hinrich's minutes. Hes not taking Nocioni's minutes. That is about 100 of the 150 possible minutes at the 1-2-3 spots.(No smith cant play the 1 but the points can both play the 2 so i thought i would include them). That leaves them 50 minutes to play between Deng(whom they love), Ty thomas(who they have to play or he becomes darko) and Smith. I dont see how he gets more than 10 minutes a game. Welcome to the life of marquis daniels mr smith.