Buck Showalter fired - Dallas-Mavs.com Forums

richard_ · 10-04-2006, 09:16 AM

just heard it on the ticket, sorry no link

hello world series next year

edit: http://www.dfw.com/mld/dfw/15676647.htm, http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=2612495

mary · 10-04-2006, 09:22 AM

wahoo!

Flacolaco · 10-04-2006, 09:24 AM

Needed to be done.

Players need to have someone they can trust and respect.

Here you go Buck....adios mo fo

jthig32 · 10-04-2006, 09:25 AM

Great news for Ranger fans.

Don't expect some big name, established manager to replace him either. I would bet a lot of money that it's someone young, someone that will be a first time manager, and probably someone from within the organization.

Only thing that sucks is I'll have to turn off Norm, because I won't be able to handle his show today.

Drbio · 10-04-2006, 09:40 AM

sweeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeet!!!!!!

Five-ofan · 10-04-2006, 09:48 AM

its about _____ time(darn promise not to curse) so whos ready to buy some world series tickets for next year?

ames7 · 10-04-2006, 09:59 AM

I gotta say, I'm slightly surprised Hicks finally did it, but then again, I'm kinda not. Just b/c Hicks gave into media pressure "firing" Hart too. But really, all I feel is a sense of relief. There's hope again.

capitalcity · 10-04-2006, 10:02 AM

Daniels and Hicks pretty'd up a pig, and now they're wondering why they couldn't win a beauty contest.

I'd love to pile on, but what exactly was buck supposed to do with that pitching staff?

jthig32 · 10-04-2006, 10:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by capitalcity

Daniels and Hicks pretty'd up a pig, and now they're wondering why they couldn't win a beauty contest.

I'd love to pile on, but what exactly was buck supposed to do with that pitching staff?

Well, first of all, the pitching wasn't just terrible this year. Much better than last year, certainly.

Second, this wasn't only about on the field performance.

capitalcity · 10-04-2006, 10:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jthig32

Well, first of all, the pitching wasn't just terrible this year. Much better than last year, certainly.

So how many games does "better than terrible" win you? 85? 90?

Quote:

Second, this wasn't only about on the field performance.

I tuned out around April 20th... when did he lose the clubhouse? After the Angels scuffle?

Just211 · 10-04-2006, 10:18 AM

good, i think this means Hicks is putting his faith in Daniels, now hopefully Daniels will continue to focus on pitching

jthig32 · 10-04-2006, 10:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by capitalcity

So how many games does "better than terrible" win you? 85? 90?

I tuned out around April 20th... when did he lose the clubhouse? After the Angels scuffle?

Their starting pitching was good enough that their record should have been better this year. The Rangers should have competed for the division after the trade for Carlos Lee.

I'm not sure that he lost the entire clubhouse. But he lost a couple really important players, and, perhaps most importantly, it was going to be impossible for the Metroplex to get excited about the Rangers as long as Buck was still the manager. He was simply not a likeable person.

sike · 10-04-2006, 10:28 AM

Don Tockamatsu(sp) or something like that is Norm's "strong rumor"

uhhhhh who?

sike · 10-04-2006, 10:28 AM

I like the move simply for the reason that it seemed that his players were not hot for him.

jthig32 · 10-04-2006, 10:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sike

Don Tockamatsu(sp) or something like that is Norm's "strong rumor"

uhhhhh who?

He was the bench coach last year.

The players supposedly love him. He was the guy that stepped in while Buck was suspended this year.

sike · 10-04-2006, 10:35 AM

Thanks Thiggy....you can be my bench coach anytime..., but I have to warn you...I run a tight ship!

have the Rangers expressed anything more than mouth service in Resigning C. Lee?

jthig32 · 10-04-2006, 10:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sike

have the Rangers expressed anything more than mouth service in Resigning C. Lee?

No, and I hope they don't. He's not worth what he's asking for, and he seems unwilling to play DH.

I want no part of Lee.

sike · 10-04-2006, 10:45 AM

I hate you now.

I don't know why...but I like that big slug. (Lee)

Five-ofan · 10-04-2006, 10:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jthig32

Their starting pitching was good enough that their record should have been better this year. The Rangers should have competed for the division after the trade for Carlos Lee.

I'm not sure that he lost the entire clubhouse. But he lost a couple really important players, and, perhaps most importantly, it was going to be impossible for the Metroplex to get excited about the Rangers as long as Buck was still the manager. He was simply not a likeable person.

he lost mike young which is a pretty darn difficult thing to do. He should have been gone last year.

sike · 10-04-2006, 10:52 AM

so what do you more faithful fans of the Rangers think of Nelson Cruz's potential?

Five-ofan · 10-04-2006, 10:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sike

so what do you more faithful fans of the Rangers think of Nelson Cruz's potential?

I like him alot. Best oufield prospect weve had in a while. I actually would have been ok with him straight up for mench now that ive seen him. He is a solid outfielder with good speed and a good arm and a TON of raw power. Im a bit worried he could turn into willy mo pena though in that he swings and misses ALOT.

sike · 10-04-2006, 11:05 AM

thanks 5-0

LonestarROB · 10-04-2006, 12:04 PM

WOOOHOOO!!!

Male30Dan · 10-04-2006, 02:16 PM

Well that just makes my Wednesday... OH HAPPY DAY!

nikeball · 10-04-2006, 06:00 PM

Don Wakamatsu, the bench coach, is the front runner for the position as of now....all of the Rangers' "stars" love him...blaylock, teixiera, young...

i wouldve liked to see the payroll raised before letting Buck go. We dont know what he couldve done with a better team.

Five-ofan · 10-04-2006, 06:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nikeball

Don Wakamatsu, the bench coach, is the front runner for the position as of now....all of the Rangers' "stars" love him...blaylock, teixiera, young...

i wouldve liked to see the payroll raised before letting Buck go. We dont know what he couldve done with a better team.

how much more do you want him to have? Young, tex, Lee, GMJ, derosa, and laird is about as much position player talent as you are gonna have. Not to mention kinser and blalock. he also had a very good closer(aki) and solid enough starting pitching. The rangers dont really have a low payroll. they dont have a high one either but its not like they are the marlins.

Drbio · 10-04-2006, 11:22 PM

The Rangers payroll is approximately 10 million less than the average payroll of the remaining teams in baseball and that is if you throw out the Yankees.

There is room to improve the pitching staff.

Five-ofan · 10-04-2006, 11:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Drbio

The Rangers payroll is approximately 10 million less than the average payroll of the remaining teams in baseball and that is if you throw out the Yankees.

There is room to improve the pitching staff.

most definitely but its not like the rangers were the marlins either.

Male30Dan · 10-05-2006, 07:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Five-ofan

most definitely but its not like the rangers were the marlins either.

...Who almost had a better record!

Drbio · 10-05-2006, 08:35 AM

In this market the Rangers payroll should never dip below 80 million.

Flacolaco · 10-05-2006, 08:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Drbio

In this market the Rangers payroll should never dip below 80 million.

Nope sorry doc...according to Hicks we're all supposed to want to drive all the way to Arlington to watch baseball without the team spending some real money and giving us the motivation to do so.

Five-ofan · 10-05-2006, 08:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Drbio

In this market the Rangers payroll should never dip below 80 million.

In a vacuum i think thats about what the payroll should be BUT i dont think they should just go spend money just to spend money. Who would you have paid last year? We paid millwood. I agree with hicks that the payroll should be player specific.

Edit- Dont give me the bs about if he spent money people would go. Hes been down that road, and people just didnt come out, payroll follows revenue not the other way around.

Drbio · 10-05-2006, 01:29 PM

It's ok if you want to disagree but this market supports that kind of annual payroll. To ask who we could have had this past season is short sighted because payroll doesn't necessarily remain constant year to year (although I suppose there were a few last offseason I would have gone after). Make a run at some damn pitchers. Overpay if needed. You get a pitching staff here worth anything and fans will put butts in seats.

Five-ofan · 10-05-2006, 01:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Drbio

It's ok if you want to disagree but this market supports that kind of annual payroll. To ask who we could have had this past season is short sighted because payroll doesn't necessarily remain constant year to year (although I suppose there were a few last offseason I would have gone after). Make a run at some damn pitchers. Overpay if needed. You get a pitching staff here worth anything and fans will put butts in seats.

I disagree, hes had an 85-100 million dollar payroll before and no one came. Im sorry but no one worthwhile was on the market last year. Also, the rangers have what the 15th or so highest payroll in the mlb? Considering bigger markets with two teams thats about where they should be.

Drbio · 10-05-2006, 04:47 PM

It is convenient not to note that the reason he had that payroll was because of the ARod stupidity. He has never balanced his payroll to the market and I think he will now. The Rangers payroll should be around 80-85 mil for this market and I am fairly certain that pitching will be the priority this year.

Five-ofan · 10-05-2006, 06:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Drbio

It is convenient not to note that the reason he had that payroll was because of the ARod stupidity. He has never balanced his payroll to the market and I think he will now. The Rangers payroll should be around 80-85 mil for this market and I am fairly certain that pitching will be the priority this year.

who do you want him to sign this year? barry effing zito is probably the best pitcher on the market(im not sure who else is out there besides him and Schmit) Neither one of those is remotely worth ace money and they will both get it. Considering the track record of Oaklands big 3 once they left oakland and the fact that JS is an old nl pitcher, i wouldnt come close to paying them ace money.

jthig32 · 10-05-2006, 06:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Five-ofan

who do you want him to sign this year? barry effing zito is probably the best pitcher on the market(im not sure who else is out there besides him and Schmit) Neither one of those is remotely worth ace money and they will both get it. Considering the track record of Oaklands big 3 once they left oakland and the fact that JS is an old nl pitcher, i wouldnt come close to paying them ace money.

Barry Zito is about the closest thing to an ace you'll find on the open market in a long, long time. I'd pay him whatever he wanted to come pitch at our park, where he's had a lot of success, btw.

It probably won't happen, but it'd be a great thing if it did.

In fact, I'd LOVE to know why you don't consider Zito Ace materical. The dude has a 3.55 career ERA. And don't try to use that Oakland park as a crutch, either. This year he's 10-3 with a 2.97 ERA away from home, and for his career he has practically identical records for home and away, and a better ERA away.

Hudson and Mulder both had fairly significant road/home splits that made them a bit risky. Zito does not.

I'd give Barry Zito whatever the hell he wanted.

nikeball · 10-05-2006, 06:47 PM

barry zito dated alyssa milano. give him whatever he wants. he is already the man.

:-D

Drbio · 10-05-2006, 07:59 PM

Zito not an ace? That basically invalidates all but 1 or 2 pitchers in the league. That's crazy talk.

Five-ofan · 10-05-2006, 08:04 PM

zito was the worst of the oakland big 3. The other 2 havent been very good elsewhere and that is in the nl. I know that zito has good home road splits but i just dont trust him. I dont trust anyone who has one above average pitch and is gonna want a minimum of 15 million a year.