Rodrigue Beaubois development thread

[mavs777]

Originally Posted by OSUmavsfan

Sample size could also be a problem with those numbers. This year he's only taken 7 shots from 10-15 feet and 13 shots from 3-9 feet. On the distances with larger sample sizes, he's closer to where he should be, although he should probably avoid the long 2.

Low 30% from a guard i would guess is below average, 3-9 feet is mostly floaters anyways, i just used the data out there.

[OSUmavsfan]

Originally Posted by mavs777

Low 30% from a guard i would guess is below average, 3-9 feet is mostly floaters anyways, i just used the data out there.

Well my point was just that those percentages could still be fluctuating a lot. Today, after factoring in the Spurs game, he's shooting 42.9% from 3-9 feet, 22.2% from 10-15 feet, and 38% from 16-23%. His attempts are probably still too low to draw a lot of conclusions, but watching him play these last three games I would imagine all of his percentages would trend upwards over the season.

[j0Shi]

http://www.mavsmoneyball.com/2012/1/...rigue-beaubois

At least his fastbreak defense is partially captured by the numbers. The Mavs give up 122.55 Points per 100 Fastbreak Possessions. With Roddy this value decreases to 105.81. Also Roddy is no longer eating up possessions like crazy but embracing the point-guard role. In his two consecutive starts at the point, the team posted a high in overall Assist-Rate and AST/TOV-ratio when Roddy was on the floor.

He leads the team in PER among all regular rotation players and posts the best WS48/WP48 numbers among all guards on the team. He closed the gap between Kidd and him in Assists per 100 Possessions and actually leads the guard position in fewest Turnovers per 100 Possessions.

[twistaeffect2004]

Boy, has he come back down to earth or what these past couple of days? He deserves the demotion he's gotten with Kidd out.

He has lost all confidence in his shot.

[dude1394]

Originally Posted by twistaeffect2004

Boy, has he come back down to earth or what these past couple of days? He deserves the demotion he's gotten with Kidd out.

He has lost all confidence in his shot.

I just cannot get a handle on roddy. It's obviously between his ears, but man he plays like a wuss. He's going to play himself right to Europe.

[dalger]

There's no doubt that Roddy has the talent to be a decent NBA player. It's just that he doesn't seem to have the mental fortitude to play his game consistently. Jet could go 0-10 in the first three quarters and still deliver big time in the final minutes of a game since he's just confident in his abilities. In comparison, Roddy's confidence appears to be fragile, and it's not even a high-pressure situation at the moment.

[tsar]

Originally Posted by dalger

There's no doubt that Roddy has the talent to be a decent NBA player. It's just that he doesn't seem to have the mental fortitude to play his game consistently. Jet could go 0-10 in the first three quarters and still deliver big time in the final minutes of a game since he's just confident in his abilities. In comparison, Roddy's confidence appears to be fragile, and it's not even a high-pressure situation at the moment.

Yeah. I'm a big Roddy supporter because you can tell he has the abilities and tools because he's obviously shown us something to get excited about. Then all of the sudden it seems like he forgets how to play or maybe I should say seems scared to play - if he doesn't fix the mental fortitude aspect of his game then he'll never become the player we think he can be. That's his next big hurdle, over coming inconsistency, playing with confidence, and over coming bad stretches but still playing your own game (like Dirk, Jet). We'll see if the kid can do it.

[LSMF]

Originally Posted by dalger

There's no doubt that Roddy has the talent to be a decent NBA player. It's just that he doesn't seem to have the mental fortitude to play his game consistently. Jet could go 0-10 in the first three quarters and still deliver big time in the final minutes of a game since he's just confident in his abilities. In comparison, Roddy's confidence appears to be fragile, and it's not even a high-pressure situation at the moment.

This is exactly why I've been disappointed in the kid lately. It seems like anything/everything can make him lose his confidence, and once that happens we get performances like his last 3 games. The one thing we all loved about him in his rookie year was he was always just playing damn hard. Even though he made a lot of mistakes back then, we knew if Rick gave him playing time he would go all out. Now, he dribbles the ball around with no apparent purpose. Can't make basic plays, takes dumb shots, can't make a shot, and isn't aggressive. I don't know what to make of this kid anymore, he better snap out of it soon.

[mavsfan1000]

You gotta let him play through it. Maybe not pile on too many minutes but you just can't bench him because he is in a slump. I think fatigue got to him as seems to not know how to pace himself. He plays every game like it's the finals. Gotta be exhausting to always play like that. Maybe give him a couple games off to work on his game but assure him he will be playing again soon.

[b_o_r]

Consistent jumper = aggressive Roddy.

Many offensive minded players shutdown when they can't hit a shot. He played so effortlessly his rookie season because he had a consistent jump shot which he had worked on all summer long. He hasn't worked on that shot since the early summer of 2010. Unfortunately for Roddy, he doesn't realize he is an above average defender at his position when he gives effort, nor is shabby in the rebounding department either.

Personally, I saw hope in his stint as a PG the last 8 games. I didn't think he could even play the position after his 2 game showing late last year. He has progressed a lot further than I expected with 2 straight off season's wiped out because injuries.

On a sidenote
I wonder how farther along his progression would be if he were on a team where young players were actually embraced. One thing I liked about Caron Butler was that he worked with Roddy after practice (in Dojo's case the off season) on his own time. Caron would post Roddy up to work on his own lost post game and to toughen Roddy up in his rookie year. Roddy til this day can hold his own when he gets back down by a bigger a player. Little exercises like this one go a long way in the development of a player.

[nowhereman]

Is the kid shut down for a while? Anyone got a scoop on the DNPs?

[jthig32]

Rotation is full, simple as that.

[mavsfan1000]

Terry is playing too many minutes though. Carlisle could easily give those extra minutes to Roddy.

[nowhereman]

RE the rotation being full - That's kinda what I was thinking too. Can't see the Mavs moving any of the guys in front of him, so barring injury, anyone have any guesses as to whether we'll see him getting important minutes the rest of the season?

[b_o_r]

Originally Posted by nowhereman

RE the rotation being full - That's kinda what I was thinking too. Can't see the Mavs moving any of the guys in front of him, so barring injury, anyone have any guesses as to whether we'll see him getting important minutes the rest of the season?

Hopefully he gets traded soon. Saw some of that Denver/Indiana game and got to see Corey Brewer in action. He looked so much better because of the fast paced offense.

[jthig32]

I'm sure he'll continue to get minutes in some of the "easier" games. Before guys starting going down with injuries Rick seemed to have established two different rotations, one for the more high profile match ups and ones against teams that you would expect to handle a little easier.

[j0Shi]

Roddy will get minutes against easier opposition. That said, I highly anticipate the Clippers matchup, because they own the sort of backcourt that has eaten the Jasons alive so far this season and where Terry/Roddy and West/Kidd looked like two choices you want to role with the entire game outside crunch time.

[JeffViggiano]

Originally Posted by jthig32

Rotation is full, simple as that.

this

[mavsfan1000]

Originally Posted by jthig32

Rotation is full, simple as that.

Rotation is full for Wright as well but he keeps getting minutes. I just don't think Carlisle and Beaubois get along. But before we trade him, I say we give him minutes to prove how valuable he can be. Obviously, he will continue to get better after his injury as he is still young. The fact that he could arguably be Dallas's best point guard shows how much he has improved this year.

[Underdog]

Originally Posted by mavsfan1000

Rotation is full for Wright as well but he keeps getting minutes. I just don't think Carlisle and Beaubois get along. But before we trade him, I say we give him minutes to prove how valuable he can be. Obviously, he will continue to get better after his injury as he is still young. The fact that he could arguably be Dallas's best point guard shows how much he has improved this year.

Kinda hard to imagine that such a petty, childish, simple-minded coach could lead a team to an NBA Championship.

You're just making shit up to support your fantasy that Carlisle has it out for Roddy...

[b_o_r]

Originally Posted by jthig32

I'm sure he'll continue to get minutes in some of the "easier" games. Before guys starting going down with injuries Rick seemed to have established two different rotations, one for the more high profile match ups and ones against teams that you would expect to handle a little easier.

Originally Posted by nowhereman

RE the rotation being full - That's kinda what I was thinking too. Can't see the Mavs moving any of the guys in front of him, so barring injury, anyone have any guesses as to whether we'll see him getting important minutes the rest of the season?

Originally Posted by j0Shi

Roddy will get minutes against easier opposition. That said, I highly anticipate the Clippers matchup, because they own the sort of backcourt that has eaten the Jasons alive so far this season and where Terry/Roddy and West/Kidd looked like two choices you want to role with the entire game outside crunch time.

Debunked. He had no playing time against the Wolves who employ a small 3 guard lineup and he didn't get off the bench even in garbage time.

Roddy has simply gone back to his "break glass in case of injury or blowout" role he had in his rookie year. Except for 20 minutes, he has been used mainly this year as PG and with him being 3rd on depth chart (4th on the SG) it makes no sense to have him here. He is not going to get better through "practicing hard" because the Mavs won't be practicing with games scheduled every other day now til the end of April.

He is not going to get better on the bench. Either ask him to go to the D league where he can practice and play or just trade him for a 2nd rounder and cap space.

[mavsfan1000]

Originally Posted by Underdog

Kinda hard to imagine that such a petty, childish, simple-minded coach could lead a team to an NBA Championship.

You're just making shit up to support your fantasy that Carlisle has it out for Roddy...

You obviously have it out for me. It is proven by your attacks at me through reputation status. I used to have a credible status until you did something. I respect everyone elses opinion on here except yours.

[Underdog]

Originally Posted by mavsfan1000

You obviously have it out for me. It is proven by your attacks at me through reputation status. I used to have a credible status until you did something. I respect everyone elses opinion on here except yours.

Boo-f*cking-hoo? You spout patently false bullsh!t about the Mavs more consistently than Roddy can run an offense. Your rep is about where it should be, seeing as how you're ALWAYS gloom-and-doom, even fresh off this franchise's one and only Championship run (which you doubted EVERY step of the way). You treat this forum as if it's simply a place to bitch and moan about things that you can't even slightly comprehend, so you'll get no sympathy from me, Chicken Little.

But go ahead and keep making sh!t up about Carlisle conspiring to ruin Roddy's career out of some unbridled hate for young players, as if Roddy's lack of consistency has absolutely nothing to do with anything - I'm sure your rep will climb steadily...

[dude1394]

Originally Posted by mavsfan1000

Rotation is full for Wright as well but he keeps getting minutes. I just don't think Carlisle and Beaubois get along. But before we trade him, I say we give him minutes to prove how valuable he can be. Obviously, he will continue to get better after his injury as he is still young. The fact that he could arguably be Dallas's best point guard shows how much he has improved this year.

Wow..best point guard my ass. He may be fourth behind dojo as a point. He's certainly behind jkiddo, delonte and jet. And I don't consider jet much of a point.

[jthig32]

Originally Posted by b_o_r

Debunked. He had no playing time against the Wolves who employ a small 3 guard lineup and he didn't get off the bench even in garbage time.

Did you even watch the Minn game? That was clearly a game the Mavs had circled. They'd lost to them twice and they treated it like a very, very important game.

Roddy has simply gone back to his "break glass in case of injury or blowout" role he had in his rookie year. Except for 20 minutes, he has been used mainly this year as PG and with him being 3rd on depth chart (4th on the SG) it makes no sense to have him here. He is not going to get better through "practicing hard" because the Mavs won't be practicing with games scheduled every other day now til the end of April.

He is not going to get better on the bench. Either ask him to go to the D league where he can practice and play or just trade him for a 2nd rounder and cap space.

Roddy's not going to get any better in the D League. He will get the chance to get better this season as he gets minutes during easier games, blowout, and filling in for injuries (all of which has already happened).

The Mavs can trade him for cap space any time they want to. There's absolutely no reason for them to do it before they need to.

Based on some of your recent comments I get the impression that you're more interested in Roddy getting better than the Mavs winning.

[j0Shi]

Originally Posted by dude1394

Wow..best point guard my ass. He may be fourth behind dojo as a point. He's certainly behind jkiddo, delonte and jet. And I don't consider jet much of a point.

Terry owns a position-worst 1.27 AST/TOV-ratio at the point this season. Delonte is at 5.00, but only assists on a position-worst 35.71% of the Mavs FGs.

Based on Delonte's assists-rate (and the one of the whole team when he's out there) I recently elected him to play the shooting guard in my lineups whenever Terry, Roddy or Kidd are out there. Had him playing point with Terry and Roddy before that, makes no sense any longer based on the numbers.

So it's Kidd and then it's wide open with Delonte at #4 on my PG depth chart.

[DevinHarriswillstart]

The only thing I take issue with is that fact that Roddy's last game played was a pretty good one. If he had gone 0-7 and sucked, then I could see being out of the rotation. Seems at least a little odd to just not play him at all.

But winning is winning. I really don't care who plays as long as the Mavs get on a roll.

[jthig32]

Originally Posted by j0Shi

Terry owns a position-worst 1.27 AST/TOV-ratio at the point this season. Delonte is at 5.00, but only assists on a position-worst 35.71% of the Mavs FGs.

Based on Delonte's assists-rate (and the one of the whole team when he's out there) I recently elected him to play the shooting guard in my lineups whenever Terry, Roddy or Kidd are out there. Had him playing point with Terry and Roddy before that, makes no sense any longer based on the numbers.

So it's Kidd and then it's wide open with Delonte at #4 on my PG depth chart.

That's a pretty narrow view of what makes a good PG. I'm not giving Roddy minutes ahead of Delonte at any position if my goal is to win the game in front of me.

[jthig32]

Originally Posted by DevinHarriswillstart

The only thing I take issue with is that fact that Roddy's last game played was a pretty good one. If he had gone 0-7 and sucked, then I could see being out of the rotation. Seems at least a little odd to just not play him at all.

But winning is winning. I really don't care who plays as long as the Mavs get on a roll.

It's not like Roddy got benched due to poor play. Kidd came back.

[Budapest Maverick]

Didn't he play around 10 minutes even when everybody was healthy at the start of the season?

[Budapest Maverick]

Originally Posted by b_o_r

He is not going to get better on the bench. Either ask him to go to the D league where he can practice and play or just trade him for a 2nd rounder and cap space.

You mean a low lottery pick. It was reported that teams offered the Mavs lottery picks for him, again, before this season. No way you give him up for a second rounder, especially knowing he will still be on his rookie contract next season, and maybe the only player we can keep besides Dirk and Kidd (vet min), if we struck gold in free agency.

[j0Shi]

Originally Posted by jthig32

That's a pretty narrow view of what makes a good PG. I'm not giving Roddy minutes ahead of Delonte at any position if my goal is to win the game in front of me.

I'm talking positional assignments here and for a point guard the assist-categories are the ones you choose for that. That doesn't mean I would play Roddy over West as a backup point by any means, only that, for statistical purposes, Delonte plays the SG spot unless he's paired up with Vince.

That only says Roddy plays more like a point when out there compared to West and Terry.

In terms of winning: The team produces the most WS/48 and combined PER when West plays the point, followed by Roddy (who leads Pythagorean Wins at PG), Kidd and Terry is last.

Take it for what you want, at least that's more reliable than the quantification "best point guard my ass."

[mavsfan1000]

Please ban underdog. He is abusing the reputation system beyond belief.

[jthig32]

Originally Posted by Budapest Maverick

Didn't he play around 10 minutes even when everybody was healthy at the start of the season?

Not in the "important" games.

[b_o_r]

Originally Posted by jthig32

Roddy's not going to get any better in the D League. He will get the chance to get better this season as he gets minutes during easier games, blowout, and filling in for injuries (all of which has already happened).

The Mavs can trade him for cap space any time they want to. There's absolutely no reason for them to do it before they need to.

Based on some of your recent comments I get the impression that you're more interested in Roddy getting better than the Mavs winning.

1. Nothing is easy for the Mavs because they tend f-up the end of the 2nd and 3rd qtrs no matter if Kidd is playing or not. The next favorable matchup for the Mavs doesn't come until Feb 28th, so that is 20 days before meaningful playing time?
2. Players develop in blowouts where everyone chucks up shots and don't play defense?
3. No one knows when an injury is going to occur. In the meanwhile, Roddy can be practicing and playing under Del Harris/David Wesley. As Darrell Armstrong rightly pointed out on Bryan's podcast, Roddy is at a freshman/sophomore collegiate level in his PG skills, he is not your typical 3rd year veteran. Any playing time is better than no playing time. He can be recalled from the D-league when someone gets injured.

And you haven't been paying attention to other teams outside of the Mavs if you don't believe a player can get better in the D-league.

Originally Posted by Budapest Maverick

You mean a low lottery pick. It was reported that teams offered the Mavs lottery picks for him, again, before this season. No way you give him up for a second rounder, especially knowing he will still be on his rookie contract next season, and maybe the only player we can keep besides Dirk and Kidd (vet min), if we struck gold in free agency.

They were offered a low lottery pick for him in his rookie year. There was still trade buzz for him before he had came off his injury last year. Another foot surgery later, the best you could get is a conditional pick. He would have to play injury free for at least year with development in order to get a low first rounder for him.

[jthig32]

Originally Posted by b_o_r

1. Nothing is easy for the Mavs because they tend f-up the end of the 2nd and 3rd qtrs no matter if Kidd is playing or not. The next favorable matchup for the Mavs doesn't come until Feb 28th, so that is 20 days before meaningful playing time?
2. Players develop in blowouts where everyone chucks up shots and don't play defense?
3. No one knows when an injury is going to occur. In the meanwhile, Roddy can be practicing and playing under Del Harris/David Wesley. As Darrell Armstrong rightly pointed out on Bryan's podcast, Roddy is at a freshman/sophomore collegiate level in his PG skills, he is not your typical 3rd year veteran. Any playing time is better than no playing time. He can be recalled from the D-league when someone gets injured.

And you haven't been paying attention to other teams outside of the Mavs if you don't believe a player can get better in the D-league.

I never said a player can't get better in the DLeague. I said Roddy won't get better. And even that might be hyperbolic. He could probably get marginally better. But he's really too good at this point to get much better from competing in the DLeague. The competition down there is awful.

More importantly (to the Mavs, I can't tell if it's more important to you), Roddy is valuable to the Mavs as depth. All it takes is foul trouble, a minor injury, or just a bad half and Roddy will be needed with no notice. They're not going to sacrifice that for the marginal gains he might receive in the DLeague. I doubt very seriously that the Mavs are going to go 20 days without Roddy getting meaningful playing time. This back to back DNP-CD is the first of the season for him, and it would seem logical to assume that it's going to be more the exception than the rule moving forward.

[dude1394]

Originally Posted by jthig32

That's a pretty narrow view of what makes a good PG. I'm not giving Roddy minutes ahead of Delonte at any position if my goal is to win the game in front of me.

Thank you... Roddy can have a stellar assist/to rate if he's just dribbling around nor making anything happen. Jet is aggressive out there to a fault, roddy just seems to be making pretty aimless motions.

[dude1394]

Originally Posted by jthig32

It's not like Roddy got benched due to poor play. Kidd came back.

But he did get beat out ( again) by delonte.

[BGMaverick9]

Originally Posted by b_o_r

Debunked. He had no playing time against the Wolves who employ a small 3 guard lineup and he didn't get off the bench even in garbage time.

Roddy has simply gone back to his "break glass in case of injury or blowout" role he had in his rookie year. Except for 20 minutes, he has been used mainly this year as PG and with him being 3rd on depth chart (4th on the SG) it makes no sense to have him here. He is not going to get better through "practicing hard" because the Mavs won't be practicing with games scheduled every other day now til the end of April.

He is not going to get better on the bench. Either ask him to go to the D league where he can practice and play or just trade him for a 2nd rounder and cap space.

That was exploiting a matchup you had to feel was at worst 90% going to work out in your favor. Did you see the post-ups Vince got on those smaller guards?

Kidd and Delonte were working well, so you might as well let them see it out.

Just because he sits on the bench doesn't mean he doesn't have any practice time or one on one time with coaches. It just means he doesn't have the chance to play. Everything else is still in the mix.

[b_o_r]

Originally Posted by BGMaverick9

That was exploiting a matchup you had to feel was at worst 90% going to work out in your favor. Did you see the post-ups Vince got on those smaller guards?

Kidd and Delonte were working well, so you might as well let them see it out.

Just because he sits on the bench doesn't mean he doesn't have any practice time or one on one time with coaches. It just means he doesn't have the chance to play. Everything else is still in the mix.

I have no problem with Carlisle choosing that match up over another because his job is to win.



But you can't be serious if you believe for one second that he can become a better player only through those side sessions and not playing. I am pretty sure he looks really good feeding Darrell Armstrong in the post who is being defended by Monte Mathis. He probably can actually complete a lob to Wright who is being guarded by nobody and doesn't have to run and catch. One on one sessions can never replace actual playing time. He hasn't played a lot in the last 3 years. Why is Roddy to good not to go to the D-league? Why was it great for Dojo, but a no-no for Roddy?