LOST: SEASON 5 - Page 30 - Dallas-Mavs.com Forums

Big Boy Laroux · 05-14-2009, 02:36 PM

just responding that the helicopter jump wasn't entirely selfless. And if i remember correctly, didn't kate ask him about that and he was sheepish?

anyway, so ben seemed to imply that the statue was fully erect when he arrived (sun called him on his lie that it was just a foot). So are to assume the bomb is what destroyed it?

Flacolaco · 05-14-2009, 02:40 PM

We've seen 1986....we've seen 1990 or thereabout (the purge)...I just don't think that a freaking thermo-nuclear bomb was detonated on the island before.

I think I am starting to lean towards the side of "they changed history".

Unless they're going to tell us that the bomb was far enough down there that it didnt you know...kill everyone and everything on the island...I just don't know.

sike · 05-14-2009, 02:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Big Boy Laroux

just responding that the helicopter jump wasn't entirely selfless. And if i remember correctly, didn't kate ask him about that and he was sheepish?

Yeah...but he always deflects any praise or attention...its one of the nicer parts of his character. I think it wasn't selfish...he was playing hero.

Kirobaito · 05-14-2009, 02:46 PM

One possibility is that that wasn't an explosion, but rather a time flash. Who knows? We're really not gonna know much of anything until next January. We have no clue of what TPTB are up to here.

sike · 05-14-2009, 02:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kirobaito

One possibility is that that wasn't an explosion, but rather a time flash. Who knows? We're really not gonna know much of anything until next January. We have no clue of what TPTB are up to here.

well...lets just close it down.

nikeball · 05-14-2009, 02:58 PM

I haven't read any articles or summaries yet but..

All this talk about good v evil and predestination v free will..

LOST is trying to tackle three of the greatest mysteries known to man..
1. Time Traveling
2. Free will v Predestination
3. Love - lol Sawliet...JacKate

But if this is a parallel with the Bible it is pretty stretched.

Jacob (good, Jesus, God) v Esau (evil)...

Jacob went to those who survived the Oceanic flight before the crash..and "preordained them to survive." Has them suffer through trials to see if they are worthy of the kingdom (the island). Then one of his followers Locke (Judas) betrays him and gets Ben to kill him through a loophole (Roman crucifixion).

Big Boy Laroux · 05-14-2009, 03:05 PM

so the ash around the cabin... i remember a previous episode where locke picked up some ash, but did we ever see anyone make a gap in it? the first time i saw it, i assumed it was to keep things OUT of the cabin. Maybe it was actually meant to keep someone IN? the Esau guy?

but Claire and Christian were hanging out there, too, in one episode. I of course now assume Christian has been Esau this whole time... but then that doesn't fit with the prison idea as we saw Christian in season 1.

BUT - christian has never actually touched anything or anyone that i can remember. So maybe christian has always been Esau's way of communicating while being trapped in the cabin. Only when the ash was broken could he actually escape and then touch things/people as locke.

I like arguing with myself.

Kirobaito · 05-14-2009, 03:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nikeball

I haven't read any articles or summaries yet but..

All this talk about good v evil and predestination v free will..

LOST is trying to tackle three of the greatest mysteries known to man..
1. Time Traveling
2. Free will v Predestination
3. Love - lol Sawliet...JacKate

But if this is a parallel with the Bible it is pretty stretched.

Jacob (good, Jesus, God) v Esau (evil)...

Jacob went to those who survived the Oceanic flight before the crash..and "preordained them to survive." Has them suffer through trials to see if they are worthy of the kingdom (the island). Then one of his followers Locke (Judas) betrays him and gets Ben to kill him through a loophole (Roman crucifixion).

But this episode certainly indicates that that isn't Locke who betrayed him. Locke died when Ben strangled him in the motel room. What we've seen of Locke this season is actually Esau, or evil God, or whoever that was sitting with Jacob on the beach at the beginning of the episode. A lot of people also speculate that this being is the Smoke Monster, who takes forms of people who died on the Island (Christian, Yemi, Alex). I think I agree with them.

sike · 05-14-2009, 03:16 PM

I don't like the idea of smokey being Esau or Jacob...just doesn't seem to fit.

How could Ben "Summon" a god? as he did when he sent smokey after Widmore's hired guns.

sike · 05-14-2009, 03:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nikeball

I haven't read any articles or summaries yet but..

All this talk about good v evil and predestination v free will..

LOST is trying to tackle three of the greatest mysteries known to man..
1. Time Traveling
2. Free will v Predestination
3. Love - lol Sawliet...JacKate

But if this is a parallel with the Bible it is pretty stretched.

Jacob (good, Jesus, God) v Esau (evil)...

Jacob went to those who survived the Oceanic flight before the crash..and "preordained them to survive." Has them suffer through trials to see if they are worthy of the kingdom (the island). Then one of his followers Locke (Judas) betrays him and gets Ben to kill him through a loophole (Roman crucifixion).

While the symbolism is there...I really doubt the writers are going to go CS Lewis on the audience...it won't be something so clear cut as a Jesus vs. Satan battle royale. thats too easy.

Flacolaco · 05-14-2009, 03:19 PM

Wouldn't something easy be a nice change of pace?

Kirobaito · 05-14-2009, 03:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sike

I don't like the idea of smokey being Esau or Jacob...just doesn't seem to fit.

How could Ben "Summon" a god? as he did when he sent smokey after Widmore's hired guns.

I think it's obvious that doppelganger Locke is the guy from the beginning.

Think about it, though. Doppelganger Locke plays dumb with Ben, and when Ben goes to "summon" the Smoke Monster, it magically doesn't appear, even though he did before. So.... they go to Smokey's Lair. Ben falls through the floor, and Locke says "lol see ya." Five minutes later Smoke Monster appears as Alex and tells Ben do WHATEVER Locke says. Then "Locke" tells him to kill Jacob. I think this is too much of a coincidence to ignore.

sike · 05-14-2009, 03:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kirobaito

I think it's obvious that doppelganger Locke is the guy from the beginning.

Think about it, though. Doppelganger Locke plays dumb with Ben, and when Ben goes to "summon" the Smoke Monster, it magically doesn't appear, even though he did before. So.... they go to Smokey's Lair. Ben falls through the floor, and Locke says "lol see ya." Five minutes later Smoke Monster appears as Alex and tells Ben do WHATEVER Locke says. Then "Locke" tells him to kill Jacob. I think this is too much of a coincidence to ignore.

it could be....I just think not.

sike · 05-14-2009, 03:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Flacolaco

Wouldn't something easy be a nice change of pace?

NO!

XERXES · 05-14-2009, 03:31 PM

no one really commented on my theory that there part of season 6 is going to be a rescue attempt to travel in time and save jack, kate, sawyer, hurley, jin, etc etc before the bomb explodes.

are we all in agreement- or do you guys have some other theories?

sike · 05-14-2009, 03:36 PM

I just don't think the explosion killed them...thats what I think for now. Just like I don't think Locke is really dead for good or Jacob for that matter.

I'm kinda hopeful that season 6 is not filled with too much time travel junk....I hope thats what this season was about. This show was great before it submersed itself in time traveling...I just don't it to bog on that too much in its final season.

Flacolaco · 05-14-2009, 03:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by XERXES

no one really commented on my theory that there part of season 6 is going to be a rescue attempt to travel in time and save jack, kate, sawyer, hurley, jin, etc etc before the bomb explodes.

are we all in agreement- or do you guys have some other theories?

Who would carry that attempt out?

Sun is the only one left in the present* that would give a crap.

The present, btw, that we're not sure is still intact or not because of the bomb detonating.

Flacolaco · 05-14-2009, 03:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sike

I just don't think the explosion killed them...thats what I think for now. Just like I don't think Locke is really dead for good or Jacob for that matter.

I'm kinda hopeful that season 6 is not filled with too much time travel junk....I hope thats what this season was about. This show was great before it submersed itself in time traveling...I just don't it to bog on that too much in its final season.

Cuse/Lindelof have said in interviews that the time traveling will not be a big player in season 6. (I hope there's a little bit though...everyone needs to get together again dammit)

They said, towards the end of last season, that Season 4 was how they left, Season 5 was going to be how they got back, and Season 6 was going to be about what happens when they get back. Whatever that means.

sike · 05-14-2009, 03:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Flacolaco

Cuse/Lindelof have said in interviews that the time traveling will not be a big player in season 6. (I hope there's a little bit though...everyone needs to get together again dammit)

good to know...

Big Boy Laroux · 05-14-2009, 04:09 PM

i'm also of the mindset that the statue is not anubis. However, remember this picture from the temple?

Maybe jacob is anubis (if that is anubis - it sure looks like anubis) and Esau is smokey? Doesn't look like they're fighting here, just hanging out

or interacting.

how in the hell do you resize pictures on here?

sike · 05-14-2009, 04:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Big Boy Laroux

i'm also of the mindset that the statue is NOT anubis. However, remember this picture from the temple?

Maybe jacob is anubis (if that is anubis - it sure looks like anubis) and Esau is smokey? Doesn't look like they're fighting here, just hanging out

or interacting.

how in the hell do you resize pictures on here?

that pic does seem to lead towards Esau/Smokey (or at the very least seems to be a pic of Anubis and Smokey though not necessarily Esau)...I still don't like that thought. Smokey just doesn't seem like a god. And he seems to have functioning parts (all those sounds)...I just don't want Esau to be Smokey.

At one point, Anubis was the most significant god of the dead....just saying.

XERXES · 05-14-2009, 04:25 PM

I understand your points- but someway somehow- theyve still gotta do SOME time traveling just to all reunite...

Kirobaito · 05-14-2009, 04:37 PM

The statue is not Anubis. It's either Taweret or Sobek.

Taweret:

Sobek

I lean toward Taweret, because Sobek usually is depicted with a real big hat thing (that picture notwithstanding), while Taweret has a little cap thing on the top of her head.

XERXES · 05-14-2009, 04:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sike

I just don't think the explosion killed them...thats what I think for now. Just like I don't think Locke is really dead for good or Jacob for that matter.

didnt richard tell sun that he "saw them all die?"

Big Boy Laroux · 05-14-2009, 04:42 PM

kiro, i agree, and said i do NOT think the statue is anubis.

look earlier in this thread when the statue first appeared, and I was saying it was not anubis. I was saying it was the hippo fertility god (taweret). because of the hat, the double ankh (even posted pictures of statues of taweret that show this common representation), the shorter ears.

now there's nothing to say anubis couldn't live within a statue of taweret.

sike · 05-14-2009, 04:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by XERXES

didnt richard tell sun that he "saw them all die?"

Richard certainly wouldn't have "seen them die" at the swan, right? He wasn't there...he was getting his leader as far away as possible.

and yes, some time travel will HAVE to happen in season 6...I'm just hoping it wont be the dominating theme like this season.

sike · 05-14-2009, 04:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Big Boy Laroux

kiro, i agree, and said i do NOT think the statue is anubis.

look earlier in this thread when the statue first appeared, and I was saying it was not anubis. I was saying it was the hippo fertility god (taweret). because of the hat, the double ankh (even posted pictures of statues of taweret that show this common representation), the shorter ears.

now there's nothing to say anubis couldn't live within a statue of taweret.

in reference to this...the EW.com blog is officially reporting that the statue is Taweret....that is probably bc they where given that name to report by the producers or writers.

alby · 05-14-2009, 05:18 PM

what if the bomb didn't go off? all we saw was a white flash right? I don't remember but was there an explosion sound or anything. What if the bomb was not detonated and it was just merely a tease

sike · 05-14-2009, 05:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by alby

what if the bomb didn't go off? all we saw was a white flash right? I don't remember but was there an explosion sound or anything. What if the bomb was not detonated and it was just merely a tease

could be.

But I think that the most likely scenario is that which Miles suggested...instead of changing anything, Jack made everything happen the way it was...

Oh silly Jack...when will you learn?

LonghornDub · 05-14-2009, 05:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Flacolaco

Wouldn't something easy be a nice change of pace?

I think it's very possible that some of the "end-game" information we get next season might be surprisingly simple--even as simple as "good vs. evil." And that's not a knock on the show. In fact, it's a compliment, because that can be very effective storytelling. You complicate things and complicate things some more as part of building up tension, and then at the climax you present a fairly clean, simple answer (or answers). That sort of process tends to be a lot more effective than presenting the audience with an incredibly complex solution, even when the audience is fairly intelligent.

Of course, you don't want to make it too simple such that you leave open a lot of holes and questions unanswered, but I'm increasingly of the belief that such a thing isn't going to happen.

sike · 05-14-2009, 05:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LonghornDub

I think it's very possible that some of the "end-game" information we get next season might be surprisingly simple--even as simple as "good vs. evil."

if they stick with the Jacob vs Esau storyline, which it seems they must....I'd be interested to see if its not clear cut good v evil...but maybe they make us take a side on who we think is right. Its clear that Widmore no longer appears the most evil, and Ben no longer appears the most evil, etc...I wonder if Jacob vs Unknown "Locke body snatcher" will be muddied waters as well.

Which makes me wonder....was Widmore a pawn of the "Other god"?

LonghornDub · 05-14-2009, 06:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sike

but maybe they make us take a side on who we think is right.

Choose Your Own Adventure: LOST ?

I like it.

DirkFTW · 05-14-2009, 06:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LonghornDub

Choose Your Own Adventure: LOST ?

I like it.

Could you imagine something similar to an American Idol format where the end of the episode comes with a choice the audience must make in the next two hours by dialing 866-PICK001 or 866-PICK002? I wonder if they could really pull off that kind of on-the-fly writing/production some day...

LonghornDub · 05-14-2009, 06:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DirkFTW

Could you imagine something similar to an American Idol format where the end of the episode comes with a choice the audience must make in the next two hours by dialing 866-PICK001 or 866-PICK002? I wonder if they could really pull off that kind of on-the-fly writing/production some day...

They've done some stuff like this with some experimental movie theaters, I think one out in LA and some overseas as well. As I recall, the general audience response has not been very positive.

Still, it'd be interesting.

Flacolaco · 05-14-2009, 06:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LonghornDub

I think it's very possible that some of the "end-game" information we get next season might be surprisingly simple--even as simple as "good vs. evil." And that's not a knock on the show. In fact, it's a compliment, because that can be very effective storytelling. You complicate things and complicate things some more as part of building up tension, and then at the climax you present a fairly clean, simple answer (or answers). That sort of process tends to be a lot more effective than presenting the audience with an incredibly complex solution, even when the audience is fairly intelligent.

Of course, you don't want to make it too simple such that you leave open a lot of holes and questions unanswered, but I'm increasingly of the belief that such a thing isn't going to happen.

I read an interview they gave the other day, and they said that once viewers have the season 5 finale and season six premier, they'll be able to make a very good educated guess about the end game of the show. So maybe it will simplify a bit.

mavspwnage · 05-15-2009, 01:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kirobaito

I lean toward Taweret, because Sobek usually is depicted with a real big hat thing (that picture notwithstanding), while Taweret has a little cap thing on the top of her head.

What about the item the statue is holding? Based on the pictures you provided, it looks a lot more like Sobek. That item is called an ankh, which represents the ability to undo evil and cure ills.

CadBane · 05-15-2009, 01:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mavspwnage

What about the item the statue is holding? Based on the pictures you provided, it looks a lot more like Sobek. That item is called an ankh, which represents the ability to undo evil and cure ills.

It's holding two ankhs, just like Taweret.

mavspwnage · 05-15-2009, 01:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CadBane

It's holding two ankhs, just like Taweret.

Sobek holds ankhs as well. But just based on the pics Kirobaito provided, it looks a lot more like Sobek to me. But to each their own.

CadBane · 05-15-2009, 01:53 AM

Sobek only holds one though.

Big Boy Laroux · 05-15-2009, 09:01 AM

posted on 3/5/09. Here's some better shots of representations of taweret.

http://www.dallas-mavs.com/vb/showpo...&postcount=623