A Real Man

[Drbio]

Your alarm goes off, you hit the snooze and sleep for another 10 minutes.

He stays up for days on end.



You take a warm shower to help you wake up.

He goes days or weeks without running water.



You complain of a "headache", and call in sick.

He gets shot at as others are hit, and keeps moving forward.



You put on your anti war/don't support the troops shirt, and go meet up with your friends.

He still fights for your right to wear that shirt.



You make sure your cell phone is in your pocket.

He clutches the cross hanging on his chain next to his dog tags.



You talk trash about your "buddies" that aren't with you.

He knows he may not see some of his buddies again.



You walk down the beach, staring at all the pretty girls.

He walks the streets, searching for insurgents and terrorists.



You complain about how hot it is.

He wears his heavy gear, not daring to take off his helmet to wipe his brow.



You go out to lunch, and complain because the restaurant got your order wrong.

He doesn't get to eat today.



Your maid makes your bed and washes your clothes.

He wears the same things for weeks, but makes sure his weapons are clean.



You go to the mall and get your hair redone.

He doesn't have time to brush his teeth today.



You're angry because your class ran 5 minutes over.

He's told he will be held over an extra 3 months.



You call your girlfriend and set a date for tonight.

He waits for the mail to see if there is a letter from home.



You hug and kiss your girlfriend, like you do everyday.

He holds his letter close and smells his love's perfume.



You roll your eyes as a baby cries.

He gets a letter with pictures of his new child, and wonders if they'll ever meet.



You criticize your government, and say that war never solves anything.

He sees the innocent tortured and killed by their own people and remembers why he is fighting.



You hear the jokes about the war, and make fun of men like him.

He hears the gunfire, bombs and screams of the wounded.



You see only what the media wants you to see.

He sees the broken bodies lying around him.



You are asked to go to the store by your parents. You don't.

He does exactly what he is told.



You stay at home and watch TV.

He takes whatever time he is given to call, write home, sleep, and eat.



You crawl into your soft bed, with down pillows, and get comfortable.

He crawls under a tank for shade and a 5 minute nap, only to be woken by gunfire.



You sit there and judge him, saying the world is probably a worse place because of men like him.


He is a real man.


If only there were more men like him!



Only two defining forces have ever offered to die for you:

Jesus Christ and the American G.I.

One died for your soul, the other for your freedom.

[Arne]

Originally Posted by Drbio

Your alarm goes off, you hit the snooze and sleep for another 10 minutes.

He stays up for days on end.



You take a warm shower to help you wake up.

He goes days or weeks without running water.



You complain of a "headache", and call in sick.

He gets shot at as others are hit, and keeps moving forward.



You put on your anti war/don't support the troops shirt, and go meet up with your friends.

He still fights for your right to wear that shirt.



You make sure your cell phone is in your pocket.

He clutches the cross hanging on his chain next to his dog tags.



You talk trash about your "buddies" that aren't with you.

He knows he may not see some of his buddies again.



You walk down the beach, staring at all the pretty girls.

He walks the streets, searching for insurgents and terrorists.



You complain about how hot it is.

He wears his heavy gear, not daring to take off his helmet to wipe his brow.



You go out to lunch, and complain because the restaurant got your order wrong.

He doesn't get to eat today.



Your maid makes your bed and washes your clothes.

He wears the same things for weeks, but makes sure his weapons are clean.



You go to the mall and get your hair redone.

He doesn't have time to brush his teeth today.



You're angry because your class ran 5 minutes over.

He's told he will be held over an extra 3 months.



You call your girlfriend and set a date for tonight.

He waits for the mail to see if there is a letter from home.



You hug and kiss your girlfriend, like you do everyday.

He holds his letter close and smells his love's perfume.



You roll your eyes as a baby cries.

He gets a letter with pictures of his new child, and wonders if they'll ever meet.



You criticize your government, and say that war never solves anything.

He sees the innocent tortured and killed by their own people and remembers why he is fighting.



You hear the jokes about the war, and make fun of men like him.

He hears the gunfire, bombs and screams of the wounded.



You see only what the media wants you to see.

He sees the broken bodies lying around him.



You are asked to go to the store by your parents. You don't.

He does exactly what he is told.



You stay at home and watch TV.

He takes whatever time he is given to call, write home, sleep, and eat.



You crawl into your soft bed, with down pillows, and get comfortable.

He crawls under a tank for shade and a 5 minute nap, only to be woken by gunfire.



You sit there and judge him, saying the world is probably a worse place because of men like him.


He is a real man.


If only there were more men like him!



Only two defining forces have ever offered to die for you:

Jesus Christ and the American G.I.

One died for your soul, the other for your freedom.

Many of these G.I.'s joined the army, because they live in regions were they just have no other opportunity, they are recruited all over the country. Many of these G.I.'s have their very own reason to go to war. Read "Jarhead" and you'll get to know a realistic description of the mind of a soldier.

[jthig32]

What, exactley, is your point, Arne?

[Drbio]

The point is that Arne will piss on the US G.I. at every opportunity.


You just cannot unteach stupid.

[bernardos70]

Doc, I luv ya, but bleh to this post bud. Hardly ever do you see people disliking troops, it's the war most people are against, not troops. Some of those statements are plain pathetic. I support the troops til the end, that's why I want to see them out of there being able to do the things the "Fake Man" like I am does. Because they're the only real ones.

[Flacolaco]

Hardly ever do you see people disliking troops, it's the war most people are against, not troops.

Let me make sure to preface this with things like IMO, and "to me it seems," and "the way I feel is" that if people say they support the troops, and not the war, That's a bunch of crap. (IMO). For everyone who says that; theres a brave guy over there who believes in why he is there. He believes in the war. To say they support him and not the war, is contradictory.

People who protest the war, do the soldiers a disservice. If they dont like the war, that's fine. There are plenty of reasons to not like the war. Just dont follow it with "but I support the troops." No you don't, you think their cause is unjust. You disrespect them.

(ok, start flaming me now....)

[Drbio]

Nice post flaco....


This thread was to celebrate/admire/give props to the US GI. If you don't wish to do that go somewhere else.

[Smiles]

Originally Posted by bernardos70

Doc, I luv ya, but bleh to this post bud. Hardly ever do you see people disliking troops, it's the war most people are against, not troops. Some of those statements are plain pathetic. I support the troops til the end, that's why I want to see them out of there being able to do the things the "Fake Man" like I am does. Because they're the only real ones.

Out of 20+ comparisons, only 5 were directed at people who dislike the war (&/or troops). Clearly, it is a testament of all that we have to appreciate in this country. I think we are to assume that if some of the comparisons listed above didn't pertain to us, then we're supposed to skip over to the ones that do (I don't call in sick over a headache any more than I make fun of a soldier).

The purpose of the "list" is clearly intended to honor the GIs for the luxuries their sacrifices have given us. It is not our place to turn this thread into an opportunity to spout our opions and ideologies about current foreign policy stratgies, etc.

Let's just allow the troops a little credit and honor, and save our opinions for another time and place (if you please).

[Flacolaco]

Originally Posted by Smiles

Out of 20+ comparisons, only 5 were directed at people who dislike the war (&/or troops). Clearly, it is a testament of all that we have to appreciate in this country. I think we are to assume that if some of the comparisons listed above didn't pertain to us, then we're supposed to skip over to the ones that do (I don't call in sick over a headache any more than I make fun of a soldier).

The purpose of the "list" is clearly intended to honor the GIs for the luxuries their sacrifices have given us. It is not our place to turn this thread into an opportunity to spout our opions and ideologies about current foreign policy stratgies, etc.

Let's just allow the troops a little credit and honor, and save our opinions for another time and place (if you please).

Well said.

Cheers.

[dalmations202]

Originally Posted by Arne

Read "Jarhead" and you'll get to know a realistic description of the mind of a soldier.

Can you give me a link to the book? I'd love to know the mind of a soldier.

<edit> I love the "realistic description" that military.com gives the book.

http://www.military.com/opinion/0,15202,79248,00.html

[bernardos70]

Fair enough. I'll still say you can choose not to support the war and support the troops. They're doing as they're told, it's not their fault. And if they believe in this war, I believe their belief is misguided. Then again, one man's opinion. I want nothing more than for every single one of them to make it home in one piece.

[Five-ofan]

Originally Posted by bernardos70

Fair enough. I'll still say you can choose not to support the war and support the troops. They're doing as they're told, it's not their fault. And if they believe in this war, I believe their belief is misguided. Then again, one man's opinion. I want nothing more than for every single one of them to make it home in one piece.

A fairly large portion of them signed up specifically to go to this war. An EXTREMELY LARGE portion of them(like more than 90%) signed up in order to fight if it was deemed this country was in jeopardy. It was so deemed so they went to fight and for that I salute them. The strength of America is that it has enough Men(and Women) who are willing to fight for what is right.

[bernardos70]

I salute them for wanting to fight for what they think is right, even though I think they have been misled, intentionally or not, to believe in this war. That does not diminish their braveness, for which I am very proud of.

[sike]

"And Knowing is Half the Battle"

[Drbio]

Originally Posted by Smiles

Out of 20+ comparisons, only 5 were directed at people who dislike the war (&/or troops). Clearly, it is a testament of all that we have to appreciate in this country. I think we are to assume that if some of the comparisons listed above didn't pertain to us, then we're supposed to skip over to the ones that do (I don't call in sick over a headache any more than I make fun of a soldier).

The purpose of the "list" is clearly intended to honor the GIs for the luxuries their sacrifices have given us. It is not our place to turn this thread into an opportunity to spout our opions and ideologies about current foreign policy stratgies, etc.

Let's just allow the troops a little credit and honor, and save our opinions for another time and place (if you please).

Thank you smiles. It is unfortunate that it couldn't be left to honoring the men and women who defend our country.

[bernardos70]

I apologize for going off on a tangent. We should honor these men and women at every opportunity, as well as having the utmost respect for them.

[nashtymavsfan13]

I really like this poem, especially the last few sentences.

"Only two defining forces have ever offered to die for you:

Jesus Christ and the American G.I.

One died for your soul, the other for your freedom."

[mcsluggo]

Arne, I don't understand your point, it seems like a "random thoughts" response.

that, said this:

Originally Posted by Flacolaco

Let me make sure to preface this with things like IMO, and "to me it seems," and "the way I feel is" that if people say they support the troops, and not the war, That's a bunch of crap. (IMO). For everyone who says that; theres a brave guy over there who believes in why he is there. He believes in the war. To say they support him and not the war, is contradictory.

People who protest the war, do the soldiers a disservice. If they dont like the war, that's fine. There are plenty of reasons to not like the war. Just dont follow it with "but I support the troops." No you don't, you think their cause is unjust. You disrespect them.

(ok, start flaming me now....)

is utter and coplete total bs. period.

You can't support individuals who have signed up to support our country - no questions asked--- and simultaneously question the wisdom of how they are being used?


Certainly not the exact same thing, but similar reasoning: if my sister is a dutiful wife and I find out her husband is cheating on her, am I "disrespecting" (a word I hate, by the way) her by calling him a scumbag?

[Nemesis]

Respect those who have gone in your place..
"Someday this war will end.'

Hopefully sooner than later because a draft would lead us down a road where 'the lost' children of today would be fighting with no conviction or belief in what this country has for so long, tried to defend.

[Nemesis]

Originally Posted by Arne

Many of these G.I.'s joined the army, because they live in regions were they just have no other opportunity, they are recruited all over the country. Many of these G.I.'s have their very own reason to go to war. Read "Jarhead" and you'll get to know a realistic description of the mind of a soldier.

Sounds a bit like Michael Moore. Also, if this is what you got out of the book, Jarhead, I would suggest reading it again.

[Five-ofan]

Originally Posted by mcsluggo

Arne, I don't understand your point, it seems like a "random thoughts" response.

that, said this:



is utter and coplete total bs. period.

You can't support individuals who have signed up to support our country - no questions asked--- and simultaneously question the wisdom of how they are being used?


Certainly not the exact same thing, but similar reasoning: if my sister is a dutiful wife and I find out her husband is cheating on her, am I "disrespecting" (a word I hate, by the way) her by calling him a scumbag?

If by not the exact same thing, you mean completely different you are exactly right. If you want to make that an analogous situation, it would be if he had said that insulting the president was disrespecting the troops. Now insulting the president would be a whole different set of questions but im just pointing out that your analogy is as you would put it complete and utter bs. Period.

I actually agree with flaco on this point(mostly but it can get a little murky in certain situations). I dont really see how you can say you support the troops(which would mean wanting them to win) and then saying i disagree with all of what they do.

If you want a more relevant analogy(though on a much different scale), it would be like saying, I support the cowboys. Now i hope the redskins beat them. Just doesnt make any sense does it?

[Drbio]

It is sad that we cannot have a thread to celebrate our soldiers without some asshat insisting on making a hey-look-at-me political statement. If you want to discuss politics take it to the effin' political forum. This thread is intended to celebrate the US soldier. Men and women who are often underappreciated for what they do.

Take your politically biased bullshit out of this thread.

[u2sarajevo]

Originally Posted by Five-ofan

If you want a more relevant analogy(though on a much different scale), it would be like saying, I support the cowboys. Now i hope the redskins beat them. Just doesnt make any sense does it?

Not if you want Parcells gone..... (read into this most of the anti-war factions don't like the President..... so that makes it a perfect analogy).

[Five-ofan]

Originally Posted by u2sarajevo

Not if you want Parcells gone..... (read into this most of the anti-war factions don't like the President..... so that makes it a perfect analogy).

Exactly which is why i made it. I hate parcells but i still want the cowboys to win. Or in kikis case a relevant analogy would be possibly wanting the knicks to lose so Isiah will be gone(im not sure which way he feels about this ive seen him question it multiple times himself). This is america so you can believe what you want. If kiki believes thats whats best thats his right BUT for the time being if you take the route of wanting the team to lose, you dont support it. You may be planning to support it in the future and you may have supported it in the past but in the present you dont.

[Five-ofan]

Originally Posted by Drbio

It is sad that we cannot have a thread to celebrate our soldiers without some asshat insisting on making a hey-look-at-me political statement. If you want to discuss politics take it to the effin' political forum. This thread is intended to celebrate the US soldier. Men and women who are often underappreciated for what they do.

Take your politically biased bullshit out of this thread.

Exactly as well.

Thank you to any soldier who might happen to read this. There are those of us who truly appreciate what you do.

[mcsluggo]

Originally Posted by Five-ofan

If by not the exact same thing, you mean completely different you are exactly right. If you want to make that an analogous situation, it would be if he had said that insulting the president was disrespecting the troops. Now insulting the president would be a whole different set of questions but im just pointing out that your analogy is as you would put it complete and utter bs. Period.

I actually agree with flaco on this point(mostly but it can get a little murky in certain situations). I dont really see how you can say you support the troops(which would mean wanting them to win) and then saying i disagree with all of what they do.

If you want a more relevant analogy(though on a much different scale), it would be like saying, I support the cowboys. Now i hope the redskins beat them. Just doesnt make any sense does it?

No, your analogy sucks.

(but btw, as a redskin's fan I CAN say I always liked Roger Staubach and Troy Aikman, AND i wanted them to lose every single game. THis is actually fact. Reality. go figure.... but your analogy still sucks)


Ignore analogies, look at the real situation. NOBODY says they want the troops to lose. nobody. I appreciate the fact that they stand ready to defend my ability to make jokes/ignore my parents/have fluffy pillows/eat tasty meals/etc.../. I'm damn glad we as a country have them. I want them healthy. But moreover since they are there I want them to SUCCEED at their objective. That said it wasn't a good idea to send them over, and the handling of their mssion over there has been attrocious.

I support the troops, both in general and in hoping they succeed in getting the best possible results from this current mission. AND I think the doinks moving the pieces around on teh chessboard are failing them. they are not contradictory.

[Five-ofan]

Originally Posted by mcsluggo

No, your analogy sucks.

(but btw, as a redskin's fan I CAN say I always liked Roger Staubach and Troy Aikman, AND i wanted them to lose every single game. THis is actually fact. Reality. go figure.... but your analogy still sucks)


Ignore analogies, look at the real situation. NOBODY says they want the troops to lose. nobody. I appreciate the fact that they stand ready to defend my ability to make jokes/ignore my parents/have fluffy pillows/eat tasty meals/etc.../. I'm damn glad we as a country have them. I want them healthy. But moreover since they are there I want them to SUCCEED at their objective. That said it wasn't a good idea to send them over, and the handling of their mssion over there has been attrocious.

I support the troops, both in general and in hoping they succeed in getting the best possible results from this current mission. AND I think the doinks moving the pieces around on teh chessboard are failing them. they are not contradictory.

THen you arent making the argument that you support the troops and are against the war. You are making the argument that you support the troops and are against the president. 2 entirely different arguments and i do agree that you can support the troops and be against the president. However, if you want them to accomplish their mission, you support the war.

[mcsluggo]

Originally Posted by Drbio

It is sad that we cannot have a thread to celebrate our soldiers without some asshat insisting on making a hey-look-at-me political statement. If you want to discuss politics take it to the effin' political forum. This thread is intended to celebrate the US soldier. Men and women who are often underappreciated for what they do.

Take your politically biased bullshit out of this thread.

oh shove it.

that is total bs and you know it. This piece is a political statement wraped in a warm-fuzzzy wrapper. IF you have a tribute piece without the obligatory thrown-in political bs, then it won't get political type responses.

* You criticize your government, and say that war never solves anything.
He sees the innocent tortured and killed by their own people and remembers why he is fighting.

* You hear the jokes about the war, and make fun of men like him.
He hears the gunfire, bombs and screams of the wounded.

* You see only what the media wants you to see.
He sees the broken bodies lying around him.

You are asked to go to the store by your parents. You don't.
He does exactly what he is told.

You stay at home and watch TV.
He takes whatever time he is given to call, write home, sleep, and eat.

You crawl into your soft bed, with down pillows, and get comfortable.
He crawls under a tank for shade and a 5 minute nap, only to be woken by gunfire.

* You sit there and judge him, saying the world is probably a worse place because of men like him.

four of the last seven "points" are direct political stabs, NOBODY could deny that, to even try would be tattooing "moron" on your own head.

I am personally tired of the politically biased bullshit as well. I have nothing but admiration for the non-asterisked points in the piece, and hope our serving men stay healthy and get back to loved ones, and I’m damned glad they are standing ready to protect all of us. The inability to pay tribute to that fact and them without throwing in the barbs does them a disservice. The feigned righteous indignation after lobbed political hand grenades is just sickening, imho.


All of this said: Please protect our troops, godspeed in accomplishing their mission and bringing them back home.

[mcsluggo]

Originally Posted by Five-ofan

THen you arent making the argument that you support the troops and are against the war. You are making the argument that you support the troops and are against the president. 2 entirely different arguments and i do agree that you can support the troops and be against the president. However, if you want them to accomplish their mission, you support the war.

I don't (didn't) support the war, but we can't just walk away and have it all go back into the box. Soooo from this point, the best option is to go forward and hope for success. That said, I don't think the current strategists can acieve success, even if they have the correct strategy in hand now... too much water under the bridge. I also am not sure if a dem admin would be able to achieve success with the same theortetical "perfect plan" (the rest of the world wouldn't view them as a change, just more of the same US is US).

I know how popular the UN is with this crowd, but some option between the US holding it all together essentially alone (basically the current moronic strategy) and the US essentially walking away (a commonlly held moronic strategy among dem challenging candidates these days) has to be the solution. If not the UN, then who?

[mcsluggo]

Also, in some situations pulling out WOULD be the best option. Still support the troops, but get them thehelloutta there is a perfectly viable option.

[Arne]

Originally Posted by mcsluggo

Also, in some situations pulling out WOULD be the best option. Still support the troops, but get them thehelloutta there is a perfectly viable option.

First go into a country and then get the out of there, because it's to dangerous or expensive to stay... That's

If you want to have a war then plan finishing it. Afghanisthan still needs rebuilding, by the way...

[Drbio]

mc sluggo- kiss my ass. The intent of this thread was to praise and feel good about our soldiers. If you don't like it go f*ck yourself. Keep your damn politics in the politics forum.

idiot.

[Drbio]

Originally Posted by mcsluggo

Also, in some situations pulling out WOULD be the best option. Still support the troops, but get them thehelloutta there is a perfectly viable option.

I wish your father would have pulled out.

[Flacolaco]

Originally Posted by Drbio

I wish your father would have pulled out.

comedy gold my friend.





You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to Drbio again.

[Five-ofan]

Originally Posted by Flacolaco

comedy gold my friend.





You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to Drbio again.

But i Musnt. THat was hilarious.

[nashtymavsfan13]

Originally Posted by Drbio

I wish your father would have pulled out.

Lol

[dude1394]

Thanks for the post doc. It is always good for me to get my come-uppance. To be reminded of just how damn good I have it and how easy my life is compared to the men and women who protect me and my family.

It's always good to be reminded of how stupidly lucky I was just to be born in this country. Thank you Lord that you have given me and my family the gift of being born in this blessed country. Dumb luck, I have.

Thanks soldier, sleep well and safe.

[Drbio]

Originally Posted by dude1394

That's for the post doc. It is always good for me to get my come-uppance. To be reminded of just how damn good I have it and how easy my life is compared to the men and women who protect me and my family.

It's always good to be reminded of how stupidly lucky I was just to be born in this country. Thank you Lord that you have given me and my family the gift of being born in this blessed country. Dumb luck, I have.

Thanks soldier, sleep well and safe.

Great post.

[chumdawg]

How many American soliders these days go days without sleeping or eating? How many don't change clothes for weeks? How many of them have ever been shot even one time, much less been shot and just kept right on going?

Can anyone offer up an educated guess as to how many American soldiers actually meet these descriptions? Also, does anyone know approximately how many American soldiers there are? Finally, would anyone know what percentage of American soldiers--over, say, the last 20 years--have ever been in a combat zone?

[jthig32]

Originally Posted by chumdawg

How many American soliders these days go days without sleeping or eating? How many don't change clothes for weeks? How many of them have ever been shot even one time, much less been shot and just kept right on going?

Can anyone offer up an educated guess as to how many American soldiers actually meet these descriptions? Also, does anyone know approximately how many American soldiers there are? Finally, would anyone know what percentage of American soldiers--over, say, the last 20 years--have ever been in a combat zone?

You're right Chum, they live a life of luxury. Screw them and their jobs.

Tell, you what, I'll ask my brother-in-law after he gets back from his second stint in Iraq how the living conditions were. He hasn't been shot yet, but a truck he was flanking blew up about a week ago, and he's lucky to be alive.

Sorry he doesn't fit your description.