2019-2020 NBA Season Thread

[mac222b]

Originally Posted by ExRocketNewMav

Rockets fans want him.

My name says it all to explain the input...

(waiting to get enough privileges to start a thread to explain myself so hopefully don't get too flamed before that time comes)

The new Rockets ownership is so incompetent though so I don't think they'll head this direction. That is of course unless Silas accepts a very low-ball offer because that's going to be the most important factor in Tilman Fertitta making his head coaching decision.

The Rockets are long past the acceptable time-frame to bring in a new coach, especially considering the discussed starting date for the next season.

As each week passes it is saving Fertitta a hell of a lot of money to not have to pay a head coach.

I wouldn't expect JVG purely because he'd be expensive and he had ties to Morey. Although I have heard he approves of the interim GM (I use that term because the GM position is a placeholder until Fertitta can insert his son into that role... can someone say New York Knicks 2.0?)

Welcome to the board! Fertitta is an idiot AND he’s cheap. At least Dolan is willing to spend. What a mess Houston is going to be going forward. How long you think before Harden asks out? I think after this season coming season (such as it shall be) he’s gone.

[ExRocketNewMav]

Originally Posted by KillerLeft

I feel like Morey would never have wanted the Westbrook trade to happen, and I've heard some suggest that Harden went over his head to the owner to get it done. As a Rockets fan, can you confirm or refute this?

I think I would be hard pressed to find on Clutchfans more than a handful of people who don't think/know deep down this was not a Morey move.

This was a 100% Tilman Fertitta move - he did not want to pay Chris Paul's monstrous contract. And Westbrook was a flashy and shiny object that attracts the attention span of idiots like Tilman.

This coincidentally was also the moment when I realised I can't defend Harden anymore from some of the hate he gets and I just had to learn to accept the fact that whilst he is a phenomenal and generational talent, he doesn't have that undying and ever burning desire to win at all costs. Since ultimately Tilman floated the idea to Harden about the CP3/Westbrook framework and Harden green lit the decision.

Westbrook is historically bad with regards to his distance shooting... I still to this day cannot fathom why we brought him to the team which sets records year after year for the amount of distance shooting they do.

I was a big Chris Paul fan well before he joined the Rockets. Knowing that the Warriors were not going to be in our way this past season, I was praying we'd give CP3 and Harden one more chance.

I know Chris Paul isn't a favourite (apologies for my Australian spelling) teammate of many in the league, but Harden not being able to make it work was a big red flag to the idea that he wants to win a Championship.

I'm blabbering here so in closing - this was 100% not a Morey move - and this has played a part in his departure regardless of what is said in the media (I am so, SO glad he left on his own terms and didn't wait until the day in the near future Tilman forced him out)

The Westbrook trade was, is and forever will be on the shoulders of Tilman Fertitta and James Harden. And it is a move which has not only destroyed the Rockets team in the short term, but has also torpedoed the franchise for at least the next decade AT BEST.

Originally Posted by mac222b

Welcome to the board! Fertitta is an idiot AND he’s cheap. At least Dolan is willing to spend. What a mess Houston is going to be going forward. How long you think before Harden asks out? I think after this season coming season (such as it shall be) he’s gone.

Yup - Tilman purchasing the team should make so many Mavs fans happy ha. The future looks horrendous for the Rockets and I shudder to think just how bad it will become when Tilman JR is the GM.

Regardless of what I've said above and if it comes across that I don't like Harden anymore - I still love the guy for everything he's done for the Rockets. As a fan since the days of......... losing a Game 7 by 40 points to Dirk Nowitzki (admittedly, that still hurts!) Harden took the Rockets to where no one has before since I've been watching religiously. No matter how much flak he cops from the media and fans of other teams, i'll always respect him forever for the fact he took it to the Warriors and never backed down from them.

Whilst I wouldn't mind seeing him finish his career and retire a Rocket as the clear #2 behind Olajuwon (if he retired today I still think he'd hold that place), a part of me hopes he asks out and chases a ring somewhere so his legacy after retirement can change.

If he were to want out, I agree with you that it will be next offseason after another failed season resulting in another woeful playoff exit. (this also comes back to the point I made earlier where I'm just not sure he cares about a championship, so may be perfectly content playing the next few years with his buddy and doing nothing in the Playoffs)

There's rumours that he has stated he'll ask for a trade if Westbrook is traded away from the Rockets.

[KillerLeft]

Originally Posted by ExRocketNewMav

I think I would be hard pressed to find on Clutchfans more than a handful of people who don't think/know deep down this was not a Morey move.

This was a 100% Tilman Fertitta move - he did not want to pay Chris Paul's monstrous contract. And Westbrook was a flashy and shiny object that attracts the attention span of idiots like Tilman.

This coincidentally was also the moment when I realised I can't defend Harden anymore from some of the hate he gets and I just had to learn to accept the fact that whilst he is a phenomenal and generational talent, he doesn't have that undying and ever burning desire to win at all costs. Since ultimately Tilman floated the idea to Harden about the CP3/Westbrook framework and Harden green lit the decision.

Westbrook is historically bad with regards to his distance shooting... I still to this day cannot fathom why we brought him to the team which sets records year after year for the amount of distance shooting they do.

I was a big Chris Paul fan well before he joined the Rockets. Knowing that the Warriors were not going to be in our way this past season, I was praying we'd give CP3 and Harden one more chance.

I know Chris Paul isn't a favourite (apologies for my Australian spelling) teammate of many in the league, but Harden not being able to make it work was a big red flag to the idea that he wants to win a Championship.

I'm blabbering here so in closing - this was 100% not a Morey move - and this has played a part in his departure regardless of what is said in the media (I am so, SO glad he left on his own terms and didn't wait until the day in the near future Tilman forced him out)

The Westbrook trade was, is and forever will be on the shoulders of Tilman Fertitta and James Harden. And it is a move which has not only destroyed the Rockets team in the short term, but has also torpedoed the franchise for at least the next decade AT BEST.

Thanks. This is pretty much what I figured, but it's nice to get it from someone who follows that team more religiously.

Westbrook could've worked if they let him play on the ball, but the whole world knew that wasn't happening, and why bring in a player who is only good on the ball when he's not better on the ball than the guy you have? I just don't get it.

[Thespiralgoeson]

Originally Posted by ExRocketNewMav

I was a big Chris Paul fan well before he joined the Rockets. Knowing that the Warriors were not going to be in our way this past season, I was praying we'd give CP3 and Harden one more chance.

I know Chris Paul isn't a favourite (apologies for my Australian spelling) teammate of many in the league, but Harden not being able to make it work was a big red flag to the idea that he wants to win a Championship.


The Westbrook trade was, is and forever will be on the shoulders of Tilman Fertitta and James Harden. And it is a move which has not only destroyed the Rockets team in the short term, but has also torpedoed the franchise for at least the next decade AT BEST.

Welcome! This is all really valuable insight. I really appreciate getting first-hand perspective from a Rockets fan what this all feels like.

The Westbrook trade looks absolutely horrible in retrospect. Hell, maybe it looked horrible at the time too. I for one didn't think it would work, but I thought it might at least be worth a shot. The way I figured the front office's thought process was something like,

"yeah, Harden and Paul were successful together, but it's only downhill from here. Paul is too old and is only going to get worse. That particular group has peaked, and bottom line, these two guys don't like each other and are flat-out DONE with each other. Westbrook probably isn't a great fit and probably won't work, however, this is the only thing of value we can get for the otherwise untradeable Chris Paul. Harden is over 30 and there really aren't any more big moves we can make, so this is our last shot. Westbrook is still ostensibly a superstar, so he and Westbrook will at least have a puncher's chance in the playoffs."

It was a total Hail Mary. This seems silly, but it honestly never occurred to me that Morey might not have wanted it and he was overruled on it. He's always been a "swing for the fences" guy, and I just figured this was the culmination of that.

Honestly CP3 for Westbrook in a vacuum isn't really a bad deal, even if it was a bad fit. What makes it horrible is losing all the draft picks. They're really in a horrible spot now. All the talks about trading Harden and tearing it all down seem to neglect that even tanking does no good now because the Rockets down have any of their own picks for the next four years. The Rockets are in a horrible spot indeed.

Yup - Tilman purchasing the team should make so many Mavs fans happy ha. The future looks horrendous for the Rockets and I shudder to think just how bad it will become when Tilman JR is the GM.

Honestly man, it kind of makes me sad. Like, yeah, it's good for my team. But I honestly don't like seeing any franchise with such a rich history hit bottom like this. It's bad for the NBA and bad for basketball. I might not root for them, but I want all the big franchises to at least be relevant. Whether its the Rockets, the Knicks, the Bulls, the Sixers, the Lakers or the Celtics... I want them to be relevant enough to actually be worth rooting against.

Also, I have a lot of sympathy for where Rockets fans are right now because I went through something very similar with the Mavs in the late 2000s. You see, before the miraculous and utterly unexpected title win in 2011, there was a few years there where it really seemed like the Mavs had missed their championship window and Dirk was destined to retire without a ring- unless he went somewhere else. That for me was the most unhappy time I've ever had as a Mavs fan. Yes, that was more unhappy than all the years of missing the playoffs or even outright tanking. At least when you're tanking there's always the hope of a brighter future. This though? Knowing that the best days are behind you, and knowing that the ultimate dream of a championship is no longer feasible but your team is still good enough to be teased with the idea, haunted by the still-recent failure. That's a horribly frustrating place to be as a fan.