Shaq may be going to Suns - Dallas-Mavs.com Forums

Simon2 · 02-05-2008, 07:07 PM

The Miami Heat have told Shaquille O'Neal and his representation that they should be prepared for him to be traded in the near future.

Barry Jackson of the Miami Herald reports that Phoenix has discussed sending forward Shawn Marion and point guard Marcus Banks to the Heat in return for O'Neal. Shaq's representatives said they have been made aware that discussions with Phoenix are serious and ongoing, but that a deal was not definite. Marion can opt out of his contract worth $17.1 million at the end of the season. And if he opts out, the Heat would then have substantial salary cap space this offseason, when potential free agents include Gilbert Arenas, Baron Davis, Elton Brand, Marion, Antawn Jamison, Ron Artest and Corey Maggette. Stay tuned. Feb. 5 - 6:30 pm et

http://www.rotoworld.com/content/Hea...t=NBA&hl=92980

jthig32 · 02-05-2008, 07:08 PM

I would welcome this trade with open arms. This would be a horrible idea for Phoenix.

Dortmund · 02-05-2008, 07:16 PM

Yeah.. would make more sense to come to dallas

MavsFanFinley · 02-05-2008, 07:21 PM

Why is it horrible? It gives the Suns another legit big man even though Shaq is on his last legs. Marcus Banks isn't even a factor.

Dirkadirkastan · 02-05-2008, 07:23 PM

Since when did major sports rumors get started by third graders?

Dirkgreatness · 02-05-2008, 07:29 PM

lol really? DO IT PHOENIX!

rabbitproof · 02-05-2008, 07:29 PM

Yeah right. Especially with Phoenix.

They....... don't like to spend money.

Windmill360 · 02-05-2008, 07:37 PM

i hope it happens.

Five-ofan · 02-05-2008, 07:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MavsFanFinley

Why is it horrible? It gives the Suns another legit big man even though Shaq is on his last legs. Marcus Banks isn't even a factor.

because marion is their second most important player and hes about 900 times better than shaq at the moment. not to mention hes a much better fit for their system.

Windmill360 · 02-05-2008, 07:48 PM

marion wont live without nash.

thereaper · 02-05-2008, 07:48 PM

twistaeffect2004 · 02-05-2008, 07:52 PM

I'd love to see Shaq try and keep up in their tempo.

Shoot, if the Heat can get Marion for Shaq... do it.

WayOutWest · 02-05-2008, 07:56 PM

The Suns better do something because the Championship window for the Nash led Suns is almost closed. Right now, despite their record, they are looking like the third or fourth best playoff team in the West.

Underdog · 02-05-2008, 08:07 PM

Shaq in the run 'n' gun???

When did Phoenix become Memphis? Maybe they could give us Marion for Damp & a case of Lonestar?

jthig32 · 02-05-2008, 08:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MavsFanFinley

Why is it horrible? It gives the Suns another legit big man even though Shaq is on his last legs. Marcus Banks isn't even a factor.

They'd have to change their entire offensive system.

Five-ofan · 02-05-2008, 08:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Windmill360°

marion wont live without nash.

uh marions numbers with and without nash are virtually identical with the exception of fg% for his career. hes the best cutter and one of the best finishers in the nba. this belief that he is somehow entirely a creation of nash that floats around is honestly one of the stupidest notions in the nba.

MavsFanFinley · 02-05-2008, 08:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jthig32

They'd have to change their entire offensive system.

I don't think it would be that drastic. They've mastered the run and gun system so it would crazy to see them have a legit post up player. I think those guys could adjust to that and run when they need to.

Tokey41 · 02-05-2008, 08:33 PM

Shaq would die somewhere between the second quarter and halftime of his first game as a Sun.

It doesn't make sense on any level for Phoenix. Like literally ANY level, their best chance to compete for a title is with Marion not Shaq, and if they wanted to go into rebuild mode they would be better off dumping Marions expiring contract after this season. How does Shaq manage to play any significant role in their system? He could be a huge tempo change off the bench maybe... but still, giving up Marion for him would be way too much for Phoenix.

TomThaMavsFan · 02-05-2008, 08:48 PM

anything that can slow down the suns and get shawn marion off their team is big thumbs up, come on phoenix and miami get er done

FINtastic · 02-05-2008, 09:03 PM

Gosh this would be such a great trade. Maybe the Spurs will think about trading Tim Duncan for a more athletic player or New Orleans will trade Chris Paul for someone with more experience. A man can dream, can't he?

Five-ofan · 02-05-2008, 09:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MavsFanFinley

I don't think it would be that drastic. They've mastered the run and gun system so it would crazy to see them have a legit post up player. I think those guys could adjust to that and run when they need to.

the reason they can run so well is marion. hes every bit as vital to that team as nash is.

skylive321 · 02-05-2008, 09:07 PM

two points:
1. Phoenix runs....
2. A lottttttt..
The fact is that nash likes to run a get the dish to his center. I don't see shaq running at nash' pace. And worst for them, is that they lose the only guy that fills up all stat sheets on their team. Go ahead phoenix, Trade the matrix... DO it.. Do it..

FINtastic · 02-05-2008, 09:10 PM

You think team defense is a problem for the Suns now? Watch what happens if you remove Marion. Yeah Shaq gives them a more traditional approach, but he's an average defender at best at this point in his career, and he would be surrounded by a bunch of other average to lousy defenders.

Btw, would Dan Tony even know how to a coach a traditional offense? Oh and Shaq can't play the minutes that Marion is giving you on a nightly basis. Who is going to fill those minutes? So many things wrong with this trade, I can't begin to list them all.

chumdawg · 02-05-2008, 09:45 PM

Phoenix also runs the pick-and-roll a lot, and that Nash-Stoudemire connection is every bit as important to their success as their run-and-gun is.

The "common knowledge" on Phoenix is that they can't win with their style. How could it possibly be a bad move, then, for them to move toward a more traditional approach?

Underdog · 02-05-2008, 09:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chumdawg

Phoenix also runs the pick-and-roll a lot, and that Nash-Stoudemire connection is every bit as important to their success as their run-and-gun is.

The "common knowledge" on Phoenix is that they can't win with their style. How could it possibly be a bad move, then, for them to move toward a more traditional approach?

Do they have the coach/team (even with Shaq) to play a more traditional style?

chumdawg · 02-05-2008, 09:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Underdog

Do they have the team/coach (even with Shaq) to play a more traditional style?

Sure, I'd say. Why not?

FINtastic · 02-05-2008, 09:49 PM

Hey, I don't think it would be a bad deal if they didn't have to give up one of their top 3 to do it. And the problem with their approach isn't the offensive end. It's the defensive end. Swapping Marion for Shaq doesn't do anything for them in that regard. It arguably makes them worse. I don't really see either where it makes them better on the offensive end. Having Shaq down there would crowd out Amare from where he does his best work.

chumdawg · 02-05-2008, 09:53 PM

Well, I don't know that we can say for sure whether it would make them better or worse, but it would sure make them more interesting!

I think that as far as they are concerned, there are issues with Marion above and beyond just what you get on the floor. So if they really do want to make this deal, it's probably a larger picture they are looking at.

FINtastic · 02-05-2008, 09:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chumdawg

Phoenix also runs the pick-and-roll a lot, and that Nash-Stoudemire connection is every bit as important to their success as their run-and-gun is.

The "common knowledge" on Phoenix is that they can't win with their style. How could it possibly be a bad move, then, for them to move toward a more traditional approach?

Sure the Nash-Stoudemire connection is great on the pick and roll. But who says it would be as great with Shaq. Honestly, Nash and Stoudemire on the pick-and-roll are about as good of a combination as you can get. Why would you then waste time on a Shaq pick-and-roll? The opportunity cost is that you give up the Stoudemire-Nash pick-and-roll. That's a net negative if you ask me.

And yeah, there is the chance that Stoudemire is on the bench or in foul trouble, but that's what you have Marion for. If you remember, when the Suns knocked us out in Game 6 a few years ago, Amare fouled out. With the way the series had gone, you would have thought that was enough for the Mavs to take control of the game. But the Suns plugged Marion into that pick-and-roll and never missed a beat.

Underdog · 02-05-2008, 09:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chumdawg

Sure, I'd say. Why not?

For some reason I just can't picture Nash slowing down enough for Shaq to catch up...

(and let's face it - if ever there was a master of the flashy-balls-to-the-wall-run-and-gun offense that D'Antoni runs, it's Steve Nash... I can't imagine him being comfortable at a slower pace...)

FINtastic · 02-05-2008, 09:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chumdawg

Well, I don't know that we can say for sure whether it would make them better or worse, but it would sure make them more interesting!

I think that as far as they are concerned, there are issues with Marion above and beyond just what you get on the floor. So if they really do want to make this deal, it's probably a larger picture they are looking at.

That's really the only reason I can figure out why they would make this trade. This would be a signal that they've absolutely had it with Marion's attitude. But it would also be delicious because it makes them worse on the court imo. It also doesn't do anything to help them in the future unless they are sure Marion is going to opt out and are trying to get something now instead of being stuck with nothing this offseason.

MFFL · 02-05-2008, 10:01 PM

Shaq doesn't need to run - he'll be the primary option if the fast break doesn't get a shot off.

I don't remember Kurt Thomas running that much and he was pretty effective

dude1394 · 02-05-2008, 10:05 PM

That's one big load of a trade idea to me. Makes absolutely no sense. So I guess shaq would be center (for about 10 mpg) and amare would be for the rest of the time and powerforward.

I'd like to see that one to be honest.

That still looks like a good deal for the mavs. It beats playing our 6'8 center out there.

FINtastic · 02-05-2008, 10:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MFFL

Shaq doesn't need to run - he'll be the primary option if the fast break doesn't get a shot off.

I don't remember Kurt Thomas running that much and he was pretty effective

Kurt Thomas was effective on the offensive end? He was alright but nothing spectactular. Heck, the guy only averaged 5 points his last year in Phoenix. Thomas was there mainly for his defense and rebounding. At this point in his career, Shaq probably can't provide what Thomas did on those fronts. So Shaq's main purpose becomes on the offensive end. I'm sure he'll still produce on that end but is it enough to even replace what you lost from Marion? I doubt it.

Janett_Reno · 02-05-2008, 10:16 PM

Marion is a mvp to Phx comparred to Shaq at Phx. No way Shaq can keep up with that running style and are they now going to walk it up and play half court? I knew it was talks of Shaq being traded and if i was Miami, i would want Marion instead of Shaq as he is on his last legs. They need a center but one that can run up and down. I read this but it is also hard to believe unless Phx is going to be a half court team.

Shaq could help a team that plays a slower pace. It is a risk because how much does he have left?

Underdog · 02-05-2008, 10:17 PM

I thought about it for a few minutes & discovered how this trade could make any sense:

The Suns keep beating the Lakers in the playoffs season after season in a shooting match... The Lakers acquire Gasol to beat the Suns at their own game... The Suns knee-jerk and go after Shaq to keep Gasol on the perimeter (only half-effective against his shot) & dominate him on the other end of the court...

It would be funny if neither team played each other in the playoffs and the Suns lost against the run-and-gun Warriors while the Lakers folded against the grind-it-out Spurs...

(actually, that scenario makes me glad we went after Bass rather than giving up key players to beat the Warriors in the off-chance that we'd meet them again in the playoffs...)

DarenG · 02-05-2008, 10:18 PM

If they get Shaq it will be to put a big body in the middle of the paint and to get some rebounds. They don't need Shaq's offense at all. Plus it would allow Amare to go back to his natural position. IMO Amare would be even a bigger beast playing PF. However, Shaq has nothing left IMO. The guy is washed up.

They are going to give up an All-Star Forward for a washed up player? Please do this deal Suns. It would blow up the team and make it one less team to compete with in the West.

chumdawg · 02-05-2008, 10:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Underdog

I thought about it for a few minutes & discovered how this trade could make any sense:

The Suns keep beating the Lakers in the playoffs season after season with a shooting match... The Lakers acquire Gasol to beat the Suns at their own game... The Suns knee-jerk and go after Shaq to keep Gasol on the perimeter (only half-effective against his shot) & dominate him on the other end of the court...

It would be funny if neither team played each other in the playoffs and the Suns lost against the run-and-gun Warriors while the Lakers folded against the grind-it-out Spurs...

(actually, that scenario makes me glad we went after Bass rather than giving up key players to beat the Warriors in the off-chance that we'd meet them again in the playoffs...)

Just remember that Shaq tore it up in the West when he was there. The West just couldn't beat him. And then when he went to the East, he bagged a title then, too.

If he's got nothing left, that changes things. But if he's anything like his former self...well, I'm just saying that it doesn't a matter a whole lot who the opponent is.

Which, come to think of it, is a reason I'd very much like to see him wear a Mavs uniform.

Underdog · 02-05-2008, 10:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chumdawg

Just remember that Shaq tore it up in the West when he was there. The West just couldn't beat him. And then when he went to the East, he bagged a title then, too.

If he's got nothing left, that changes things. But if he's anything like his former self...well, I'm just saying that it doesn't a matter a whole lot who the opponent is.

Which, come to think of it, is a reason I'd very much like to see him wear a Mavs uniform.

I think he'd be a much better fit on the Mavs than the Suns, no doubt (I thought that 3 years ago too & look what happened...)

Hell, Shaq doesn't even need to play at the level he used to if we don't have to give much up to acquire him... Too bad we can't top a Marion-for-Shaq deal (but then again, I read Marion-for-Gasol was also on the table at one time, so anything is possible!)

Getting Shaq also makes the idea of sending Diop as part of a package for Kidd a lot more realistic...

thereaper · 02-05-2008, 10:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chumdawg

Which, come to think of it, is a reason I'd very much like to see him wear a Mavs uniform.

So would you do a deal for Shaq if it cost you Josh?