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Old 02-27-2010, 08:57 PM   #161
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I concur, fine sir. This game was epic, as far as 4th quarter play/overtime goes. So much fun to watch!!!

However, heres the question: assuming we get Butler back without nagging injuries, does Kidd still have to score 11+ppg for the Mavs to beat the good teams? Will Terry continue to shoot well coming in behind a guy that can already score?
Well...the answer to can Kidd keep it up and will Terry disappear are central to the Mavs doing anything in the playoffs.

Dirk will be Dirk...if....IF Kidd, Butler, JT can play at a high level and IF Haywood/Damp can play at a high level, this team can compete with and beat anyone in a 7 game series.

But those are BIG ifs.
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Old 02-27-2010, 09:02 PM   #162
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Well...the answer to can Kidd keep it up and will Terry disappear are central to the Mavs doing anything in the playoffs.

Dirk will be Dirk...if....IF Kidd, Butler, JT can play at a high level and IF Haywood/Damp can play at a high level, this team can compete with and beat anyone in a 7 game series.

But those are BIG ifs.
My sentiments exactly. I think we can get to the conf. finals IF, out of Kidd/Dirk/Terry/Butler/Haywood, all but either Kidd or Terry score the ball well, we should be fine. However, if BOTH Kidd and Terry don't have good games, I think we are toast. To beat the Lakers, everyone has to play at the top of their game, every game.
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Old 02-27-2010, 09:48 PM   #163
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Watching that game again-- its one of the all time great games in Maverick history as well as Kidd history. Wow. Its not just the triple-double or Dirk's shooting or even the come-back (with the good guys winning)

Trading threes with Bibby, Kidd's ballsy play on Woodson, the swarming zone, the clutchness of Dirk and Kidd. It was an amazing game for the ages.
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Old 02-27-2010, 09:53 PM   #164
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Even though the discussion seems to be already a step further, I'd like to go back and point out that there seems to be a lot of discussion on the technical that Kidd drew on Woodson (video) in the blogosphere. Just to wrap it up.
TrueHoop had that Hollinger article, but also linked to this post from a Hawks-blogger, who then cited players, the coaches and other bloggers:
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On to the game's other talking point: Mike Woodson's fourth quarter technical. I've been critical of both the timing of and propensity for the head coach's technicals this season. This time, he got jobbed. Railroaded, even. The replays showed that Woodson had clearly gotten back* out of bounds before Kidd (himself with at least one foot out of bounds) made glancing contact with his outstretched left arm. The replays, though, only confirmed what was an obviously terrible call when witnessed live. Jason Kidd only came into contact with Mike Woodson because he, Kidd, veered suddenly to the left when approaching the Hawks' bench. Jason Kidd only came into contact with Mike Woodson because Kidd purposely dribbled the ball out of bounds.

*Oh, that one of Woodson's veteran guards had feet that quick.

It looked weird. It didn't look like a basketball play. It wasn't a basketball play. It was an attempt to con the refs and the refs fell for it. They waived the element of risk inherent in purposely dribbling the ball out of bounds in the pursuit of one point. If Kidd draws (or even creates) contact with a coach who's on the court, fair play to him. He didn't manage that but his failure didn't matter on a night where, otherwise, Kidd rarely failed.

It's a credit to Woodson (and his team) that he (and they) did not lose his (their) cool given the circumstances and the unjust penalty delivered upon him. It will be a discredit to every copycat who attempts to mimic this nationally televised bit of gamesmanship.

Jason Kidd:

"The coach is not supposed to be on the floor. You see that a lot in games. The NBA has so many rules, and there is a coaching box, and some of the coaches do stretch that box. For me, it's just a reaction. Make something happen. It was a big play for us."

Mike Woodson:

"He made a heck of a play. Jason Kidd is an All-Star, a Hall of Fame guard, and he’s had a hell of a career. He did what he had to do. I’ve got to take the hit on that. I shouldn’t have been on the floor."

Rick Carlisle:

"This is one for the ages. I don’t think there’s ever been a smarter player in this league than Jason Kidd."

Joe Johnson:

"It was a big deal. He just blatantly ran into our coach. I’ve never seen that.

Coaches are always on the floor, but nobody tries to run into them. I might have to try and do that."

Please don't.

The Human Highlight Blog:

Some call this veteran or savvy. We call it a "jerk" move.

Woodson was off the court, Kidd initiated contact, with a forearm shiver no less. It's not basketball, yet there it was.

Still, it had nothing to do with Kidd killing the Hawks with threes (3 of them in that run) or leading the charge of standing around in a zone while the Hawks continued to try to shoot over it with no success over and over again. And it certainly didn't take away from the statistically incredible night Kidd had. Bravo.

The Vent:

"They T'd Woody up. Okay fine, what's done is done. My question is simply this, WHY IN THE HELL WOULD MIKE WOODSON AGREE WITH THEM?

He should not be on record saying Kidd made a "heck of a play" and all the other nonsense he spewed after the game. He should be screaming at the top of his lungs that he made it off the court before Kidd came over and shoved him. Why is he going the opposite way? Whose side is he on? I've seen the replay, and it's not like there was overwhelming evidence against that theory. I'm blown away that he is going along with this Jason Kidd is a genius bullshit. Seriously, even if it turns out that there's indisputable evidence that you didn't make it off in time, you don't go into the post game press conference tipping your hat to him. You bitch and moan and act like Kidd just assaulted you like you were his wife. (yes, that was a cheap shot, but I'm mad)"

I get in less trouble for quoting the joke I lack the balls to make myself, don't I?

John Hollinger deems the play "unusually clever." I wonder if a look at the replay would change the good professor's mind.

Kurt Helin at Pro Basketball Talk:

Jason Kidd is a clever a%($hole.

At least his play was, drawing a technical on Atlanta coach Mike Woodson. Smart play. Good strategy. Got a technical free throw (made by Dirk), a point that helped send the game to overtime where his team went on to win.

Still an a*#$hole move.
Some strong opinions here on Kidd. I call that a savvy veteran move from Kidd. or, like Hollinger put it, "the veteran move to end all veteran moves". Maybe(I'm not sure) Woodson was already from the court when Kidd got him, but Kidd was clearly inbounds and not dribbling out of bounds when the contact happened. Either way, didn't matter, andFish already dismissed all the voices who said the refs got it wrong, or that Kidd did something wrong.
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Old 02-27-2010, 09:58 PM   #165
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Originally Posted by EricaLubarsky View Post
Watching that game again-- its one of the all time great games in Maverick history as well as Kidd history. Wow. Its not just the triple-double or Dirk's shooting or even the come-back (with the good guys winning)

Trading threes with Bibby, Kidd's ballsy play on Woodson, the swarming zone, the clutchness of Dirk and Kidd. It was an amazing game for the ages.
Repalicious.
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Old 02-27-2010, 10:43 PM   #166
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Originally Posted by EricaLubarsky View Post
Watching that game again-- its one of the all time great games in Maverick history as well as Kidd history. Wow. Its not just the triple-double or Dirk's shooting or even the come-back (with the good guys winning)

Trading threes with Bibby, Kidd's ballsy play on Woodson, the swarming zone, the clutchness of Dirk and Kidd. It was an amazing game for the ages.
...and it already has it's own youtube mix (from a db.com poster): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vUs7H...layer_embedded

I'm going to re-watch it now as well, although I might skip the second and third quarter.
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Old 02-28-2010, 12:15 AM   #167
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his feet may have been off the court but his gut sure as hell was still well inside the court and in the way. point is he didnt pay attention and shouldnt be on the court unless it is time out or between quarters.
period.
players "sell" fouls and other misconduct on the hardwood all the time... this really isnt all that different.
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Old 02-28-2010, 01:09 AM   #168
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Even though the discussion seems to be already a step further, I'd like to go back and point out that there seems to be a lot of discussion on the technical that Kidd drew on Woodson (video) in the blogosphere. Just to wrap it up.
TrueHoop had that Hollinger article, but also linked to this post from a Hawks-blogger, who then cited players, the coaches and other bloggers:


Some strong opinions here on Kidd. I call that a savvy veteran move from Kidd. or, like Hollinger put it, "the veteran move to end all veteran moves". Maybe(I'm not sure) Woodson was already from the court when Kidd got him, but Kidd was clearly inbounds and not dribbling out of bounds when the contact happened. Either way, didn't matter, andFish already dismissed all the voices who said the refs got it wrong, or that Kidd did something wrong.
The dudes comments would make more sense if they were correct. Jkiddo did not dribble the ball out of bounds, he extended his elbow to make contact with the coach who (if nba refs would actually call the game by the rules) should have been assessed a technical already...but hey...they only assess them by the book when they want to.

He was getting off the court but certainly he was close enough to be a factor. The hawks bugger can suck it.
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Old 02-28-2010, 01:32 AM   #169
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Just got back from Atlanta. Where to start? Oh Hotlanta, you truly are the dirty dirty.

1. Hawks fans are jerks and just plain rude. Twice we had to argue with a group over the location of THEIR seats. We were in our seats and group of six Hawks fans tried to take our seats from us. The first time was ok, but when they came back even more agitated and started shouting at us, I got very pissed off. I don't put up with that crap, I got the usher and they got shown to the exit. (Not actually sure they were kicked out, but they didn't bother us again.)

2. I don't think anyone at the game noticed Kidd's stats. Most were just floored by Dirk's 37 points. At one point some guy shouted something like, "Hey Dirk, it's about time you go to the bench, stop scoring dammit."
In fact it wasn't until my wife pointed out Kidd's stats that I even noticed what a game he had played.

3. I am pretty sure the girls sitting next to us were strippers. They smelled of Love's "Baby Soft", looked kinda skanky, and were women from Atlanta, so probably strippers.

4. Lenox Square Mall is still way overpriced, and when did Patty La'Belle get her own line of pillowtop comforters?

5. Celebrity sightings? You Betcha!!! While Jay-z had a concert the next night, he didn't attend the game. However I am pretty sure I saw his manicurist and the guy who played Benson (same guy). Also in attendance none other than Kool (and the Gang wasn't present, as gangs aren't allowed in Phillips Arena) and his beautiful date Sheila E.

6. The strippers and their boyfriends (pimps?) left after the fourth quarter. Guess they knew something the rest of us didn't. Shame they missed the offensive might of the Hawks. In fact, when Joe Johnson connected with those first overtime points, with a minute left, the crowd roared with jubilation. In fact all us Mavs fans still in the building gave a standing ovation.

Overall. It was a fun experience and, with the stadium nearly filled to two thirds capacity, it was almost like being at an actual game.
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Old 03-04-2010, 12:13 AM   #170
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I watched the Hawks-Mavs game again this morning, apart from the epic play by Kidd, Dirk and Jet I also noticed how good Marion looked out there. Guy was jumping like crazy out there, he had about 5 dunks in that game. Think about that for a second, 5 dunks in one game...

Marion Alley Oop Dunk Shot: Made (2 PTS) Assist: Kidd (1 AST) 10:20
[DAL 6-4


Marion Running Dunk Shot: Made (4 PTS) Assist: Nowitzki (1 AST) 07:23
[DAL 11-12]


Marion Running Dunk Shot: Made (6 PTS) Assist: Terry (1 AST) 02:45
[DAL 23-18


Marion Running Dunk Shot: Made (10 PTS) Assist: Terry (3 AST) 02:11
[DAL 27-18]


Marion Running Dunk Shot: Made (14 PTS) Assist: Terry (6 AST) 11:35
[DAL 67-76]
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