Nash Against War - Dallas-Mavs.com Forums

MavsFanFinley · 02-07-2003, 09:24 PM

I'll be here for a few more minutes then it's out to dinner with friends. If someone wants me to put this in the Lounge, let me know and I'll do it before I leave. But, I figured it involved a Maverick, so I put it here first.

Steve speaks out

Mavericks' star voices opposition to war in Iraq

By John Hollinger, SI.com

ATLANTA -- NBA All-Star Game media days are usually filled with pithy quotes and clichés, but Dallas Mavericks guard Steve Nash veered wildly off the standard course Friday by using the occasion to speak out against war in Iraq.

Wearing a T-shirt that said "No war -- Shoot for peace," the Canadian celebrated his 29th birthday by making his position perfectly clear.

"I believe that us going to war would be a mistake," he said. "Being a humanitarian, I think that war is wrong in 99.9 percent of all cases. I think it has much more to do with oil or some sort of distraction, because I don't feel as though we should be worrying about Iraq."

Nash said he felt that U.N. weapons inspectors should be allowed to complete their mission before any further action is taken, and that the United States in particular had provided insufficient evidence to warrant an attack.

"I think that Saddam Hussein is a crazy dictator and in some ways a scary person, but I don't think he's threatening us at this point in time," he said. "We haven't found any nuclear weapons -- no matter what anyone says -- and that process is still under way. Until that's finished and decided I don't think that war is acceptable."

He also blamed the media for beating the war drum. "I think a lot of what we hear in the news is misleading and flat-out false, so I think it's important for us to think deeper and find out what is really going on."

Nash did allow that he's still learning more about the situation in Iraq, and he encouraged others to do the same. "I'm still trying to educate myself ... and I think people should should just go out and try to educate themselves and learn so they can make an informed decision."

He then reiterated his position that "unfortunately, this is more about oil than it is about nuclear weapons."

seelenjaeger · 02-07-2003, 09:54 PM

courageous approach ...

anyone holding the bet that stern will dish out his political position by suspending Nash?

kepper · 02-07-2003, 10:05 PM

no way!! stern will act like it was never said. nashty is a very smart guy and he made sure that his comments were undertoned. by the way has anyone read the book about steve nash? the road to the nba <u>Text</u>

MavKikiNYC · 02-07-2003, 10:10 PM

Screw Nash. What a punk idiot. Like he has any qualification whatsoever to be pontificating on geopolitical issues. What a freakin' dolt.

Trade his long-haired, tree-huggin', terrorist-coddlin', hippy ass back to Hoser-ville.

I'm done with you already, boy. You are DEAD to me.

I actually thought he'd turn out to be a pothead, but this is just as bad.

jayC · 02-07-2003, 10:13 PM

Over reacting a bit. We watch him because he plays basketball, not because he is against war.

MavKikiNYC · 02-07-2003, 10:18 PM

And he has a platform to talk about basketball, not to pop off on issues that he himself admits to being undereducated on.

Highly, grossly irresponsible of him.

He doesn't have time to be worrying about things he's not intelligent enough or informed enough to understand.

He ought to be figuring out how to tighten up his loose-assed perimeter defense.

Trade him for a real man point guard already, I say.

dude1394 · 02-07-2003, 10:19 PM

Millionaire basketball players, actors and singers are not exactly on my list of informed political analysts. Everyone is welcome to their opinion, idiotic or not.

Rhylan · 02-07-2003, 10:19 PM

Ahh, he's just uneducated on the entire situation and overly idealistic. Big deal. I disagree with him. Big deal. I still like the guy. Most celebrities and athletes are too insulated to really go beyond the "let's all love each other" level anyway.

Seleen, I don't know what country you think this is, but there's nothing all that courageous about stating an opinion held by 40% of Americans. It's his opinion, he can state it. You act like this is Orwell's 1984 or something over here.

Bookit · 02-07-2003, 10:25 PM

I thought Nash was smarter than that. Keep your mouth shut Nash. Make your teamates better and shut your mouth. I really didn't need to know that about him. Typical Canadian response though. Maybe Nash should sit in some classified meetings before he concludes that Saddam isn't a threat.

OzMavs · 02-07-2003, 10:29 PM

Nash is entitled to his opinion. Just as we all are. Whether he is right or wrong who knows? I disagree with what he has to say, but I will not disregard his opinion. Why should sports people be forced to keep their mouth shut? This is what I like about Nash, he stands up for what he believes in.

FlyinGK22 · 02-07-2003, 10:30 PM

stern is a cool guy. hes no bud selig. courageous on nash's part tho. im proud of him.

dude1394 · 02-07-2003, 10:33 PM

<< Ahh, he's just uneducated on the entire situation and overly idealistic. Big deal. I disagree with him. Big deal. I still like the guy. Most celebrities and athletes are too insulated to really go beyond the "let's all love each other" level anyway.

Seleen, I don't know what country you think this is, but there's nothing all that courageous about stating an opinion held by 40% of Americans. It's his opinion, he can state it. You act like this is Orwell's 1984 or something over here. >>

I don't know why you are trying to impugn seleens free speech??? Stern has just as much "right" to discipline nash for saying this as he would for that coach in denver making racist comments. Free speech is free speech isn't it?? Not really if it reflects poorly on your business. Haven't you taken sensitivity training??

Chris · 02-07-2003, 10:39 PM

This isn't really surprising to hear from Steve, who apparently doesn't do big advertising campaigns because he was profoundly influenced by Naomi Klein's <u>No Logo</u>, which decries corporate globalization and that sort of thing. I don't particularly agree with Steve in this case, but I think some of the responses here are pretty scary. Maybe you disagree with him, but can you really fault a guy for using a platform that, for whatever reason, he holds to speak out against a perceived injustice. Maybe it's not his place, and his opinion certainly isn't going to sway me, but it's not like he's doing anything wrong by speaking his mind. I wish more celebrities would try to educate themselves about this kind of issue; if they're the only people who we are going to pay attention to, they might as well try to have something worthwhile to say.

P.S. MavsKikiNYC, Bookit, I don't think Nash's political opinions, voiced or not, are going to affect his on court play, and it's pretty ridiculous for you to be bashing a guy's play while he is at the All Star Game, especially considering he's clearly one of the hardest working players in the NBA.

Bookit · 02-07-2003, 10:40 PM

Why should sports people be forced to keep their mouth shut?

Because Nash entertains people who might be also be passionate with the exact opposite views. Dumb on his part. I own a small business. When people come in to my store I don't tell them my religious views or my political views unless I know for a fact that we have the exact same views! George Clooney came out and said that he is against all guns and ripped Charlton Heston. Since I am an avid hunter and shoot guns it offended me somewhat. I won't watch his movies now. If he would have kept his personal views to himself I would still be paying to see him entertain. Nash screwed up.

OzMavs · 02-07-2003, 10:46 PM

I guess the media is to blame. But, don't you admit it is refreshing to hear a sports person answer a question in a forthright nature? Ok, so he did go a little further than what might be considered appropriate:

He then reiterated his position that "unfortunately, this is more about oil than it is about nuclear weapons."

kepper · 02-07-2003, 10:51 PM

dont you think its entertaining to see a athlete speak about current events. nash speaking his mind is not going to change what is already going to happen. i would rather have my child listen to a educated athlete expressing his opinon in a educated fasion then a multi-millionaire teen complain about not geting the ball enough. thats the way i see it.

dude1394 · 02-07-2003, 10:53 PM

Entertainment people have to be willing to take less popularity and revenue if they feel so "strongly" about an issue. If you voice your opinion in a public forum you'd better be ready for folks not liking it very much.

My list of entertainers I won't watch, listen to or in anyway support with my dollars has gotten quite long actually.

Alec Baldwin, Woody Allen, Ben and Jerry's, Georgy Clooney(I really like him too, too bad), Barbara Streisand, Oliver Stone...I actually have a list but can't recall it.

In other words voicing opinions doesn't mean you get off scott free, you MAY have to pay a price for it, their call however.

MavKikiNYC · 02-07-2003, 11:02 PM

<< Maybe you disagree with him, but can you really fault a guy for using a platform that, for whatever reason, he holds to speak out against a perceived injustice. >>

Uhmm...yes, you can. Examples? Reggie White's homophobic comments were way out of line, even though he was speaking about something that was incongruent with his own personal perception of morality. He should NOT have used his visibility as a football player to condemn a group who could not engage him in a public debate. Same goes for Jeremy Shockey sounding off earlier this year on the Howard Stern show--wrong, inexcusably wrong.

John Rocker gave his social commentary on the desirability of living in New York. Did he have the RIGHT to do it? Yes. Was it appropritate? No. Big difference.

Why do atheltes like Nash think that it's their right to comment publically on highly sesntive issues like this? For an issue like this, it's not enough just to have an opinion and be willing to babble it out; it's not 'courageous' just to be willing to exploit one's high degree of visibility to talk about something he doesn't even know about. The quotes didn't even show him to be qualifying his opinion--he categorically gave an uninformed opinion.

Things I WOULD be interested in hearing Nash comment on, about which he would have special knowledge, but about which he won't be NEARLY so courageous:

--Should Cuban extend Nellie's contract now rather than let him dangle?

--Should the Mavs have pursued a more defensive-oriented point guard to back him (Nash) up, instead of NVE?

--To what extent does he perceive that the Mavericks' frontcourt is holding the team back?

--Would Donnie Nelson REALLY make a good head coach? Does the team function better under Big Whistle, Dell, or Little Whistle?

--Does Nash that he may have gotten any undue attention because he's a successful white player playing a position dominated by African-American players? Has he experienced any resentment from teammates or opponents?

--Who is The Man, the Go-To Guy on the Mavericks? Is it Dirk? If it's not, why not? Was it awkward to watch the team transition from looking to Finley as the leader to looking to Dirk?

--Why, in Steve's opinion, didn't Fin make the All-Star team this year? Does Nash feel guilty about making the team when his just-as-deserving teammmate didn't? Does he think that the benefited unjustly for being an international player? Did Nash consider stepping aside to let John Stockton play in what may be his final season? If not, why not?

--Does Nash think that Yao Ming deserved to start over Shaq?

--Does Nash think that Vince Carter should've stepped aside and let Michael Jordan start?

THESE are things that Nash would have an special, informed perspective about, but he damned sure won't have the 'courage' to address.

It's one thing for politicians with access to information that the general public might not have, or academics with special knowledge of a region and culture and history to speak out in an attempt to influence public opinion. I may disagree with them vehemently, but at least they're coming from an informed perspective.

I've had some reservations about his oncourt decision-making this year and his off-court focus and dedication last year, but have held back criticism to give him the benefit of the doubt.

I certainly have HUGE issues with his off-court decision making on the basis of these statements. And fair or not, I probably won't be giving him the benfit of the doubt anymore, on- or off-the-court. I now see him as just another dumb jock, intoxicated by modest success, and burdened by an over-inflated sense of importance. I really think he would be better off now playing in Toronto.

Bookit · 02-07-2003, 11:04 PM

Dude, our lists are somewhat similar. You might want to add Susan Sarandon and Jessica Lange to your list.[img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-happy.gif[/img]

Evilmav2 · 02-07-2003, 11:05 PM

Stupid, stupid Nash... I love the guy, but he doesn't need to be pontificating about something like this.

Steve Nash: You are paid to play basketball, not to pontificate. If you set yourself alongside the Sean Penn's and Barbara Streisand's of the world you make yourself look like a fool. You don't want to be remembered for your dumb T-shirt and ill-founded views more than for your inspired offensive basketball play. That was a really dumb move...

i.liek.basketball · 02-07-2003, 11:20 PM

what if nash came out sporting an anti sadam shirt or something pro war, and voiced his opinions on the situation(educated or not) would you guys be making such a big fuss?

Bookit · 02-07-2003, 11:22 PM

What if Cuban is extremely passionate with the exact opposite views as Nash. Who knows, when a blockbuster trade involving Nash is purposed, Cuban just might be more apt to pull the trigger now that Nash's views are public. Is Nash this stupid? I would hope that Finley and Nowitzki will keep their mouths shut.

i.liek.basketball · 02-07-2003, 11:24 PM

i want to say im proud of nash. its the principle of the thing. he admits hes not educated enough and encourages education. he says give the inspectors more time. i dontthink anyone wants to jump into war although it is good for the olde economy. quit calling nash stupid, i bet alot of peopl ewould give an arm and a leg to be able to do what he does. well not the shooting arm, a leg for that matter.

southern_sweets · 02-07-2003, 11:28 PM

<< What if Cuban is extremely passionate with the exact opposite views as Nash. Who knows, when a blockbuster trade involving Nash is purposed, Cuban just might be more apt to pull the trigger now that Nash's views are public. Is Nash this stupid? I would hope that Finley and Nowitzki will keep their mouths shut. >>

Not likely. Cuban has a history of being very tolorant of his players and employees having whatever views they want to have, political, religious, whatever. Also, Cuban once said in an interview that his biggest fear or phobia is guns so it seems there's a soft spot there. Not that that's necessarily a bad thing. Cuban isn't an ex Marine of something so I can't see Nash's statement to impact anything Mark does.

MavKikiNYC · 02-07-2003, 11:29 PM

<< what if nash came out sporting an anti sadam shirt or something pro war, and voiced his opinions on the situation(educated or not) would you guys be making such a big fuss? >>

Wouldn't be making a fuss, but I wouldn't think it was appropriate either. I'd think he shouldn't be discussing things publically as a pro basketball player that extend beyond his experience, insight and expertise as a pro basketball player.

Epitome22 · 02-07-2003, 11:30 PM

My god the responses in this thread are scary. I'm pretty much used to the criticism of war and American global foreign policy around school so it's surprising to see how many people are getting bent out of shape over such a non threatening issue, what backward people. I've seriously lost some respect for some of the people in here. And for whatever it's worth, what did you expect? Nash has a maine of hair longer than my girlfriends' he's into music like Radiohead, Dead Prez, Bjork and such and he's from Canada. And you're surprised he would be the type that would have issues with going to war?

Get a life people

i.liek.basketball · 02-07-2003, 11:32 PM

you've no ripcord... you've no ripcord

kepper · 02-07-2003, 11:37 PM

<< What if Cuban is extremely passionate with the exact opposite views as Nash. Who knows, when a blockbuster trade involving Nash is purposed, Cuban just might be more apt to pull the trigger now that Nash's views are public. Is Nash this stupid? I would hope that Finley and Nowitzki will keep their mouths shut. >>

if your post is true i think we are in big trouble. but sorry there is no way anybody is that stupid!!
plus who says this topic is that touchy. would all you nash bashers be up in arms if it were another subject. what if nash came out with a "shooting to find osama!" i think everyone of you that is telling nash to keep his mouth shut would be backing nash for steping up and saying what all of americe is thinking. we can talk about the government and political topics all day but were here to talk mavs,right? are we even sure nash brought up the subject (other then the t-shirt) what if he was provoked by the reporter.

MavKikiNYC · 02-07-2003, 11:38 PM

Backward? lol. Right.

Wait..you don't admire the courage it takes to voice an opinion about Nash's right to express an opinion?

Bent out of shape? Yeah. I'm pretty disgusted that at a time when the country is about to go to war, and at a time when the country is under an high security alert due to the threat of international terrorism, and at a time when I have to weigh the risk of taking the subway or going to a public event, some know-nothing jock takes the mike and defames the motivations of the country's political leaders; basically calls George Bush and Colin Powell and Donald Rumsfeld liars, even though he admits he doesn't really know what he's talking about; and simplifies to the point of gross distortion the issues surrounding what is in all likelihood about to cost the lives of soldiers and civilians.

Is THAT something to get 'bent out of shape' about, or not?

Nellie · 02-07-2003, 11:44 PM

My opinion on anti-war t-shirts:

The only reason anybody has the choice to wear that t-shirt is because soldiers before them have fought for that freedom to do so. Ungreatful irony.

Evilmav2 · 02-07-2003, 11:45 PM

"We Agree With epitome! Good going Nash! The People need to Educate themselves about Bush's Evil War for Oil!

Bookit · 02-07-2003, 11:52 PM

lol.

turbo.mav · 02-07-2003, 11:58 PM

n/m

MavsFanFinley · 02-08-2003, 12:19 AM

I thought this would draw some responses, but whoa!!

I don't agree with Nash's comments. I don't agree with the forum he chose to voice his beliefs. If he had called a press conference or took part in some anti-war march, I wouldn't have a problem with it so much.

He chose a poor time to voice something of this magnitude.

kepper · 02-08-2003, 12:36 AM

NYC,
GETTING BENT OUT OF SHAPE ABOUT WHAT A PERSON SAYS IS CRAZY. JUST BECAUSE A DALLAS MAV SAID SOMETHING ABOUT A CURRENT EVENT DOES NOT MEAN HE HAS CHANGED THE COURSE OF HISTORY. PLUS YOUR COMPLAINING ABOUT PEOPLE BEING KILLED BUT YET THAT IS EXACTLY WHAT NASH DOES NOT WANT. WAR!! SHOOTING FOR PEACE. NOT SHOOTING FOR WAR. LETS TRY TO STICK TO MAVS TALK. REMEMBER EVERYBODY.. THE TRADES,COMPLAINTS,GAME SCENERIOS ARE ALL IRRELEVANT. I DONT THINK NELSON,CUBAN OR THE PRESIDENT OF THE US COMES TO THIS WEB AND SAYS "AH THAT GUY HAS A GOOD POINT,LET ME CALL THAT PERSON" THIS IS SUPPOSED TO BE FOR FUN! NOT TO TRY AND WIN A DEBATE CONTEST!!

dude1394 · 02-08-2003, 12:45 AM

<< what if nash came out sporting an anti sadam shirt or something pro war, and voiced his opinions on the situation(educated or not) would you guys be making such a big fuss? >>

Nope... But that's MY freedom of speech and association.

i.liek.basketball · 02-08-2003, 12:45 AM

i kinda want to agree with you, but i couldnt read it

Evilmav2 · 02-08-2003, 12:48 AM

PLEASE DON"T POST IN ALLCAPS ALL THE TIME!!!!! IT DOESN'T MAKE YOUR POSTS MORE INTELLIGENT! IT JUST MAKES IT LOOK LIKE YOU ARE YELLING STUPID SHIT!!!!!!

dude1394 · 02-08-2003, 12:48 AM

<< i want to say im proud of nash. its the principle of the thing. he admits hes not educated enough and encourages education. he says give the inspectors more time. i dontthink anyone wants to jump into war although it is good for the olde economy. quit calling nash stupid, i bet alot of peopl ewould give an arm and a leg to be able to do what he does. well not the shooting arm, a leg for that matter. >>

Now I'm going to call YOU stupid. Since when is WAR good for the economy. You are reading the nytimes editorial page or something. What in the world do you think has the stock-market so depressed. If war were so GOOD for the economy you would see hiring and the market booming as everyone got "ready" for it. This is why folks like nash and you shouldn't voice opinions on this since you don't know what you are talking about.

kepper · 02-08-2003, 12:54 AM

<< PLEASE DON"T POST IN ALLCAPS ALL THE TIME!!!!! IT DOESN'T MAKE YOUR POSTS MORE INTELLIGENT! IT JUST MAKES IT LOOK LIKE YOU ARE YELLING STUPID SHIT!!!!!! >>

be careful EVILMAV2 you might make the gods angry! oh wait a minute, you think your one![img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-wink.gif[/img][img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-tongue.gif[/img][img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-cool.gif[/img][img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-disgusted.gif[/img][img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-frown.gif[/img][img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-confused.gif[/img]