Brad Miller gets offer sheet from Jazz - Dallas-Mavs.com Forums

sturm und drang · 07-21-2003, 03:48 PM

Jazz offer Brad Miller 6-year deal

Indy Star report
July 21, 2003

Free-agent center Brad Miller's future in the NBA will become clearer in the next 48 hours.

Miller, an Eastern Conference All-Star with the Indiana Pacers last season, has been offered a six-year contract worth about $52 million from the Utah Jazz.

"We're talking to people, and we're hoping to come to a resolution soon," said Mark Bartelstein, Miller's Chicago-based agent.

The Pacers have been attempting to clear room to re-sign Miller, but likely will not have enough to match Utah's offer that averages $8.7 million a year. Miller made $5.3 million last season.

Denver also is interested in Miller, having interviewed him on Friday and Saturday.

The Jazz have become a major player by virtue of John Stockton's retirement and Karl Malone's departure to the Los Angeles Lakers. Malone made $19.5 million and Stockton about $8 million last season.

MavKikiNYC · 07-21-2003, 07:26 PM

Can the Mavericks do a sign-and-trade with Indiana now?

mavsfanforever · 07-21-2003, 08:46 PM

Indiana cannot offer him that. Mavs can do a sign and trade but are you interested in giving up Nick or Nash in return. I do not mind as long as we get rid of Tariq's contract but I am sure Nellie's system works better in a offensive backcourt.

one long blue sock · 07-21-2003, 09:14 PM

If they were to trade Nick, they would get somebody better then Miller.

When Raef was with the Nuggets he averaged 14, 9, and 2.
But even when Miller was in the EAST with Indiana it was 13, 8, and .5

Who is to say that Brad Miller would even perform up to Raef's level. When Raef was the 2nd option, he played much better then Miller does now.

And if you want an inside presence on defense, Raef brings alot more blocks then Miller. (2 to .5)

kg_veteran · 07-21-2003, 09:32 PM

If they were to trade Nick, they would get somebody better then Miller.

Really? Who?

When Raef was with the Nuggets he averaged 14, 9, and 2.
But even when Miller was in the EAST with Indiana it was 13, 8, and .5

Actually, try 14/7.4.

Miller has averaged over 8 boards a game the past 3 seasons. Raef, far less than that.

Miller has enough size and strength to actually defend the post on a regular basis, something Raef can't claim.

Miller is tough-minded and believes that he can be an enforcer, something Raef has professed he will never be.

I think Miller could teach Raef a few things.

If they offer some package involving NVE on our end and Miller on theirs, we have to do it.

Who is to say that Brad Miller would even perform up to Raef's level. When Raef was the 2nd option, he played much better then Miller does now.

Have you watched the two of them play? Miller's the better post defender. Miller's the better post scorer. Miller's the better passer. Miller's the better rebounder. Raef can block shots and shoot 3 pointers better. That's it. As Bayliss pointed out, don't we have enough blocks with Shawn and 3s with our perimeter guys?

Also, if Miller had been the 2nd option in Denver, who's to say what he might have done? He wasn't the second option in Indy last year.

And if you want an inside presence on defense, Raef brings alot more blocks then Miller. (2 to .5)

If you want more blocks, sure. If you want someone who can defend the post and actually hold position, it's easily Miller.

one long blue sock · 07-21-2003, 09:41 PM

Well maybe Miller is better then Raef, but is he so much better then Raef that you are willing to give up NVE.

Hitman · 07-21-2003, 09:44 PM

Shockingly, I agree with everything KG says!

Go get Miller! People love to compare white 7 footers, but the fact is that Raef and Miller are no more similar than Olokowandi and Mourning.

Miller is a banger, and has the potential to at least bring a Divac style post defense to our team, and a garbage man type of offense. He is tough as nails, and ala Divac and Sabonis gets under the skin of Shaq--which is all you can really hope for.

Mavs_Rule2003 · 07-21-2003, 10:20 PM

Maybe he is a banger, but is he worth giving up NVE? [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-confused.gif[/img]

FilthyFinMavs · 07-21-2003, 10:48 PM

BEing that Pacers could lose him maybe we can get a even better deal. IT is going to have to involve one of our pgs of course and i'm sure Chroshere will be a part of it but maybe we can get a Artest or a Bender to come in the deal.

Hitman · 07-21-2003, 10:48 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by: Mavs_Rule2003
Maybe he is a banger, but is he worth giving up NVE? [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-confused.gif[/img]

In my opinion....

Yes.

Brad Miller brings a lot of what the Mavs lack to the table. Nick, great as he may be when he is hot, brings a lot of what we really don't need.

OutletPass · 07-21-2003, 11:02 PM

Let us not forget what Miller can also bring...

He's in the top 3 in the NBA in flagrant fouls last time I checked....

He doesn't play "Matador Defense"...He brings a hammer and lunch pail to work.

I'd only give up NVE for him if we could get a Harrington, Artest or Bender in return. Obviously, our package would have to be more than NVE...so we have some possibilities....but don't know that Indiana would take TAW, ESCh, or Aj in return.....

on the other hand, utah's offer doesn't give Indiana a lot of leverage in dealing with us.

it's either lose him completely or get something in return.

but miller has to agree to the S&T in the first place, so there's lots of variables at work...

He may be one of the smarter FA's...letting the hub bub subside and waiting on teams that get desparate...not a bad strategy....there's always love somewhere for a 7 footer who plays the 5 at a fairly skilled level. Say what you want, compare him to others, but bottomline, he's not a stiff...as KG pointed out...he can score, rebound, pass well and play some hard D.

he is getting about $52 million in love offers already.

MFFL · 07-21-2003, 11:09 PM

I wouldn't mind getting Miller (although I think he is only a minor upgrade) but I'm not willing to give up NVE for him.

Miller feels like a slightly more talented Esch. Since Esch can't get any PT, then why would Miller?

Hitman · 07-21-2003, 11:16 PM

OP,

Though I am not Larry, I can 99% tell you we are not getting Artest or Harrington in the deal. They are too valuable to the Pacers and their idealogy. If we give the Nick and Bradley, we will get Bender or Croshere in return.

Personally, I would take either one. Croshere is a shooter who would fit in well with our style of play. Bender is 7 feet and young. Bottom line is we would be giving up Bradley, which is not that big of a loss and Nick, who seems like a big loss, but when you truly think about it, is not that big of a loss.

MavsFanFinley · 07-21-2003, 11:53 PM

edit

kg_veteran · 07-22-2003, 09:49 AM

I wouldn't mind getting Miller (although I think he is only a minor upgrade) but I'm not willing to give up NVE for him.

I take this to mean you want to keep Van Exel and have no desire to trade him. I'll pose the same question to you that I posed to the sock man: Who are they going to receive in trade that's better than Miller?

Miller feels like a slightly more talented Esch. Since Esch can't get any PT, then why would Miller?

Ouch. You can't be serious with this one. The ONLY thing they have in common is that both are white and both foul hard.

Evilmav2 · 07-22-2003, 10:08 AM

Quote:

Miller feels like a slightly more talented Esch. Since Esch can't get any PT, then why would Miller?

Ouch. You can't be serious with this one. The ONLY thing they have in common is that both are white and both foul hard.

Respectfully KG, I have long thought that Evan and Brad have a lot of similarities in their games and talent levels. I had to watch these two battlers repeatedly bruise my Hoosiers during their Big 10 careers, and everything I saw then and since has convinced me they are really, pretty similarly talented...

They are both strong, committed rebounders who have pretty jump-shooting and passing skills. They are also both very physical defenders, who make up for their lack of athleticism and length with gamesmanship and toughness. Offensively, Evan is a bit more accomplished playing with his back to the basket, and of course Miller's little 12 foot jumper has been his bread and butter in the league, but I think that neither player has a significantly greater offensive ability than the other...

If Esch can ever shake off his unfortunate injury problems, I think a lot of Mavs fans will be surprised to discover just what a solid, strong player he can be for us...

MavKikiNYC · 07-22-2003, 10:24 AM

Respectfully disagree, Emav.

I had the displeasure of watching Esch plod up and down the court with the Nets, and he looks to be at least a couple of skill levels below Miller. The injuries have almost certainly held back his development, but he looked to be bringing less to the table from the start.

Mavericks shouldn't be counting on Esch for anything other than eventual cap space.

Big Boy Laroux · 07-22-2003, 11:24 AM

honestly, i think a frontcourt of miller and raef, with bradley coming off the bench, is VERY formidable. raef is a good shot-blocker, but he gets very few of those blocks playing straight up on his man. most of his blocks are due to weak side help. miller is a pretty good post defender. he bodies up his man, his man tries to shoot, his man gets rejected by raef or shawn. i like it.

kg_veteran · 07-22-2003, 11:57 AM

Evil - I suppose I can see the similarities that you point out. Evan does rebound well when he actually plays. I just think that Miller's a far superior scorer (I've never seen Evan score in the post -- heck, I've rarely seen him score), passer, and offensive player. Defensively, I like Evan's effort, but I think Miller is a bit more talented in that area as well. Just my opinion.

I agree with BBL - if you could rotate Miller, Bradley, and LaFrentz up front, it oughtta be pretty formidable. For an idea as to how we could do that, see my post in the General Mavs forum regarding a trade with Indy.

Evilmav2 · 07-22-2003, 12:19 PM

Maybe my picture of Esch is still a bit skewed by my fond memories of his Northwestern days, but only time, and maybe a bit of luck with his injuries, will tell...

Also, I absolutely agree with y'all that a stable of Miller, Raef, and Bradley would be a very strong unit. As BBL said, Miller is just the kind of complimentary, hard-nosed, individual defender that could really free Raef and Bradley to challenge shots from the weekside and really lock down our 3 second lane...

Ahhh... Dreams, dreams, dreams...

jayC · 07-22-2003, 12:28 PM

The bottom line is that with all of our centers you have this potential feeling if they have a good game they will do this, this and then this. But we can't count on the production of our conglomerate of spares. I am sorry but I take the guy with slightly less talent but the one who works harder at it. Would you want to work with underachievers or overachievers Id rather work with overachievers and I am sure the mavs feel the same way.