PGT: Not Entirely Clear if Mavs Tried Hard - Dallas-Mavs.com Forums

nowhereman · 01-10-2013, 01:05 AM

Wow. The hits keep coming. Mavs just had a look on their face that they were gonna lose. And Dirk had so much disdain on his face when he reentered in the fourth. This team is really not having fun right now.

Its been a long time since I've seen a Mavs team with such low confidence and such bad chemistry. It's like the last Avery year, but without the playoffs.

adonis · 01-10-2013, 01:06 AM

Team gave a lot of effort tonight. Seemed like maybe Rick got a call from Cubes to do the tank.

j0Shi · 01-10-2013, 01:09 AM

Carlisle's inability to adjust strikes again. This time overplayed Carter badly.

Not the whole story why we lost, but his shot selection was so bad that there is almost no excuse that he was out there in the 4th.

nowhereman · 01-10-2013, 01:11 AM

Game turned when Clips took Griffin out in the third. LAC really started pushing it, instead of working to Griffin in the low block where the Mavs could send someone over to double. Props to VDN for leaving in Turiaf as well in the fourth.

Kaman looked terrible, especially in the fourth. Roddy looked worse. Mayo was the invisible man again.

Brand and Marion looked fine. Collison looked great when going for himself. Not so much when facilitating.

Dirk's clearly not right, and probably won't be for a while. I'm not so sure he shouldn't take some more games off. Playoffs aren't happening anyway.

b_o_r · 01-10-2013, 01:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nowhereman

Game turned when Clips took Griffin out. LAC really started pushing it, instead of working to Griffin in the low block where the Mavs could send someone over to double. Props to VDN for leaving in Turiaf as well in the fourth.

Kaman looked terrible. Roddy looked worse. Mayo was the invisible man again.

Griffin had some pretty nice baskets late in the 4th. VDN made a smart decision to let Paul play the entire 2nd half.

adonis · 01-10-2013, 01:24 AM

So is Mayo on a bad slump or is he simply the same player he was in Memphis?

Melonhead · 01-10-2013, 01:25 AM

Make these close games/inevitable defeats stop!

nowhereman · 01-10-2013, 01:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by b_o_r

Griffin had some pretty nice baskets late in the 4th. VDN made a smart decision to let Paul play the entire 2nd half.

Yeah, he really came alive late. They changed up his position a bit too to make the double a little harder. They were really forcing it to him earlier in the third, in part because we were doing a much better job getting back in transition and taking care of the ball to prevent the breaks.

nowhereman · 01-10-2013, 01:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by adonis

So is Mayo on a bad slump or is he simply the same player he was in Memphis?

I would also like to know. The guy has just shrunk.

markus1234 · 01-10-2013, 01:32 AM

On this team Dirk won't be able to find his rhythm on offense.

In a game like this they need to set some screens for Dirk and force feed him in his sweet spots, till he catches fire.

One can't expect Dirk take over in the 4th without any rhythm. Walker/Jamison/Harris basketball all over again. Period. Amen.

Quote:

http://sturminator.blogspot.de/2008/...tine-dirk.html

I'm here to tell you the move on Kidd has as much to do with Avery Johnson's dissatisfaction with Dirk Nowitzki as a leader as with Devin Harris' point-guard shortcomings.

According to an infallible source, the Mavericks' coach pressed team owner Mark Cuban to deal Dirk after the NBA's MVP came up shamefully small against the Warriors in last season's upsetting first-round elimination, but was overruled.

sounds familiar, right ? According to some smart asses Dirk was done in 2008.... nobody looked at his pathetic teammates. Not even stupid Avery. And now it is the same.

adonis · 01-10-2013, 01:34 AM

Dirk was the clear MVP in 2007, I still can't believe how people thought Kobe or Nash deserved it.

b_o_r · 01-10-2013, 01:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nowhereman

I would also like to know. The guy has just shrunk.

Outside of his 3pt shooting percentage, I believe Mayo stats are very similar to Memphis across the board on a 36min basis.

nowhereman · 01-10-2013, 01:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by markus1234

On this team Dirk won't be able to find his rhythm on offense.

In a game like this they need to set some screens for Dirk and force feed him in his sweet spots, till he catches fire.

One can't expect Dirk take over in the 4th without any rhythm. Walker/Jamison/Harris basketball all over again. Period. Amen.

sounds familiar, right ? According to some smart asses Dirk was done in 2008.... nobody looked at his pathetic teammates. Not even stupid Avery. And now it is the same.

Dirk's not done. He just doesn't have all his strength or any rhythm, and more than half his touches start at the top of the three point circle. No one can get him the ball in his sweet spots either when he's trying to go to them either. When he finally started forcing things late against Utah, he looked lethal. When he got in the block tonight, it was the same. But I just don't think he has the health or teammates to do that every time down the court.

Walker/Jamison/Howard/Daniels/Nash/Nowitzki/Finley had far more chemistry and talent than this group. Which is saying something, because that season was brutal.

b_o_r · 01-10-2013, 01:40 AM

The Mavs are playing well as of late but with so many guys shooting% @ career lows, it makes the margin of error really low. The team as a whole has to get better at shooting.

adonis · 01-10-2013, 01:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nowhereman

Dirk's not done. He just doesn't have all his strength or any rhythm, and more than half his touches start at the top of the three point circle. No one can get him the ball in his sweet spots either when he's trying to go to them either. When he finally started forcing things late against Utah, he looked lethal. When he got in the block tonight, it was the same. But I just don't think he has the health or teammates to do that every time down the court.

Walker/Jamison/Howard/Daniels/Nash/Nowitzki/Finley had far more chemistry and talent than this group. Which is saying something, because that season was brutal.

How dare you forget Danny Fortson.

markus1234 · 01-10-2013, 01:47 AM

Tonight Dirk was 5-13.

If he takes 7 more shots, he probably ends up with 9-20 or something like that. Book it. Been there done that. Starting the night with 5-13 is nothing unusual for Dirk.

grndmstr_c · 01-10-2013, 02:01 AM

General comments:

- @Miami, @Utah, and @LAC. Those are three of the toughest regular season games there are, and Dallas has had a very real chance to come out in top in all of them. Wins and losses matter tremendously for this team right now, and there are no consolation prizes in losing, but it feels to me like they're close to getting on a roll if they can just keep their heads up and stick together a little longer. Really need to do it soon, though.

- Defensive commendations to two guys who regularly fail to impress me with their efforts on that side of the ball: Kaman and Mayo. I thought they represented themselves very well with their work on Griffin and CP, respectively (though the box score certainly doesn't give evidence that the Mavs had any success against Chris, I really did think Mayo played him as well as you could ask when he was on him).

- Big game by DC. Didn't make as much of an impact late, obviously, but overall he did his part.

- Really need OJ to find his three point shot again. If he could even get back to looking like a moderately competent long range shooter we wouldn't be talking about the flood of losses. That said, I liked the way he played tonight. Wasn't connecting as much as you'd like, but I thought he played a mature, focused game. The Mavs can win with him being that kind of player.

- Dirk...has to take some of the blame for this one. Careless (would Rick say catastrophic?) TOs early in the 4th and lost rebounds late played a pretty big part in turning the game and then sealing Dallas' fate. Though he had some good makes to offset the mistakes, too. He's still probably a couple weeks away from looking like himself again. Just need a touch better efficiency from some of the other shooters to bridge the gap.

Thomas86 · 01-10-2013, 02:05 AM

The Clippers are not contenders at all...that mavs showed if you stop the lob passes and make them play half court you have a chance to beat them.

markus1234 · 01-10-2013, 02:14 AM

This season Mavs showed how to slow down LAC, NY, LAL and MIA. lol. Quite an achievement.

j0Shi · 01-10-2013, 02:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by grndmstr_c

- @Miami, @Utah, and @LAC. Those are three of the toughest regular season games there are, and Dallas has had a very real chance to come out in top in all of them. Wins and losses matter tremendously for this team right now, and there are no consolation prizes in losing, but it feels to me like they're close to getting on a roll if they can just keep their heads up and stick together a little longer. Really need to do it soon, though.

It might seem this way and I'm really inclined to agree, but on the flip side there are so many little things going wrong on both ends of the floor that sometimes you feel like they are a training camp away from playing a complete game.

Since the Hornets game the playoffs are pretty much out of reach for me and I really feel sorry for Dirk. He is such a competitor that he hasn't realized the season is already over. Vegas has Kings as favorites tomorrow and rightfully so, it's the reality.

A glimmer of hope though: After tomorrow they play only 7 games in 16 days on a long homestand (briefly interrupted by visiting Orlando). You gotta think they can train quite a lot in the next two+ weeks and if you're still hoping for a serious win streak, this is the last shot they've got.

RareMilk · 01-10-2013, 04:45 AM

In other news, The Sactown Kings will be moving to Seattle. Looks like the Supersonics will be coming back, and the Kings are no more.

DevinHarriswillstart · 01-10-2013, 09:19 AM

Is it just me or has Mayo come up short in every "big" game this year?

b_o_r · 01-10-2013, 09:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DevinHarriswillstart

Is it just me or has Mayo come up short in every "big" game this year?

It really, really hurts the team that you can't play a 2man game between Dirk/Mayo (Mayo can't use a screen) or Dirk/Collison (Darren can't pass nor is good at the pull up J off a screen).

It also doesn't help that the team collectively aren't hitting wide open shots consistently. They have to shoot a respectable % to win. I would like to see more off the ball movement to manufacture closer shots. What ever happened to Marion coming off a curl to get a layup play?

DevinHarriswillstart · 01-10-2013, 09:47 AM

Passing is as big of an issue as defense and rebounding. It isn't just Collison though. If you think about it, the team really doesn't have an above average assist man.

spreedom · 01-10-2013, 09:57 AM

I'm not sure of the OP is joking with the title, but short of a win, what more could we have hoped for playing the best team in the NBA on the road? I'm not for moral victories in most cases but I was expecting us to get blown out and lobbed on all night. It took the Clippers' best shot to beat us when we're in the worst losing streak we've had in a decade.

That said, it is extremely frustrating to see us lose another game due to turnovers.

DevinHarriswillstart · 01-10-2013, 10:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by spreedom

I'm not sure of the OP is joking with the title, but short of a win, what more could we have hoped for playing the best team in the NBA on the road? I'm not for moral victories in most cases but I was expecting us to get blown out and lobbed on all night. It took the Clippers' best shot to beat us when we're in the worst losing streak we've had in a decade.

That said, it is extremely frustrating to see us lose another game due to turnovers.

I hate to keep using this quote, but it almost always rings true in the NBA...

"The difference between good and bad teams is that good teams win close games."

I've never taken much solace in keeping it close against good teams. Good efforts mean squat when the season keeps getting dumped down the toilet. At the end of the day there is still more bad than good.

b_o_r · 01-10-2013, 11:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DevinHarriswillstart

Passing is as big of an issue as defense and rebounding. It isn't just Collison though. If you think about it, the team really doesn't have an above average assist man.

Assists are overrated especially out of the PG position. Passing from big men and off the ball movement is criminally underrated in basketball. Something I noticed in the preseason was Brand/Kaman/Wright were not good at kicking the ball back out. This really hurts when your 2 SG's(Mayo/Carter) are at best spot up shooters. Secondly, Brand/Kaman/Dirk aren't very good at rolling to the basket which takes away a lot of easy assists from a PG. How many assist did Paul have tonight on big man rolls to the basket?

Dirkadirkastan · 01-10-2013, 12:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DevinHarriswillstart

I hate to keep using this quote, but it almost always rings true in the NBA...

"The difference between good and bad teams is that good teams win close games."

I've never taken much solace in keeping it close against good teams. Good efforts mean squat when the season keeps getting dumped down the toilet. At the end of the day there is still more bad than good.

I thought the old adage was "Good teams don't win close games, they avoid them."

SMC0007 · 01-10-2013, 12:35 PM

With the game tied at 76, Dirk had two huge iso buckets basically identical. Right after that he had two huge turnovers. Stupid ass turnovers.

These guys don't believe they can win.

Rick41 · 01-10-2013, 01:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SMC0007

With the game tied at 76, Dirk had two huge iso buckets basically identical. Right after that he had two huge turnovers. Stupid ass turnovers.

OJ Mayo is rubbing off on Dirk.

(out of context that sounds incredibly bad)

SMC0007 · 01-10-2013, 02:40 PM

Or incredibly good!

grndmstr_c · 01-10-2013, 03:08 PM

At least Mayo is self-lubricated?

More seriously, Dirk's basically still in preseason form. I really don't think you have to go farther than that to explain his unevenness in the fourth quarter last night. If they're really as good as they've looked to be in battling to the cusp of victory in these last three road games they'll clear the hurdle of getting a win soon enough, and it only takes one win to clear the cobwebs of whatever doubts the guys may be struggling with right now.

I'm also not buying the playoffs being out of reach. They're 7 games back of the 8, and 8 games back of the 6 seed with 46 to go, which is the same as being 1 back with 5 or 6 to go. The odds aren't in your favor, but you're hardly out of the race.

chumdawg · 01-10-2013, 05:22 PM

I get your point, but no, the two situations are nowhere near identical. If you are 1 back with 5 or 6 to go, you need to pick up a game over such a span one time. If you are 7 or 8 back, you need to pick that same game up every single time. It's a huge difference.

That said, though, I agree that they aren't anywhere close to being out of it.