POLL: Has Carlisle done a good Job this season? - Page 2 - Dallas-Mavs.com Forums

mavs777 · 01-04-2013, 04:57 PM

Yes because he was kind of forced to give Kaman minutes with Dirk endorsing him, Kaman has been the biggest issue by far with why the defense is so bad.

With Bernard James on the floor the Mavs have a 100.2 defensive rating which would be tied for 9th with Golden State
With Chris Kaman on the floor the Mavs have a 107 defensive rating which would be 28th only in front of the Hornets and Kings

Basically Dirk's front office decision which everything suggests it was is a huge reason for the struggles on the defensive end.

jamaljasonandjimmy · 01-04-2013, 05:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kante

RC by a mile.

rick carlisle inherited a good team but don nelson i think was the foundation of our 12 year playoff run.

jamaljasonandjimmy · 01-04-2013, 05:16 PM

don nelson made such an impact on this organization that his son is gm.

Kante · 01-04-2013, 05:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jamaljasonandjimmy

rick carlisle inherited a good team but don nelson i think was the foundation of our 12 year playoff run.

And what did he won?

Don't get me wrong, he is/was good but still, i'll take RC!

chumdawg · 01-05-2013, 12:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kante

And what did he won?

Don't get me wrong, he is/was good but still, i'll take RC!

Let me put it this way. The difference between the two is so large--and this is no disrespect to Carlisle--that Nelson could beat Carlisle with his own, and then swap teams and beat his own with Carlisle's.

jamaljasonandjimmy · 01-05-2013, 12:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chumdawg

Let me put it this way. The difference between the two is so large--and this is no disrespect to Carlisle--that Nelson could beat Carlisle with his own, and then swap teams and beat his own with Carlisle's.

he kinda did that with golden state 8th seeds upset no 1 seeds
This has only happened five times in NBA history:

The Denver Nuggets defeated the Seattle SuperSonics 3-2 in 1994.
The New York Knicks defeated the Miami Heat in 1999 3-2.
The Golden State Warriors defeated the Dallas Mavricks in 2007 4-2.
The Memphis Grizzlies defeated the San Antonio Spurs in 2011 4-2.
The Philadelphia 76ers defeated the Chicago Bulls in 2012 4-2

dude1394 · 01-05-2013, 01:29 AM

Carlisle takes him every time.

EricaLubarsky · 01-05-2013, 01:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mavs777

Yes because he was kind of forced to give Kaman minutes with Dirk endorsing him, Kaman has been the biggest issue by far with why the defense is so bad.

With Bernard James on the floor the Mavs have a 100.2 defensive rating which would be tied for 9th with Golden State
With Chris Kaman on the floor the Mavs have a 107 defensive rating which would be 28th only in front of the Hornets and Kings

Basically Dirk's front office decision which everything suggests it was is a huge reason for the struggles on the defensive end.

Good numbers.

rmacomic · 01-05-2013, 02:37 AM

No, Rick has done a less than stelar job this year.

I feel that while Rick Carlisle is not doing a half-assed job this year, he is not doing his best. As a coach, I think he is limited by the talent he has been given, but I do not suspect this team is looking to upgrade this season. The record has been hampered by the lack of Nowitzki, and it could be easily speculated that this team is just a few games away from contention. Yet, this squad reeks of rental. The majority of newer pieces are placeholders at best and they know it. They are good on paper, but they lack any chemistry, or even the desire to develop any chemistry for that matter.

They are not that bad though. At times the team has shown me signs of life and drive. Carlisle, however, has not seemed to me a coach driven to invest in his roster. Yes, he has been very vocal in his "belief" in this team as of late. This has not equated to any tangible result. I don't think Rick cares that this year is not up to his or this organization's standard. In my opinion, he and Dirk are both mailing it in this season.

I still think this team can make the playoffs this year. Yet, I am starting to suspect that is counter to the plan. As much as it sucks, this is our tank season. Hats off to Cuban for waiting until a championship to start the reboot, but it was coming around 2007-2008 and we lucked into a trophy before he had to take his foot off the gas. Honestly, the guy spent a ton of money to keep the window open after 2006. If he blew it up to save money after the championship, I thank him for not giving up until then. There are so many lesser interest/venue teams in the NBA that will never even sniff the finals much less over a decade of playoff appearances. That Cuban put the Mavericks in such category is a testament to the man's commitment.

The end of Nowitzki's career as a Mav may be rough. It stinks that he may have to go to another team to contend again. But I am convinced that as long as Cuban owns this team, a title run will be in the future.

Dan1 · 01-05-2013, 11:28 PM

I think Carlisle is a good coach but as far as this season: no, not a good job. I dont think any coach would improve this roster significantly but some bad decisions were made this season. And that cost us some games.

markus1234 · 01-05-2013, 11:33 PM

Too much crowder, carter and mayo. Not enough Dahantay jones and bernard james.

EricaLubarsky · 01-05-2013, 11:41 PM

The real question: will Carlisle finish the season as a Mav? Most coaches don't last with disappointments this bad-- even when it's personnel and not the coach. Should he stay?

j0Shi · 01-05-2013, 11:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by EricaLubarsky

The real question: will Carlisle finish the season as a Mav? Most coaches don't last with disappointments this bad-- even when it's personnel and not the coach. Should he stay?

I'm really bad evaluating coaches, but not quite sure Carlisle is the best fit in a rebuilding project.

Dan1 · 01-05-2013, 11:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by EricaLubarsky

The real question: will Carlisle finish the season as a Mav? Most coaches don't last with disappointments this bad-- even when it's personnel and not the coach. Should he stay?

I think he will and i think he should stay (if we decide not to tank/rebuild). But a change on the coaching staff would be welcomed.

Aggie E · 01-06-2013, 12:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by markus1234

Rick is definitely a bit overrated. I followed him pretty closely in Indiana

http://www.basketball-reference.com/teams/IND/2007.html

http://www.pacersdigest.com/showthre...fire-Carlisle&

and he looked VERY confused in his last 2 seasons. Jasikevicius was a much better PG than Tinsley, but stubborn RC kept playng Tinsley and losing games... Then he suspended Sjax and other guys "left and right" and lost the team completely.... That Sjax, Jermaine O Neal and Artest do not play for the Mavs is no coincidence.

ps: And Jasikevicius got his revenge during our pre season game vs. barcelona

He turned a solid team into a Chip team. He would have to turn into a total goof before I turn on RC....

dude1394 · 01-06-2013, 02:42 AM

I don't think even cubes is nutty enough to let Carlisle go.

DevinHarriswillstart · 01-06-2013, 08:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by EricaLubarsky

The real question: will Carlisle finish the season as a Mav? Most coaches don't last with disappointments this bad-- even when it's personnel and not the coach. Should he stay?

I think he's safe because of Dirk's knee. Otherwise, it might be a tough choice to make...

I wouldn't fire him no matter what happens this season, but that is just me. The good (and I guess bad) news that he can have a whole new team next season. Unfortunately, I can't see what will save the drop in ticket sales unless a miracle happens this summer.

jthig32 · 01-06-2013, 09:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by EricaLubarsky

The real question: will Carlisle finish the season as a Mav? Most coaches don't last with disappointments this bad-- even when it's personnel and not the coach. Should he stay?

Cubes has fired one coach since he's been here, so I'm not sure what basis you have for this statement.

I'd be beyond shocked if Rick was let go. He's part of the core here. He's going to be here a long time, assuming he wants to be.

b_o_r · 01-06-2013, 09:17 AM

No

With and without injuries, Carlisle's rotations have left a lot to be desired. He gave up on a Kaman/Brand front court after 1 preseason game but starts with the Dirk/Kaman one which has a DRTG of 120 in 40 minutes.

Last night, NO had a backcourt of Grevis/Rivers and Mavs countered with Roddy/Dahntay. Why not switch defensively if you weren't going to send trap for Grevis?

Yes, the players have underperformed but so has Carlisle. A coach has to play players to their strengths.

EricaLubarsky · 01-06-2013, 11:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jthig32

Cubes has fired one coach since he's been here, so I'm not sure what basis you have for this statement.

I'd be beyond shocked if Rick was let go. He's part of the core here. He's going to be here a long time, assuming he wants to be.

I'm talking regular nba coaching. E.G. Avery

jthig32 · 01-06-2013, 01:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by EricaLubarsky

I'm talking regular nba coaching. E.G. Avery

Ah, gotcha.

My rebuttal would be that Cubes just doesn't work the way most of the NBA does. And Carlisle is one of a handful of coaches that just isn't ever going to be fired unless something goes horribly, horribly wrong for a long, long time.

Popeye · 01-06-2013, 09:15 PM

I really don't get why Chandler, Kidd and Terry are expendable, but Carlisle is untouchable. He's a good coach but I'm not sure he's a good fit for this team.

grndmstr_c · 01-06-2013, 09:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Popeye

I really don't get why Chandler, Kidd and Terry are expendable, but Carlisle is untouchable. He's a good coach but I'm not sure he's a good fit for this team.

Kidd wasn't viewed or treated as expendable by the Mavs. And Rick is one of the top 2 or 3 active NBA coaches. None of the players that have left Dallas in the last two years rank that high in their profession.

But the bottom line is that it makes no sense to compare coaches to players in that respect because coach's salaries don't count against the cap or incur luxury tax penalties.

Popeye · 01-06-2013, 09:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by grndmstr_c

Kidd wasn't viewed or treated as expendable by the Mavs. And Rick is one of the top 2 or 3 active NBA coaches. None of the players that have left Dallas in the last two years rank that high in their profession.

But the bottom line is that it makes no sense to compare coaches to players in that respect because coach's salaries don't count against the cap or incur luxury tax penalties.

I was talking more about this board's reaction to those players leaving. It seems like for many even though Kidd, Terry and Chandler helped win us a championship, they understand it was time to move on. However, whenever the possibility about moving in a different direction at head coach is brought up, they point to Rick's championship as a reason why that would be stupid.

Anyway, let's see how he does when Dirk gets healthy and these player become more familiar to him. He's a good coach and I hope he figures it out soon. That said, I think the criticisms of him this year are valid, and if he continues doing weird things then the Mavs will consider a change.

dude1394 · 01-06-2013, 11:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Popeye

I was talking more about this board's reaction to those players leaving. It seems like for many even though Kidd, Terry and Chandler helped win us a championship, they understand it was time to move on. However, whenever the possibility about moving in a different direction at head coach is brought up, they point to Rick's championship as a reason why that would be stupid.

Anyway, let's see how he does when Dirk gets healthy and these player become more familiar to him. He's a good coach and I hope he figures it out soon. That said, I think the criticisms of him this year are valid, and if he continues doing weird things then the Mavs will consider a change.

Letting Tyson go was stupid. Letting Carlisle go would be idiotic.

wilmtalk · 01-07-2013, 12:43 PM

Most of you guys have been deceived by the Champianship that was finally won. It was not won because of Carlisle. It was a perfect storm. Carlisle can only coach when his team has the right players. He does not make good on the fly adjustments. He also is terrible at developing players. That is why he stacks his teams with older vets. Don't think that the front office didn't consult RC when they made their roster change moves, so don't put all the blame on Mark and company. Last year and this is a better gage of RC coaching ability than the champianship year.

Personally I never cared for RC and felt he was a mistake from the word go. He was the exact opposite of Nellie which is why Mark hired him. It was a reaction to Nellie's problem with structure. He was in love with his image of the unconventional genius. Carlisle is methodical who has to think out each move pregame. Unless Cuban somehow acquires a bevy of talent that makes the team superior on paper they are doomed to mediocrity. Carlisle does not have the ability to coach them up.

Don't anyone tell me about the creative lineups he used in the playoffs the Champianship year. He utilized the three guard line up the entire season before. It was only when Chandler was acquired that the defense was able to compensate for it. It was not an on the fly decision but formulated over a long period of time. It's just that the perfect opportunity to utilize it came into play during the play offs.

I waited 20+ years for the Mav's to win a champianship. Now they have one, so my frustration with Carlisle doesn't bother me as much. I have no great expectations from him and as long as he is the coach not much from the team either.

EricaLubarsky · 01-07-2013, 12:52 PM

Carlisle coached circles around Spoelstra and beat the more talented team with a less talented team. Don't tell me that he was just lucky.

wilmtalk · 01-07-2013, 01:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dude1394

Letting Tyson go was stupid. Letting Carlisle go would be idiotic.

Actually keeping Carlisle would be idiotic.

The effects of letting Tyson go were obvious. He was a perfect fit for Dirk and the team. When he was on the team it was much better than it was before he was here. And the team was much worse after words. Conclusion-Tyson made the team better.

Carlisle was not that successful before Tyson was here. In fact the team underachieved. When the team let go of Tyson/Kidd the team was far worse the next year. ( Remember this was with Dirk). It can be logically assumed that the major difference was Tyson/Kidd. Carlisle was not a difference maker. You people that think so are probably the same fans who thought Dampier was a good center. It took his being replaced by Tyson for you to recognize what a stiff he really was. It's the same with Carlisle. You just have no evaluational abilities.

I also think Carlisle needed Kidd as an on court coach. Carlisle needed Tyson/Kidd and the older vets to compensate for his lack of coaching ability. He needs a half a year to be able to evaluate his players enough to develop an effective rotation. He is not a quick study. Give him the same players for two years and he might be able to come up with a rotation.

This team is in a state of flux. Changes have to be made and Carlisle is the wrong coach to deal with changes. He requires a settled team. In this type of situation he is just one more liability.

jthig32 · 01-07-2013, 01:16 PM

I don't have enough face palm gifs to pull this thread out of the ditch at this point. I suggest we all just move along.

wilmtalk · 01-07-2013, 01:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by EricaLubarsky

Carlisle coached circles around Spoelstra and beat the more talented team with a less talented team. Don't tell me that he was just lucky.

Out coaching Spoelstra isn't that big of a deal. He was basically LB b!tch anyway. The rotation RC used was the same rotation he had experimented with for the last two years. Carlisle is a good coach when he has enough time to evaluate his players and then make game plans in advance. The rotations he used in the playoffs were no different than those he used all year. They were just very effective because they ( except for the Thunder) played against the Lakers and Heats weakness's. It was not something he did on the fly.

As I stated before Carlisle is not a good coach when he is required to make quick evaluations of his personal and in game adjustments that he has not planned for. He is methodical. If he was really the coach that some of you believe the Mavs wouldn't be having the problems they are now. Dirk see's the handwriting on the wall. Isn't it time the rest of you woke up. But then most of you are like Carlisle. You are incapable of recognizing a trend until far after it has bitten you in the Aff. He was the right coach for the year the team won the champianship, but he is wrong for the situation this team finds itself in at present.

jthig32 · 01-07-2013, 01:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wilmtalk

Out coaching Spoelstra isn't that big of a deal. He was basically LB b!tch anyway. The rotation RC used was the same rotation he had experimented with for the last two years. Carlisle is a good coach when he has enough time to evaluate his players and then make game plans in advance. The rotations he used in the playoffs were no different than those he used all year. They were just very effective because they ( except for the Thunder) played against the Lakers and Heats weakness's. It was not something he did on the fly.

As I stated before Carlisle is not a good coach when he is required to make quick evaluations of his personal and in game adjustments that he has not planned for. He is methodical. If he was really the coach that some of you believe the Mavs wouldn't be having the problems they are now. Dirk see's the handwriting on the wall. Isn't it time the rest of you woke up. But then most of you are like Carlisle. You are incapable of recognizing a trend until far after it has bitten you in the Aff. He was the right coach for the year the team won the champianship, but he is wrong for the situation this team finds itself in at present.

I'm not going to debate you on this, because you're so far out there that it's not even worth it.

I just wanted to take the time to point out that you appear to have the EXACT OPPOSITE opinion of Carlisle's strengths as the entire rest of the NBA and those who watch it and cover it. Carlisle is the king of "be ready". His rotations are always in flux. His lineups change all the time. Hell, his lineup was constantly changing the entire 2010-2011 season. Hell, he completely removed Peja from the rotation early in the Heat series, and changed his staring lineup halfway through as well.

I mean...I get that people often have issues with their coach. But your characterization of Rick is so, so backwards. If anything, the majority of his critics, and some of his players, would claim that he is too volatile, TOO unwilling to commit to a steady, consistent plan.

Just such a strange stance to take.

dude1394 · 01-07-2013, 02:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by EricaLubarsky

Carlisle coached circles around Spoelstra and beat the more talented team with a less talented team. Don't tell me that he was just lucky.

You can also say he did the same to Jackson and the thunder coach.

EricaLubarsky · 01-07-2013, 03:03 PM

Who would have coached us to a better record with the current roster. Assume that Carlisle had no roster control-- which sounds justified because of how much he's lamented the roster changes.

Who would have done a better job.

SMC0007 · 01-07-2013, 03:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by EricaLubarsky

Who would have coached us to a better record with the current roster. Assume that Carlisle had no roster control-- which sounds justified because of how much he's lamented the roster changes.

Who would have done a better job.

Pop. But not by leaps and bounds.

RC has made some mistakes looking in from afar, but you just can't ever really tell what goes on behind practice doors.

LonghornDub · 01-07-2013, 03:44 PM

Pop is the only active coach who is better than RC. Firing RC would be a catastrophically stupid move.

sefant77 · 01-07-2013, 03:51 PM

Our players acted pretty much mentally challenged in every crunchtime situation. Blame the players for throwing away allready at least a handful of games.

Dont blame RC for dozens of butterfinger TO and clanking wide open shots. We were supposed to be around 0.500. Easily.

Simple_Like_That · 01-07-2013, 07:53 PM

If there is no trade in the way ... and the team continues to loose it's better to enter in kind of tank mode and devolop chemistry and players for next year. I don't what a lot of your games but Collison for me is better off the bench; Kaman and Dirk / Collison and OJ duos are liability on D. My point is that besides they are skinny Wright and Cunnigham seems that are the players who have more potential on the weak links this team has (Pg and C); special on the D end.

Cunnigham/OJ/Marion/Dirk/Wright
Collison/Jones/Marion/Brand/Kaman

I think this way this team stay way more balanced. Play the rest of the year and see what happens. Will be ugly most of the time but after all I think this team has a fair chance to get a high pick and/or a FA or 2 to complete the main core.

Maybe and just maybe this teams clicks and make a last run to the playoffs and don't make a bad act there.

dude1394 · 01-07-2013, 08:09 PM

All these guys except maybe mayo, collison are gone. But they aren't the answer to anything. If you can trade them for something now, do it.

THE LOVER · 01-09-2013, 07:11 AM

Rick isn't a good coach he is a great coach. This mess is all on Cuban.

Five-ofan · 01-09-2013, 08:22 AM

I have been driving the Carlisle struggled this season bus but lets be honest, with his best coaching job(and his best is as good as anyone in basketball) we are still 2 or 3 games under .500 at best. This team has serious roster construction issues. With absolute peak dirk this team would still be the worst of the dirk as a star era. With no followed by shadow of himself dirk this team is just terrible.

The thing is IMO this is a time to appreciate what we've had in the big German era. It's been 12 years since we weren't considered a viable contender at some point. That's a longer run then a lot of people get. Well be extremely lucky if the next run lasts anywhere near that long, plus well get to follow a young up and coming team at some point hopefully soon. Assuming he can learn to let people play through struggles, there's no one is rather have teaching those youngsters the game than Carlisle