Who will win MVP? - Page 2 - Dallas-Mavs.com Forums

mary · 04-12-2006, 05:04 PM

Statements in this thread I most agree with.

Quote:

Dirk now or never. Give it to Lebron the next 10 years.

I think it will be now or never (or maybe "now, or next year") for Dirk and the rest of the candidates. The Era of LeBron is about to descend upon us with great fury. In three years or so, MVP may not even be an issue of debate.

Quote:

I dont think there is a thing that Dirk could do at this point to change the MVP race in his favor.

Nope, I don't either.

Quote:

Dan Patrick can suck it.

Indeed he can!

Quote:

Guys lebron is not just an espn creation. I think dirk should win it but lebron is a beast.

LeBron may be "hyped" by ESPN, but he has MORE THAN fulfilled his end of the bargain. I'd trade two Dirks for him. Does anyone know where I can get two Dirks?

Quote:

Lebron can have the Heisman.

Dirk's gonna win the Rose Bowl

Greatness. I hope its true.

dude1394 · 04-12-2006, 05:09 PM

Chuck Cooperstein may have just become my fav' radio announcer. When asked about dirk his statement about bucher was..

"That was possibly the stupidest thing written by a journalist this year. Anything I read from him in the future will have to be taken with a grain of salt".

And I don't agree with Bron-bron being MVP...I just don't, I still believe your team needs to be higher than 7th in the league. If you want to give it to someone give it to Vince Carter, he's had more impact than LeBron has.

He's just not there yet. And potential doesn't count here. I might take Yao over dirk as well, but he's not the MVP. I might take Kobe, Duncan over Dirk as well, but neither are they the MVP as it's been voted on in the past.

blahblehblah · 04-12-2006, 05:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dude1394

Chuck Cooperstein may have just become my fav' radio announcer. When asked about dirk his statement about bucher was..

"That was possibly the stupidest thing written by a journalist this year. Anything I read from him in the future will have to be taken with a grain of salt".

And I don't agree with Bron-bron being MVP...I just don't, I still believe your team needs to be higher than 7th in the league. If you want to give it to someone give it to Vince Carter, he's had more impact than LeBron has.

He's just not there yet. And potential doesn't count here. I might take Yao over dirk as well, but he's not the MVP. I might take Kobe, Duncan over Dirk as well, but neither are they the MVP as it's been voted on in the past.

Not there yet?? counting on Potential? What are you talking about? News flash, noone who votes for LBJ will do so because they are "counting on his potential" but rather at what hes done thjis year. That simply is having the BEST Statistical season in the league. With avgs of nearly 32 7 and 7 48%fg and likely leading his team to 50 wins if hes "not there yet" or close to it I shudder to think what number he'll put up when he is "there."

Lebron is going to win the MVP, hes having a great year, his team has been on a great run, his team is gonna win 50 games, ESPN NBA the media all love him... I say this its a pretty safe bet to declare him the winner... with the other media darling Nash coming in second.

Dirk who I think deserves it as much as Nash and Lebron as the Mavs are by far the best team out of the three... I predict will finish a distant third at best, maybe fourth... Truth is the guy like the Mavs just don't get much national publicity, interest or hype and like it or not... its gonna cost him coming voting time.

Oh and what did Bucher say about dirk that ChuCK COoperstein refered to as "stupidiest..."?

Five-ofan · 04-12-2006, 05:44 PM

He said Josh howard was more of an mvp than dirk. He is an idiot. Dude i dont know what you are smoking but vince carter over lebron? i happen to like vince but have you lost your damn mind? I generally think you are a solid poster but vince and lebron are 2 different classes of players right now. Lebron is there. The thing is i dont think he is quite as good as he will be. Just because he COULD still get better because he is the most physically talented nba player ever doesnt mean that he should be penalized. It is actually possible that at some point in his career he could average 35 10 10 2 2. Obviously that would require alot and i am projecting alot but the guy is amazing. However that has nothing to do with this years mvp race. I think dirk should win but lebron is extremely deserving as well.

NXperience · 04-12-2006, 05:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by blahblehblah

That simply is having the BEST Statistical season in the league. With avgs of nearly 32 7 and 7 48%fg

I totally disagree with that. He is worse in every shooting % category as Dirk and leads only in points (on 4 more shots a game) in assists (no argue here) and in steals. That's it he looses in every other category by playing 4,7 minutes more and that in a conference that just stinks.

EricaLubarsky · 04-12-2006, 05:58 PM

Everyone on this board knows that everyone was tripping over their own boots, trying to give LeBron the MVP last year.

dude1394 · 04-12-2006, 05:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by blahblehblah

Not there yet?? counting on Potential? What are you talking about? News flash, noone who votes for LBJ will do so because they are "counting on his potential" but rather at what hes done thjis year.

Not there yet. His team is 7th in the league, 7th! If his team were at least 4th maybe.

That's why he's not there yet.

dude1394 · 04-12-2006, 06:02 PM

Kobe and AI have more PPG. Kobe by a full 4points. If you are just going by stats Kobe gets it.

Five-ofan · 04-12-2006, 06:15 PM

There are more to stats than just points.

rabbitproof · 04-12-2006, 06:18 PM

Personally, I'm all Dirk but this thread gets at it. Who does the media love? LBJ and to be honest, he is MVP-worthy enough though the record is a dash on him. So who do I vote for?

I consult the betting gods!

Odds to win the MVP for the Big 6:
Billups at 6/1
Dirk at 12/1
LBJ at 10/11!!!
Nash at 3/1
Wade at 15/1
Kobe at 10/11!!

It's ugly. Dirk is slotted 5th!

I think LBJ will take it.

blahblehblah · 04-12-2006, 06:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dude1394

Kobe and AI have more PPG. Kobe by a full 4points. If you are just going by stats Kobe gets it.

Kobe avgs 3.4 more points per game... this would be important if not for the fact that Lebron far outperforms Kobe in every other category. Just a quick note, rebounds Lebron by a 2, Assists Lebron by 2, field goal percentage Lebron 48% Kobe 44%, and lastly wins... Lebron 47 Kobe 42.

And as far as Lebron not "being there yet" because his team is 7th in the league... I guess by that logic... Hakeem Olajuwon regressed and wasnt "there yet" in 1995 when the Houston Rockets won 47 games and finished tied for 10th in the league! Hmm I wonder how Olajuwon and the Rockets managed to win the NBA championship that year!

dirno2000 · 04-12-2006, 06:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rabbitproof

Personally, I'm all Dirk but this thread gets at it. Who does the media love? LBJ and to be honest, he is MVP-worthy enough though the record is a dash on him. So who do I vote for?

I consult the betting gods!

Odds to win the MVP for the Big 6:
Billups at 6/1
Dirk at 12/1
LBJ at 10/11!!!
Nash at 3/1
Wade at 15/1
Kobe at 10/11!!

It's ugly. Dirk is slotted 5th!

I think LBJ will take it.

I thought Vegas didn't take odds on things that could so easily fixed.

blahblehblah · 04-12-2006, 06:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NXperience

I totally disagree with that. He is worse in every shooting % category as Dirk and leads only in points (on 4 more shots a game) in assists (no argue here) and in steals. That's it he looses in every other category by playing 4,7 minutes more and that in a conference that just stinks.

I dont know how you can even argue Dirk having a better year than Lebron statistically. Just look at the raw numbers... whats numbers would you rather have?

31.7 points 7 rbs 6.8 assists on 48% fg 74% ft 10.4 fta per

or

26.1 points 9 rbs 2.8 assists on 48% fg 90% ft 7.3 fta per

Dirk only slightly outperforms Lebron on Rbs by 2 in the 4 major categories of Points, Assists, rebounds and Field goal percentage. Lebron has a large edge in points and assists. But if still you prefer Dirks numbers... you should check the full statistical record at www.82games.com and the Hollinger statistics. Statistically speaking tho, I dont see how you can argue 26, 9 and 3 is better or even with 32, 7 and 7! Especially when both have the same feild goal percentage!

capitalcity · 04-12-2006, 08:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dirno2000

I thought Vegas didn't take odds on things that could so easily fixed.

I think those odds indicate Vegas knows the fix is in.

chumdawg · 04-12-2006, 09:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dirno2000

I thought Vegas didn't take odds on things that could so easily fixed.

Vegas may not (though I expect some places might), but other books do. Remember when Shaq was requesting a trade? Offshore books had odds there. And the British, they will bet on anything.

dude1394 · 04-12-2006, 09:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by blahblehblah

Kobe avgs 3.4 more points per game... this would be important if not for the fact that Lebron far outperforms Kobe in every other category. Just a quick note, rebounds Lebron by a 2, Assists Lebron by 2, field goal percentage Lebron 48% Kobe 44%, and lastly wins... Lebron 47 Kobe 42.

And as far as Lebron not "being there yet" because his team is 7th in the league... I guess by that logic... Hakeem Olajuwon regressed and wasnt "there yet" in 1995 when the Houston Rockets won 47 games and finished tied for 10th in the league! Hmm I wonder how Olajuwon and the Rockets managed to win the NBA championship that year!

What exactly is your point? Did he win the MVP that year?

And since you decided to just throw-off the wins... Dirk 60 (after tonight), Lebron 47.. That's MY point.

rabbitproof · 04-12-2006, 10:09 PM

GOD HAS SPOKEN!!

LeBron with an ankle sprain. I wish him well and hope he tears up the East in the playoffs but perhaps the basketball gods are waving their hands and opening the door for the BIG GERMAN!!

dude1394 · 04-12-2006, 10:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rabbitproof

GOD HAS SPOKEN!!

LeBron with an ankle sprain. I wish him well and hope he tears up the East in the playoffs but perhaps the basketball gods are waving their hands and opening the door for the BIG GERMAN!!

He'll now get the sympathy vote.

blahblehblah · 04-12-2006, 10:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dude1394

What exactly is your point?

I'm pointing out to you how ridiculous it is for you to argue that Lebron isnt "there yet." To argue that Lebron hasnt reach a level worthy of MVP consideration is silly this year as his level of play and numbers are excellent. For you to then argue he isnt "there yet" because his team is the 7th best in the league is also ridiculous as I pointed out that Hakeem's team in 95 the tenth best record went on to win the title. If you want further evidence to why my point that your contention that Lebron level of play isnt "there yet" becuase his team is the 7th best in the league... guess where Jordan's 88 Bull's rank was in the league with their 50 wins that year. O and Jordan did win the MVP that year... by your logic Jordan wasnt "there yet" either lol.

NXperience · 04-12-2006, 10:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dude1394

He'll now get the sympathy vote.

That's the first thing I thought too.

rabbitproof · 04-12-2006, 10:17 PM

Ankle sprains are baby scratches in the world of MVPs. Any writer who votes out of injury sympathy is a putz.

birdsanctuary · 04-12-2006, 10:19 PM

I like Lebron, don't get me wrong, but consideration as MVP candidate? Pitiful. absolutely pitiful. Take a way Lebron and the Cavs are not that much worse than they are now because the East is pathetic. Take away Dirk, and I think we would see a much bigger drop off.
MVP
Dirk
Billups
Nash
Duncan
Kobe
Lebron
Wade

dude1394 · 04-12-2006, 10:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by blahblehblah

I'm pointing out to you how ridiculous it is for you to argue that Lebron isnt "there yet." To argue that Lebron hasnt reach a level worthy of MVP consideration is silly this year as his level of play and numbers are excellent. For you to then argue he isnt "there yet" because his team is the 7th best in the league is also ridiculous as I pointed out that Hakeem's team in 95 the tenth best record went on to win the title. If you want further evidence to why my point that your contention that Lebron level of play isnt "there yet" becuase his team is the 7th best in the league... guess where Jordan's 88 Bull's rank was in the league with their 50 wins that year. O and Jordan did win the MVP that year... by your logic Jordan wasnt "there yet" either lol.

Beats me dude...My take would be that he shouldn't have won it that year then. I see no way that a guy who's team is 7th in the league deserves the MVP...period. You can use Jordan as an outlier to try and make your point but I don't buy it. Now unfortunately since the media is hyping bron-bron (like they did jordan) he'll probably get it but he's not deserving yet.

There are 6 more teams that are better and that have more deserving MVP caliber players on them.

Billups, Wade, Parker, Nash.. Nash is an outlier to me since his team isn't winning as much.

Not to mention that the Mavs are going for their best record in franchise history while Dirk has lost the MVP one year and Finley the next and STILL have brought his team to their best record. THAT's my point.

blahblehblah · 04-12-2006, 10:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dude1394

Not to mention that the Mavs are going for their best record in franchise history while Dirk has lost the MVP one year and Finley the next and STILL have brought his team to their best record. THAT's my point.

This point I can agree with. In fact I think I mentioned Dirk being deserving of the award in my inital post. However your other point about LeBron this year and Jordan in 88 not deserving the awrd due to their teams not finishing higher than 7th we will just have to agree to disagree.

chumdawg · 04-12-2006, 11:33 PM

My vote goes like this:

Nowitzki
Parker
Nash
James
Bryant

mary · 04-15-2006, 12:14 PM

Steve Kerr picks LeBron.

http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/news?slu...yhoo&type=lgns

chumdawg · 04-15-2006, 01:46 PM

The Grizzlies play-by-play guy already turned in his ballots. You can read all his selections on the team website, but here is how he voted MVP:

MOST VALUABLE PLAYER
Steve Nash, Phoenix Suns
There are a million ways to interpret “most valuable player,” which makes voting for this the most difficult of all the awards. Simply put, Steve Nash produces for himself and he makes his teammates better and puts them in a position to win games and the last time I checked, basketball is still a team game (which is why I have him at the top of the list instead of say, Kobe Bryant). Guys play with Nash and all of a sudden, they’re having the best seasons of their careers. Coincidence? I think not. It’s a rare gift that Nash has, therefore it’s valuable, therefore he’s the Most Valuable Player. There, I’ve just confirmed my vote.

Also voted for:

LeBron James, Cleveland Cavaliers

Put this team on his back after all the commentary was how he hadn’t been to the playoffs. Well, the Cavaliers have homecourt advantage for their first-round playoff series and James has led them there. The young fella deserves a ton of credit for dealing with the expectations and delivering in the crunch.

Chauncey Billups, Detroit Pistons

No one makes more big shots than Mr. Big Shot. He’s the best player on the best team (at least record-wise), so he gets a runner-up vote from me after strong consideration for the top spot.

Dirk Nowitzki, Dallas Mavericks

He’s the heart and soul of the Mavericks who, like the Spurs, figure to win 60 games. Dirk is a relentless competitor who delivers in the big moment and has been a much more effective leader this season.

Kobe Bryant, Los Angeles Lakers

Without him, the Lakers are counting ping-pong balls and waiting for the draft.

Dtownsfinest · 04-15-2006, 05:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chumdawg

My vote goes like this:

Nowitzki
Parker
Nash
James
Bryant

You know its funny you bring up Parker. I'm actually shocked he's not a candidate. Not saying he should win but if there's going to be talks of Kobe and Billup's than how can there not even be mention of a guy who's been the best player on his team this season and has the #1 seed in the West?

Hitman · 04-15-2006, 09:21 PM

Does anyone really believe this Dallas team is in the playoffs without Nowitzki?

I mean, seriously. With all the injuries, this team wins 30 games without Dirk this year.

Why doesn't anybody realize this?

chumdawg · 04-15-2006, 09:29 PM

Who said nobody realized they would miss Dirk a hell of a lot?

Thirty games might be a bit low. I'm thinking they would be on the fringe of playoff competition, with something around 40 being more reasonable. But still, I don't think anyone would argue that point with you.

Hitman · 04-15-2006, 09:38 PM

Chum -- In the West...would the Mavs win 40 games? I don't know.

Their starting lineup would be...

Terry
Stackhouse
Diop
Howard
Marshall

Van Horn would be out for the season. Stackhouse didn't play in the beginning of the season. Howard has missed 20 games. Harris has missed a bunch of games. Marshall sucks.

I mean...that team would suck. They would be terrible. Worse than the 76ers were this year, and the Sixers play in the East. If you think that sad group would win more than 30-32 games playing in the West.....

Dirk is the MVP of the league because you add him to the mix, and that group won 60 games. And he put up 27 points, 9 rebounds, 3 assists and shot 48% from the field, 90 % from the line and 41% from three.

He is the MVP of the league. Besides Lebron, there is no other true candidate.

Dirkenstien · 04-15-2006, 10:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mary

Steve Kerr picks LeBron.

http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/news?slu...yhoo&type=lgns

Kerr is an idiot. He uses Cleveland's last game againt New York as an example because Cleveland barely won without Lebron but what he forgot to mention was that in their last matchup with the Knicks this seasons they had Lebron and lost .

Milles · 04-15-2006, 10:43 PM

Quote:

According to an informal poll of 22 reporters - 12 from the East and 10 from the West - who cover the league on a regular basis, Nash will edge out James.

The poll is far from definitive as a total of 127 members of the media across the country will vote in the league's official poll, but in past years the informal poll has given a pretty clear indication on how the official voting will go....

On a 5-4-3-2-1 point basis, the informal poll showed Nash with 82 points and nine first-place votes while James had 78 points and five first-place votes. Nowitzki edged Billups for third place, with Bryant fifth.

The All-NBA first team was comprised of Bryant, Nash, Nowitzki, James, and Detroit center Ben Wallace. There were no unanimous selections on the first team. Making up the second team were Billups, Miami's Dwyane Wade, the Clippers' Elton Brand, Phoenix's Shawn Marion, and Miami's Shaquille O'Neal. The third team consisted of Philadelphia's Allen Iverson, New Jersey's Jason Kidd, Denver's Carmelo Anthony, San Antonio's Duncan, and Houston's Yao Ming.

In other categories, the Hornets' Chris Paul was a unanimous choice for rookie of the year, with Toronto's Charlie Villanueva second, Charlotte's Raymond Felton third, and Milwaukee's Andrew Bogut fourth. That foursome, along with New York's Channing Frye made up the all-rookie team.

Avery Johnson of Dallas was a solid choice for coach of the year with Flip Saunders of Detroit and Mike D'Antoni of Phoenix tying for second.

Also, Phoenix's Boris Diaw was the choice for most improved player with the Hornets' David West a distant second and New Jersey's Nenad Krstic third; Detroit's Wallace edged San Antonio's Bruce Bowen for defensive player; and Memphis' Mike Miller won comfortably over the Hornets' Speedy Claxon for the sixth-man award.

http://www.jsonline.com/story/index.aspx?id=416179

orangedays · 04-15-2006, 10:46 PM

At least the days of TD and KG dominating the All-NBA first team are finally over.

Dirk-V-P!

dude1394 · 04-15-2006, 10:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chumdawg

Who said nobody realized they would miss Dirk a hell of a lot?

Thirty games might be a bit low. I'm thinking they would be on the fringe of playoff competition, with something around 40 being more reasonable. But still, I don't think anyone would argue that point with you.

I don't see it to be honest. I think they would be out of the playoffs big time. Their rebounding would be horrific, no one could shoot the ball, no double teams on anyone on the team.

Who would the starting lineup be? Jason, Stack, Josh, Powell?, Diop?

It would be horrific imo.

dude1394 · 04-15-2006, 10:57 PM

Man I sure never figured Nash to be as good as Larry Bird and Tim Duncan but heck...since all of those intelligent eastern sports writers say so, I guess he is?

Fooled me however.

Milles · 04-15-2006, 10:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by orangedays

At least the days of TD and KG dominating the All-NBA first team are finally over.

Dirk-V-P!

I hadn't noticed that. No KG and Duncan 3rd team. Wow.

chumdawg · 04-15-2006, 11:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dude1394

I don't see it to be honest. I think they would be out of the playoffs big time. Their rebounding would be horrific, no one could shoot the ball, no double teams on anyone on the team.

Who would the starting lineup be? Jason, Stack, Josh, Powell?, Diop?

It would be horrific imo.

Well, I have news for you. If the supporting cast isn't even good enough to contend for the playoffs, there is no way in frozen hell that the Mavs are winning the title this year. Not with Dirk, not with Magic, not with Jordan, not with whoever.

And there just ain't no getting around that. In the playoffs it will depend a lot on the supporting cast. We saw that last year, when at times we were able to take Steve Nash out of the game if we wanted to take that gamble. Let someone else beat us, the mantra was.

The Mavs are doomed if the rest of the team is that bad. Doomed. No second chances. No funeral. Doomed.

dude1394 · 04-15-2006, 11:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chumdawg

Well, I have news for you. If the supporting cast isn't even good enough to contend for the playoffs, there is no way in frozen hell that the Mavs are winning the title this year. Not with Dirk, not with Magic, not with Jordan, not with whoever.

And there just ain't no getting around that. In the playoffs it will depend a lot on the supporting cast. We saw that last year, when at times we were able to take Steve Nash out of the game if we wanted to take that gamble. Let someone else beat us, the mantra was.

The Mavs are doomed if the rest of the team is that bad. Doomed. No second chances. No funeral. Doomed.

Then they just may be doomed. But I don't see that group making the playoffs. They would be stiff defensively but wouldn't be able to score.

chumdawg · 04-15-2006, 11:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dude1394

Then they just may be doomed. But I don't see that group making the playoffs. They would be stiff defensively but wouldn't be able to score.

Which would put them, what, second or third in the East?