Another Dallas/Portland Trade - Dallas-Mavs.com Forums

Nash13 · 06-08-2005, 12:51 AM

Dallas Trades

Devin Harris
Marquis Daniels

Portland Trades

Derek Anderson
#3 pick

Donnie wouldn't be at pre-draft workout for no reason. They should use that pick and get Paul. He's more NBA ready then Harris was, and has a better perimeter game.

EricaLubarsky · 06-08-2005, 03:07 AM

First, give Harris a chance. Second, I just dont see much that would motivate me to get the 3rd pick. There are a few guys in the middle of the 1st that I'd trade for and think a pick in the middle to late first round could be had without giving up Harris.

aexchange · 06-08-2005, 08:06 AM

i'd do it.

we need a pass first pg who can run a team. i dont think harris or daniels fits that mold. not sure if i really like anderson, but i suppose we have to take some to get some.

Arne · 06-08-2005, 08:31 AM

Raymond Felton is my candidate. So I'd trade for a pick somewhere lower. The only problem is that New Orleans would really like to get a point guard and it's quite possible that they draft Raymond, who's been pretty damn good in his workouts.

If you're looking for a NBA-pass-first-point guard than you should really consider picking Raymond. He's pure muscle and body-wise, NBA material.

fin4life · 06-08-2005, 11:25 AM

NO.

Why is it so hard for everyone to be patient with our young players. Doesn't everyone realize that trading last year's #5 pick that is being developed just to get this year's #3 pick so we can develop them is just taking a step backwards. BE PATIENT. Quis and Devin are a big part of our future.

Nash13 · 06-08-2005, 12:02 PM

To Erica and Fin,

I think Harris is going to be a good player one day, i just think Paul is going to be better.

FreshJive · 06-08-2005, 04:28 PM

I would be extremely excited about Paul or Felton. I would definately do this trade.

Flip41 · 06-08-2005, 04:52 PM

I was looking around for a point guard that had similar numbers to Devin thier rookie year and I found this and though it was interesting. Maybe Devin just needs more time. We don't need to just jump up and trade him. I myself have even thought about trading him, but after looking around at all options and finding this, I think it's encouraging

Baron Davis
YEAR TEAM G GS MPG FG% 3P% FT% OFF DEF RPG APG SPG BPG TO PF PPG
99-00 CHA 82 0 18.6 .420 .225 .634 .60 1.40 2.00 3.8 1.18 .23 1.71 2.50 5.9

Devin Harris
YEAR TEAM G GS MPG FG% 3P% FT% OFF DEF RPG APG SPG BPG TO PF PPG
04-05 DAL 76 19 15.4 .429 .336 .757 .40 1.00 1.30 2.2 1.01 . 25 1.08 1.80 5.7

The Miles · 06-08-2005, 07:46 PM

Devin had the same season as Luke Ridnour had as a rookie and I don't know about you guys but I would rather have Luke than Felton. Chris Paul is very good though, that would be tough. Personally, I don't do it, I believe in Devin Harris and have since he was at Wisconsin, he caught my eye there and was pleased when we drafted him (tho I had hoped Livingston would fall to #5 going in).

If we did do this trade I would much rather have draft Gerald Green and then just sign Jay Williams. Jay has beeing working out with Dee Brown (IU) and Raymond Felton and reportedly looks to be back.

Bottom line, other than Chris Paul and perhaps Deron Williams, there isn't a PG in this draft I like as much as Devin Harris. I do love Gerald Green though, 6'8" cat with great athleticsm and already has a stroke. He would be 3 years off but that would be about the time Finley is wrapping it up.

gnzl312 · 06-08-2005, 10:29 PM

stupid trade

gnzl312 · 06-08-2005, 10:31 PM

EXACTLY

Pirate · 06-08-2005, 10:41 PM

Pointless.

Point guards take time to develop. Not one year, but several. It is easy to keep chasing the next new fad, but you merely end up with one rookie after another.

dirno2000 · 06-08-2005, 11:03 PM

Why would Portland want Harris when they drafted Telfair in the lottery last year?

sike · 06-08-2005, 11:20 PM

Harris stays if thats the offer.

stressboy2 · 06-09-2005, 01:31 AM

Portland is a real enigma for me since I have no idea what they are going to do moving forward. Do they want to cut salary more? Do they wish they had not given Randolf and Miles the franchise? They have to be kicking themselves over Ratliff's contract also. What is it worth to get rid of Pattersons bad seed? Do they really want Green? He would look awesome next to Outlaw, but who would play the 2 and who will play the 5 after next year? I know they don't plan on getting one of the PG's. So if I'm a billionare without a clue about basketball what do i do?

If I'm the GM, I try to get multiple picks and use the highest to sell some salary. Thus I would probably try to get #5 and #13 from Charlotte, I don't think I can make that happen so, I end up with #7 and #16 from Toronto. I then package Ratliff/Patterson/#7 for an expiring contract, in this example we will do the Dallas scenario of KVH/Bradley.

Dallas then drafts ??? at number 7. Best big man? Best Player? Antoine Wright? Splitter, Vasquez, HS phenom?

Don't really care for it from the Dallas end, but a pretty good draft from Portlands point of view i think. They dump a max salary to go after a max FA next summer, they get a Backup Center for when Pryzbilla hits FA and they still get a young player in a decent draft. In the end, though I think they just sit back and take Green.

This is Stressboy a.k.a. Stressboy2

Pirate · 06-09-2005, 02:06 AM

Cuban-etc has said in the past the Mavs will not accept Patterson on the Mavs, ever. His off the court baggage is too large for them to brush aside.

Ratliff might be intriguing for Dallas, but you would have to find a way to send them a similar amount of long term salary in some way to satisfy Cuban's approach. Would both teams be open to Finley-Bradley for Ratliff-Miles-cash, perhaps? That gets two "veteran good guys" to a Portland team that desperately needs an infusion of character. (Mavs take back 9M more than they send away in that swap, justifying the cash.) Mavs then have wriggled out from under the Finley and Bradley contracts and gotten the needed backup center to pair with Dampier, as well as another usable swing man who is much younger than Finley, to toss into the mix.

Dalhoop · 06-09-2005, 07:34 AM

In Portland, they would be willing to move some big bodies for medium sized bogies. Przybilla is the future center, Outlaw is young athletic and a very nice PF that they are high on. I doubt they would trade for another big man, as they have too many as it is. When healthy there PF/SF looks like our SG/SF, too many bodies. They wont trade Przy or Outlaw as they both are very young and have massive upside. They have to decide on Seung-Jin and may keep Theo around in case Jin is not ready. They have five bodies for two positions at PF/SF Abdur-Rahim, Outlaw, Randolph, Miles, and Patterson all of them, except Outlaw, want starting minutes. Portland would like to trade one of those guys for a SG, they have few quality guys at that position (Frahm and Anderson) at PG they have Stoudamire, Van Exel and Telfair (with only the last under contract).

I can see them trading Randolph and/or Patterson for a starting SG and a serviceable PG (to back to Telfair if he is not ready). The Mavs should not be in the market for either player, we have a PF and SF that WILL get most of the minutes.

The Miles · 06-09-2005, 11:49 AM

What about Stackhouse + Bradley for Theo Ratliff? Would you guys do that? Portland needs a SG as it seems Derek Anderson has kinda fell off of the radar.

fin4life · 06-09-2005, 12:06 PM

Well accourding to Chad Ford (which means almost nothing), the Blazes are considering making a deal for Paul Pierce the would involve thje #3 pick. That would more than solve their SG problem

u2sarajevo · 06-09-2005, 12:06 PM

Theo Ratliff for Stackhouse? No thanks.

I guess it is a bit intriguing, but would he accept the role we would need him to play here?

And our roster would look a bit more like the Hawks of 03. [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif[/img]

edit: To make my remarks more user friendly.

grndmstr_c · 06-09-2005, 12:53 PM

Quote:

What about Stackhouse + Bradley for Theo Ratliff?

Don't like it. For one thing, I'm not at all confident that this improves the team more than not making the trade and signing a backup 5 in FA. I also tend to thing Stack should have more value than this, in trade terms and as a player given the large question mark currently hanging over Marquis' head. It's not that I'd have a problem with Ratliff as the backup C, it's just that with his injury history and contract I'm not willing to give up a commodity like Stack to get him.

dalmations202 · 06-09-2005, 12:57 PM

How about? ?
Theo Ratliff
6-10 C from Wyoming
4.8 ppg, 5.3 rpg, 0.5 apg in 27.5 minutes

Derek Anderson
6-5 SG from Kentucky
9.2 ppg, 2.7 rpg, 3.0 apg in 26.3 minutes

Darius Miles
6-9 SF from East St. Louis HS (IL)
12.8 ppg, 4.8 rpg, 2.0 apg in 27.0 minutes
Incoming

Michael Finley
6-7 SG from Wisconsin
15.7 ppg, 4.1 rpg, 2.6 apg in 36.8 minutes

Marquis Daniels
6-6 SG from Auburn
9.1 ppg, 3.6 rpg, 2.1 apg in 23.5 minutes

Shawn Bradley
7-6 C from Brigham Young
2.7 ppg, 2.8 rpg, 0.2 apg in 11.5 minutes

Successful Scenario --The Trade ID for this scenario is 2411586.

Would either side do this one? Would Dallas do it if Portland kicked in a 2nd rounder? Would Dallas/Portland need to kick in some cash?

grndmstr_c · 06-09-2005, 01:13 PM

Dalm, I'm really not interested in trading for Anderson. Too much of a question mark. Miles and Theo are guys I woudn't mind having, but I'm loath to give up a 3 pt threat like Finley when we're not getting any kind of reliable shooter in return, and I maintain that I'm not in any kind of hurry to give up Marquis because I think there's a good possibility his value will rebound from its current relatively low level after a healthy summer. Bottom line, I just don't see how that trade improves the team enough to set back the chemistry development.

dalmations202 · 06-09-2005, 02:39 PM

I'm not sold on it either, but it meets some aspects that some seem to want.

Dalhoop · 06-09-2005, 05:34 PM

Assuming this happens the we have Terry, Anderson, Howard, Dirk and Dampier as starters with Harris, Stackhouse, Miles, KVH, and Ratliff on the bench (Stack and Anderson may switch positions).

I don't like the long range shooting on this teams starters, though with Miles, KVH, and Stack coming off the bench would be special. Would Miles like playing behind Howard with little hope of replacing him in the starting line-up? (he wants to start now in Portland)

zhartman · 06-09-2005, 10:16 PM

If anyone has been paying attention, the whole problem with our team is that the chemistry isn't there. That's the only reason I was unhappy with Cuban letting Nash go. We had a chemistry with him. I can only imagine what would have happened if we wouldd have had Howard, Nash, Dampier, Dirk, and Finley. I know some say Dampier mught not be here if we would of signed Nash. But who knows. So why would we get rid of Harris. He is defiently capable to be a great PG. Plus who in the NBA could teache a defensice PG better than Avery. OK. So no trade. Although Felton is a great player

dalmations202 · 06-10-2005, 12:08 PM

While in a perfect world, you would love to have great time to develop chemistry. In a racing analogy -- time to break in a motor. But if you don't have the correct parts, and pieces, you will never build an ultimate winner.

Does Dallas have the pieces/parts to be the winner? ?

LRB · 06-10-2005, 12:17 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by: dalmations202
While in a perfect world, you would love to have great time to develop chemistry. In a racing analogy -- time to break in a motor. But if you don't have the correct parts, and pieces, you will never build an ultimate winner.

Does Dallas have the pieces/parts to be the winner? ?

Well since Dallas won 58 games this season with tons of inuries to key players and a huge turnover in players and a midseason coaching change. Then played like crap in the playoffs but were still 1 mistake away from forcing a game 7 in the 2nd round, I would say that we have sufficient talent if we can get the proper chemistry. These guys really need a 2nd year together to see if we can develop that chemistry, otherwise we're banking on getting so much more talent than anyone else that we can win it all sans chemistry. I don't like the odds of that happening.

If this team sticks together and just has normal levels on injuries next year, I don't see why they can't win 60+ games and seriously contend for a championship. At some point in time we have to stop blowing the team up and starting all over again. That said, I feel we could still do some Minor tweaking of the Roster, but if done it definitely should be minor unless we have a chance to land a huge talent gain in a trade. So if Cleveland calls and wants to trade LeBron for TAW, then I won't have a problem with it. [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-wink.gif[/img]

dalmations202 · 06-10-2005, 12:47 PM

Ok, then what is a Minor tweak?

Is TAW gone a minor tweak? What about Bradley, DA, Henderson? What about Daniels, KVH, Stackhouse, Terry, Harris? What about Fin? What about Benga and PPod?

Is it the player, or the number of players that makes it a minor tweak?

I tend to agree with what you are saying, but my minor tweaking, and yours, and Donnie/Marks are all probably different.

I don't want to retool, and start over -- but I would like to see a few minor tweaks (from my opinion of course) made.

LRB · 06-10-2005, 12:59 PM

Minor Tweak would be trading no more than 1 player from the top 6 in the rotation, and trading no more than 1 player in the next 3 in the rotation, The rest of the roster is tradeable providing no more than a total of 5 players are traded and preferrably no more than a total of 4.

That's my definition anyways. Yeah I know we all have slightly different definitions, especially Donnie and Mark. However my expectations are the above unless we can land an allstar level talent without giving up a allstar level talent. That would be my definition of a significant increase in talent. So if we had to trade say Fin and Stack to get Ray Allen + filler, then I'd be for it since neither Fin nor Stack are currently at allstar talent leve and Allen is.

dalmations202 · 06-10-2005, 03:12 PM

So, If Mark traded Damp (1 in top 6), Daniels (1 second 3), Bradley (10th), TAW, -- and got back say Dalembert, Ratliff, and filler : this would be a minor tweak? ? Since none of them are all-star talent..................

[img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif[/img]

jayC · 06-10-2005, 03:30 PM

2 things have to happen for Ray Allen to become a mav. 1) He has to demand a trade to Dallas. 2) the mavs have to give up a young big.

What are the holes on seattle?

PF and backup pg. What about a keith van horn and pavel podkolzin to seattle for Ray Allen.
Seattle then would be a tough match up for most teams on the perimeter.

Ridnour
Ronald Murray
Rashard Lewis
Keith Van Horn
Jerome James

Dallas would have its 3 point shooter and slasher in Allen. Finley could either except a bench role or be traded.

Terry/Harris
Ray Allen/Stackhouse
Howard/Daniels
Dirk/
Dampier/DJ

The mavs then would have three great three point shooters in the starting lineup and three guys that can create their own shot.

LRB · 06-10-2005, 03:51 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by: dalmations202
So, If Mark traded Damp (1 in top 6), Daniels (1 second 3), Bradley (10th), TAW, -- and got back say Dalembert, Ratliff, and filler : this would be a minor tweak? ? Since none of them are all-star talent..................

[img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif[/img]

That would be stretching it, but yes I'd consider that a minor tweak. And I'd probably do that trade if it was offered. It sure would be hard not to. I just not going to hold my breath for this to happen. [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif[/img]

dalmations202 · 06-10-2005, 04:00 PM

Quote:

That would be stretching it, but yes I'd consider that a minor tweak.

Then tweak away...........LOL [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif[/img]

MFFL41 · 06-10-2005, 04:28 PM

Switch PPod or Mbenga for Harris and it's a deal.

TAW could be a throw in for cap relief.

and with the third pick, I would take Gerald Green. He's going to be a star. We can put him at SG for Finley.

gnzl312 · 06-11-2005, 01:05 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by: jayC
2 things have to happen for Ray Allen to become a mav. 1) He has to demand a trade to Dallas. 2) the mavs have to give up a young big.

What are the holes on seattle?

PF and backup pg. What about a keith van horn and pavel podkolzin to seattle for Ray Allen.
Seattle then would be a tough match up for most teams on the perimeter.

Ridnour
Ronald Murray
Rashard Lewis
Keith Van Horn
Jerome James

Dallas would have its 3 point shooter and slasher in Allen. Finley could either except a bench role or be traded.

Terry/Harris
Ray Allen/Stackhouse
Howard/Daniels
Dirk/
Dampier/DJ

The mavs then would have three great three point shooters in the starting lineup and three guys that can create their own shot.

I would do this trade in a heartbeat but dont think seatle is that stupid