are the mavs better off without signing d. williams now?

[BGMaverick9]

Originally Posted by Rick41

Do you think he's going to get booed as loud as Lamar Odom?

Personally, I doubt Deron gets booed. Maybe enough people want to heckle, but it won't resonate as an major boo.

[howdoesmydirktaste]

Deron is full of shit. It's the ego man. The bright lights of NYC, being JayZ's "boi". I'm not considering my prediction "bold", but I'm convinced we will finish with a better record than Brooklyn (in a tougher conference).

Joe Johnson? Are you serious?

[G-Man]

If you add up the reasons Deron had for staying in New York, starting with the extra 25 million, and being a star in the nation's biggest city, and the fact that his wife loves it there, and Joe Johnson, and an owner willing to throw money down a rat hole, I don't think Cuban's presence at a meeting would change the balance very much. Deron leaving 25 mil on the table is a lot different than LeBron doing it. His shoe contract alone more than makes up the difference...not to mention that Deron' endorsement value in New York is worth a lot more millions as well.

Unless he was really hungry for home cooking, Dallas's bid was simply not competitive. And for less than 1 of those 25 million, he can fly him mom in to cook, and buy her a nice condo to stay in while she's up there.

[Murphy3]

It's not hard to see how Cuban not being there could rub Williams the wrong way. Cuban's at everything Mavs related but he chooses not to show up to the DWilliams sales pitch? How would you think DWilliams would feel? "The guy's involved in everything Mavs related but doesn't have time for me?".

The Nets owner not showing up was just part for the course. It's what was expected. The Mavs needed to go above and beyond.. Cuban didn't do that.

[Big Boy Laroux]

Originally Posted by Murphy3

It's not hard to see how Cuban not being there could rub Williams the wrong way. Cuban's at everything Mavs related but he chooses not to show up to the DWilliams sales pitch? How would you think DWilliams would feel? "The guy's involved in everything Mavs related but doesn't have time for me?".

The Nets owner not showing up was just part for the course. It's what was expected. The Mavs needed to go above and beyond.. Cuban didn't do that.

Couldn't have said it better myself. Actually, I may have. Let's leave that up to the judges.

I also would have said "par for the course"

[DevinHarriswillstart]

Originally Posted by Big Boy Laroux

The two don't have to be mutually exclusive. Deron is to blame for his choice (he wanted more money), but Cuban also made a mistake by not showing up.

When you don't have the extra money to offer, you need to go above and beyond in catering to these egos. And not showing up to a meeting is not going above and beyond.

The problem is gauging Deron wanting to come here versus Cuban wanting him to come here. It is a merry-go-round that really isn't going to solve anything.

[DevinHarriswillstart]

Originally Posted by Murphy3

It's not hard to see how Cuban not being there could rub Williams the wrong way. Cuban's at everything Mavs related but he chooses not to show up to the DWilliams sales pitch? How would you think DWilliams would feel? "The guy's involved in everything Mavs related but doesn't have time for me?".

The Nets owner not showing up was just part for the course. It's what was expected. The Mavs needed to go above and beyond.. Cuban didn't do that.

The main problem is where do you draw the line? If Cuban showed up for Deron, then does he have to show up for every free agent? Will every free agent have sour grapes because Cuban didn't show up? Maybe Cuban didn't want him that badly after all? Maybe Deron was never coming here to begin with? It doesn't really matter now because it is what it is.

[Big Boy Laroux]

The point is that taking the stance of "Cuban not showing up didn't matter at all" is wrong.

If think a lot of you may may be trying to say "Cuban not showing up SHOULD NOT have mattered at all", and I would agree with that. The owner showing up to a meeting really shouldn't have an affect on the player's decision.

But in this case, it did have an affect on the ego of Williams, as mentioned by myself and others.

Am I 100% right? Of course not, no way to tell for sure. But if williams is saying it, there is at least a sliver of truth to it.

As for whether Cuban should attend all free agent meetings - I'm sure he's missed others in the past. And not all free agents are worth it. And maybe he didn't really even want Williams. And all that is fine. My point is trying to claim that it didn't matter at all is giving the egos of these superstar divas too much credit. And Cuban should have recognized that.

[davblue]

Originally Posted by DevinHarriswillstart

The main problem is where do you draw the line? If Cuban showed up for Deron, then does he have to show up for every free agent? Will every free agent have sour grapes because Cuban didn't show up? Maybe Cuban didn't want him that badly after all? Maybe Deron was never coming here to begin with? It doesn't really matter now because it is what it is.

My main issue with that is the organization basically stated that Deron Williams was their off-season goal. In the end, I'm happy with the direction the FO went in with their "Plan B", but there is no downside to having your very vocal owner who has a hand in all things Mavericks at the pitch for the player that is so clearly the top priority of the offseason... and this is coming from someone that loves Shark Tank.

[dude1394]

Deron wasn't chopped liver. He was the guy, the guy we tore down the team for..cubes should have been there IMO.

[Big Boy Laroux]

Originally Posted by dude1394

He was the guy, the guy we tore down the team for..

great point. Didn't pay Chandler. Didn't pay Barea (although I'm not really upset about that compared to chandler)

All so we could go after Williams. And then all of the sudden it's not important enough to Cuban?

[LonghornDub]

I'd imagine the truth is somewhere in the middle. But I wasn't happy with Cuban's decision at the time, and I'm still not. It was a pretty lame thing to do.

[spreedom]

I'm glad we're still talking about this. I wanted Deron too but we didn't get him. Oh well. I love what we were able to do after that whole mess cleared up.

Move on!!!!

[The Ghost of Championship]

Collision lol. /thread

[chumdawg]

Originally Posted by Big Boy Laroux

And maybe he didn't really even want Williams.

Could be some truth to this.

[Bayliss]

I griped about Cuban not being there when it happened. I was told that it wouldn't matter. Looks like it did matter.

[Big Boy Laroux]

Originally Posted by spreedom

I'm glad we're still talking about this. I wanted Deron too but we didn't get him. Oh well. I love what we were able to do after that whole mess cleared up.

Move on!!!!

The discussion has been raised from the dead due to Williams' recent comments that Cuban not showing up to the meeting clinched his decision.

[Ninkobei]

Hard to say. Its more fun to create a superstar than it is to sign one from free agency. If the Mavs suck horribly for a few years (which I do not think will happen) and they get some good draft picks that turn into excellent players, then that's fine by me. The "miami-la route" is successful but not nearly as meaningful from a fan's perspective.

[dude1394]

Originally Posted by Big Boy Laroux

The discussion has been raised from the dead due to Williams' recent comments that Cuban not showing up to the meeting clinched his decision.

Yea like what is there to chat about except a pretty bad pre-season game.

[Murphy3]

Originally Posted by Big Boy Laroux

Couldn't have said it better myself. Actually, I may have. Let's leave that up to the judges.

I also would have said "par for the course"

Ha...talk about a bad typo. What the hell?

[LonghornDub]

Originally Posted by chumdawg

Could be some truth to this.

I don't think this is true exactly. But I do think that after Deron made his choice, Cuban started to genuinely think we might be better off (at least, once he made the other additions).

I'm sure that's rationalization to a degree, but there's a reasonable objective point somewhere in there. The roster would have been thin as hell with just Dirk and Deron on max Ks. As much as I wanted Deron here, that's a pretty scary proposition.

[Ninkobei]

Let's also mention the fact that it would not be proper for the owner of a team to show up to literally beg a player to join his franchise. Props to Cubes for having self respect for both him and his GM. If the player can't discuss a deal with the GM, F' him.

[Murphy3]

Originally Posted by Ninkobei

Let's also mention the fact that it would not be proper for the owner of a team to show up to literally beg a player to join his franchise. Props to Cubes for having self respect for both him and his GM. If the player can't discuss a deal with the GM, F' him.

Beg? Why would he have to beg... Cuban has his hands on everything Mavs related. It probably was a bit of a shocker to DWilliams for Cuban not to be there. It's very, very easy to see how this could have negatively impacted the situation with regards to the Mavs signing DWilliams.

[Ninkobei]

Originally Posted by Murphy3

Beg? Why would he have to beg... Cuban has his hands on everything Mavs related. It probably was a bit of a shocker to DWilliams for Cuban not to be there. It's very, very easy to see how this could have negatively impacted the situation with regards to the Mavs signing DWilliams.

It's idiotic that somehow the owner of a sports franchise has to show up at a players party just to be considered interested in said player. No, DWill had his mind made up already and just wanted to drag Cubes through some hoops for amusement. I respect Cubes for not taking the bait.

[Murphy3]

Originally Posted by Ninkobei

It's idiotic that somehow the owner of a sports franchise has to show up at a players party just to be considered interested in said player. No, DWill had his mind made up already and just wanted to drag Cubes through some hoops for amusement. I respect Cubes for not taking the bait.

Your usage of the word idiotic in your post was idiotic.

[SMC0007]

Like anyone could even know that.... yet. Or ever. Imo, this thread lacks discipline.

[Murphy3]

The thing is this... We don't know. We will never know. I would have rather the Mavs take their best shot with Cuban there. It makes little sense for him not to be there especially considering some might believe it's a personal slight for him not to show up. If I were a free agent in DWilliams situation, I might consider it a slight as well (that is, if DWilliams does indeed feel this way). Now, would it impact my decision? Probably not. But if it was a virtual dead heat between the two teams, I suppose it very well could help to be a deciding factor. To 100% say that it would play no role under any circumstances is silly. To 100% say that it would play no role under the DWilliams circumstance is nothing more than pure speculation. I'm saying that it could have played a minor role..nothing else.

[Big Boy Laroux]

right, as i stated before - was it THE factor? No. Was it A Factor? Yes.

Should it matter if the owner is there? No. We would all like to think that if we were athletes, it wouldn't matter. Would it matter to me if the CEO of a company didn't show up in person to interview me? of course not. But i'm not a high-profile athlete in an organization with 15 key employees.

To me, it's very easy to see how this could be a perceived slight, and even damage the ego. And that's not saying Cuban should have begged. Showing up to a meeting is not begging.

As Murph said, Cuban has proven he is hands-on with all things mavs-related. this was very much mavs-related. Comparing to prokhorov is just making excuses for Cuban. prokhorov has proven he is an absentee owner. Cuban is very much the opposite.

[Murphy3]

Originally Posted by Big Boy Laroux

right, as i stated before - was it THE factor? No. Was it A Factor? Yes.

Should it matter if the owner is there? No. We would all like to think that if we were athletes, it wouldn't matter. Would it matter to me if the CEO of a company didn't show up in person to interview me? of course not. But i'm not a high-profile athlete in an organization with 15 key employees.

To me, it's very easy to see how this could be a perceived slight, and even damage the ego. And that's not saying Cuban should have begged. Showing up to a meeting is not begging.

As Murph said, Cuban has proven he is hands-on with all things mavs-related. this was very much mavs-related. Comparing to prokhorov is just making excuses for Cuban. prokhorov has proven he is an absentee owner. Cuban is very much the opposite.

Well said. However, I would have used more "...."

[DevinHarriswillstart]

I'm just not sure Cuban could sell deron on less money and how to build the team outside of him and Dirk. It seems fairly obvious that Cubes didn't think Deron was the end all be all of the franchise.

[Ninkobei]

Originally Posted by Murphy3

Your usage of the word idiotic in your post was idiotic.

I really wish you'd find someone else to troll. literally 90% of my posts have you coming along right behind them disagreeing with me.

[wilmtalk]

Originally Posted by Ninkobei

It's idiotic that somehow the owner of a sports franchise has to show up at a players party just to be considered interested in said player. No, DWill had his mind made up already and just wanted to drag Cubes through some hoops for amusement. I respect Cubes for not taking the bait.

I agree. I think DWill had already made his decision. He just said that Cubes not showing up was the final thing that made up his mind to get back at Cubes for his latter statement. If that were not the case then Cubes would have made every effort to show. The mavs front office must have seen the handwriting on the wall already.

[Thomas86]

Originally Posted by wilmtalk

I agree. I think DWill had already made his decision. He just said that Cubes not showing up was the final thing that made up his mind to get back at Cubes for his latter statement. If that were not the case then Cubes would have made every effort to show. The mavs front office must have seen the handwriting on the wall already.

I think that's the main reason Cuban didn't go to the meeting, D-Will turning down 25 mill plus being the man/face of the Nets might have been to much for the Mavs to overcome and Cuban saved himself the heartbreak.

[Kidd Karma]

Originally Posted by DevinHarriswillstart

I'm just not sure Cuban could sell deron on less money and how to build the team outside of him and Dirk. It seems fairly obvious that Cubes didn't think Deron was the end all be all of the franchise.

Yea, difficult to sell, especially if Cubes didn't view him as that quintessential star everyone had to have. You even look at Kidd's free agency for 2003. He could have tossed 20 million for a chance at the Spurs rings, but he maxed out with NJ, even though it was a matter of time before Nj was dismantled, they were pretenders in a weak conference.

[Murphy3]

Originally Posted by Ninkobei

I really wish you'd find someone else to troll. literally 90% of my posts have you coming along right behind them disagreeing with me.

Ninkobei.. I don't have a clue as to who you are.. don't have a clue as to anything you've ever posted on this site. I don't know you from Ghost of Championship, SinSin or just about anyone else on the site. I recognize your user name but I don't have any recollection of anything that you've ever posted on this site.

Yeah, there are a handful of people that I have a good idea as to what they stand for as far as basketball philosophy or anything else basketball related. You're just not one of them. You're like the color of paint in my old office.. Once I switched offices, my Admin Assistant asked me if I wanted an accent wall like I had in my previous office. I didn't have the slightest clue that my office walls were painted two different colors. I had to go back and look at the office to make sure she was right. You, like the color of paint in my old office..just not something that I've ever paid much attention to. And as soon as I post this, probably not something or someone that I'll think about again.

[Murphy3]

Originally Posted by wilmtalk

I agree. I think DWill had already made his decision. He just said that Cubes not showing up was the final thing that made up his mind to get back at Cubes for his latter statement. If that were not the case then Cubes would have made every effort to show. The mavs front office must have seen the handwriting on the wall already.

I "think" he probably had also. I don't think that it played much if any role. However, it is pretty stupid to say that it definitely did not or could not play a role. That is all. Each person makes their own decisions based upon their own reasons. Williams is the only person that knows for sure.

[sefant77]

Deron Williams is already tired of talking about Dallas Mavericks' owner Mark Cuban.

Williams considered signing with the Mavericks, but ultimately re-signed with the Brooklyn Nets.

“I’m not gonna go back and forth with Mark Cuban,” Williams said following practice on Wednesday. “Don’t even ask me about Mark Cuban.

“I’m not gonna any questions about the Dallas Mavericks or Mark Cuban for the rest of the year. Even when we go play Dallas or they come here, I’m not answering [any] questions about the Dallas Mavericks.”

Crybaby...first trying to take a swing at Mark and then this. Have fun in Brooklyn with Billy King and Co...

[CapitanObvious]

F*** Deron Williams. Mavs got Jared Cunningham.

[sinsin]

Originally Posted by CapitanObvious

F*** Deron Williams. Mavs got Jared Cunningham.

thats obvious!

[Kidd Karma]

Originally Posted by sefant77

Crybaby...first trying to take a swing at Mark and then this. Have fun in Brooklyn with Billy King and Co...

Agreed, he's the one that took the first shot, then goes and walks away expecting nothing, chicken. I mean the way the guy played the last 2 years in NJ and the effort he gave....save the game against Lin, was mediocre at best. Barely .500 is what he's going to get this year....barring getting in the middle and stirring the pot.