Odom is a doofus - Page 14 - Dallas-Mavs.com Forums

FINtastic · 03-25-2012, 11:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by grndmstr_c

Maybe you're right. I just don't think there's sufficient evidence either way. Dirk for one doesn't agree with you, though, so I wouldn't mind seeing them try it.

As far as his post-up ability, it should be noted that last season he ranked 3rd in the league in PPP at 1.23 in post-up possessions. The year before, he was much lower at 0.96 PPP in 112 post-up possessions, but that was still good for 35th in the league.

This year he certainly has been terrible at it - 0.55 PPP in 44 possessions - but then again in what facet of his game has he not been terrible? Honestly, I'll be glad when this thread title finally comes true.

bobatundi · 03-26-2012, 07:23 AM

Odom has zero value on the court this year, but there's no way the Mavs are going to waive him or buy him out before the season ends. He's worth too much as a trade chip.

The Mavs can trade Odom and $2.5MM to another team for around $10MM in contracts (S&T, or just a team looking to dump salary) with that other team able to waive Odom. It costs the other team absolutely nothing, so they'd be saving $10MM, and the Mavs could get somebody really solid out of it.

Too bad we have to put up with having him on the roster until that happens though.

jthig32 · 03-26-2012, 08:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by b_o_r

From your post in the Lamar Odom Traded to Dallas thread

We don't run the middle PnR much with our Bigs, just the side PnR to get the guard an open J.

At this point it doesn't even matter. You don't get good players that you have to count on for nothing. The Mavericks got him for nothing and he has given them nothing in return. You get what you pay for.

Bring on the 3-guard lineup at this point.

That post also mentions that he was in the top 50 on post ups, which you claims he can't do. And in fact, the entire point of that tweet and my posting it was to show how versatile Odom has historically been.

We didn't get him for nothing, and it's ridiculous to try to write off his complete and utter failure based on how we acquired him. West and Wright were attained for what literally is "nothing" in the NBA and they've looked like Hall of Fame caliber players compared to Odom.

No more excuses, he's been horrible, and it's on him. It's all on him.

jthig32 · 03-26-2012, 08:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bobatundi

Odom has zero value on the court this year, but there's no way the Mavs are going to waive him or buy him out before the season ends. He's worth too much as a trade chip.

The Mavs can trade Odom and $2.5MM to another team for around $10MM in contracts (S&T, or just a team looking to dump salary) with that other team able to waive Odom. It costs the other team absolutely nothing, so they'd be saving $10MM, and the Mavs could get somebody really solid out of it.

Too bad we have to put up with having him on the roster until that happens though.

The problem with the idea of using him as a trade chip is that his contract becomes guaranteed on June 30th if he hasn't been waived. That's not enough time to use him as a trade asset.

But you are correct that they're not going to buy him out, because unless he waived next year's salary (which he has no incentive to do at this point), it would hurt their cap next year significantly.

LonghornDub · 03-26-2012, 09:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jthig32

The problem with the idea of using him as a trade chip is that his contract becomes guaranteed on June 30th if he hasn't been waived. That's not enough time to use him as a trade asset.

Draft night is June 28th. You don't think they could find a taker for him with all the wheeling and dealing that goes on that day?

jthig32 · 03-26-2012, 09:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LonghornDub

Draft night is June 28th. You don't think they could find a taker for him with all the wheeling and dealing that goes on that day?

You're right, they could use him that day. So it's not completely worthless.

But it's not a Damp situation where you have the entire off season to find the best fit.

And they're not going to be looking to bring back a ton of salary at that point, with the Deron situation still unresolved.

At best, they could try to move him along with some cash to a team under the cap and let them waive him so that 2.4Mil doesn't go on the Mavs books. I think that's the best they can hope for.

dude1394 · 03-26-2012, 09:53 AM

I think they'll have something lined up when the clock strikes midnight.

howdoesmydirktaste · 03-26-2012, 10:00 AM

We are not going to get rid of Odom until the season is over. If I'm Carlisle, I'm making a phone call to Phil Jackson to get his take on how to light a fire (that sticks) under Odom's ass. Odom playing to his potential would be of value to us in the playoffs. Of course, drawing the Lakers in the first round would be a good time for him to wake up.

ribosoma · 03-26-2012, 10:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by b_o_r

From your post in the Lamar Odom Traded to Dallas thread

We don't run the middle PnR much with our Bigs, just the side PnR to get the guard an open J.

At this point it doesn't even matter. You don't get good players that you have to count on for nothing. The Mavericks got him for nothing and he has given them nothing in return. You get what you pay for.

Bring on the 3-guard lineup at this point.

We run literally every possible deviation of the middle pick-and-roll. I'm not sure if you understand what a middle pick-and-roll looks like, but it is at the core of the offense.

I've seen us run all of these countless times, and I am sure that there are many that I have missed:

A pure middle pick-and-roll we have used countless times to get Dirk or Kidd the wing 3, and Terry or Vince the corner 3.

Pure mid pick-and-roll we have used to get Dirk the ball on the low block.

A very simple middle pick-and-roll play we have used to get Dirk a look for a wing 3, or Terry a baseline J.

A variation of a "horns" mid pick-and-roll set we have used in late game situations to get Vince a three, or to get Dirk the ball at the freethrow line on a switch for an iso.

A variation of a "horns" set utilizing the mid pick-and-roll that we have run to get an alley-oop for Wright and dunks for Haywood/Mahinmi.

A variation of the "horns" set utilizing the middle pick-and-roll to get Dirk a freethrow-line J, or a 3 way go isolation.

A variation of the "horns" set utilizing the middle pick-and-roll to get Wright the ball in a low block mismatch due to a switch, Terry a straight-away 3, or Vince a corner 3.

The problem with Odom certainly isn't the offense, it's his lack of tenacity that he has been know for up until now. There doesn't seem to be the junkyard dog in him that there was last year. We need him to play angry. When he does, he is an efficient, dangerous weapon. When he doesn't he is a body who mucks up sets and eats up the shot clock.

This is angry Lamar (a guy we have yet to see):

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wv3fWUVkYVI

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HM61v...eature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature...&v=37lPwGZ0s_c

grndmstr_c · 03-26-2012, 12:33 PM

There is only one thing in all of Mav'dom that I find to be anywhere near as irritating as Lamar Odom, and that is Tim MacMahon's reporting on Lamar Odom.

jthig32 · 03-26-2012, 12:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by grndmstr_c

There is only one thing in all of Mav'dom that I find to be anywhere near as irritating as Lamar Odom, and that is Tim MacMahon's reporting.

Fixed that for you.

xavier · 03-26-2012, 01:07 PM

I had the best dream ever. Then I woke up and realized lamar is still a Mav! Damn.

j0Shi · 03-26-2012, 01:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jthig32

Fixed that for you.

+1

Can't stand that guy. Way too negative and often simply wrong in so many ways. Also last year.

Should cover "his" Cowboys exclusively...

4Dirk1Nowitzki · 03-26-2012, 01:50 PM

I'm over Lamar and don't expect him to have long stretches of playing decent basketball. We're better off with Marion at the 4 when Dirk goes to the bench. VC at the 3 and then whatever combo of 1-2 RC comes up with will be fine.

By Marion playing the 4 we dont lose much. VC comes in at three and can hit outside shots. Lamar Odom is just not doing enough to help us even compete.

mavs777 · 03-26-2012, 02:24 PM

agreed, it's time to get him out of the rotation, the Mavs have given him countless oppurtunities and all he has done is sucked.

grndmstr_c · 03-26-2012, 03:09 PM

As irritated as I am with him, I'm not expecting to see him banished from the rotation just yet. Although there are unquestionably differences between the two situations, recall that last year Dallas went down to the wire in the regular season with a struggling Booby in the starting lineup before successfully changing things up in the playoffs. If I were the coaching staff I think I'd have that precedent in the back of my mind even as I continued to try to find 12 mpg or so and something, anything, that could work with Lamar through the duration of the regular season. If the last game or two arrives and he still hasn't found a way to consistently contribute, as seems destined to be the case, then I have little doubt that we'll see him planted firmly on the bench, Vince getting most of his minutes at SF, and Shawn taking the backup PF minutes from the get-go in the first round.

Of course, if the buffer between Dallas and the 9th seed starts getting too thin and Lamar is still worthless, I think that would probably speed up an irrevocable demotion to his new position on the team as Brian Cardinal's personal towel-boy.

SMC0007 · 03-26-2012, 03:29 PM

I also like a variation of Markus' idea. Give him a bunch of minutes and commit to two or three games of it, maybe you hit on something that works great. If not, now you know...you tried, move on.

grndmstr_c · 03-26-2012, 03:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SMC0007

I also like a variation of Markus' idea. Give him a bunch of minutes and commit to two or three games of it, maybe you hit on something that works great. If not, now you know...you tried, move on.

You really think Dallas can risk that with the standings in the middle of the West being as tight as they are? I sure don't.

nowhereman · 03-26-2012, 03:42 PM

As 03-04 was the Antoine Walker year, this, now, is the Lamar Odom year. 5 years from now, I'm fairly certain this saga will be the first thing I think of when I reflect.

Dirkadirkastan · 03-26-2012, 04:11 PM

The thing is, Odom still hasn't had a single good game this season. He's had about three games that would register on the low end of "Oh, that was a bad shooting game but at least it looked like the effort was there on a couple possessions," i.e. a possibly acceptable off-night if there was some semblance of production surrounding it. The rest of the time he's been a complete drain on the team.

That being said, I'm hesitant to sugarcoat any game as getting sincere effort from Odom. Think back to the game in NY after he passed the ball to Lin to end the 3rd. I think this was the only time he's smiled all season. Now, Marion's been known to yuk it up a few times after making dumb mistakes too, but at least you know he's busting his ass out there for you the other 99% of the time. Meanwhile, Odom is clowning around the other 99% of the time. Whatever he's doing out there, it has never once looked like winning is his goal.

SMC0007 · 03-26-2012, 04:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by grndmstr_c

You really think Dallas can risk that with the standings in the middle of the West being as tight as they are? I sure don't.

Well, that is something you have to monitor closely. I'm not saying get L.O. going at all costs. I just don't care too much about what seed we have as long as we make it to the postseason. It would be a nice little miracle to get him coming around by then.

Dirkadirkastan · 03-26-2012, 04:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SMC0007

Well, that is something you have to monitor closely. I'm not saying get L.O. going at all costs. I just don't care too much about what seed we have as long as we make it to the postseason. It would be a nice little miracle to get him coming around by then.

The horse was already led to water months ago.

j0Shi · 03-26-2012, 04:33 PM

It's so tough because the Mavs would be that much better with Lamar playing decent. And they know it.

mavspwnage · 03-26-2012, 04:56 PM

Where would you put Odom on the list of worst Mavs ever? I think he is climbing the standings, but I wouldn't put him at #1. My #1 still has to be Antoine Rigaudeau. Just typing out that name almost made me throw up.

markus1234 · 03-26-2012, 06:23 PM

expectations+performane ? Odom is clearly No.1

dude1394 · 03-26-2012, 06:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SMC0007

I also like a variation of Markus' idea. Give him a bunch of minutes and commit to two or three games of it, maybe you hit on something that works great. If not, now you know...you tried, move on.

It would be unfair to the rest of the team in the thick of the playoff race to waste minutes on Lamar.

I also do not think he will be banished but I sure do not look forward to having him booed at the AAC. It will only bring the rest of the guys down.

dude1394 · 03-26-2012, 06:46 PM

Odom has given the least effort of any maverick I have ever seen, including rigedeaux and heaven help us Tariq wahad.

LonghornDub · 03-26-2012, 06:59 PM

"Khloe Kardashian and Lamar Odom to Divorce Because of Reality Show?"

http://blacksportsonline.com/home/20...-reality-show/

Sigh.

DevinHarriswillstart · 03-26-2012, 07:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LonghornDub

"Khloe Kardashian and Lamar Odom to Divorce Because of Reality Show?"

http://blacksportsonline.com/home/20...-reality-show/

Sigh.

He chose that life. Hard to live in the Truman Show AND be an NBA player....oh and have horrible tragedies to deal with at the same time. The perfect storm.

Spurred1 · 03-26-2012, 07:19 PM

Well, if that gossip is true, then things are likely to only worsen for Lamar. Unless he's really wanting to get divorced; but hell, it'll be another excuse for him to play like shit.

LSMF · 03-26-2012, 08:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LonghornDub

"Khloe Kardashian and Lamar Odom to Divorce Because of Reality Show?"

http://blacksportsonline.com/home/20...-reality-show/

Sigh.

It just doesn't end...

bobatundi · 03-26-2012, 09:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jthig32

The problem with the idea of using him as a trade chip is that his contract becomes guaranteed on June 30th if he hasn't been waived. That's not enough time to use him as a trade asset.

But you are correct that they're not going to buy him out, because unless he waived next year's salary (which he has no incentive to do at this point), it would hurt their cap next year significantly.

Thanks--I wasn't sure when it became guaranteed. That certainly makes it less valuable.

EricaLubarsky · 03-26-2012, 10:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spurred1

Well, if that gossip is true, then things are likely to only worsen for Lamar. Unless he's really wanting to get divorced; but hell, it'll be another excuse for him to play like shit.

Dont really follow the Cardassian sisters but didn't Hump start playing better after his breakup with whichever sister he dated?

Speaking of which, Marko Jaric's play plummeted when he started dating Adriana Lima.

JJB may be one of the few players with a high-profile sig-other that has played well since getting together with them.

Cerberus · 03-26-2012, 10:36 PM

Underdog · 03-26-2012, 10:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by EricaLubarsky

Dont really follow the Cardassian sisters but didn't Hump start playing better after his breakup with whichever sister he dated?

41mvp · 03-27-2012, 12:22 AM

Lama Odom

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi...ama_animal.jpg

howdoesmydirktaste · 03-27-2012, 12:44 AM

They should arrest Lamar at the end of the season because he clearly stole over $8 million from Mark Cuban.

SMC0007 · 03-27-2012, 10:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dude1394

It would be unfair to the rest of the team in the thick of the playoff race to waste minutes on Lamar.

I also do not think he will be banished but I sure do not look forward to having him booed at the AAC. It will only bring the rest of the guys down.

Well RC, the staff and the players aren't gonna completely give up on him. RC said today that they were gonna stand behind him and that they believe he will play well for us.

GP · 03-27-2012, 10:09 AM

I guess the way I remember it is this:

Rigaudeau just wasn't an NBA caliber player. Tried. Couldn't get the job done. Same as a lot of other guys the Mavs ran through here.

Antoine Walker: Thought he was option #1 and best player on team. Not to bright but busted his tail every second on the court. Not really a good fit and his game was totally ruined by Pitino and that guy who replaced him in Boston.

Jamison: Guy played hard and could have been successful except he can't play a lick of defense. Just not able.

Really, to me Odom is my least favorite Mav of all time simply because the other candidates actually tried to win, wanted to win and gave it their all. It really isn't their fault that their skill sets either didn't mesh with the team or was lacking. The problem I have with Odom is that he has a skill set that is far superior to any of the guys that have been discussed and just chooses not use it for whatever reason. I just can't fathom showing up to work and not giving a darned or even trying. Yet, that is what Odom doing.

SMC0007 · 03-27-2012, 10:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GP

I guess the way I remember it is this:

Rigaudeau just wasn't an NBA caliber player. Tried. Couldn't get the job done. Same as a lot of other guys the Mavs ran through here.

Antoine Walker: Thought he was option #1 and best player on team. Not to bright but busted his tail every second on the court. Not really a good fit and his game was totally ruined by Pitino and that guy who replaced him in Boston.

Jamison: Guy played hard and could have been successful except he can't play a lick of defense. Just not able.

Really, to me Odom is my least favorite Mav of all time simply because the other candidates actually tried to win, wanted to win and gave it their all. It really isn't their fault that their skill sets either didn't mesh with the team or was lacking. The problem I have with Odom is that he has a skill set that is far superior to any of the guys that have been discussed and just chooses not use it for whatever reason. I just can't fathom showing up to work and not giving a darned or even trying. Yet, that is what Odom doing.

Pfft. Then you are one of the minority that likes their job. Congrats