Is Avery's job on the line?

[endrity]

I think we miss Del a lot, and I have been saying this. The reason is that he was the one guy who had worked will Nellie a lot, and also knew the offense much better. Plus I saw Del under Avery a lot, and he was always calming him down, telling him something. One of the main weaknesses of Avery has been that he doesn't know what to do once things turn bad, and he believes getting mad is the only way, not realising that he is reflecting insecurity to the team. Del was great at offering the other image, the "don't worry, we have an answer" image that Avery has never found.

[guntfighter]

I believe Avery is somewhere in the top ten among coaches. Unless there is someone clearly better available it would be a pretty dumb idea.

[Bookit]

Originally Posted by guntfighter

I believe Avery is somewhere in the top ten among coaches. Unless there is someone clearly better available it would be a pretty dumb idea.

Why do you believe Avery is a top ten coach? Watching Boston's defense has opened my eyes a bit about Avery. He is obviously a very good communicator but his defenses have never been suffocating and he can't coach offense very well, especially against the zone. He is nowhere close to Nellie in evaluating talent so what is so great about Avery?

[LonghornDub]

Originally Posted by Bookit

Why do you believe Avery is a top ten coach? Watching Boston's defense has opened my eyes a bit about Avery. He is obviously a very good communicator but his defenses have never been suffocating and he can't coach offense very well, especially against the zone. He is nowhere close to Nellie in evaluating talent so what is so great about Avery?

His defense was pretty suffocating last year. And in the WCF against PHX two years ago (talk about suffocating, those 2nd halves were amazing).

[Bookit]

Originally Posted by ProdigyDub

His defense was pretty suffocating last year. And in the WCF against PHX two years ago (talk about suffocating, those 2nd halves were amazing).

So his defense coaching abilities are why he is a top ten coach?

[LonghornDub]

Originally Posted by Bookit

So his defense coaching abilities are why he is a top ten coach?

He's a top 10 coach because I can't name 10 better coaches in the NBA. Can you?

[sike]

Does Paul Westphal have anything left?...or is he just happier as a ast. coach?

he would put some pop in the offense I'd wager.

[Jack.Kerr]

Originally Posted by sike

Does Paul Westphal have anything left?...or is he just happier as a ast. coach?

he would put some pop in the offense I'd wager.

If they're going to change, they'd need more than Westphal. He's a 2nd or 3rd-tier alternative, at best.

Weren't we supposed to see a revitalization of the offense with him onboard?

[sike]

Originally Posted by Jack.Kerr

If they're going to change, they'd need more than Westphal. He's a 2nd or 3rd-tier alternative, at best.

Weren't we supposed to see a revitalization of the offense with him onboard?

that is AJ's iron fist in action, I'd wager...

there was a time when Paul Westphal was one of the better coaches (especially offensive coaches) in this league...does that just leave a guy?

[endrity]

Pop, PJax, Riley, George Karl, Jerry Sloan, Byron Scott, Nate McMillan, Rick Adelman

These are probably all better than AJ

You could argue about Sam Mitchell, Doc Rivers, Stan Van Gundy, Mike D'Antoni

Also Larry Brown, Scott Skiles, Jeff Van Gundy, Rick Carlise while out of coaching are still better than Avery. We are not sure whether Avery's success is just a product of a very talented roster.

[sike]

Originally Posted by endrity

Pop, PJax, Riley, George Karl, Jerry Sloan, Byron Scott, Nate McMillan, Rick Adelman

These are probably all better than AJ

You could argue about Sam Mitchell, Doc Rivers, Stan Van Gundy, Mike D'Antoni

Also Larry Brown, Scott Skiles, Jeff Van Gundy, Rick Carlise while out of coaching are still better than Avery. We are not sure whether Avery's success is just a product of a very talented roster.

I'm not sure "better" is the key...as much as "different". I think they need a different coach if they do not succeed in reaching deep into the playoffs this season.

[alexamenos]

Originally Posted by endrity

....We are not sure whether Avery's success is just a product of a very talented roster.

And I still think the very talented roster angle is over-rated.

Bass, for instance, couldn't get off the bench in New Orleans yet in Dallas he's looking like a key part of about an 8 man rotation. So if Byron Scott is a genious coach, and Avery only wins because of the greatness of talent in Dallas, why is it a guy that couldn't get on the floor in N.O. is getting so much run in Dallas?

And....let's not forget that Diop and...crud, I forgot the dude's name....what was it???

Anyhow, Diop and some dude that was playing XBox at the beginning of the '06 season (who was last seen occupying territory down at the end of the oh-so talented Bulls bench) were starters (STARTERS) on the team that made the finals run.

Adrian Griffith -- that's the dude's name. He ain't exactly Mr. Supertalent, is he?

....anyhoo....the mavs have had some talent in recent years, but outside of Dirk it has hardly been mind-blowing talent (and it's not like dirk is heads and tales better than Duncan, KG, Nash, Kobe, D-Wade, etc.). Pre-kidd, Josh was arguably the 2nd best player (actually, it was Devin, but for the sake of argument) -- yet Josh would be at best the third option for any number of teams......

....Denver (w/ AI), Houston, Utah ('07), San Antonio, Phoenix, Miami ('06), Detroit, blah blah blah......

Who would you trade heads up for JET???? Ginobili? Marion? Marcus Camby? Kirilenko(well, he's playing a bit better this year)? Rip Hamilton? Rashweed Wallace? Chauncey Billups (if we're in the race)? That freaky looking dude that plays small forward for the Pistons? I'd seriously consider any of the above, so it's not like Terry is some unique and special talent.

Pt being, our 2nd and third best players over the last few years aren't any better than any other teams 2nd and 3rd's, and in a lot of cases I'd trade these guys straight up for guys on other teams. So as far as great talent advantage on the starting five, forget it.

And further down the bench--deep, schmeep. We've had stack, and he's had his moments, and we've had 12 fouls at the center. The rest of the deepness has been a mirage.

So, it ain't a talent advantage which we have not had over the past couple of years that explains the number of wins the mavs have had under Johnson....

[endrity]

Originally Posted by alexamenos

And I still think the very talented roster angle is over-rated.

Bass, for instance, couldn't get off the bench in New Orleans yet in Dallas he's looking like a key part of about an 8 man rotation. So if Byron Scott is a genious coach, and Avery only wins because of the greatness of talent in Dallas, why is it a guy that couldn't get on the floor in N.O. is getting so much run in Dallas?

And....let's not forget that Diop and...crud, I forgot the dude's name....what was it???

Anyhow, Diop and some dude that was playing XBox at the beginning of the '06 season (who was last seen occupying territory down at the end of the oh-so talented Bulls bench) were starters (STARTERS) on the team that made the finals run.

Adrian Griffith -- that's the dude's name. He ain't exactly Mr. Supertalent, is he?

....anyhoo....the mavs have had some talent in recent years, but outside of Dirk it has hardly been mind-blowing talent (and it's not like dirk is heads and tales better than Duncan, KG, Nash, Kobe, D-Wade, etc.). Pre-kidd, Josh was arguably the 2nd best player (actually, it was Devin, but for the sake of argument) -- yet Josh would be at best the third option for any number of teams......

....Denver (w/ AI), Houston, Utah ('07), San Antonio, Phoenix, Miami ('06), Detroit, blah blah blah......

Who would you trade heads up for JET???? Ginobili? Marion? Marcus Camby? Kirilenko(well, he's playing a bit better this year)? Rip Hamilton? Rashweed Wallace? Chauncey Billups (if we're in the race)? That freaky looking dude that plays small forward for the Pistons? I'd seriously consider any of the above, so it's not like Terry is some unique and special talent.

Pt being, our 2nd and third best players over the last few years aren't any better than any other teams 2nd and 3rd's, and in a lot of cases I'd trade these guys straight up for guys on other teams. So as far as great talent advantage on the starting five, forget it.

And further down the bench--deep, schmeep. We've had stack, and he's had his moments, and we've had 12 fouls at the center. The rest of the deepness has been a mirage.

So, it ain't a talent advantage which we have not had over the past couple of years that explains the number of wins the mavs have had under Johnson....

It's true that in 06 there was a dropoff from Dirk to the next guy, whoever that was. But the thing is that the roster was stacked with players that could contribute. We had Stack, KVH (two former number 1s for their teams), Devin, and Diop coming off the bench. That is crazy good. Tell me one team in 06 that could bring anything close to that from the bench. The Spurs? They had Oberto, Finley and..... The Heat? They had Zo, Posey and a very washed up GP. Suns? Nothing, they still got nothing since D'Antoni plays like 6 guys at most. And the Mavs had Del, still providing some of the offensive wizardry from the Nellie days. Don't forget also that the roster overhaul in the summer of 04, was done precisely to become a better defensive team. And most players were brought in with that intention in mind. Avery had a roster that most coaches would dream about. While he had no Shaq or Duncan, he probably had the next best thing, a roster with very little weakness and versatility to drool about, and a superstar entering his prime.

Diop and Bass were both Donnie's finds more than anything. Especially Diop came in because the head of scouting for the Mavs (I forget his name) knew Diop very well since he was in Senegal. And how did Avery menage Diop???? He was barely playing him this year eventhough to me Diop seemed still the very active defensive player we knew. Now he is falling in love with Bass. The problem is that while Bass plays more and more minutes, his novelty act wears off and know we are seeing the real holes in his game. He tries to be overagressive, and has yet to figure out how he can be an undersized power player. He is even worse than Josh at passing the ball, and that's saying something. He is alright in man to man, but really gets lost anytime he has to help out on D. He is an average, maybe slightly better, rebounder and provides nothing in terms of shotblocking. So knowing all these holes in his game, does Avery try to put him in better positions? NO. He still plays him as center, while he should be playing alongside a center most of the time, and puts him in iso after iso situation where often becomes a black hole.

Is New Orleans pissed to see him do well now? Maybe. Does that say that Avery is better than Byron? Hardly. Anyone that makes it to the NBA has talent, and put in a right position they can all succeed to a certain level. Every year we hear stories of some scrub who all of sudden starts to play well and contribute for some team(Royal Ivey, W.Hermann, Flip Murray, Bowen, etc etc). Every coach loses one or two guys like these. Pop gave up on Udrih and now Sacto is making him their PG of the future. Does that mean Theus is better than Pop? Of course not.

[alexamenos]

Originally Posted by endrity

It's true that in 06 there was a dropoff from Dirk to the next guy, whoever that was.

It isn't just that there's a drop-off from Dirk to the next guy, it's that the next guy is no better than a lot of guys on a lot of other teams.

Have the teams been reasonably well constructed? Did players meld together well? Did they play their roles? Yeah, yeah and yeah -- that's not necessarily talent but management and coaching.

And....the point in re Bass is not that Avery is so great at spotting talent, but instead it's that the talent differential between New Orleans and Dallas was never that great in the first place, and perhaps New Orleans has had the edge in that regard. To wit...

Pop gave up on Udrih and now Sacto is making him their PG of the future. Does that mean Theus is better than Pop? Of course not.

Of course that's not what it means. What it means is that there is a lot more talent in San Antonio than in Sacto, so much so that a guy that was a third stringer pg in SA is looking like the man in Sacto....kind of like Bass not being able to get off the bench in New Orleans but then looking like the greatest maverick offensive player in the paint since Roy Tarpley.

Again, my whole point is that I think people vastly over-estimate the talent that the Mavs have had these last few years. The reason they have won so many games, imho, is not because they are so talented, but instead because they do a lot of little things extremely well and they've played with a tremendous edge, night in and night out....they lost a bit of that edge this season, and I think what we're getting this season is a real indication of what kind of team they are based on talent.

alternatively stated....if the mavs did what they did in '06 and '07 because of their amazing talent levels, then how do we explain their shortcomings this season? Did their talent really fall that much when they gave up Buckner and Croshere and acquired Jones and Bass?

[endrity]

Originally Posted by alexamenos

1)It isn't just that there's a drop-off from Dirk to the next guy, it's that the next guy is no better than a lot of guys on a lot of other teams.


2)And....the point in re Bass is not that Avery is so great at spotting talent, but instead it's that the talent differential between New Orleans and Dallas was never that great in the first place, and perhaps New Orleans has had the edge in that regard. To wit...

1)My argument again, was that we had a lot of "next guys" and while clearely no one was better than a lot of other teams' next guy, collectively was much better. Again, we were bring Stack and KVH, two former nr1 options, off the bench. No one could even approach that. That to me is a considerable advantage in talent.

2) Ok, how about this. Where was Diop more useful: Dallas or Cleveland? Cleveland of course, since they had very little talent anyway. Yet he cracks the rotation of an elite level team like the Mavs. Ths point is that nearly every player that makes it to the NBA has some kind of talent and skill and put in the right position he can succeed. If anyone has followed Darko's international career you would instantly understand why he was the second pick of the draft. Yet those years under Larry Brown have probably forever damaged what I think would have been a great NBA player.

[ty]

Avery is a good coach.......for his style.

I don't think he is a flexible coach though. He's only good at coaching the Spurs.

[sike]

Originally Posted by ty

He's only good at coaching the Spurs.

then that is not a good coach.

[rabbitproof]

Yes.

We need some results but it will be more about the how things unfold. The West is just so animal this year that if say Utah lost in the second round this year, it would not directly indicate regression.

[alexamenos]

I think what Avery did in '06 is he got guys believing that they could play mean and tough and even a little dirty, and they believed him for awhile. It ain't geometry*, it's basketball --- the x's and o's aren't that difficult to figure out. Attitude matters.

Since '06, they've gotten softer and softer and more intimidate-able.....and they're playing like it. They're still playing ok defense from time to time, but they don't haven't that same edge they played with for awhile after Avery first took over.

(*from Kidd's press conference -- geometry being the most infathomably difficult subject that Jason Kidd could imagine, complementary angles and pythagorean theorems being concepts well beyond his grasp)

[ty]

Originally Posted by alexamenos

(*from Kidd's press conference -- geometry being the most infathomably difficult subject that Jason Kidd could imagine, complementary angles and pythagorean theorems being concepts well beyond his grasp)

Kidd ain't the sharpest tool in the shed.

[LonghornDub]

Again, need I remind everyone at this point that the line between Avery being a "fantastic" coach and a "ok" coach is as thin as a few free throws by Wade and Dirk.

[endrity]

Originally Posted by ProdigyDub

Again, need I remind everyone at this point that the line between Avery being a "fantastic" coach and a "ok" coach is as thin as a few free throws by Wade and Dirk.

Maybe in terms of respect and labeling, since winning a ring is great in terms of defining someone's legacy. However sometimes that is a mirage also. Look at Billups for example. Has anyone choked more than he has the last two playoffs? Absolutely not. Yet he won a ring, hit some big shots against a Lakers pick and roll D that made stars out of PGs like Bibby and Hudson, gained a reputation as "clutch" and Mr. Big Shot and has done very little of that the last two years. I guess what I am trying to say is that reputations, just like the one Dirk has now, are sometimes underserved even when they are positive.

Avery had an opportunity to keep his team together during the finals, and he didn't. He has had two more seasons to show that those free throws were not going to stop this team from winning, and he hasn't. If we win that ring, and he gets clearely outcoached by Nellie in 07, starts to lose his superstar, and fills the roster up with veterans that provide nothing, I think we are still having this debate. Even if he won in 06, this remains a "what have you done for me lately" business.

[LonghornDub]

Originally Posted by endrity

Maybe in terms of respect and labeling, since winning a ring is great in terms of defining someone's legacy. However sometimes that is a mirage also. Look at Billups for example. Has anyone choked more than he has the last two playoffs? Absolutely not. Yet he won a ring, hit some big shots against a Lakers pick and roll D that made stars out of PGs like Bibby and Hudson, gained a reputation as "clutch" and Mr. Big Shot and has done very little of that the last two years. I guess what I am trying to say is that reputations, just like the one Dirk has now, are sometimes underserved even when they are positive.

Avery had an opportunity to keep his team together during the finals, and he didn't. He has had two more seasons to show that those free throws were not going to stop this team from winning, and he hasn't. If we win that ring, and he gets clearely outcoached by Nellie in 07, starts to lose his superstar, and fills the roster up with veterans that provide nothing, I think we are still having this debate. Even if he won in 06, this remains a "what have you done for me lately" business.

What have you done for me lately doesn't mean less than 2 years after your brand new coach wins a title you start calling him a bad coach. It takes a bit longer than that.

I'm not saying nobody would be debating it--just that the folks arguing on the one side wouldn't have a leg to stand on.

[endrity]

Originally Posted by ProdigyDub

What have you done for me lately doesn't mean less than 2 years after your brand new coach wins a title you start calling him a bad coach. It takes a bit longer than that.

I'm not saying nobody would be debating it--just that the folks arguing on the one side wouldn't have a leg to stand on.

If you mean that he wouldn't be fired 2 years after winning a ring than I probably agree with you.

But after two bad coaching seasons, any FO would have the right to start rethinking his position. Plus succesful coaches often do get fired, in order to hire possible better ones. Carlise was fired for Larry brown after an ECF berth in his second season. Didn't Magic get his LA coach fired a year after they won a ring, because he wanted Riley? Riley again replacen Stan a year after an ECF berth, and led the heat to a ring. I am not saying that the Mavs can get a better coach now. All I am saying is that at time even succesful coaches can be under scrutiny

[LonghornDub]

Originally Posted by endrity

If you mean that he wouldn't be fired 2 years after winning a ring than I probably agree with you.

But after two bad coaching seasons, any FO would have the right to start rethinking his position. Plus succesful coaches often do get fired, in order to hire possible better ones. Carlise was fired for Larry brown after an ECF berth in his second season. Didn't Magic get his LA coach fired a year after they won a ring, because he wanted Riley? Riley again replacen Stan a year after an ECF berth, and led the heat to a ring. I am not saying that the Mavs can get a better coach now. All I am saying is that at time even succesful coaches can be under scrutiny

But it hasn't been 2 bad seasons. It's been a 67 win season with a disappointing exit, and a season that's not even close to complete yet.

I'm not arguing that last year was "good" by any means, but Avery coached really well for the entire regular season after the 0-4 start. A playoff collapse should detract heavily from that--but it shouldn't completely negate it.

And you really can't count this year. The Mavs are 31-19, and are shaping up to make their final push. We'll see how it goes, but, assuming the Mavs had won the title, this wouldn't be nearly enough to get people justifiably riled up about Avery. Some might be complaining, but when is there not someone complaining?

[sbibi]

this is the stupidest debate i've ever seen. There is no question whether avery is a good coach or not. There is no way that his job is on the the line... The team was doing very well but since we were without harris or a pure pg (Kidd), we've been losing games. The team needs to adjust now... Without Avery, we would still be the running team when Nellie was around... The team might be struggling right now, but I trust Avery because of where he brought us through the competitive western conference. The last 2 years have been great lessons for this Maverick team with Avery taking over the team. Just be patient until the playoffs, you will be surprised...

[endrity]

Originally Posted by sbibi

this is the stupidest debate i've ever seen. There is no question whether avery is a good coach or not. There is no way that his job is on the the line... The team was doing very well but since we were without harris or a pure pg (Kidd), we've been losing games. The team needs to adjust now... Without Avery, we would still be the running team when Nellie was around... The team might be struggling right now, but I trust Avery because of where he brought us through the competitive western conference. The last 2 years have been great lessons for this Maverick team with Avery taking over the team. Just be patient until the playoffs, you will be surprised...

In case you don't remember, the 04 roster overhaul pretty much prevented Nellie from ever again having a running team with the Mavs at least. That, and Nash's departure, is why he stepped down. The FO made a clear decision to move towards a more conventional style of playing, and that the Nellie days were over. Therefore no, with or without Avery, we would not be Nellie's Mavs all over again.

[Dirkenstien]

I have a feeling that, with Kidd's arrival, Avery is going start getting our guys to be a little nasty again. We have a team than can be pretty damn mean when they want.

[Janett_Reno]

If teams keep running us and making us take Dampier out, after this season, will Avery and Cuban go with a player and players that play Kidds style? I don't think Dampier plays Kidd style.

Just something to remember, it is talks of Marion not returning to Miami. Does Dallas go back to Nash/Kidd style and run next year? That puts Dampier out of business most of the game and then does Avery go with Kidd, Terry, Howard, Marion and Dirk? I think all five guys can play that style and Marion and Howard are great defenders. The only bad, it puts alot of pressure on Dirk at defense. If no Marion, then they might try to pick up a running center. Kidd has two years left after this. Nash has about the same and time is running out for both. Both have been great players.

When Kidd and Nash have spacing, up and down game and make it a full court game they are both really good. Our team will have to adjust to playing that style again. It looks like with us getting Kidd, we are going to adjust to playing his style, not him adjusting to playing our style. It will also mean getting another forward and playing three forwards or getting a center that can fly up and down the court. I am still not giving up on this year and i hope for all the best. It is going to be difficult with how strong the west is.

[endrity]

Originally Posted by Janett_Reno

If teams keep running us and making us take Dampier out, after this season, will Avery and Cuban go with a player and players that play Kidds style? I don't think Dampier plays Kidd style.

Just something to remember, it is talks of Marion not returning to Miami. Does Dallas go back to Nash/Kidd style and run next year? That puts Dampier out of business most of the game and then does Avery go with Kidd, Terry, Howard, Marion and Dirk? I think all five guys can play that style and Marion and Howard are great defenders. The only bad, it puts alot of pressure on Dirk at defense. If no Marion, then they might try to pick up a running center. Kidd has two years left after this. Nash has about the same and time is running out for both. Both have been great players.

When Kidd and Nash have spacing, up and down game and make it a full court game they are both really good. Our team will have to adjust to playing that style again. It looks like with us getting Kidd, we are going to adjust to playing his style, not him adjusting to playing our style. It will also mean getting another forward and playing three forwards or getting a center that can fly up and down the court. I am still not giving up on this year and i hope for all the best. It is going to be difficult with how strong the west is.

To get Marion, it would have to be a sign and trade, or just a regular trade because even if he leaves his option (unlikely, given that he is making 17 mill next year) we don't have cap to sign him. Frankly I thought Marion was a bit overrated as a Sun, so no I wouldn't be thrilled to see him here. Damp will serve his purpose man, I guarantee you. He just might not be enough. Gasol and Bynum, Chandler and West, Duncan and Thomas, those are some heavy frontlines.

[Janett_Reno]

I like Dampier but i want Avery to play him and play big. I do not playing small ball. I know in the end it is losing ball. It was no better than Phx playing small ball and they won zero titles with it. They were the most excitting if that counted. It looks like maybe we will pick up Magloire and this would really help our back line. This year and now.

[endrity]

we are picking Magloire? Link please, cause that is really some good news.

[Janett_Reno]

I have no link but it is a thread someone just posted about the Nets waiving Magloire. It was no way we trade Diop without getting another center(i thought). It just left us way to thin against big back lines in the west. I knew the Nets wanted to move Magloire. I am guessing the numbers did not match up and maybe the Mavs knew the Nets would wave him and maybe Magloire said he would sign with us to do the Harris/Kidd deal.

This is alot of if's but witth Magloire, we do not lose anything with Diop being gone. He will score more, block as many shots and Magloire is more physical. Maybe i am wishing and guessing but he would be a huge pick up for us and fill in our back line. He is good on defense.

[LonghornDub]

Yeah, we really need to get Magliore. That would be so awesome.

[Janett_Reno]

I was reading in a Lakers forum and they want to dump DJ and sign Magloire fast but alot of them are saying, Considering that Dallas still haves their full MLE, I'd expect they could sign him if they want. Magloire is definitely worth a look and will probably get a few offers. I would think Dallas would try to make a bid for him. Just thinking about it for a few minutes, my guess is that he goes to Dallas with New Orleans as a long shot. Dallas has the $ to offer and the guaranteed playing time, and he is familiar with the Hornets.

He was waived specifically so that Dallas could sign him. It's the other piece of the Kidd trade and a blatant attempt to circumvent the cap.


i still dont think the lakers should pick up players (magloire or barry) just to keep them away from another team, we have an up and coming team with youth on our side so we want some has beens or never weres....no thank you, let dallas and the spurs get who they want and lets worry about our future


The above lines i was reading in a Laker forum. I happen to agree with the one person, i feel this was in the Kidd/Harris deal and we knew this making the trade.

[endrity]

... and I am done, I am taking a short nap before catching the Mavs.

Just so that I don't forget, since it's the topic anyway: Avery better provide some hope during the playoffs or his ass should be send to SA immediately where I think he wants to be anyway. I will never forgive him for wasting Dirk's two most amazing seasons in 06 and 07.

[Thespiralgoeson]

Originally Posted by aexchange

I've been as big a fan of Avery as anyone on the board here, but in the span of 2 seasons we have gone from being one of the youngest most exciting teams to one of the oldest teams in the league. In that time, we've gone from reaching the Finals to being booted in the 1st round.

Unless something borderline miraculous happens this season, we'll be lucky to break the 2nd round of the playoffs. With that said, is Avery's job safe? If the Mavs are bounced in the 1st round again, is it time to fire Avery?

Our offense is stagnant and predictable, our players are old, and its becoming quickly apparent that he's lost some of his key players --- namely Dirk.

It was time to fire Avery last year.

[chumdawg]

You're patronizing me? I was interested in that bold-faced fact you were selling. I was willing to give you some patronage.

[LonghornDub]

Originally Posted by chumdawg

You're patronizing me? I was interested in that bold-faced fact you were selling. I was willing to give you some patronage.

Just a bit. I have a feeling you'll get over it, though.

[MavsX]

ugh oh....here we go again.