Do you let Ellis walk in the Summer?

[GermanStandard]

The Mavs have hard decisions to make in the summer.

If they want to keep this team together as it is they likely have no Cap Room left for ANY signings.

Ellis will Opt out. Thats for sure, same goes for Aminu who will get a bigger deal aswell.

So lets look at the Cap Numbers 2015/2016. Cap projected to go up to 65M$

Parsons 15,3M$
Dirk 8,3M$
Harris 4M$
Felton 4,5M$ (Player Option which he will surely activate)
Aminu 1,1M$ (Player Option -> will opt out)
Ellis 9M $ (Player Option -> will opt out)
Mekel and Powell dead money 1M$

= 43 M $

We learned that Ellis and Aminu will opt out

= 33M $

Left: 32M$

to sign: Rondo, Chandler, Ellis, Aminu, Barea, Stoudemire, Jefferson, Villanueva, B. James

Ellis will demand 7 figues (likely 11-12M$). Aminu will take the MLE if were lucky (5M$)

If we sign those two to those kind of contracts we have

= 15M$ left.

to sign Chandler, Rondo, Barea, Jefferson, Stoudemire, Villanueva, B.James

Lets say Barea, Jefferson, Villanueva and James take the Vet Minimum (800k-1,4M$) we have around

= 10-11M$ left

to sign Rondo, Chandler and Stoudemire.

I highly doubt Stoudemire stays here and more so not for the Vet Min so you can basically forget signing him.

Chandler will surely demand around 8-10M$. We can go over the Cap Limit and sign Rondo with Bird rights.

If we pay them all we basically dont have much left for any significant signings.




So what do you do? Keep most of the Team together (well maybe switch one or another Vet Min guy) and hope of getting a better PG fit for close to nothing or let Ellis walk and use his 11-12M$ to sign both Guard Positions with other Players?

[Underdog]

Remember, we can go over the cap to keep Ellis/Chandler/Rondo because we have Birds Rights on them.

[sefant77]

http://www.cbafaq.com/salarycap.htm

Maybe read there a little.

[Melonhead]

Too bad we can't ever get a core team together because the mavs don't draft worth a damn.

I want Aminu, Ellis, Chandler, Barea. I don't expect Amare to play for the min.

[GermanStandard]

UFA 2015/2016

PG: Rondo, Mo Williams, Lin, Nate Robinson
Dragic has a Player Option and will likely get a Max Deal in Miami so forget him.

SG: Wesley Matthews, Danny Green, Gerald Green, Manu Ginobili, Stuckey, Lou Williams, Gary Neal

-> Crawford, Afflalo, Wade, Gordon, Henderson, JR Smith all have Player Options

SF: Josh Smith, Carroll, Dunleavy, Marion, Prince, Teletovic
-> Lebron, Green, Deng, Pierce and Wilson Chandler have Player Options

PF: Aldridge, Millsap, Bass, Boozer, A. Johnson, Stoudemire
-> Love, West, Young, Davis have Player Options

C: M.Gasol, DeAndre Jordan, Asik, R.Lopez, Brandan Wright
-> B.Lopez, Hibbert, Jefferson,



Not really looking good especially on the Guard Positions...

I dont even bother with the good RFA like Butler, Knight, Jackson or Beverley...

[GermanStandard]

Originally Posted by Underdog

Remember, we can go over the cap to keep Ellis/Chandler/Rondo because we have Birds Rights on them.

I know but anyway we wont have ANY Cap Room left for signings that improve the team.

[Underdog]

Originally Posted by GermanStandard

I know but anyway we wont have ANY Cap Room left for signings that improve the team.

We won't have any cap room anyway unless we let 2 out of 3 of them walk (and as you pointed out, the FA market is kinda weak)... Which means the only real options are to bring back Ellis/Chandler/Rondo, or tear the whole thing down and start building the post-Dirk Mavs from the ground-up.

Honestly, I'd rather see what this team looks like after a training camp together than start the decade(s)-long process of trying to find and build around a new super star... I mean, it's not like any of those 2016 FAs are going to come to Dallas to play with an empty roster - best to keep some talent around and retool later, even if you have to overpay some of these guys now. Besides, trading players who don't fit should become easier with the cap going up over the next couple years, since the definition of "overpaid" will adjust to the new market.

[GermanStandard]

The Problem is that Rondo will likely not resign with the Mavs....

so the Bird Rights arent there anymore and we cant go over the Cap or am i wrong? In that case we would have to find a PG for very cheap...


Also keep in mind that the Mavs have traded away a lot of picks in the future so rebuilding through the Draft will be a very tough challenge.

[Underdog]

Originally Posted by GermanStandard

The Problem is that Rondo will likely not resign with the Mavs.

Why not? I mean, we can offer him a 5th year on his contract, so he's not going to find a better deal than what Cuban can offer him (even if it's not max)... And it's not like any teams who have a better shot at a title can afford him.

Or are you still buying the rumor that the Lakers are going to max him out to pair with a perpetually-injured Kobe? I know Kevin Love isn't dying to get into that situation, so I'm not sure why Rondo would either.

[spreedom]

Ellis is an interesting case because he's clearly more valuable to the Mavs than he is to anyone else. That said, I think signing him to a 4yr/$50M+ deal would be a huge mistake. I won't deny that he's been very good (and at times, electrifying and dominant) but I just don't like the logic in building around an undersized SG that doesn't shoot threes well or play good defense. Supremely talented player, but I would probably let him walk unless he takes some sort of a discount and the team is constructed to he can come in off the bench.

Mavs are kind of in no man's land with this roster because we're either going to have to (A) bring everyone back and hope to add small pieces in free agency with the minimum to offer, (B) let everyone walk and try to find replacement players in free agency without going over the cap, or (C) bring a couple of guys back while remaining over the cap. None of those options guarantee any level of success, and quite frankly even if we pick the best option (debatable which one that is) there isn't even any sort of high probability that the team will be better than they were this year.

I don't envy the work that needs to be done or the tough decisions that need to be made. The only way I can really see the team getting better right away is through some really complicated and unlikely sign and trade scenarios. And those deals so rarely involve real assets as opposed to trade exceptions and the like.

[markus1234]

Monta is like OJ Mayo.

Hurts you more than he helps.

I'drather have Kevin Martin. At least he can shoot and you can't shoot over him...

Monta's perimeter defense (esp 3p) is pure comedy.

[spreedom]

Flaws aside, Kevin Martin would actually probably be a really good fit next to Rondo.

[tsar]

Originally Posted by markus1234

Monta is like OJ Mayo.

Hurts you more than he helps.

I'drather have Kevin Martin. At least he can shoot and you can't shoot over him...

Monta's perimeter defense (esp 3p) is pure comedy.

I think Monta will come around and play well again but I don't think he's consistent enough to be counted on as the workhorse of this team. You knew what you were going to get with Dirk night-in, night-out: with Monta - you just don't really know what you're going to get.... I cringe at some of the ISO plays they run for him.

I love the guys character and toughness (he genuinely seems like a super good dude) but I say let him walk.

[Twenty4sevenn]

With the emergence of Jordan Clarkson, I doubt the Lakers go after Rondo very hard.

But if they want to make the switch, I'm down.

[Twenty4sevenn]

With the emergence of Jordan Clarkson, I doubt the Lakers go after Rondo very hard.

But if they want to make the switch, I'm down.

[markus1234]

Monta is quite consistent tbh.

He plays well early in the season, when teams do not game plan for him, yet. And he plays well against bad teams, which do not game plan at all...

Monta is very easy to defend if you really want it. Just pack the paint and let him shoot...

[dirkhorse]

Stop trying to build around Monta Ellis.

[tsar]

Originally Posted by markus1234

Monta is quite consistent tbh.

He plays well early in the season, when teams do not game plan for him, yet. And he plays well against bad teams, which do not game plan at all...

Monta is very easy to defend if you really want it. Just pack the paint and let him shoot...

A consistently good player would adapt to this situation eventually but he has not. I feel like before the all star break he would drive into the packed paint and make the right pass but I hardly see Ellis pass anymore unless he's completely trapped. He's playing a lot of hero ball.

[DevinHarriswillstart]

Originally Posted by tsar

A consistently good player would adapt to this situation eventually but he has not. I feel like before the all star break he would drive into the packed paint and make the right pass but I hardly see Ellis pass anymore unless he's completely trapped. He's playing a lot of hero ball.

He hasn't been the same since his hip injury. I'm not using that as in excuse, but his poor play came directly after that. He should have rested a few games.

[CanadianMavsFan]

Originally Posted by markus1234

Monta is like OJ Mayo.

Hurts you more than he helps.

I'drather have Kevin Martin. At least he can shoot and you can't shoot over him...

Monta's perimeter defense (esp 3p) is pure comedy.

Sadly I think this is accurate (although the Mayo comparison is harsh).

Monta is an elite penetrator and a streaky scorer, but offers little else in other areas. His defense is poor and his three point shooting is below average.

I too would rather have a three and D guy (or a Martin type) to pair with Dirk. Unfortunately Monta is the best the FO could do after whiffing on Williams, Howard, Paul, and even Iggy. He's a fun player to watch when he gets hot but even at his best he is far less valuable than a guy like Terry was. IMO he would always have been better utilized as a sixth man (playing starter minutes) but Carlisle did not explore this option either because he didn't consider it viable or did not want to hurt Monta's confidence.

Long story short I let Monta go this offseason if he demands more than 8-9 million per. Just not worth it with the way this team is currently producing. I'd rather pair Rondo with a shooter in the back court as bad as he has looked (having a back court without a three point threat is a huge liability in the modern game to begin with).

[Kante]

Taking Martin over Ellis is just a bad post in many ways.

[sefant77]

Originally Posted by markus1234

I'drather have Kevin Martin. At least he can shoot and you can't shoot over him...

Monta's perimeter defense (esp 3p) is pure comedy.

hahahahahahaha

Wanting Kevin Martin and pointing out Montas defense one sentence later. Funny stuff. Kevin Martin is garbage. His defense is on Calderon level. That makes him automatically a bad fit for any team with Monta and Dirk.

[sefant77]

And again all this people talking about letting Rondo or Ellis go and "get a blablabla guy" should realize how shitty and small the FA market in the summer is...

[EricaLubarsky]

Originally Posted by sefant77

And again all this people talking about letting Rondo or Ellis go and "get a blablabla guy" should realize how shitty and small the FA market in the summer is...

1) The FA class is actually pretty solid
2) Free agency isn't our only option. We don't have many trade assets, but we can SnT and make some other moves like that.

I'm not outwardly advocating dumping players, though. I am concerned that either

A) Rick isn't doing a good job getting the team to play together as a cohesive team or
B) This team is just not a good collection of pieces

[Melonhead]

Originally Posted by spreedom

Flaws aside, Kevin Martin would actually probably be a really good fit next to Rondo.

He would be a great piece next to Monta. Except I worry about defense.

[Five-ofan]

I think we keep monta, let rondo go and sign pat Beverly

[sefant77]

Originally Posted by EricaLubarsky

1) The FA class is actually pretty solid
2) Free agency isn't our only option. We don't have many trade assets, but we can SnT and make some other moves like that.

1) No its not if you are trying to be realistic about who is staying anyway

2) The new CBA drastically cut into the SnT options, so it would be pretty tricky to pull a solid SnT

[DevinHarriswillstart]

Originally Posted by Melonhead

He would be a great piece next to Monta. Except I worry about defense.

And Martin's health. The guy seems like he is injured all the time.

[spreedom]

Originally Posted by Kante

Taking Martin over Ellis is just a bad post in many ways.

Why do you keep pretending everyone that suggests other SGs to look at, they're saying "MONTA SUCKS THIS GUY IS BETTER"... that's pretty boring to me.

Originally Posted by Melonhead

He would be a great piece next to Monta. Except I worry about defense.

Monta isn't a point guard and Martin isn't a SF... I don't really think those two fit together, especially since, as you mentioned, neither of them are good defenders. I think Martin is a starting caliber SG on a good team if the right pieces surround him (also, assuming on this team, Dirk would be coming in off the bench).

[spreedom]

Originally Posted by EricaLubarsky

1) The FA class is actually pretty solid
2) Free agency isn't our only option. We don't have many trade assets, but we can SnT and make some other moves like that.

I'm not outwardly advocating dumping players, though. I am concerned that either

A) Rick isn't doing a good job getting the team to play together as a cohesive team or
B) This team is just not a good collection of pieces

That's the conclusion I'm coming to. In particular, it's not that Rondo/Ellis can't play, it's that they absolutely can't play together. And if one of them has to go, I think it's easier to find a quality SG than it is a quality PG.

[kg_veteran]

Originally Posted by Five-ofan

I think we keep monta, let rondo go and sign pat Beverly

I would be fully in support of this.

[spreedom]

Originally Posted by kg_veteran

I would be fully in support of this.

I'd be okay with that too, but if we want to sign Beverly, we probably let Tyson, Aminu AND Stoudemire walk... especially with Beverly being an RFA on a division rival. It would be really tough to pull off unless we're signing-and-trading Rondo for him. And with the way both guys are playing now, I don't see why Houston would be interested in that.

[rimrocker]

Mavs basically have 4 options:

1. Sign Rondo and find a suitable SG via S&T of Ellis.
2. Sign Ellis and find a suitable PG via S&T of Rondo.
3. Sign both along with Chandler and hopefully Aminu and try to make chemistry work.
4. Sign neither and break this thing down completely to start the rebuild process.

I personally think #3 is still our best bet at this point.
Sign Rondo and then trade him if things go sour. We'd most likely be stuck with Ellis if we sign him to any long deal so I'd be really skeptical committing to much and too long for him.

[rimrocker]

Originally Posted by spreedom

I'd be okay with that too, but if we want to sign Beverly, we probably let Tyson, Aminu AND Stoudemire walk... especially with Beverly being an RFA on a division rival. It would be really tough to pull off unless we're signing-and-trading Rondo for him. And with the way both guys are playing now, I don't see why Houston would be interested in that.

If we're not bringing back Chandler we might as well tear this thing down unless there is a pretty solid replacement coming back (Jordan, Gasol, etc...)
Hell, I'm beginning to feel the same with Aminu.

[Kante]

Originally Posted by spreedom

Why do you keep pretending everyone that suggests other SGs to look at, they're saying "MONTA SUCKS THIS GUY IS BETTER"... that's pretty boring to me.

Boring is a poster who always wants to trade Ellis in every post...

Martin is not the solution, plays for three quarters and disappears in the 4th, injury prone, one of the worst defenders in the league.

[spreedom]

Originally Posted by Kante

Boring is a poster who always wants to trade Ellis in every post...

Martin is not the solution, plays for three quarters and disappears in the 4th, injury prone, one of the worst defenders in the league.

Get a life. You haven't offered any solutions, just plugging your ears and saying "YOU JUST WANT TO TRADE ELLIS" and utterly ignoring every bit of substance from the posts I make. I have said repeatedly that it is a difficult situation and that moving on from Ellis was one way to fix it.

You've spent more time criticizing my opinions than offering any kind of real solution whatsoever.

[DevinHarriswillstart]

Originally Posted by Mavzzz

We will suck without him

Unless Parsons takes that next step, then you're probably right. Doubt we're even in the playoff picture this year without him.

[Kante]

Originally Posted by spreedom

Get a life. You haven't offered any solutions, just plugging your ears and saying "YOU JUST WANT TO TRADE ELLIS" and utterly ignoring every bit of substance from the posts I make. I have said repeatedly that it is a difficult situation and that moving on from Ellis was one way to fix it.

You've spent more time criticizing my opinions than offering any kind of real solution whatsoever.

Substance, funny...

There is no easy solution, every name that gets thrown in here is pretty bad. And yes, nearly every post is made of "Trade Ellis" but the names given (if any) are not available...

[Twenty4sevenn]

Originally Posted by DevinHarriswillstart

Unless Parsons takes that next step, then you're probably right. Doubt we're even in the playoff picture this year without him.

Parsons is averaging 12.5 shots per game compared to 17.1 per game for Monta.

If you flip those (and they should) Parsons would be averaging 20 ppg easy.

It's passed time to unleash Parsons, IMO.

[Sportstudi]

Originally Posted by Five-ofan

I think we keep monta, let rondo go and sign pat Beverly

Beverly is a dirty scumbag. He makes Bruce Bowen look like a saint.