Mavs at Suns: W 48-29

[dirno2000]

Originally Posted by WraithXx

.

ummm........sports?

[dude1394]

Nice....I mean jkidd/dirk, not that wacko wraithxx stuff.

[Five-ofan]

Originally Posted by dude1394

So help me out...

These are not flagrants, right?


or this

if that second one is the play i think it was, shaq didnt get called for a foul let alone a flagrant.

[chumdawg]

Originally Posted by dirno2000

Technically that's not true. The foul only need to be deemed "excessive" by the ref, even if the defender is making a play on the ball.

In reality some players are better than others at making the excessive foul look like a basketball play and getting away with it. Shaq is probably the master as evidenced by the "accidental" elbow to Dirk's face in game 1 of the finals.

Shaq is a big old boy. A gentle foul by him is going to look like a flagrant by a smaller guy.

That's the price you pay when you take him on. There's nothing wrong with this. It's part of what makes him such a bad mo-fo in the first place.

Props to Terry for taking the big man on.

[Caseman]

This has nothing to do with the Mavericks, but Gordo is on the Ticket and whispering sexy things in my ear.

[dude1394]

So it IS okay to block a ball and drive your forearm into the guys face after a block if you are a great big guy. So the next time little stevie or chris paul for example takes it into the paint against the mavs damp should block it through his face, right?

Do you think if damp did this the league might review it? Since they seem to review everything after the fact, why isn't this type of stuff reviewed?

[LonghornDub]

Originally Posted by dirno2000

I thought it was great when Jackson talked about how Van Gundy used to tell his team that if they didn't play hard on defense he had no way of knowing if he was making the right calls.

Exactly. The players are the lens through which all of the coach's decisions must be examined. This distorts things sometimes--bad coaching can look good, or good coaching can look bad. Or sometimes, you don't even know what the coach is saying, cause you can't tell if the players are actually following his directives or just lazing around out there.

[fluid.forty.one]

I was at my grandpa's house so I couldn't post during the game, but dang what a comeback!!

[LonghornDub]

On a mostly unrelated note, apparently if you only score 64 points against Utah it doesn't even register as a loss.

[Usually Lurkin]

Originally Posted by Five-ofan

if that second one is the play i think it was, shaq didnt get called for a foul let alone a flagrant.

he certainly didn't get called for the foul on Kidd late in the game as Kidd went past everyone for the layup.
Nor did he get called for the forearm to the back of Dirk's head on an out of bounds play.
etcetera. It's Shaq.

[dude1394]

prodigy, where is that screenshot from? ABC?

[LonghornDub]

Originally Posted by dude1394

prodigy, where is that screenshot from? ABC?

Nah, ESPN (although that's essentially the same thing as ABC). Go to the "more videos" link on the right side under the little mini video player.

[dongtouch]

I didn't get to watch the game. I just wanna know how the front line of Damp/Dirk fared with Shaq/Amare? Did Dirk guard Amare most of the time? I see that Magloire didn't play. Who guarded Shaq when Damp was off the floor? Just Bass?
The game against the Lakers, it looked horrible against Pau/Odom, but mainly because Damp was trapping Kobe 40 feet from the basket leaving Dirk by himself against Pau/Odom.

[monty55555]

PHOENIX – He played only 12 seconds in a loss to the LA Lakers.

He made up for lost time Sunday.

Brandon Bass was a key in the Dallas Mavericks victory over Phoenix, coming off the bench to score 19 points – the only points the Mavericks got from the bench until Devean George hit two free throws in the final 21 seconds.

"It's big for the team, it's big for me," Bass said. "I'm excited just to be able to contribute any way I can."

Bass has struggled of late. Sunday marked only the second time in the last eight games that he's scored in double figures.

But he was on in this game, going 8-of-13 from the field. His ability to hit the intermediate jumper pulled center Shaquille O'Neal away from the basket and gave the Mavericks a little more room to operate.

The Mavericks needed Bass to step up, since Malik Allen was unable to play because of back spasms.

"Brandon Bass, who hadn't played particularly well for us recently, came in and gave us a huge spark," Mavericks coach Avery Johnson said. "I don't know if we win the game without [Jason] Kidd's defense and without Bass' points in the first half."

Bass was on the court for more than 24 minutes Sunday. But he said he knows his performance doesn't ensure he will see comparable time Tuesday against Seattle.

"You can't think about playing time and minutes and how things are going to be, because you tend to not be focused," Bass said. "I just try to stay ready and not worry about it."

Ankle update: Dirk Nowitzki has averaged 25.7 points and shot 52.6 percent in three games since returning from a high-ankle sprain. The numbers indicate he's healthy.

He's not. Johnson estimated Nowitzki's mobility to be at 60 percent. Nowitzki took several hard falls Sunday and came up limping.

"It wasn't great on a couple of moves, I'm not going to lie," Nowitzki said. "But they are quick hits. It hurts for five to 10 seconds, and I move through it. It's not the kind of pain where you have to be taken out of the game. I can walk it off.

"It sounds kind of stupid, but after I take a couple of steps, it's able to calm down again.

It's stable. I'm feeling comfortable on it."

Briefly: Jason Kidd blocked four shots in Sunday's win. When was the last time that happened? "Maybe in high school," Kidd said. "All of them were below-the-belt blocks." ... The Mavericks are 13-11 since the Jason Kidd trade. The Suns, meanwhile, fell to 14-10 with Shaquille O'Neal.

http://www.dallasnews.com/sharedcont...s.34d4733.html

[Five-ofan]

the funniest one was where he blocked dirk. he hand checked with one hand, hand checked with the other, blocked the shot and then fouled the hell out of dirk again when dirk recovered the ball(which is where i think that picture came from) with no call on any of them.


one really positive thing about this game, dirks bad ankle is his left one and thats also the leg he jumped off of on the off balance shot at the end.

[twistaeffect2004]

Originally Posted by Five-ofan

one really positive thing about this game, dirks bad ankle is his left one and thats also the leg he jumped off of on the off balance shot at the end.

Ahh, good observation, that is a really good sign for the Diggler.

It looked like he tweaked his ankle in I believe the 3rd quarter, but the guy has cantaloupes. I think these past three games were a series of tests for Dirk. Falling for the first time, getting bumped, etc. Things that happen countless amounts of times during a game, but when you're injured ya just don't know how it's going to react.

Thankfully it seems that the ankle/knee is just fine, and he's steadily improved since the Golden State game.

[dirno2000]

Originally Posted by Five-ofan

the funniest one was where he blocked dirk. he hand checked with one hand, hand checked with the other, blocked the shot and then fouled the hell out of dirk again when dirk recovered the ball(which is where i think that picture came from) with no call on any of them.


one really positive thing about this game, dirks bad ankle is his left one and thats also the leg he jumped off of on the off balance shot at the end.

The play brought back memories of the summer of 06'. Wade's foul shots were only half of the story. The way the Heat were allowed to beat up Dirk was despicable.

[Five-ofan]

Originally Posted by twistaeffect2004

Ahh, good observation, that is a really good sign for the Diggler.

It looked like he tweaked his ankle in I believe the 3rd quarter, but the guy has cantaloupes. I think these past three games were a series of tests for Dirk. Falling for the first time, getting bumped, etc. Things that happen countless amounts of times during a game, but when you're injured ya just don't know how it's going to react.

Thankfully it seems that the ankle/knee is just fine, and he's steadily improved since the Golden State game.

yeah and the way he jumped off of that ankle is about the most amount of pressure he can put on it so i dont think hes gonna have a serious recurrance unless he rolls it.

[Five-ofan]

Originally Posted by dirno2000

The play brought back memories of the summer of 06'. Wade's foul shots were only half of the story. The way the Heat were allowed to beat up Dirk was despicable.

yeah which is what pissed me off about the amare off the ball call. he ended up blowing the fts so it turned out ok but the mavs honestly should never get called for an off the ball foul.(which as you said reminded me of the heat series because wade got a ton of off the ball calls.) im not saying the mavs should be allowed to just murder people off the ball or anything but you should call games evenly and dirk EASILY takes more contact away from the ball than anyone in the nba but it almost never gets called. then the mavs get called for off the ball fouls all the time. and it drives me nuts. honestly if i was cuban, the way people are allowed to maul dirk off the ball would be my pet peeve that i got on the commish/officials about with videos and things, not moving screens or whatever hes mad about at the moment.

[ghazi]

I'm still confused as to what happened to the Josh Howard that shot 48.8% from behind the 3 in December.

If there is one area that Mavs haven't improved in the last 3 games, it's perimeter shooting going 14-49 the last 3 games.

Anyone else concerned about that? or am I just knitpicking (again)..

[dude1394]

the worst thing that seems to happen to the mavs is hitting 3ptrs (except dirk as he doesn't only jack 'em up). Mavs only took 10 today.

[monty55555]

Forgive the forthcoming scatology, but going into Sunday afternoon, we spent the weekend collecting Mavs’ statistical turds. And DallasBasketball.com even got some help from Mark Cuban himself, who came along with a pooper-scooper.

The reason Dallas’ come-from-nowhere 105-98 win at Phoenix is so stunning is that it bucks most every trend established by this year’s club. The reason the win – which points to an eventual playoff berth -- is so encouraging is that it follows most every trend established by the previous two 60-win editions of the club.

Cuban’s explanation for it all? “Shit happens,’’ he tells DB.com in an exclusive two-word summary.

We’d gotten our hands full (and filthy!) dealing with the following before-the-Suns-game road apples: As we wrote after Dallas’ last-second loss Friday at LA, this year’s Mavs were a lowly 4-9 in close games. Another quick check shows that in those same “close games’’ (defined as four-point-or-fewer margins), last year’s Mavs were 15-5 in such games. And one more check: the year before, the Mavs were 14-6 in such games.

And again, Cuban’s reaction when we excitedly showed him our revolting science project?

“Shit Happens,’’ he said.

Dallas can’t beat contenders? They were 1-11 in the Kidd Era before Phoenix.

Dallas can’t win roadies against West contenders? They were 6-12 before Phoenix.

Dallas can’t come back when behind by double-digits? They were 5-23 before Phoenix.

But the Phoenix game changed all that. … at least for one afternoon. They DID win a tight one, Kidd’s Mavs DID beat a contender, DID do it on the road against a power, and DID do it with a comeback that was marked not by frantic play but by calm, methodical, fundamental play.

“We haven’t been able to win these kinds of games,’’ Avery said afterwards. “It was good for it to finally happen.’’

It finally happens. AND “Shit Happens.’’

We appreciate Cuban’s position -- at least temporarily -- and we’ll roll with it. Let’s forget for a moment the negative over-analysis (we said for a moment) and consider that those unsavory pre-Phoenix numbers, along with this win, provide us with a thesis:

This remains a very good team – essentially as good as the 60-wins-or-more editions of the club that won the WCF in 2005-06 and won the NBA’s top seed in 2006-07. A very good team. … Maybe even the very same team. … With one singular, fixable, shortcoming.

This year’s team will win, say, 51. It will do so with maybe nine or 10 or 11 “close-game’’ losses. Give these Mavs enough closer games, and closer wins – the sort they captured in the previous two seasons – and Dallas is suddenly a 60-game winner again. … and the heavy favorite as the No. 1 seed in the West.

That’s our thesis.

Elsewhere at DB.com we’ve applied that 4-9 number to Friday’s loss in LA in which the Mavs suffered late-game breakdown after late-game breakdown. We dig Cuban’s angle enough that we’re taking a breather of sorts here, taking a breather from the finger-pointing and the blame-laying and the FireSoAndSo-Dot-Comming.

Let’s side-step whether it’s because Avery’s been lobotomized or because Dirk’s been castrated or whether Life As A Mav is too easy or Life As A Mav is too hard or whether our bench sucks or our drafting sucks or whether Kidd is too old or Josh is too young or whether a vengeful David Stern has spent the last eight years trying to drink Tony Cubes’ DQ milkshake.

Let’s side-step the “why’s’’ altogether.

Let’s just allow this one “what’’ to sink in.

Four-point outcomes boil down to one made shot. One errant pass. One silly substitution. One disorganized inbounds play. One rebound. One unfortunate whistle. One misstep.

“Shit Happens.’’

Is it that simple?

No less a stat jockey than ESPN’s John Hollinger (who can crunch a number until it becomes thoroughly unrecognizable, the way an elephant’s foot can crunch a peanut) is kinda with Cuban here. Hollinger writes that Dallas has experienced “more bad luck than bad basketball’’ and that “only a flukish series of close losses’’ define the problem. And he mentions Dirk’s four-game absence.

But Hollinger disappoints because he’s so focused on that overcooked 1-11 record. We’re dropping an unknown, but just as fascinating number: 4-9 in close games. And that’s a season-long turd.

(As we noted in a previous piece, you combine the full year’s record of 4-9 in close games with the full year’s record of 5-23 in games in which you trailed by double-digits with the full year’s record of being 6-12 on the road against West contenders, and. … well, the numbers seem almost as sickening as “2 Girls, 1 Cup.’’)

But today we get another injection of optimism. The Mavs reverted to the closers they once were. Consider:

· Dirk Nowitzki gave Dallas a game-high 32 points and 12 rebounds. He hauled around a semi-useless leg while doing it (and he’s averaging 29 ppg in his four hobbled games), and his leg almost failed him on the dagger try with 32 seconds left and the Mavs up four. He ran a pick-and-roll with Kidd, drove around Amare, stumbled, and then canned a falling-away jumper while almost crumbling while facing the defensive pressure of helper Grant Hill.

“I stumbled about 18 times there,’’ Dirk said self-effacingly.

· More Dirk: The offense ran through him almost exclusively in the key moments of the fourth. Not on iso’s, either. Pick-and-rolls. The ball and the decision in Kidd’s hands. … who over and over re-set to get Dirk in a sweet spot. As a result, Dirk scored 12 in the fourth, while the entire Suns team scored nine.

· One more Dirk: Did we see a couple of Dirk-and-Damp P-and-R’s that required Shaq to switch onto Nowitzki in space? Nice.

· Speaking of the P-and-R: How about the decision to involve Devean George with Kidd against the Nash-Amare attack so Dallas wasn’t as overmatched no matter the switch?

· Kidd played shutdown defender on Steve Nash – and, when necessary, on Amare. Kidd finished with four steals and four blocked shots while Nash countered with an 0-of-6 final period. Dirk had two steals in the fourth. Dallas had a 27-9 fourth-quarter edge while holding the explosive Suns without a point for almost eight minutes.

· George snared a big rebound of a late missed FT in traffic (Amare missed ‘em both), and then Devean coolly hit two FTs on the other end. The right guy in the right place at the right time? Yes. Devean played just 11 minutes in the game – but eight of those were in the fourth as Avery leaned to his defense over Jet’s offense.

· Erick Dampier was on the court for all but five seconds of the remaining 10:23 of the game. Ah, how we love the traditional center!

Said Avery: “We played some serious defense in the fourth.’’

The Mavs played like the closers they were. … or are. We dunno. The (essentially) same bunch of men wins an overwhelming percentage of its close games one year, wins a similarly overwhelming percentage of its close games the next year. … and in the third year spends the final minutes of close games tripping over its collective shoelaces?

Maybe they’re due?

“Shit Happens.’’

Oh, and how much of it is “pinpoint execution’’ (as coaches always claim) and how much of it is “luck’’? That word is so disgusting to the control-freakish in the coaching fraternity that our old chum Jimmy Johnson used to refuse to admit that “that word’’ played any role in his teams’ successes; Dirk, however, conceded that on his game-clinching stumbler, “I definitely needed a little luck there.’’

We’ll contend that Avery pushed many right buttons here – and we’ll concede that it often looks that way when the button-pushing results are positive. (And that the right button can look wrong when a player goofs up.) Example: He used Brandon Bass as the backup center, including among his assignments guarding Shaq. Question this? “The Animal’’ sharp-shot his way to 19 points! What’s to question?

Maybe this is all proof that sport really is, as most coaches have been telling us since the dawn of the inflatable ball, an “Any Given Sunday’’ proposition? And that previous to the Phoenix visit, this year’s Mavs are simply not being “given’’ enough Sundays?

As we understand it, at halftime of a recent Mavs game, ESPN carnival barker Stephen A. Smith dismissed the fact that J-Kidd had made a couple of 3-pointers, characterizing them as “lucky.’’ Is that how this works? A man spends 35 years perfecting his craft only to have some vidiot poop on his success?

“Shit Happens.’’

We’re hopeful that some of the things that worked in Phoenix are the result of analysis by Avery and staff. We’re also sure that at the right time, Cuban and staff will take a more analytical look at the trends we’ve mentioned here. And that they will be as interested in the “why’s’’ as they are in the “what’s.’’ (Cuban works too hard at everything he does to spend too long viewing it all with a “Shit Happens’’ shoulder-shrug.) Quite possibly the conclusion will fit our thesis, that this is a fine team that this year has often played “fine’’ for all but the few minutes of games, that can be “fine’’ in the future if it tightens things up in, say, minutes 44–through-48.

As it was against Phoenix. And, by the way, as it was earlier in the week in a monster blowout win over Golden State. And how it might be in a postseason appearance that now seems pretty likely.

“Shit Happens’’ could have been the alternate title, or the subtitle, for Oliver Stone’s football movie. “Any Given Sunday: Shit Happens!’’

We’re encouraged, right now, that it might not also be the title to the 2007-08 Dallas Mavericks highlight film.

http://www.dallasbasketball.com/fullColumn.php?id=370

[dirno2000]

Originally Posted by endrity

-The second, and this is being lost a bit, when the Suns traded away Marion they gave up anyone that can cover Josh. Bell is not the great defender that everyone makes him to be. He is a tough, gritty guy who does well at times against big guards that like to post up. However his lateral movement and athleticism are lacking even more now that he is getting up there with his age. And that is where Josh's game is based more.
Very simply, Josh can and should take over a game anytime against these new Suns. What he did today against them should be a norm. I think he can make up for any trouble that we will have with Shaq and Stat as a frontline. I really think he can do well against these guys, as well as Utah and New Orleans. Unfortunately we are heading for SAS and LAL as our possible first and second round matchups.

I think Dirk is the real beneficiary of the trade. Marion would have been hounding him all over the floor in the 4th but instead we were able to run the 4/5 pick and roll and isolate him against Shaq.

[Windmill360]

Is there anywhere i can see an archive link to this game?

[LonghornDub]

Originally Posted by Windmill360°

Is there anywhere i can see an archive link to this game?

Check your PM.

[monty55555]

Originally Posted by ProdigyDub

Check your PM.

Could you please send me the link as well?

Thank you very much.

[DirkFTW]

· More Dirk: The offense ran through him almost exclusively in the key moments of the fourth. Not on iso’s, either. Pick-and-rolls. The ball and the decision in Kidd’s hands. … who over and over re-set to get Dirk in a sweet spot. As a result, Dirk scored 12 in the fourth, while the entire Suns team scored nine.

*JOY*

[Usually Lurkin]

Originally Posted by DirkFTW

*JOY*

yeah. Much better than Dirk getting the basketball in his "sweet spot" with 2 seconds left on the shot clock with 2 guys draped on him. And how often have we screamed "REPOST!!!!" over the course of the last 2 years? This was a very encouraging game for many reasons.

[cinemablend]

For the first time since the Mavs got Kidd... they finished well.

Yeah I know they beat Golden State, but that game wasn't close at the end, the Mavs didn't have to finish well.

[FINtastic]

Originally Posted by dirno2000

I think Dirk is the real beneficiary of the trade. Marion would have been hounding him all over the floor in the 4th but instead we were able to run the 4/5 pick and roll and isolate him against Shaq.

Yeah, the Suns really don't have anyone that has a prayer of guarding Dirk. The fact that he scored 32 points on a gimpy ankle pretty much said it all.

[dirno2000]

[QUOTE=FINtastic]Yeah, the Suns really don't have anyone that has a prayer of guarding Dirk. The fact that he scored 32 points on a gimpy ankle pretty much said it all.[/QUOTE}

Amare's defense on Dirk's fade away was really bad. When Dirk got the ball Amare was flat footed looking at Kidd which allowed Dirk to blow past him. Then he just kind of ran down the land and didn't even contest the shot. If Marion was there i don't even think he gets that off.

It may not have mattered because we were still up two possessions with under a minute remaining but it was nice insurance.

I also noticed that Dan Tony went to the Nash/Shaq pick and roll instead of the Nash/Amarie version on two straight possessions at around the three minute mark. That one is much easier to defend and I think it helped us.

[Dirkadirkastan]

Originally Posted by chumdawg

Shaq is a big old boy. A gentle foul by him is going to look like a flagrant by a smaller guy.

That's the price you pay when you take him on. There's nothing wrong with this. It's part of what makes him such a bad mo-fo in the first place.

Props to Terry for taking the big man on.

But it's still a foul...?

I just hate the old "he can't help that he's big" argument. Well, someone has to pay for his bulky body parts flailing all over the place. Might as well be everyone on the other team, huh?

[horse900703]

Very Good Win!!!!
Keep it up guys!!!

[alexamenos]

Originally Posted by Caseman

This has nothing to do with the Mavericks, but Gordo is on the Ticket and whispering sexy things in my ear.

I caught this too -- Gordo as "Compound Carl". That was some funny stuff.

[MavsX]

Originally Posted by monty55555

what are they going to make out?

[alexamenos]

my four or five random things, most of which has already been covered.

a) dirk. stud;

b) the pick and rolls with damp did a fine job of getting shaq out on the perimeter against dirk, but dirk is still too immobile to take advantage of this. that is, dirk is still very injured, and this makes him all the more studly;

b) Bass wasn't altogether terrible when guarding Amare. He got schooled a couple of times early, but did a reasonably pleasant job later on. I will even swear to you that at one point in the second half Bass had Amare really frustrated -- they were bumping chests and glaring at each other, and then Amare got the ball and put up a frustrated ugly jumpshot that didn't come close;

b) Bass isn't the ideal center to be guarding Shaq. This is not a matchup that favors Dallas, imo;

b) Like it or not, Bass is the 3rd best "big" on this team. The Mavs lack of depth is appalling, and all the more so at the 4-5.

b) i kinda liked the kidd-howard-george-dirk-damp lineup, moreso than jet and especially stack at the two with j-ho at the three. they're a better defensive team, a better rebounding team, stack is spent and JET needs to get his little scoring butt in gear anyway.

b2) i don't quite get the jet for george sub late in the 4th -- sometimes when a thing is working that well you just ought to leave it alone.

b) a desperately needed win and a confidence boost. i think the mavs close game losses have been a little more than random bad luck, perhaps this win will chart a better course for them.

[LonghornDub]

Originally Posted by alexamenos

b) Like it or not, Bass is the 3rd best "big" on this team. The Mavs lack of depth is appalling, and all the more so at the 4-5.

Most of your post I'm completely on board with, but this part makes no sense. The Mavs depth at the 4/5 is not "appalling" by any measure relative to the rest of the NBA

How many teams in the NBA have a 3rd best "big" better than Bass? The Mavs were one of the only teams to have two legit C's when Diop was here--it's not like that's some luxury that all other 29 NBA teams have.

Hell, a lot of teams don't even have ONE legit C. Look at the Spurs--they have a PF who plays a lot of C, then Robert Horry or Kurt Thomas? I'll take Damp.

[alexamenos]

Originally Posted by ProdigyDub

Most of your post I'm completely on board with, but this part makes no sense. The Mavs depth at the 4/5 is not "appalling" by any measure relative to the rest of the NBA

How many teams in the NBA have a 3rd best "big" better than Bass? The Mavs were one of the only teams to have two legit C's when Diop was here--it's not like that's some luxury that all other 29 NBA teams have.

Hell, a lot of teams don't even have ONE legit C. Look at the Spurs--they have a PF who plays a lot of C, then Robert Horry or Kurt Thomas? I'll take Damp.

that's a fair point, I guess I should say it's appalling as compared to when they had diop backing up damp -- how quickly we come to take things for granted, eh?

[Thespiralgoeson]

I have a whole new appreciation for Jason Kidd's defense after this game. Despite his age, the guy is still one of the best defensive guards in the league IMO.

[Thespiralgoeson]

Originally Posted by alexamenos

that's a fair point, I guess I should say it's appalling as compared to when they had diop backing up damp -- how quickly we come to take things for granted, eh?

I have to agree. This team has misses Diop A LOT. I truly believe we might've won 60 again this year if Bass hadn't played the bulk of his minutes at center.