Preacher Zell

[dude1394]

I think that the msm really doesn't understand southerners for sure and probably mainstream democrats either. Zell miller was preceived as angry for NO reason by the msm, but I don't think it rings that way to others.

preach on brotha'

Mighty Miller
Say it louder, brother!

I didn't know until I saw replays on television that Zell Miller looked angry during his convention speech — like a Baptist preacher going after flagrant sins. From where I sat in Madison Square Garden, Miller looked like he was having a grand old time, getting something big off his chest with as much zest, gusto, and good ol' Baptist invective as he could.

People all around the country reacted to Zell as I did. My sister, who was in Cincinnati at a six-week consultation of nuclear engineers and other technicians from all over the country, told me the next morning that all anybody could talk about in the usually silent and grumpy early-morning breakfast room was Zell Miller. They loved the speech. Some were former Democrats, some were Republicans angry at Bush for one reason or another (the war, the spending, etc.), but Miller was speaking for many of them when he explained why he did not want to vote for this Democrat. My sister was the co-chair of Jimmy Carter's winning campaign in Michigan in 1976, and Zell spoke for her, too.

To quibble over whether Zell was right on this or that point, or as fair and balanced as the reporters of the Associated Press, or as evenhanded as Joe Klein, is to miss the point when listening to a Baptist sermon, rendered by a Southern populist who relishes his heritage. He has the obligation of fitting into a literary form, as demanding in its way as a sonnet. His task is to penetrate through the details, fire like a laser straight into the heart, spear the essential sin and betrayal thriving there, and explode the grip of their tentacles. His task is to lead the sinner, with the light of that explosion, to mend his ways.

Zell Miller nailed the political correctness of the little liberal in the heart of all of us (driven into us by the monolithic liberal media of the last generation) — the political correctness that leads us to be ashamed to speak forthrightly about good and evil, ashamed to face the desperate need to rally to the defense of our country against one of the worst evils to ever threaten it.

The left wing of the Democratic party doesn't like either the war on terror or the war in Iraq, and refuses to see the vividly clear connection between the two. The left wing wants to change the subject to domestic policy, and even that is absurdly characterized by them. The left wing wants to forget its own wartime heroes Franklin Roosevelt, Harry Truman, and John Kennedy — "bear any burden, meet any hardship."

Preacher Zell reminded us of what Democrats of his age, and ours, once used to stand for.

the rest

[dude1394]

They probably hope southies aren't reading thie either. This is item 106 of the Kerry's list of lies told at the RNC.
onefinejay

106. Miller: “…Against the Trident missile, against, against, against. This is the man who wants to be the Commander in Chief of our U.S. Armed Forces? U.S. forces armed with what? Speeutbawlls?”[Miller Remarks, 9/1/04]

It’s S-P-I-T-B-A-L-L-S, but you knew that. You just wanted to take a shot at a man with a Southern accent, proving once again that the target of a Democrat rebuttal is the person, and not the message.

[Epitome22]

Novak would know alot about Southern Democrats and Southern religion, him being from Pennsylvania and all. I'm sorry but Zell Miller's speech definitely had alot of cast out the devil anger in it. To even insinuate that his over the top anger was forgivable because he was merely expressing himself in a traditional southern babtist sermon sort of way is also no excuse. For an intelligent, calm, classy southern babtist, sunday school teacher and honorable Georgian (unlike Zig Zag Zell) look no further than this man.

The text of a letter former President Carter sent to Zell Miller over the weekend
http://www.talkingpointsmemo.com/archives/week_2004_09_...

You seem to have forgotten that loyal Democrats elected you as mayor and as state senator. Loyal Democrats, including members of my family and me, elected you as lieutenant governor and as governor. It was a loyal Democrat, Lester Maddox, who assigned you to high positions in the state government when you were out of office. It was a loyal Democrat, Roy Barnes, who appointed you as U.S. Senator when you were out of office. By your historically unprecedented disloyalty, you have betrayed our trust.

Great Georgia Democrats who served in the past, including Walter George, Richard Russell, Herman Talmadge, and Sam Nunn disagreed strongly with the policies of Franklin Roosevelt, Harry Truman, John Kennedy, Lyndon Johnson, and me, but they remained loyal to the party in which they gained their public office. Other Democrats, because of philosophical differences or the race issue, like Bo Callaway and Strom Thurmond, at least had the decency to become Republicans.

Everyone knows that you were chosen to speak at the Republican Convention because of your being a “Democrat,” and it’s quite possible that your rabid and mean-spirited speech damaged our party and paid the Republicans some transient dividends.

Perhaps more troublesome of all is seeing you adopt an established and very effective Republican campaign technique of destroying the character of opponents by wild and false allegations. The Bush campaign’s personal attacks on the character of John McCain in South Carolina in 2000 was a vivid example. The claim that war hero Max Cleland was a disloyal American and an ally of Osama bin Laden should have given you pause, but you have joined in this ploy by your bizarre claims that another war hero, John Kerry, would not defend the security of our nation except with spitballs. (This is the same man whom you described previously as “one of this nation's authentic heroes, one of this party's best-known and greatest leaders -- and a good friend.")

I, myself, never claimed to have been a war hero, but I served in the navy from 1942 to 1953, and, as president, greatly strengthened our military forces and protected our nation and its interests in every way. I don’t believe this warrants your referring to me as a pacificist.

Zell, I have known you for forty-two years and have, in the past, respected you as a trustworthy political leader and a personal friend. But now, there are many of us loyal Democrats who feel uncomfortable in seeing that you have chosen the rich over the poor, unilateral preemptive war over a strong nation united with others for peace, lies and obfuscation over the truth, and the political technique of personal character assassination as a way to win elections or to garner a few moments of applause. These are not the characteristics of great Democrats whose legacy you and I have inherited.
===END====

Class Personified

[dude1394]

Carter was an abomination as a president and I voted for the sob.

[Epitome22]

Originally posted by: dude1394
Carter was an abomination as a president and I voted for the sob.

I have hearf many people question Mr. Carter's worth as a president. I've yet to hear anyone question his loyalty, honor, religious conviction or integrity as a man, a Georgian, a Christian and a Democrat. The same cannot be said for big tobacco Zell.

[dude1394]

Carter was an abomination as a president. Maybe the worst ever.

[Epitome22]

Originally posted by: dude1394
Carter was an abomination as a president. Maybe the worst ever.

Anything else?

Keep supporting your racial segregationist buddies.

[dude1394]

As usual, you pull out the tired racist, nazi gun. But it's just funny coming from a bigot.

[reeds]

anyone who wishes they could turn back time and challenge someone to a duel is flipping out of their minds.. redneck nuts...but the republicans eat that stuff up..its right up their alley..backwards

[Epitome22]

Originally posted by: dude1394
As usual, you pull out the tired racist, nazi gun. But it's just funny coming from a bigot.

Relax homie, I'm not talking about you. I'm talking about dixiecrat Zell.

[dude1394]

Oh...sorry, I thought you were just in the habit.

You and andrew sullivan jumping on the dixiecrat meme.. You should check out what I'm reading right now about zell and sullivan and folks not getting it..

frontpage

[Epitome22]

It has nothing to do with Andrew Sullivan (nothing against him) his quote was made aware to me some years ago in a piece I read about the "renegade Democrat." To add insult to injury, he lied about saying it when it was originally brought up against him. Like the honorable President Carter said, these old racist dixiecrats like Strom Thurmond, at least had the decency to switch parties and become Republicans, a party where their thoughts and feelings about negroes and mud people are much more respected and admired.

As for what you are reading, spare me. Next time at least cite a publication of repute like the standard or review or at least cite a non-racist author (racial charlatans indeed) You seem to be rather fond of far-right, pro-imperialist, racist scribblers. Mark Steyn, David Horowitz, I suppose the next article you'll highlight will be written by David Duke.

[dude1394]

Done...finished talking to close minded bigots.

[dalmations202]

Typical Jimmy Carter

Great Georgia Democrats who served in the past, including Walter George, Richard Russell, Herman Talmadge, and Sam Nunn disagreed strongly with the policies of Franklin Roosevelt, Harry Truman, John Kennedy, Lyndon Johnson, and me, but they remained loyal to the party in which they gained their public office.

Sell your soul to be loyal to the democratic party, no matter how much you disagree with what the democratic party is saying. Carter did, that is why he was a one term president.

[LRB]

Originally posted by: dalmations202
Typical Jimmy Carter

Sell your soul to be loyal to the democratic party, no matter how much you disagree with what the democratic party is saying. Carter did, that is why he was a one term president.

Yeah sounds like Carter is preaching loyalty to party over loyalty to principles and to country.

[LRB]

BTW using Jimmy Carters logic, shouldn't John Kerry has sought a conscientious objecters release from the Navy reserve before protesting the war?

[Epitome22]

Originally posted by: dalmations202
Typical Jimmy Carter

Sell your soul to be loyal to the democratic party, no matter how much you disagree with what the democratic party is saying. Carter did, that is why he was a one term president.

The only one who did any soul selling was Zell himself. If his 'philosophical differences' were that great, he should have had the decency to switch parties. It's not about loyalty to party over country and principle. Their are many conservative and moderate democrats who were pro-war and they voice their opinions hrough their voting legislation and agreement with Republicans and disagreements within their party. John McCain is a maverick who has taken his party to task numerous times and has disagreements about many principles of his party, but despite this (and many Democrats urgings to do such) he remains loyal to his party and it's elected officials to the point of rebuking attempts to make him and Kerry seem like close pals.

Zell was a key-note speaker precisely because he was a 'Democrat.' If ol' Zig Zag, Big Tobacco, Dixiecrat Zell had such opposition to his party's philosophies and it's presidential candidate, he should have at least had the honor and decency to switch parties. Unfortunately for Zell (A Democrat only in name) and Republicans, honor and decency are concepts they know nothing about.

Carter did, that is why he was a one term president.

Carter sold his soul? how why and when, and how does this relate to his only being a one term President? Note: If the only rebuttal you have to what Carter has said is that he was an allegedly ineffectual President, and can find no stains on his moral character, you would serve your purpose better by just being quiet. At least call him a traitor and an ally to Osama or something.

[dalmations202]

Carter sold his soul? how why and when, and how does this relate to his only being a one term President? Note: If the only rebuttal you have to what Carter has said is that he was an allegedly ineffectual President, and can find no stains on his moral character, you would serve your purpose better by just being quiet. At least call him a traitor and an ally to Osama or something

You must not even be old enough to know who Jimmy Carter is, or what happened while he was president. Or the farmers that voted him into office only to be shafted. Or the politics involved that left Americans hostage in Iran for a long long time. Or the "I've got to take the peaceful" approach with terrorism, which literally held this whole country hostage. Or maybe the military which had to play politics on who was going to do what causing a failed mission into Iran, instead of being able to send in a unit to "get the job done".

He was not a traitor, and not an ally to Osama. But he also had no courage, and didn't believe in America saying, "enough is enough". America is free because people were willing to give their lives to make that happen. Yes, I've been there, and no, I don't need to hear from you about something that you have not a clue.

And I stand by my statement that he sold his soul for politics, instead of "what is right". America saw this, and that is why he was a one term President.

[knowitall]

Well I'm old enough to remember. I think they wanted us to turn over the Shah to them. Remember the Shah? The guy we put into power in Iran? The guy that butchered thousands and thousands of the people there?

[dalmations202]

Yes, I remember the Shaw, and the oil, and the millions sent to Iran. And also the Iatolla (sp)? And the Americans who lost their lives, and the politics, and the politics, and the politics. And somewhere in all of that, Americans stayed hostage in Iran, and American servicemen died. And instead of us putting an end to it right then, we are still dealing with it today.

[knowitall]

When you say "still dealing with it today" are you suggesting that we take a stroll on over to Iran right now?

[dude1394]

Carter WAS a malaise. Carter sat by while our country had war declared on us and did squat. He is or is tied with the worst president in our history. He couldn't have been any worse.

As zell said...

But don't waste your breath telling that to the leaders of my party today. In their warped way of thinking, America is the problem, not the solution. They don't believe there is any real danger in the world except that which America brings upon itself through our clumsy and misguided foreign policy.

It is not their patriotism, it is their judgment that has been so sorely lacking.

They claimed Carter's pacifism would lead to peace. They were wrong.

They claimed Reagan's defense buildup would lead to war. They were wrong.

And no pair has been more wrong, more loudly, more often than the two Senators from Massachusetts, Ted Kennedy and John Kerry.

[knowitall]

I remember thinking the hostages would be released if Reagan became President. And a great President he was.

[dude1394]

The hostages were released becaue the pathetic carter was out of office.

[Epitome22]

The hostages were released after Carter was voted out of office because members of the challenger Reagan's campaign which included men with CIA ties like former President Bush, sabotaged discussions between Carter and the Ayatollah. It was part of this covert treason that led to the Iran-Contra crisis. It wouldn't even have existed if the U.S. hadn't publically backed a tyrant like the Shah for so long, admitting asylum to him to excape the justice of the people he ruled over for so long. Iran merely asked that the Shah be returned and the U.S. promise to quit meddling in their affairs anymore. But Carter refuaed to appease them and send a covert resue mission. During the mission, an army helicopter accidentally crashed into an army aircraft (Carter's fault) and the mission failed. Later when that wimp Carter was deposed, Reagan showed the real way Americans are supposed to deal with countries that hold terrorists. Sell missiles to them.

[LRB]

Wow Epitome do you sit up at night with tin foil rapped around your head at night so the mother ship can contact you?

What a bunch of bunk. The hostages were released not because of anything carter did. They weren't delayed in any way by Reagan either. The hostages were released only because the Iranians feared that Reagan would come over and kick their sorry asses if the hostages weren't released by the time he took office.

And if Carter had had the balls to stand up to the military politicians and go with the teams and equipment the way the mission had been practiced, he might have actually done something. But I can't really think of anyone that Carter ever stood up to.