General Election GDT 11/04/2008

[Silk Smoov]

Originally Posted by Rhylan

If you look at combination of a very long time spent on this forum and relatively low but steady posts per day, I think BBL and I both are prime candidates for high average post quality.

And.. we voted on opposite sides of this election.

Just goes to show who's carrying the empty bag in this thread. Everyone check your credit! Someone is failing debate 101.

Once again, you went to your childish levels. Mr.Moderator!!!! Once BBL goes back to read the thread, I think he will see what I was talking about. Keep it up Mr.Moderator.

[Big Boy Laroux]

dude, i edited my post to add the ".000000000001%" statement.

what set me off, Silk, was your "that is ______ baiting" post. that's what did it. Not any of the other posts on this thread. that SINGLE ridiculous post of yours. so kudos to you.

Man, i'm done with you, just like I'm done with 92bdad. Go find another sandbox to play in. Better hope it's not WHITE sand, though.

[Murphy3]

Originally Posted by Silk Smoov

Your problem is you think you know it all. Speaking of reading comprehension, please tell me once again what my post said? It seems that you want to quote only one sentence. Take your time and read the entire post. Then go back to find out what I was talking about. My ENTIRE post was directed at YOU and OTHERS who claimed that blacks voted for Obama because he was black. You guys made the black vote into a race issue, now you are trying to turn it around to something different.

Many did, I'm sure... however, many probably voted based on their beliefs...

[Silk Smoov]

Originally Posted by Big Boy Laroux

dude, i edited my post to add the ".000000000001%" statement.

what set me off, Silk, was your "that is ______ baiting" post. that's what did it. Not any of the other posts on this thread. that SINGLE ridiculous post of yours. so kudos to you.

Man, i'm done with you, just like I'm done with 92bdad. Go find another sandbox to play in. Better hope it's not WHITE sand, though.

Think about how silly that is. You got ticked off by my post that MOCKED Rhylan post that made a statement similar to that except about blacks. First, you claim I race bait, but when I point out someone else saying similar statements and I mock them by saying they race bait, then you are ticked off???????????? Go figure???

[Silk Smoov]

Originally Posted by Rhylan

Silk & Chum -

Fill in the blank:

90% of Blacks ______ the same.

You guys say it's okay to fill the blank in with "vote," and disrespectful to blacks to fill it in with anything else.

I say it's disrespectful no matter what you fill it in with - and the fact that it's TRUE when you fill it in with "vote" is a problem! No group of people that large is THAT similar on all the dimensions by which we choose to vote, just because of skin color.

BBL,
Here is the post I responded to. No matter who responded to that between Chum or myself, it was designed to bait us into race debate...Do you not see that?

[fluid.forty.one]

magic johnson on CNN talking about obama lol

[dude1394]

Well cubes did.

I voted for President Elect Obama.

The rest of my votes went almost exclusively to Republicans , Libertarians and Independents.

In looking at the Democratic platform, there are a few things I agree with, but on the economic side, other than being ok with him raising my effective tax rate to 40pct, there isn’t a lot of his economic policy that I do agree with him on. So why did I vote for him ?

Its simple. Having an elected black President will do more to energize this country than any economic or social policy ever could. In a single day of voting, our amazing country once again reinvigorated the dream that any child in this country, no matter what circumstances they are born into, can grow up to be anything they want, including President of the United States.

That dream, staying viable, being reinvigorated, will do more for this country than any economic policy or any legislation that could ever be passed.

I have said it before, the power of the American Spirit is what separates our country from every other. We have been able to overcome the stupidity that politicians do every year, and will do for ever more. The election of Barack Obama is a shot of adrenaline for those who felt they could never participate in the American Dream.

How do you stimulate and turn around the economy in this day and age ? Motivate those who in the past couldn’t , wouldn’t or didn’t, into those who can and do. Motivate those who can and do, to continue to innovate and increase productivity.

As any successful CEO will tell you, leadership, vision and motivation has far more impact on results than any tax cut or increase. While I prefer lower taxes, I can tell you that no entrepreneur or CEO worth a damn in this country gives up or works less because of a change in tax policy. In this country you work harder to achieve your dreams and goals.

I can honestly say that I never thought that I would see a black President in my lifetime. I’m incredibly proud and excited to be part of this moment in our history. I believe that the election of President Obama will energize many, many more of our fellow citizens to work harder to achieve our goals.

I’m Bullish on America.

[Usually Lurkin]

This report might have been titled: "Running with and without a base"

http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com...igher-than-04/

Report: '08 turnout same as or only slightly higher than '04
Posted: 01:55 PM ET

WASHINGTON (CNN) – A new report from American University’s Center for the Study of the American Electorate concludes that voter turnout in Tuesday’s election was the same in percentage terms as it was four years ago — or at most has risen by less than 1 percent.

Click here to read the entire report.

The report released Thursday estimates that between 126.5 and 128.5 million Americans cast ballots in the presidential election earlier this week. Those figures represent 60.7 percent or, at most, 61.7 percent of those eligible to vote in the country.

“A downturn in the number and percentage of Republican voters going to the polls seemed to be the primary explanation for the lower than predicted turnout,” the report said. Compared to 2004, Republican turnout declined by 1.3 percentage points to 28.7 percent, while Democratic turnout increased by 2.6 points from 28.7 percent in 2004 to 31.3 percent in 2008.

“Many people were fooled (including this student of politics although less so than many others) by this year’s increase in registration (more than 10 million added to the rolls), citizens’ willingness to stand for hours even in inclement weather to vote early, the likely rise in youth and African American voting, and the extensive grassroots organizing network of the Obama campaign into believing that turnout would be substantially higher than in 2004,” Curtis Gans, the center’s director, said in the report. “But we failed to realize that the registration increase was driven by Democratic and independent registration and that the long lines at the polls were mostly populated by Democrats.”

Some experts also note that national turnout trends may mask higher turnout in swing states with more intensive attempts by both campaigns to get their supporters to the polls. Several large states, including California and New York, had no statewide races and virtually no advertising or get-out-the-vote efforts by either presidential campaign.

According to the report, several Southern states — North Carolina, Georgia, South Carolina, Alabama, Virginia, and Mississippi — and the District of Columbia saw the greatest increases in voter turnout.

Overall turnout was highest in Minnesota, Wisconsin, Iowa, Missouri, Michigan, South Dakota and North Carolina, according to the report.

In 2004, 122 million Americans voted in the general election.

edit: a post at powerlineblog says that the AU study left out some west coast states (like CA!)

[92bDad]

Interesting post regarding voter turnout.

In the wake of this election, I would urge the Republican party to do many many things...but one of the top priorities would be to stop assuming California is only a Democratic state. They should be making efforts now to start winning Republican California voters. Turn California into a Swing state, rather than just sit idle.

The Republican party has ignored California and as result we see the large number of voting for Democratic candidates, but we can see with the various propositions that there are more than enough Conservative minded voters within the state.

Rather than bash California and its citizens, they must work to win the hearts and minds of California citizens. Call me crazy, but that is a key ground that I truly believe can be won over by the Republicans if they go after that vote.

If they can win California, then they can win the rest of the country.

Are the Republicans willing to do what it takes? Stick to their values rather than float in the middle and stand for nothing?

Saddly there are other criteria, voting blocs that are defined by racial lines...this is truly a sad state of affairs, but never the less, they must go out and reach out to the various ethnic voting groups. Each of which has a strong conservative values system and they must tap into those values, without tearing individuals down. They must develope and strengthen groups that compete with left wing groups such as ACLU and NAACP and ACORN. These groups have done well for their constituents, but they only do this for a portion of them...the Republicans and Conservatives must support other such groups.

The closest that I can compare of a group that I am aware of is the differences between "Planned Parenthood" groups and "Pregnancy Resource Center" organizations.

The Republicans must bring more awareness to resources that offer the type of support for individuals that Republicans believe in.

They must show the various voting blocs that they can have diversity of beliefs, opinions and have support for what they want in life.

It will be a long hard road, the Democrats have done a great job of demonizing Republicans, for that I give the Democrats credit. It's up to Republicans to get the truth out about Republicans, it is also up to Republicans to act on that truth and not find themselves caught up in lies.

As they say, the truth shall set you free.

Discredit me all you want and discredit the link below...but it well worth exploring.

I have complete faith and hope in the American people and it is up to the Republican party to restore that faith into the American people.

http://www.nationalblackrepublicans....main&x=4837891

[92bDad]

Democrat-controlled cities that are burdened by socialism and mired in poverty:

Detroit, MI (1st on the poverty rate list); no Republican mayor since 1961
Buffalo, NY (2nd on the poverty rate list); no Republican mayor since 1954
Cincinnati, OH (3rd on the poverty rate list); no Republican mayor since 1984
Cleveland, OH (4th on the poverty rate list); no Republican mayor since 1989
Miami, FL (5th on the poverty rate list); no Republican mayor ever
St. Louis, MO (6th on the poverty rate list); no Republican mayor since 1949
El Paso, TX (7th on the poverty rate list); no Republican mayor ever
Milwaukee, WI (8th on the poverty rate list); no Republican mayor since 1908
Philadelphia, PA (9th on the poverty rate list); no Republican mayor since 1952
Newark, NJ (10th on the poverty rate list); no Republican mayor since 1907

Einstein once said: "The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results."

[Underdog]

Originally Posted by 92bDad

Einstein once said: "The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results."

So why do we keep voting at all then?

[mary]

Originally Posted by 92bDad

Democrat-controlled cities that are burdened by socialism and mired in poverty:

Detroit, MI (1st on the poverty rate list); no Republican mayor since 1961
Buffalo, NY (2nd on the poverty rate list); no Republican mayor since 1954
Cincinnati, OH (3rd on the poverty rate list); no Republican mayor since 1984
Cleveland, OH (4th on the poverty rate list); no Republican mayor since 1989
Miami, FL (5th on the poverty rate list); no Republican mayor ever
St. Louis, MO (6th on the poverty rate list); no Republican mayor since 1949
El Paso, TX (7th on the poverty rate list); no Republican mayor ever
Milwaukee, WI (8th on the poverty rate list); no Republican mayor since 1908
Philadelphia, PA (9th on the poverty rate list); no Republican mayor since 1952
Newark, NJ (10th on the poverty rate list); no Republican mayor since 1907

Einstein once said: "The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results."

link?

[92bDad]

Originally Posted by Underdog

So why do we keep voting at all then?

What are you recommending?

[92bDad]

Originally Posted by mary

link?

http://www.nationalblackrepublicans....main&x=4837891

Scroll down and you will see the points in the articles. It's about halfway down the page, just under the picture of Paul Johnson protesting.

[mary]

Originally Posted by 92bDad

http://www.nationalblackrepublicans....main&x=4837891

Scroll down and you will see the points in the articles. It's about halfway down the page, just under the picture of Paul Johnson protesting.

Thanks. I was pretty sure you hadn't gathered that information on you own.

[Underdog]

Originally Posted by 92bDad

What are you recommending?

I recommend not doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results.

[alexamenos]

the black man just can't catch a break in this country...

Black Man Given Nation's Worst Job

WASHINGTON—African-American man Barack Obama, 47, was given the least-desirable job in the entire country Tuesday when he was elected president of the United States of America. In his new high-stress, low-reward position, Obama will be charged with such tasks as completely overhauling the nation's broken-down economy, repairing the crumbling infrastructure, and generally having to please more than 300 million Americans and cater to their every whim on a daily basis. As part of his duties, the black man will have to spend four to eight years cleaning up the messes other people left behind. The job comes with such intense scrutiny and so certain a guarantee of failure that only one other person even bothered applying for it. Said scholar and activist Mark L. Denton, "It just goes to show you that, in this country, a black man still can't catch a break."

[92bDad]

Originally Posted by Underdog

I recommend not doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results.

So how would you work on improviding those 10 poverty stricken cities with a history of Democratic leadership?

[alexamenos]

Originally Posted by 92bDad

So how would you work on improviding those 10 poverty stricken cities with a history of Democratic leadership?

change
hope

[mary]

I'm guessing there's a population parameter on those data...and that there's a very strong correlation between population density and poverty.

[Underdog]

Originally Posted by alexamenos

change
hope

Alex is catching on...

[92bDad]

Originally Posted by mary

Thanks. I was pretty sure you hadn't gathered that information on you own.

You welcome.

[92bDad]

Originally Posted by alexamenos

change
hope

How?

What would you change?

What is HOPE?

Outside of me going away...what are you hoping for?

[alexamenos]

Originally Posted by Underdog

Alex is catching on...

yes we can.

si se puede.

[Underdog]

Originally Posted by 92bDad

How?

What would you change?

What is HOPE?

Outside of me going away...what are you hoping for?

I'm hoping to score tonight for a change...


(it's been, like, a week or so - I don't go swimming when the tide is red...)

[alexamenos]

Originally Posted by 92bDad

What would you change?

The first thing I'd change is I'd make it a crime punishable by death for a person to say "literally" when what they really mean is "figuratively". Like when Bob Ortegal says "Dirk literally exploded tonight!". Obviously he doesn't mean that there a little bloody pieces of the uber-German scattered around the court, but instead that Dirk blew it up, figuratively speaking of course.

After I enacted this, I'd probably spend a lot of taxpayer money on hookers and booze and stuff.

[alexamenos]

Originally Posted by Underdog

I'm hoping to score tonight for a change...


(it's been, like, a week or so - I don't go swimming when the tide is red...)

i'm literally laughing my ass off...no wait, I'm figuratively laughing my ass off.

[92bDad]

Originally Posted by mary

I'm guessing there's a population parameter on those data...and that there's a very strong correlation between population density and poverty.

Unfortunately, I do not have all the data, but your point is well taken and very plausible.

Do you find a possible correlation between the areas and the leadership at the Mayor of those cities?

It is rather interesting to find the 10 worst all have 10 Mayors who are Democrat and then to find out the historical time frame that the Democrats have been in charge of those cities.

Don't get me wrong, I know without a doubt that the Republicans have theri fair share of incompetence as a party and within their own individuals using the "R" under their name. But I find it interesting to see this list and honestly I was surprised NOT to see an "R" represented in those cities.

Perhaps the Republicans should truly campaign on Change and Hope in these 10 cities?

[Underdog]

Originally Posted by alexamenos

The first thing I'd change is I'd make it a crime punishable by death for a person to say "literally" when what they really mean is "figuratively". Like when Bob Ortegal says "Dirk literally exploded tonight!". Obviously he doesn't mean that there a little bloody pieces of the uber-German scattered around the court, but instead that Dirk blew it up, figuratively speaking of course.

After I enacted this, I'd probably spend a lot of taxpayer money on hookers and booze and stuff.

Also - could someone do away with daylight savings???

Who does it serve? How many millions of dollars do we lose each year due to workers trying to adjust their sleep schedules???


I think this needs to be the #1 priority for our government above all else - I think God would even forgive us for working on Sundays to get this problem solved!

[Underdog]

Originally Posted by 92bDad

Perhaps the Republicans should truly campaign on Change and Hope in these 10 cities?

Well, "free beer" also goes a long way in bringing about meaningful change...

It's a brave new world - we need brave new ideas!

[alexamenos]

Originally Posted by 92bDad

Unfortunately, I do not have all the data, but your point is well taken and very plausible.

Do you find a possible correlation between the areas and the leadership at the Mayor of those cities?

It is rather interesting to find the 10 worst all have 10 Mayors who are Democrat and then to find out the historical time frame that the Democrats have been in charge of those cities.

Don't get me wrong, I know without a doubt that the Republicans have theri fair share of incompetence as a party and within their own individuals using the "R" under their name. But I find it interesting to see this list and honestly I was surprised NOT to see an "R" represented in those cities.

Perhaps the Republicans should truly campaign on Change and Hope in these 10 cities?

this could easily be a bit of correlation and causation type confusion.

perhaps for whatever reason cities with high incidents of poverty find the democratic pitch more palatable??? The inference then is not that dem mayors and policies are the cause of poverty, but instead an inadequate response.

likewise, suppose we saw some stats where the 10 richest cities were traditionally governed by republicans. So what? This could easily mean nothing other than where people are already quite content, they prefer that the government not interfere, not that the government's actions (or lackthereof) were the cause of the city's riches.

hence,

in poor cities, people say "please government do more"
in rich cities, people say "please government do less"

we still haven't accounted for what caused the respective cities to be rich or poor in the first place.


n'est ce pas?

[92bDad]

Originally Posted by alexamenos

this could easily be a bit of correlation and causation type confusion.

perhaps for whatever reason cities with high incidents of poverty find the democratic pitch more palatable??? The inference then is not that dem mayors and policies are the cause of poverty, but instead an inadequate response.

likewise, suppose we saw some stats where the 10 richest cities were traditionally governed by republicans. So what? This could easily mean nothing other than where people are already quite content, they prefer that the government not interfere, not that the government's actions (or lackthereof) were the cause of the city's riches.

hence,

in poor cities, people say "please government do more"
in rich cities, people say "please government do less"

we still haven't accounted for what caused the respective cities to be rich or poor in the first place.


n'est ce pas?

I can see the correlations and understand your point of poor/rich cities. I especially like your point that this perhaps is not the root cause of the cities, but rather an inadequate response...thus what I read into this is a need for change.

Perhaps after years of inadequate response it is time for change? Is that not what the Democrats campaigned on for the National elections?

So if the mandate from this election is change, should we not alse see that mandate in these cities that have had continued inadequate response from Democratic leadership?

[Usually Lurkin]

Originally Posted by alexamenos

this could easily be a bit of correlation and causation type confusion.

...
we still haven't accounted for what caused the respective cities to be rich or poor in the first place.


n'est ce pas?

I'm not speaking for 92b here (I don't know what he was thinking when he posted that list). But the Einstein quote, and asking whether mary sees a correlation don't imply that he's thinking in terms of causal inference.

The correlation is bad enough. Maybe the number of "Dem"s on that list is a complete coincidence (what are the odds of flipping 10 coins and getting heads every time?). Maybe the Dems have driven the cities to the bottom of the charts. Or maybe it's just that the Dem leaders don't have the answers, but the dem voters think they do, and have continued to think they do even though 80 years of history suggests they don't. The first possibility would be weird. Neither of the second two would speak well of the Dem leaders or of those who keep voting them in.

[bernardos70]

Originally Posted by Underdog

Also - could someone do away with daylight savings???

Who does it serve? How many millions of dollars do we lose each year due to workers trying to adjust their sleep schedules???


I think this needs to be the #1 priority for our government above all else - I think God would even forgive us for working on Sundays to get this problem solved!

And please, for the love of God and all that is sacred, please fix the situation with the quality of Highland Park water. It's an issue long overdue.....

[Underdog]

Originally Posted by 92bDad

I can see the correlations and understand your point of poor/rich cities. I especially like your point that this perhaps is not the root cause of the cities, but rather an inadequate response...thus what I read into this is a need for change.

Perhaps after years of inadequate response it is time for change? Is that not what the Democrats campaigned on for the National elections?

So if the mandate from this election is change, should we not alse see that mandate in these cities that have had continued inadequate response from Democratic leadership?

So, you've drawn the correlation that the Democrats are responsible for cities being poverty-stricken and that all people need to do to fix the problem is to stop voting for Democrats...

Could the Communist Party, Green Party, Labor Party, Libertarian Party or Free Beer Party (mine) fix their problems?


...or is this just another partisan tactic to garner support for the floundering Republican Party?

[rabbitproof]

Could it be that Democratic run cities dont function well under a Republican federal government or state government?

I'm not saying that is the case but there are a bajillion factors out there. You're trying to bring some knowledge that sounds like: "this team will be the NBA champion because it is from the Western conference."

[Usually Lurkin]

Originally Posted by Underdog

So, you've drawn the correlation that the Democrats are responsible for . . .

this would be a correlation/causation confusion

[chumdawg]

My research shows that seven of the ten wealthiest cities in the US are also run by Democrat mayors. Maybe mayors are just more likely to be Democrat?

[Underdog]

Originally Posted by Usually Lurkin

this would be a correlation/causation confusion

His word, not mine...


(but I'd bet the word "coincidence" could just as likely be plugged in...)

[Usually Lurkin]

Originally Posted by rabbitproof

Could it be that Democratic run cities dont function well under a Republican federal government or state government?

I'm not saying that is the case but there are a bajillion factors out there. You're trying to bring some knowledge that sounds like: "this team will be the NBA champion because it is from the Western conference."

You could answer that question by checking how those cities faired under democratic fed and state governments.

And ah, sports metaphors. . .
If the 10 worst teams in the NBA were all Eastern Conference teams, wouldn't you conclude that the eastern conference sucks . More directly, if Cuban announced that he was going to start taking money from Dirk's salary and giving it to James Singleton in order to make things fair, we'd all say he's an idiot and we'd run him out of town.