Do you think we'll make a major trade before the deadline? - Dallas-Mavs.com Forums

MavsWiLLHaVeRinGs · 12-18-2010, 03:43 PM

What do you think?

mavs777 · 12-18-2010, 03:51 PM

trading for a backup 4 is a major trade?

mavs777 · 12-18-2010, 03:51 PM

I think if we make a trade it will be for a second scorer, not a role player

MavsWiLLHaVeRinGs · 12-18-2010, 03:55 PM

Yeah I wanted to change the thread without the word "major" but it wouldn't let me. Oh well.

tcat075 · 12-18-2010, 03:57 PM

If the Mavericks really regret Haywood's contract and want a backup 4, I read Jared Jeffries is available. This is obviously if they can't pry Martin away, which I doubt.

Bayliss · 12-18-2010, 04:22 PM

I'd prefer Cuban to make a trade for Dan Crawford. He suks during the regular season, but he is a very clutch player in the playoffs.

tcat075 · 12-18-2010, 04:28 PM

Carmelo's not a poll option?

LonghornDub · 12-18-2010, 04:34 PM

If we keep winning 70% or more of our games, I doubt it (even though I still think we need to make a move to really, truly compete with the top 2-3 teams).

tcat075 · 12-18-2010, 04:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LonghornDub

If we keep winning 70% or more of our games, I doubt it (even though I still think we need to make a move to really, truly compete with the top 2-3 teams).

What don't you buy into about this team? Maybe we fall off a little, but it seems like everyone is buying into the defense. Perhaps there's a few players on the offense who are overperforming (Butler and Dirk's shooting percentages come to mind as possibly unsustainable for 82 games), but we're also missing Roddy.

DMOC · 12-18-2010, 04:46 PM

And LeBron takes the early lead!

BGMaverick9 · 12-18-2010, 04:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tcat075

What don't you buy into about this team? Maybe we fall off a little, but it seems like everyone is buying into the defense. Perhaps there's a few players on the offense who are overperforming (Butler and Dirk's shooting percentages come to mind as possibly unsustainable for 82 games), but we're also missing Roddy.

I'm really starting to wonder if "over performing" is a myth with Butler. He's had a stretch of nearly a month where he's really finding his role in the offense and getting to the spots he likes to go.

There is behind the scenes stuff I can't see all of the time but he and Carlisle are working very hard together to get Butler comfortable within the flow offense. They work on that and then it's translating when Kidd takes over.

41mvp · 12-18-2010, 04:52 PM

Lebron?Are you joking???

MavsWiLLHaVeRinGs · 12-18-2010, 05:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tcat075

Carmelo's not a poll option?

Ummm, yeah I was sorta high when I made the poll. Allergy medication. (and still am)

CadBane · 12-18-2010, 05:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bayliss

I'd prefer Cuban to make a trade for Dan Crawford. He suks during the regular season, but he is a very clutch player in the playoffs.

You can't argue with his percentages. Joining the ranks of GS Baron Davis, mid-2000s Kobe, Monta Ellis, and Kyle Lowry, Danny Crawford is indeed a Mavs killer.

Underdog · 12-18-2010, 05:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MavsWiLLHaVeRinGs

Ummm, yeah I was sorta high when I made the poll. Allergy medication. (and still am)

Do they prescribe weed for allergies now?

CadBane · 12-18-2010, 05:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tcat075

What don't you buy into about this team? Maybe we fall off a little, but it seems like everyone is buying into the defense. Perhaps there's a few players on the offense who are overperforming (Butler and Dirk's shooting percentages come to mind as possibly unsustainable for 82 games), but we're also missing Roddy.

The only aspect where Butler is overperforming is from three, where he's shooting 40%. However, given that he only makes .8 a game, that's a rather minute sample size. Moreover, he should have an increase his his percentage from there because of all the wide open looks he gets from distance here which he never got in the past.

From the field, he is only shooting 44.8%. He's a career 44.1% shooter. He's topped his current shooting percentage four times. Considering the easy looks he gets here, if anything, he's underperforming (on the season, he's been much better lately). The problem was that early on he was simply one of the worst players in the league. He's performing right about how he should be now.

LonghornDub · 12-18-2010, 05:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tcat075

What don't you buy into about this team? Maybe we fall off a little, but it seems like everyone is buying into the defense. Perhaps there's a few players on the offense who are overperforming (Butler and Dirk's shooting percentages come to mind as possibly unsustainable for 82 games), but we're also missing Roddy.

I buy into the team totally. I think it's a great team, with or without Roddy. Hopefully it's even better with him.

Unfortunately, we are very unlucky to be playing in an NBA where there are a few other teams that have consolidated incredible talent (and two of those teams, the Lakers and Celtics, are also very well coached). Not believing we can win a championship has a lot less to do with my lack of belief in the Mavs than recognizing how talented and tested a few of those other teams are.

This Mavs team is better (or at least far more talented) than the 2006 team and the 2007 team, IMO. From the coach all the way down to the 12th guy. The difference is the rest of the league at the top.

tcat075 · 12-18-2010, 05:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CadBane

The only aspect where Butler is overperforming is from three, where he's shooting 40%. However, given that he only makes .8 a game, that's a rather minute sample size. Moreover, he should have an increase his his percentage from there because of all the wide open looks he gets from distance here which he never got in the past.

From the field, he is only shooting 44.8%. He's a career 44.1% shooter. He's topped his current shooting percentage four times. Considering the easy looks he gets here, if anything, he's underperforming (on the season, he's been much better lately). The problem was that early on he was simply one of the worst players in the league. He's performing right about how he should be now.

You're right, for the season Butler's FG% is still around his average. However, since November 20th, the start of our 12 game winning streak, he's shooting 49%. That's what I was thinking of, though I didn't make it clear. As for his three point percentage, yes, it's definitely above his career.

I support Butler, though, and I wouldn't be surprised to see those numbers stay. I was just figuring some people would think he was.

BGMaverick9 · 12-18-2010, 05:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LonghornDub

I buy into the team totally. I think it's a great team, with or without Roddy. Hopefully it's even better with him.

Unfortunately, we are very unlucky to be playing in an NBA where there are a few other teams that have consolidated incredible talent (and two of those teams, the Lakers and Celtics, are also very well coached). Not believing we can win a championship has a lot less to do with my lack of belief in the Mavs than recognizing how talented and tested a few of those other teams are.

This Mavs team is better (or at least far more talented) than the 2006 team and the 2007 team, IMO. From the coach all the way down to the 12th guy. The difference is the rest of the league at the top.

The thing that I would say to this is the big difference in the year: the defense. It's imperative that they defensive mentality sticks and they perform. For years, people have been saying they have had the talent and they were just missing defense...the problem was, people overreacted and we really didn't even have the right people. It looks like we do this year, now the defense needs to stick and it changes the ballgame because the talent is really there.

tcat075 · 12-18-2010, 05:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LonghornDub

I buy into the team totally. I think it's a great team, with or without Roddy. Hopefully it's even better with him.

Unfortunately, we are very unlucky to be playing in an NBA where there are a few other teams that have consolidated incredible talent (and two of those teams, the Lakers and Celtics, are also very well coached). Not believing we can win a championship has a lot less to do with my lack of belief in the Mavs than recognizing how talented and tested a few of those other teams are.

This Mavs team is better (or at least far more talented) than the 2006 team and the 2007 team, IMO. From the coach all the way down to the 12th guy. The difference is the rest of the league at the top.

Good post. I have hope for a Mavericks playoff run this year, but you're completely right...there are some really tough teams this year that have at least as much talent as us.

LonghornDub · 12-18-2010, 05:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BGMaverick9

The thing that I would say to this is the big difference in the year: the defense. It's imperative that they defensive mentality sticks and they perform. For years, people have been saying they have had the talent and they were just missing defense...the problem was, people overreacted and we really didn't even have the right people. It looks like we do this year, now the defense needs to stick and it changes the ballgame because the talent is really there.

I think it's definitely better, but I still don't think they have quite enough to beat a Spurs team 4/7, followed by a Lakers team 4/7, followed by a Celtics/Heat team 4/7 (or whatever the case may be). It's not totally impossible, but it would take some really fortuitous bounces over the course of those games to make it happen.

Everybody needs luck to win a championship, but I think the Mavs would need quite a bit more than some of those other teams. I'm not down on them, I just have a ton of respect for what those other teams have put together (except the Heat who are sorta just trying to out-talent you into submission).

Oh, and FWIW, a substantial part of me feeling this way is that Dirk simply does not get the same benefit of the doubt from the refs that some of those other guys get. He is absolutely penalized for being big and awkward. Wade/James/Kobe/Pierce shoot 15+ FT's if they are abused like Dirk was in Game 4 @ SA last spring. Wade probably shoots like 200 FT's. It's a god damn shame, really.

CadBane · 12-18-2010, 05:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tcat075

You're right, for the season Butler's FG% is still around his average. However, since November 20th, the start of our 12 game winning streak, he's shooting 49%. That's what I was thinking of, though I didn't make it clear. As for his three point percentage, yes, it's definitely above his career.

I support Butler, though, and I wouldn't be surprised to see those numbers stay. I was just figuring some people would think he was.

You're right, I don't think he'll be at 49% for the rest of the year. But if he can sustain around 46% with 40% from three, I'll be pleased. One thing he needs to improve on (though it's not something that's likely to change) is finishing at the rim. He has an eFG% of .417 on close shots. That is embarrassingly bad.

BGMaverick9 · 12-18-2010, 05:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LonghornDub

I think it's definitely better, but I still don't think they have quite enough to beat a Spurs team 4/7, followed by a Lakers team 4/7, followed by a Celtics/Heat team 4/7 (or whatever the case may be). It's not totally impossible, but it would take some really fortuitous bounces over the course of those games to make it happen.

Everybody needs luck to win a championship, but I think the Mavs would need quite a bit more than some of those other teams. I'm not down on them, I just have a ton of respect for what those other teams have put together (except the Heat who are sorta just trying to out-talent you into submission).

Oh, and FWIW, a substantial part of me feeling this way is that Dirk simply does not get the same benefit of the doubt from the refs that some of those other guys get. He is absolutely penalized for being big and awkward. Wade/James/Kobe/Pierce shoot 15+ FT's if they are abused like Dirk was in Game 4 @ SA last spring. Wade probably shoots like 200 FT's. It's a god damn shame, really.

I agree with this, even the Dirk stuff.

I can tell you someone in the Mavs organization doesn't buy what's going on with the Spurs right now, too much dependency with the 3-ball, Manu is hot (eventually hurt) and the breaks are just going their way right now.

I think one thing that helps is the fact the Mavericks would be the underdog in pretty much all of the given scenarios, this team thrives much more in that situation versus being the hunted. I have a feeling in those series, they either get extremely exposed on something or they're knockdown drag-out battles that could go either way.

LonghornDub · 12-18-2010, 05:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BGMaverick9

I agree with this, even the Dirk stuff.

I can tell you someone in the Mavs organization doesn't buy what's going on with the Spurs right now, too much dependency with the 3-ball, Manu is hot (eventually hurt) and the breaks are just going their way right now.

I think one thing that helps is the fact the Mavericks would be the underdog in pretty much all of the given scenarios, this team thrives much more in that situation versus being the hunted. I have a feeling in those series, they either get extremely exposed on something or they're knockdown drag-out battles that could go either way.

Yeah I'm not sure I buy the new Spurs either. But I've gotta put them up there just because of their experience. They just keep doing it every year.

I love the Mavs as the underdog.

CadBane · 12-18-2010, 05:44 PM

I wouldn't say Manu has been on a streak or anything. As much as I hate SA, Manu is a fantastic player. This what the guy can (and has) done when he starts. We'll see if the minutes get to him. I pray that they will. Dude is a beast.

BGMaverick9 · 12-18-2010, 05:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CadBane

I wouldn't say Manu has been on a streak or anything. As much as I hate SA, Manu is a fantastic player. This what the guy can (and has) done when he starts. We'll see if the minutes get to him. I pray that they will. Dude is a beast.

If 3 critical plays in back to back games at the finish isn't hot, I don't know what is haha.

The minutes and the style of play more often than not find a way to bite him.

Underdog · 12-18-2010, 05:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LonghornDub

I love the Mavs as the underdog.

Sounds familiar...

mac222b · 12-18-2010, 09:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LonghornDub

I think it's definitely better, but I still don't think they have quite enough to beat a Spurs team 4/7, followed by a Lakers team 4/7, followed by a Celtics/Heat team 4/7 (or whatever the case may be). It's not totally impossible, but it would take some really fortuitous bounces over the course of those games to make it happen.

Everybody needs luck to win a championship, but I think the Mavs would need quite a bit more than some of those other teams. I'm not down on them, I just have a ton of respect for what those other teams have put together (except the Heat who are sorta just trying to out-talent you into submission).

Oh, and FWIW, a substantial part of me feeling this way is that Dirk simply does not get the same benefit of the doubt from the refs that some of those other guys get. He is absolutely penalized for being big and awkward. Wade/James/Kobe/Pierce shoot 15+ FT's if they are abused like Dirk was in Game 4 @ SA last spring. Wade probably shoots like 200 FT's. It's a god damn shame, really.

+rep

deamon · 12-19-2010, 10:16 AM

Dirk, Kidd and Chandler aren't to move, we have to talk about SG and SF positions in our team.
We should trade Haywood for Martin, and Mahinmi will be backup at C. If we will lose game in PO by 4 points because of Haywood's 1-6 on FT line...,
and we need scorer, Butler isn't Robin. We need true SG as Martin. DO IT NOW.
We will have true SG, but what about our SF position. Give Butler 10-15 games and lets see what he will play like. If he sucks then trade him for Iggy just before trade deadline.
This would look very good:
KIDD
MARTIN
BUTLER (eventually IGGY)
DIRK
CHANDLER

dude1394 · 12-19-2010, 10:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CadBane

I wouldn't say Manu has been on a streak or anything. As much as I hate SA, Manu is a fantastic player. This what the guy can (and has) done when he starts. We'll see if the minutes get to him. I pray that they will. Dude is a beast.

I agree..he is what makes that team special.. Without him they are second tier no matter how well Timmah is playing. With him they are as much of a contender as any team in the league.

I hate to hope for him to get hurt but if he doesn't it's going to be mighty tough on the rest of the west.

dude1394 · 12-19-2010, 10:55 AM

I don't think the mavs HAVE to make a trade but I would do a haywood for martin, I think that does make us pretty special...And it may actually be because wood cannot stay on the floor in the fourth...it's one thing for him to now be second team but quite another to be second team UNLESS the game is close in the fourth, that's untenable.

deamon · 12-19-2010, 11:26 AM

I don't see no close games in April (in PO).

41mvp · 12-19-2010, 11:51 AM

yesterday I wrote Haywood for Martin this's good deal for us.But today I once again think about this trade.And I think this isn't good deal.Why?Because look at Lakers bigmens roster:
Gasol
Odom
Bynum
they can score,they can blocks,they are top players
Dallas Mavericks:
Nowitzki
Chandler
Haywood
Mahinmi
We have also top tall players now.But if Haywood goes out our big man roster will be weak.If we wanna fight about rings Haywood must stay in Dallas.

Lor20 · 12-19-2010, 12:33 PM

i dont think its a good idea... mahinmi is completely unproven and chandler has had injury and foul trouble in the past.... dont want to imagine chandler getting hurt before the playoffs...

dude1394 · 12-19-2010, 12:53 PM

I'm not sure what good a big man who cannot play in the fourth is going to do for a playoff run. If this doesn't get fixed he won't play in the fourth anyway.

deamon · 12-19-2010, 01:17 PM

This Haywood isn't more efficiency than Mahinmi. If he play like just after trade, then stay, but at now? I say TRADE HIM. Still we need scorer and someone who will drive to rim, and we don't know what Roddy can play in offense after injury, but for sure he's too short for pressing Kobe, and I can't imagine Kidd do it in PO. We need true SG for sure.

41mvp · 12-19-2010, 01:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by deamon

This Haywood isn't more efficiency than Mahinmi. If he play like just after trade, then stay, but at now? I say TRADE HIM. Still we need scorer and someone who will drive to rim, and we don't know what Roddy can play in offense after injury, but for sure he's too short for pressing Kobe, and I can't imagine Kidd do it in PO. We need true SG for sure.

You say trade him.I agree with you.But we must think about future.We must think about playoffs.We must have two solid centers.

CadBane · 12-19-2010, 04:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BGMaverick9

If 3 critical plays in back to back games at the finish isn't hot, I don't know what is haha.

The minutes and the style of play more often than not find a way to bite him.

Three isolated plays have absolutely nothing to do with a season. And Manu has always been clutch...

deamon · 12-19-2010, 05:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 41mvp

You say trade him.I agree with you.But we must think about future.We must think about playoffs.We must have two solid centers.

All the time I'm talking just about playing in PO. You need to understand better or read again my posts.
You think he's solid when we will have close games in PO and he will miss his FTs? Mahinmi isn't good defender as Haywood, but he is better in offense, has more energy. Haywood just moves like in slow motion, is fouled and then misses FTs. 27%? Shaq is better by 30 with his 57%.
Trade Haywood, we need scorer (,,Robin"), a SG who isn't shorter than average SG in NBA.
We have time till PO to give Mahinmi play and teach him how to play in defense.

41mvp · 12-20-2010, 01:04 AM

I told you something.You want Robin right!But if you forget about Butler?In last 10 games he played well.I very like Ian but he isn't Haywood.Brendan is good defender,Ian not yet.
In playoffs defense is most important.We need him!!!