The"Crap, it didn't happen..but it was awesome to think of" thread - Page 3 - Dallas-Mavs.com Forums

Dale4Saul2Red0 · 12-22-2011, 05:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mavs777

Dwight basically has said he will only sign an extension in 3 places: NJ, Dallas, and with the Lakers. Its kind of weird that for whatever reason he wouldn't sign an extension with the bulls, but he wouldn't from all signs. I think why he would with the Lakers is its a huge market, and he realizes he would be the face of the franchise when Kobe leaves. In fact there have been some talk that he maynot be interested so much in Chicago cause he wants to be the face of future of the franchise whereever he lands. He would be that in Dallas, NJ, and with the Lakers.

Don't want that type of player here, sorry. Anyone worried about being the face of the franchise over winning a championship has his heart in the wrong place.

LonghornDub · 12-22-2011, 05:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dale4Saul2Red0

Don't want that type of player here, sorry. Anyone worried about being the face of the franchise over winning a championship has his heart in the wrong place.

Dwight can worry about fame as much as he wants, as long as he'll box out, dunk, and continue having 20' wide shoulders.

OneLove22 · 12-22-2011, 06:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dale4Saul2Red0

Don't want that type of player here, sorry. Anyone worried about being the face of the franchise over winning a championship has his heart in the wrong place.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wKmzDi40LfY

Sure about that?

I mean, after all he is the face of Orlando yet he is willing to leave... So there is more to his motivation than that.

DevinHarriswillstart · 12-22-2011, 06:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dale4Saul2Red0

Don't want that type of player here, sorry. Anyone worried about being the face of the franchise over winning a championship has his heart in the wrong place.

23pp 14 rpg 2.4 bpg on 60% shooting talks and bs walks. He can want to be Shirley Temple for all I care as long as he puts up stats like that.

xrobx · 12-23-2011, 10:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mavs777

he wants to be the face of future of the franchise whereever he lands. He would be that in Dallas

OneLove22 · 12-23-2011, 11:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by xrobx

key word is future face.

We all know who the face is now. But if we were to land Howard, there is no doubt he would be the face of our franchise whether he wants to be or doesn't want to be lol.

j0Shi · 12-22-2011, 02:34 PM

http://www.mavsmoneyball.com/2011/12...ts-future-mavs

Quote:

So a broken bone in the right foot of Brook Lopez effectively upgraded the Mavs chances of landing either Dwight Howard or Deron Williams in next years free agency.

sefant77 · 12-22-2011, 06:53 PM

Lopez with a broken foot (its a stress fracture, i think basically the one that took Roddy out for one year) is great news for the Mavs.

The Magic dont like him anyway so much, he had a weak last season and now this stress fracture (probably even more complicated because he is a heavy center) AND is going for a huge contract next offseason.

So the Magic have to decide if they wanna trade Dwight for Lopez and give this dude a huge extension practically being out for season....

mavs777 · 12-22-2011, 06:58 PM

i don't understand why lopez would even want to sign a contract with orlando

EricaLubarsky · 12-22-2011, 08:23 PM

Nets just picked up okur. Response?

BGMaverick9 · 12-22-2011, 08:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by EricaLubarsky

Nets just picked up okur. Response?

Wasn't Okur out for most of the season due to an injury? I'm sure DWill signed off on the move to get him based on the Utah connection.

j0Shi · 12-22-2011, 08:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by EricaLubarsky

Nets just picked up okur. Response?

It's a nice pickup since Lopez will be out for months, but that also means they can't trade for Howard unless they match salaries (are 1M under the cap or so).

Don't know if they can make the playoffs though, seems like they are gambling on next years FA as well. Will be interesting whether Deron chooses to join a proven roster or starts over with the Nets (and Howard possibly, but he might already wear purple and gold at that point).

endrity · 12-22-2011, 10:52 PM

I don't get the whole "being the face of the franchise thing", he is already that in Orlando and would be almost anywhere else except maybe Miami (he's so much better than Rose).

He wants to win and if he has any good advisor they should try to understand what is the team best set for the future with him. LA for sure isn't that. Dallas could be, but Chicago would be the best. I hope they never figure out the last part and it's Dallas, with Deron following.

mavs777 · 12-23-2011, 02:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by endrity

I don't get the whole "being the face of the franchise thing", he is already that in Orlando and would be almost anywhere else except maybe Miami (he's so much better than Rose).

He wants to win and if he has any good advisor they should try to understand what is the team best set for the future with him. LA for sure isn't that. Dallas could be, but Chicago would be the best. I hope they never figure out the last part and it's Dallas, with Deron following.

It's about marketing and attention I am sure, the small market is a pretty big reason why he will leave Orlando. While he maybe better than Rose, Rose will always get more attention and better endoresment deals in Chicago because he is the hometown star.

LonghornDub · 12-23-2011, 02:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by endrity

I don't get the whole "being the face of the franchise thing", he is already that in Orlando and would be almost anywhere else except maybe Miami (he's so much better than Rose).

Being the "face of the franchise" in Orlando is not the same as being the same in LA, Brooklyn, or even Dallas.

endrity · 12-23-2011, 10:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LonghornDub

Being the "face of the franchise" in Orlando is not the same as being the same in LA, Brooklyn, or even Dallas.

But my point is that he'll be that anywhere, except Miami. Rose might be the hometown star in Chicago but after playing there for a bit people would easily understand Howard is the much better player.

So I don't think there is some special information to be gotten at by trying to understand where he'll be the face of the franchise. The real question is where can he win, and possibly increase his earning by playing in a big tv market.

Take the Knicks off the list, take the Clippers as well now, I don't think Lakers are a great team with just him and Kobe, Dallas with Dirk would be very good, Chicago with Rose would be awesome, better than him and Deron. The other big markets, Philly has nothing to offer, same for Washington and Houston.

So if he goes to FA it's between us and the Nets I think, and I like our chances. If one team can trade for him it's Chicago.

The crazy scenario would be an LBJ for Dwight trade, or Wade+Bosh trade. While the Heat might not want to blow up the core just yet, those two trades would make both teams think seriously about the idea.

LonghornDub · 12-24-2011, 10:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by endrity

But my point is that he'll be that anywhere, except Miami. Rose might be the hometown star in Chicago but after playing there for a bit people would easily understand Howard is the much better player.

So I don't think there is some special information to be gotten at by trying to understand where he'll be the face of the franchise. The real question is where can he win, and possibly increase his earning by playing in a big tv market.

Take the Knicks off the list, take the Clippers as well now, I don't think Lakers are a great team with just him and Kobe, Dallas with Dirk would be very good, Chicago with Rose would be awesome, better than him and Deron. The other big markets, Philly has nothing to offer, same for Washington and Houston.

I'm not sure exactly what your point is now. Earlier you were suggesting that he's already the "face" of the franchise in Orlando, meaning you didn't understand how that would be his rationale for leaving. It obviously is. He wants to be the face in a big market, not Orlando.

Now you seem to be saying that he could be the face of the franchise in just about any big market, which is right. But I was responding to your initial point that he's already achieved that status in his current city.

endrity · 12-24-2011, 10:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LonghornDub

I'm not sure exactly what your point is now. Earlier you were suggesting that he's already the "face" of the franchise in Orlando, meaning you didn't understand how that would be his rationale for leaving. It obviously is. He wants to be the face in a big market, not Orlando.

Now you seem to be saying that he could be the face of the franchise in just about any big market, which is right. But I was responding to your initial point that he's already achieved that status in his current city.

I don't think you understood what I said. I was merely responding to the claim that "Howard doesn't just want to anywhere, he wants to go somewhere where he could be the face of the franchise".

I said I don't get that idea because he would be anywhere the face of the franchise. So the question is not where could he be that, but where can he win and maximise his earnings. He shouldn't worry about something he'll be wherever he goes.

wilmtalk · 12-22-2011, 11:38 PM

I get the impression that he secretly wants to play in Dallas with Dirk that is why he included them in the list. Dirk is the type of non limelight seeking player that will let him shine. There aren't many players like that in the NBA. He could have his cake and eat it too. A legitamate superstar who complements him and make him betterby drawing constant double teams. He is a none ball hog good passing team player who would feed him in the post off his own double teams. Dirk is not ego driven, also doesn't crave or searching for, but in fact runs from the limelight.

sefant77 · 12-23-2011, 11:16 AM

EricaLubarsky · 12-23-2011, 12:14 PM

If he's willing to re-sign with us, you gotta make everything other than Dirk available to the Magic. Howard is the most dominant center in the NBA in a field of centers that only has one superstar and a handful of stars. Y'all crazy if you dont want him.

Now if he's available I dont know, but if he can be secured, you have to do it if you are the front office.

MavsFTR · 12-28-2011, 05:58 PM

http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/news;_yl...ard_nba_122811

T-Mac to Howard: Be careful what you wish for

NEWARK, N.J. – Tracy McGrady forever will be remembered on the wrong side of the superstar alliances, a career of what-ifs with those Grant Hill and Yao Ming partnerships perishing with fractured bones and twisted ligaments. Between Shaquille O’Neal and Dwight Howard, McGrady had been the smaller, sleeker franchise star wanting to leave the Orlando Magic.

Now at 32 years old with the Atlanta Hawks, the knee operations behind him, McGrady has been seared with the scars of professional regret. He won scoring titles, earned tens of millions of All-Star votes and made tens of millions of dollars. As history goes, it’s never worked out right for T-Mac. No titles, no finals, no significant advancements in the playoffs.

Tracy McGrady, now with the Hawks, joined Grant Hill in 2000 to chase a title in Orlando.
Nevertheless, McGrady was one of the originals who inspired franchises to clear salary-cap space, to partner with another All-Star, and few have lived the free-agent frenzy like him. Yes, McGrady knows of Howard requesting a trade to the New Jersey Nets to play with Deron Williams, but he doesn’t care about the Nets’ shiny new arena in Brooklyn, the Russian billionaire owner willing to spend and spend. For whatever it’s worth, T-Mac doesn’t see Howard and the Nets.

“I can’t see him coming here,” McGrady told Yahoo! Sports late Tuesday inside the visiting locker room at the Prudential Center. “If it’s just Dwight and D-Will, he’s better off just staying in Orlando. You want to go to a team that’s championship caliber, and just him and D-Will won’t get it done. There’s got to be other pieces around to make it look sweet.”

In the most awkward game of the young season, the depleted Nets play the Magic on Thursday night in Orlando. The Nets’ Brook Lopez is out several weeks with a broken foot, and the starting five and bench surrounding Williams is beyond brutal. The Nets have gutted themselves for the cap space to re-sign Williams and sign Howard this summer, entrusting the franchise’s future on the belief they will secure the best center on the planet.

If Howard goes elsewhere, so does Deron Williams, and, yes, general manager Billy King’s plan would come tumbling down. It’s a bold gamble, the highest risk-reward scenario in memory – the kind that unfolded with Orlando and the Chicago Bulls in the 2000 free-agent market for McGrady, Grant Hill and Tim Duncan.

It’s so hard for players to visualize a different day for the Nets, a Brooklyn arena that still is under construction. And so much easier to make a case for the defending NBA champion Dallas Mavericks and an owner, Mark Cuban, who is fully engaged in the championship chase. After watching the Nets offer no resistance to the Hawks in a 106-70 dismantling Tuesday night, T-Mac’s vision of Howard’s future had been further validated in his own mind.

“D-Will is from Dallas,” McGrady said. “You’ve got Dirk Nowitzki there. They’re going to have [cap space] there. That looks sweet. Dirk. D-Will. And then you get Dwight Howard. That’s it, right there.”

The Mavericks will have space for one star, but after possible contract buyouts and an amnesty waiver, it would still take a team to accept the final two years left on Shawn Marion’s contract to get the Mavericks near $30 million in room next summer to sign Williams and Howard. “And that would be really hard because they don’t have a first-round pick [to send with Marion] until 2014,” one league executive said.

Now in the late stages of his career, McGrady has tried to climb aboard one of these super-teams, one of these championship contenders. There was no room for him in Miami, nor Los Angeles, nor Chicago. The Hawks are a good fit, a team that needs him for its bench. McGrady played a pain-free, productive season for the Detroit Pistons a year ago, and there was life in those legs as he scored 12 points against the Nets on Tuesday. He’s come to peace with his standing in the sport, a superstar no more. Still, McGrady has been dutiful in his work with renowned trainer Tim Grover at Attack Athletics in Chicago, and the reward has been a second act for his reconstructed knee.

“There’s so many stars in this league, and we come and go,” McGrady said. “I’m not what I used to be, but I’m still able to go out and help a team win ballgames.”

In retrospect, McGrady is realistic with what could’ve been. He doesn’t speak of missed championships with the Magic and Rockets, but of the genuine possibilities. “If Grant had been healthy when I was in my prime in Orlando, just think of what we could’ve done when the East was so weak,” he said. “And there’s no doubt in my mind we would’ve played in the Finals in [2009] when Yao and I got hurt in Houston. We had Ron Artest, and [went seven games] with the Lakers. … I wish it would’ve worked out.”

Dwight Howard has told the Magic there are three teams he'd sign a contract extension with: the Nets, Lakers and Mavericks.

As the original owner of a lifetime shoe deal with Adidas, a man with no championships, no glistening playoff legacy, McGrady rejects the idea that Howard ought to let his endorsement-earning power with the shoe company dictate anything about his desire to play for the Bulls. For Adidas, there’s far less of a return on Howard’s stardom to have him sharing the Chicago stage with the company’s biggest endorser, Derrick Rose.

“You’re going to have other endorsements because you’re playing in a big-ass city like Chicago, and because you’re [bleeping] Dwight Howard,” McGrady said.

And a Howard-Rose combination?

“Hell yes, championship,” McGrady said. “Championship. There’s no doubt about it.”

At the end in Orlando in 2004, there came a threshold of no return between McGrady and the organization. He had to leave, and the Magic finally moved him to Houston. Clearly, the Magic are rightfully resisting that moment of truth with Howard, but it’s probably inevitable they’ll have to trade him before they lose him to free agency. Superman’s a different kind of franchise star, an irreplaceable Hall of Fame center.

“I’ve been watching Orlando play, and I think they let it go too far – to where they can’t compete for a championship,” McGrady said. “Dwight’s going to find a sweeter spot for him next year with him being a free agent, with D-Will being a free agent, and Dallas already having an established star there. … Yup, Dallas.”

And then he laughed and said, “You heard it from me first.”

McGrady doesn’t have to do the heavy lifting on Dallas’ salary cap to make it happen – that’s someone else’s job. He took one look at the Nets, and made an understandable declaration. Williams won’t handle this losing well this year, and everyone knows that. This is the highest-risk, highest-reward gamble of all with the Nets: Howard or bust.

“If you think another place looks sweeter, it might not be sweeter than where you are,” McGrady said. “If you’re competing in the playoffs, and you’re a couple pieces away, sometimes it’s better to try and make it work there. In the Dwight situation, though, I think Orlando has made some bad moves.”

McGrady shrugged and smiled. He finds this scenario so fascinating, perhaps because he sees it all through the unique prism of experience. Once, the whole NBA was clearing salary-cap space for Tracy McGrady, and now it’s Dwight Howard. Now it’s someone else. McGrady knows the drill. As he said, so many stars in this league, and they all come and go. On his way out, T-Mac watches one more go down that jagged journey chasing a championship, and he’s living proof this pursuit often ends with far more regret than it does rejoice.

iella · 12-28-2011, 06:58 PM

Be still, my heart.

endrity · 12-29-2011, 02:53 AM

there's light at the end of the tunnel

sefant77 · 12-29-2011, 11:00 AM

I can see allready the McGrady quote next summer after we signed Dwight&Deron "Without me, they are a 0.500 ballclub"

nowhereman · 12-29-2011, 11:05 AM

T-Mac knows what's up.

jthig32 · 12-29-2011, 01:47 PM

FYI, DLord got his hands on the new CBA and has confirmed that the "renegotiate" provision is very poorly characterized. It simply means that when a team is ready to discuss an extension, that extension can start at a much lower salary than it could previously. This lines up with Coon's answer to a question of mine in a Q&A a couple weeks ago.

So no more discussion of Dirk renegotiating his contract. It can't happen.

sefant77 · 12-29-2011, 01:55 PM

Quote:

If you need anything else to add to the smoldering Dwight Howard rumors (aka the "Dwightmare"), try this: Howard and Deron Williams dined together Wednesday night in Orlando! Williams tried to play dumb about it, but Howard gave him up.

"I don’t even know who that is," Williams deadpanned. "Who is Dwight Howard?"

"Since he’s been in the league, every time he comes to town we go and eat dinner and just kick it," Howard said. "We’ve been friends since the Olympics. So we go out to eat, have a bite."

When one of the reporters asked Williams how does he likes New York, he responded he likes the area and the organization. Follow-up question: Would recommend the area to a certain 6’10" center? Williams responded unequivocally "Yes, I would!" Now they have to play the game.

netsdaily.com

Damn, i would love to know if they are also "discussing" to sign both in Dallas...

LonghornDub · 12-29-2011, 02:07 PM

It would be pretty humorous if they both ended up in Dallas and one of the first highly public personas who predicted that on the record was Tracy McGrady.

clutch#41 · 12-29-2011, 03:00 PM

starting 5 in 2012.
Dwill
Tmac
Marion
dirk
Howard

Kidd Karma · 12-29-2011, 03:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by clutch#41

starting 5 in 2012.
Dwill
Tmac
Marion
dirk
Howard

Just with his omnipresent prediction, we should bring him to get him his ring.

clutch#41 · 12-29-2011, 03:17 PM

yeah he took the vet minimum with atlanta. i can see him taking a one year deal with us next year. i prefered him over VC!!

DirkFTW · 12-29-2011, 04:30 PM

The heretofore unknown power of the Eye awakens!

Quote:

Tracy McGrady has Mavs' future mapped

According to a Yahoo! Sports report, McGrady envisions Nets point guard Deron Williams, who can become a free agent this summer along with Howard, joining up with Dirk Nowitzki and the Mavs. Once that happens, then McGrady says, the Mavs should go get Howard.

Kidd Karma · 12-29-2011, 06:25 PM

Found this piece to be interesting reading about Dallas being on Howard's resigning list:

http://www.netsdaily.com/2011/12/27/...-the-mavericks

LonghornDub · 12-29-2011, 06:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kidd Karma

Found this piece to be interesting reading about Dallas being on Howard's resigning list:

http://www.netsdaily.com/2011/12/27/...-the-mavericks

Just a Nets fan trying to convince himself that NJ is competing against only LA for Dwight. The reasons he'd want to come to Dallas are obvious and plenty (not that it'll happen necessarily).

mavs777 · 12-29-2011, 06:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LonghornDub

Just a Nets fan trying to convince himself that NJ is competing against only LA for Dwight. The reasons he'd want to come to Dallas are obvious and plenty (not that it'll happen necessarily).

Better question is why the nets? I mean there are quite a few teams with lots of cap space where deron and dwight fit in.

FINtastic · 12-29-2011, 07:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mavs777

Better question is why the nets? I mean there are quite a few teams with lots of cap space where deron and dwight fit in.

Because they have a billionaire Russian owner who has the means to make them disappear should they refuse his most generous offer.

Kidd Karma · 12-29-2011, 07:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mavs777

Better question is why the nets? I mean there are quite a few teams with lots of cap space where deron and dwight fit in.

yea, no history outside of the Kidd years. No following. Moving to a new location...unproven location Brooklyn. Trade to Nets, you only get Deron and little else, future shipped to Utah and probably the other half will go to Orlando, it'll be bare bones, no proven players. Is the Russian dude serious or not, Lebron said no, Bosh said no, Johnson said no? Mavs have kept Dirk happy, despite 1 ring, multiple 50 win seasons and several bad endings. Dirk never demanded out. JKidd demanded out of Jersey. Shaq got his butt escorted to the curb in LA.....Mavs keep the players happy. Yep, no doubt, better question is why the Brooklyn Nets? SMH

EricaLubarsky · 12-29-2011, 10:25 PM

That line tonight for Howard is sick.

16pts, 24reb, 3blk, 3stl, 3ast

LonghornDub · 12-30-2011, 12:42 AM

One scenario I was thinking about that I haven't heard talked about much: since Dallas would need to move at least one other contract besides amnestying Haywood to have room for both dudes, shouldn't we be expecting that they'll make a serious push to trade for one of them this season? Is there some reason that makes less sense than hoping to get to the summer with both of them as FAs and then doing a SnT for at least one?