Is Dirk the best player in the league?

[Hitman]

27 points, 10 rebounds, 3 assists, 2 blocks and 1.5 steals per game.

This is not an anomaly.

This is the Diggler that we all know and love. He is better than McGrady, Kobe and, at this point...Shaq.

In my opinion, the only questions are Duncan and KG.

I think he has the ability to be better than either one of them, and

I think...at this point....

he is.

Get the Freaking Ball To Dirk.

That needs to be the mantra of the 2004/2005 Mavs.

I was sitting in a bar on Thursday night after my baskeball game, and at least 3 people mentioned (during the Heat game on ESPN) that this guy (Dirk) was "ridiculous."

He was getting props on ESPN last night too.

I think that he is getting dangerously close to being....


The Best Player in the League.

[digit]

Word!

Dirk Mix Tape

Just found a wonderful piece of art.
Scroll down the page and click on the Download! button...

But, watch out, it`s rainin` dunks and long-range bombs .

I f*ckin`love Dirk`s game...

[Mandyahl]

i don't want to take anything away from dirk...and he certainly is playing incredibly, incredibly well. while the numbers you cited look great, here are kg's:

25 points, 15 rebounds, 7 assists, 1.5 steals, 2 blocks.

so, basically kg scores 2 less per game than dirk, has about the same number of steals and blocks, and rebounds and assists at considerably higher rates.

and here are duncan's:

23 points, 15 rebounds, 2.5 assists, 1 steal, 3 blocks

fairly comparable to dirk's with 4 less points but 5 more rebounds per game.

while we're at it, look at what lebron is putting up:

28 points, 8 rebounds, 6 assists, 2.5 steals, 2 blocks

same blocks and a few less rebounds, but more points, steals and assists...lebron is playing out of his mind right now.

so, while i do agree that dirk is playing at an mvp-level thus far, i don't think that you can call him the best player in the league quite yet. what he's done in 7 games is very impressive, but there are several other players that have put up the same (and better) numbers.

i would be very surprised if, at the end of the year, dirk beats out kg and duncan for mvp, but if he keeps playing this way, people outside of dallas are going to have to start recognizing that he is a top five player in this league...and honestly that's all we need him to be with who else we have on this team.

[The Miles]

KG, Duncan, Kobe, LeBron, and Dirk have all had great starts statistically. I have him ranked as the 5th best player in the NBA.

1. Tim Duncan
2. Shaquille O'Neal (he is getting healthy, 23/21 v Duncan)
3. Kevin Garnett
4. Kobe Bryant
5. Dirk Nowitzki
6. Jermaine O'Neal
7. Tracy McGrady
8. Paul Pierce
9. LeBron James
10. Allen Iverson

I think he has surpassed McGrady, in fact I would wager Jermaine O'Neal as being better than McGrady now, I am just not big on TMac, he doesn't win. LeBron James and Amare Stoudemire are moving towards the top quickly, Allen Iverson is still in the top 10 along with Paul Pierce.

But Dirk has some work to do to be the best. He is on his way up though, if he keeps the defense up he is definitely top 5.

[Pongo]

http://www.nba.com/statistics/2004/d...opic=0&stat=27

Dirk is also shooting 50% from the field and 47.8 from tree-point range
converts 82% of his free-throws

now thats great shooting

[MavKikiNYC]

1) It's VERY early in the season.

2) Mavericks have a much better mix of players around Dirk this year (thank you, Atlanta).

3) Dirk is beginning to show the type of improvment that come from experience and maturity.

4) Need to wait until he's gone up against both TD and KG--check their head-to-heads, the game results, and compare how far they get with their respective teams.

5) LeBron isn't in TD, KG's or Dirk's class yet. Big stats on a bad team don't rate (IMO).

[Pongo]

Originally posted by: digit
Word!

Dirk Mix Tape

Just found a wonderful piece of art.
Scroll down the page and click on the Download! button...

But, watch out, it`s rainin` dunks and long-range bombs .

I f*ckin`love Dirk`s game...

Thanks, great vid, digit!

He's converts a nice hook-shot in it, btw

[Murphy3]

I wouldn't say that Dirk has caught KG or TD yet. But, I do believe that he's quickly catching up with Kobe, and I have no problem putting him ahead of McGrady. It's also possible that Shaq might not be as dominant as the Shaq that we're used to seeing. He hasn't appeared to be overly dominant yet this season...We'll have to wait and see how that turns out, but it is possible that Dirk could pass Shaq in my eyes along with passing Kobe.....but we'll also have to wait and see about Shaq and how he plays this year.

Now, I'm not saying that he will...but it is possible. It's also possible that LeBron at some point throws his name into the hat as being one of the top 5-6 players in the league if he continues to play at this level. Well, 'if' he plays at the level that he's currently playing at through just a handful of games, LeBron could leapfrog just about everyone.

But, we'll see. Dirk needs to rebound a bit better and block shots a bit more consistently in my opinion...

[grndmstr_c]

IMO, AK's making a very strong argument for being top 10.

And while I think Dirk has certainly been top 5 this season, I just don't think there's any way you can put him over Garnett or Duncan at this point.

[rakesh.s]

1. garnett
2. duncan and dirk tied
3. lebron james and shaquille tied
4. kirilenko

after this, the one on one players and shooters come in
5. kobe
6. tmac
7. jermaine
.
.
.
.
.

[mary]

Originally posted by: Pongo

Thanks, great vid, digit!

He's converts a nice hook-shot in it, btw

Just FYI, my virus software detected a trojan in this video file....so might want to be careful.

To stay on topic - is Dirk the best player in the league? Um no. I still got to give top four honors to TD, Garnett, Shaq and Kobe right now.

[dude1394]

Originally posted by: digit
Word!

Dirk Mix Tape

Just found a wonderful piece of art.
Scroll down the page and click on the Download! button...

But, watch out, it`s rainin` dunks and long-range bombs .

I f*ckin`love Dirk`s game...

Nice video, but turn off the audio if you don't want to hear a bunch of misogynistic gangsta' rap.

[fin4life]

I would rate Dirk as the third best PF in the league, and it will stay this way unless he puts up some umpresentede sats this year, wins a championship, or KG/TD have a major slip. With that being said, Dirk is playing great this year. I believe he in a early candidate for MVP... key word is early. We all know that Dirk is capable of keeping these numbers up, but we shouldnt get too excited. I tend to think that the best player(s) in the league for a particuler season cant be judged until 1/4 of the way into the season. If Dirk is puting these numbers up 20-25 games in, then we should start talking MVP.

[FilthyFinMavs]

I might have to wait until the season is over to determine whether or not Dirk is past Kobe, Garnett and Duncan. You have T-Mac who hasn't gelled with his team yet and you have Shaq who is still lingering from injuries. As of right now with just 6 games into the season I rank them like this:

1. Duncan
2. Garnett
3. Kobe
4. Dirk
5. Shaq

This could change towards the end of the season. If Dirk keeps this play up he will surpass Kobe. I give him the edge of T-Mac and Shaq due to their problems with their respective teams. IMO, the only way that Dirk surpasses Duncan and KG is if he starts grabbing as many boards as those guys do. Not exactly 15 but definately around the 11-12 range.

[nowitzki_prophecy]

Dirk is a better ball-player than Kobe,period.
Has a better attitude too,Kobe is a bitch,and drove the man who got him his 3 rings to Miami.

[DubOverdose]

So far this season its something like:
1.KG
2.TD
3.Dirk
4.LBJ
5.Wade
6.AK47

[EricaLubarsky]

wow that page is loaded with exploits and

there is an activex control that is malicious. Make sure you have an updated virus protection and a spyware blocker/destroyer.

[LRB]

So far I put Dirk at 3rd best player in the league and very, very close to passing Duncan. KG though is IMO clearly the MVP right now. LeBron isn't really in contention despite huge numbers because his team sucks. Huge numbers on a sucky team does not a MVP make. Still a long way to go this season but so far Dirk along with Duncan and Garnett are all all in a class far above the rest IMO.

[fin4life]

I wouldnt say that the cavs suck. They will make the playoffs this year and have already had some pretty good games. LeBron is gunna emerge as the superstar that he was supposed to be.... but still not better than Dirk.

[FINtastic]

At the rate Dirk has been going this season, he's the 3rd best behind Duncan and Garnett. I'm interested to see if he can keep up his great play.

[Murphy3]

Originally posted by: FINtastic
At the rate Dirk has been going this season, he's the 3rd best behind Duncan and Garnett. I'm interested to see if he can keep up his great play.

He's played this well for a half season before...Let's hope that the Mavs will continue to run much of the offense through him like they have in the past 3 games.

[The Miles]

In the 2002 season Dirk averaged 28 and 12 in the 13 games Fin was hurt. Dallas was also 12-1.

[FilthyFinMavs]

Originally posted by: The Miles
In the 2002 season Dirk averaged 28 and 12 in the 13 games Fin was hurt. Dallas was also 12-1.

And what teams did the Mavs face? Out of the bunch if I remember correctly the only decent team was the Pacers.

[4cwebb]

Originally posted by: DubOverdose
So far this season its something like:
1.KG
2.TD
3.Dirk
4.LBJ
5.Wade
6.AK47

I'd agree with this list at the moment, although I might throw Kobe in the mix below the top 3.

And, yes, Lebron is playing for a losing team, but think about how terrible that team would be without him? Good lord, they wouldn't have won a game yet. The same can't be said for the Mavs...

But, Dirk has been playing ridiculously well to this point...no matter when you check out a box score, it seems he has 30+ and 10+ every night, and the Mavs are playing well, so it's hard to ignore the diggler at the moment in early MVP talk.

[Murphy3]

Originally posted by: The Miles
In the 2002 season Dirk averaged 28 and 12 in the 13 games Fin was hurt. Dallas was also 12-1.

In the second half of the 2002-2003 season, Dirk averaged between 27-28 points while grabbing 11 boards a game.

[EricaLubarsky]

Originally posted by: fin4life
I wouldnt say that the cavs suck. They will make the playoffs this year and have already had some pretty good games. LeBron is gunna emerge as the superstar that he was supposed to be.... but still not better than Dirk.

that comeback victory against the then 4-0 Suns was definitely an awakening. I always thought that James was just one of those players that could put up a triple double in losses, but I was very surprised by that game. He just did everything and really made his team better.

[Rockstar]

I wouldn't say that Dirk has caught KG or TD yet.
but it is possible that Dirk could pass KG and TD

[rabbitproof]

Dirk is certainly playing as well as anybody in the league right now. In terms of league-wide respect and overall greatness, Dirk is also defintely going in KG/TD's direction but not quite there. The season is still too green. If we keep feeding him and running the offense through him, he'll be there before season's end.

When will we know he's there? When we know, without a doubt, we can take the Wolves and Spurs because our cast is as strong, or stronger, then either team.

As for topping TD/KG, Dirk would have to take it to yet another level IMO.

[Day1MavsFan]

I have a hard time saying that KG is the best player in the league. Playoffs count more than anything else, and he just hasn't been up to other player's levels in the post season. How do we arrive at "best player" in the league? Over how many years are we judging? If it's just this year, then it isn't even worth discussing.
How about a more interesting discussion: who's the best player in the playoffs over the past 3-5 years?

[4cwebb]

Originally posted by: Day1MavsFan
I have a hard time saying that KG is the best player in the league. Playoffs count more than anything else, and he just hasn't been up to other player's levels in the post season. How do we arrive at "best player" in the league? Over how many years are we judging? If it's just this year, then it isn't even worth discussing.
How about a more interesting discussion: who's the best player in the playoffs over the past 3-5 years?

Is your question based upon stats alone, or playoff success, b/c if the latter, then the only three players are worth discussing: Shaq, Kobe and Duncan...I'd probably go with Shaq in the end (since he has three Finals MVP trophies).

As for more marginal playoff success, after last season is there much difference between KG and Dirk? Does getting to the second round instead of getting ousted in the first really give one player an advantage over the other?

[Murphy3]

It's pretty easy to say that Dirk's playoff production exceeds that of KG.

[4cwebb]

Originally posted by: Murphy3
It's pretty easy to say that Dirk's playoff production exceeds that of KG.

From a purely points/rebounds perspective, yes, but was that the question? And, is playoff "success" simply making it out of the first round? Neither player has really been that deep in the playoffs other than one time to the WCF, and neither player was able to carry his team past that point (Dirk's due to injury, KG's due to Cassell's injury, possibly).

And, discussing Dirk and KG is a second-tier discussion to begin with anyway, at least when talking about team playoff success, imho.

[Murphy3]

Of course, the ultimate goal is the championship. However, there's nothing wrong with digging just a big further than that. Fans sometimes unfairly judge an individual player based upon how their team performs in the post season when it's obviously not in control of just one man. So yeah, the ultimate is to win the title, but there's nothing wrong with analyzing individual performances of certain players.

[DubOverdose]

I can't believe that as of now KG is the best player in the league. I hate saying it. I thought he had maxed out last season, and then I thought he was a tad below Duncan's level.

[4cwebb]

Originally posted by: Murphy3
Of course, the ultimate goal is the championship. However, there's nothing wrong with digging just a big further than that. Fans sometimes unfairly judge an individual player based upon how their team performs in the post season when it's obviously not in control of just one man. So yeah, the ultimate is to win the title, but there's nothing wrong with analyzing individual performances of certain players.

I agree, and as you pointed out, Dirk clearly has a statistical edge over KG, especially considering any time period other than just last year. For one thing, it took KG 7 games to bust out with 30 against CWebb on one leg --- not exactly a ringing endorsement of his offensive firepower.

And, just to be a contrarian, while games aren't just in the hands of one man, the NBA is perhaps the easiest game in which one player can dominate a single game, a playoff series, or even the entire playoffs. Hakeem's run in the mid-90s comes to mind, although his "role players" all played quite well those years.

[Murphy3]

Sure, basketball is the easiest sport to dominate in the playoffs for the most part (although a starting pitcher that might throw in games 1, 4, and 7 of a series can have as much or more say).

But, one thing.....I think we're seeing that Dirk wasn't in his prime..that perhaps he's stepping into it this year or at least taking another step up although it is too early to tell conclusively.....
Is KG in his prime? God, I hope so. Surely he can't get much better, can he?

Regardless, it'll be a great matchup for the next several years even if KG does have the edge right now. Regardelss, I'll take Dirk when the two match up against each other. Neither can stop the other, but Dirk is even more explosive offensively.

[jayC]

Do you make your teammates better? Are you a leader on the court? And third do you win?
Dirk is the most unstoppable player in the league. Except this season he has become a more complete player. KG is the most versatile defender in the league able to guard 2-5. Duncan is the most dominant in the paint and is the best post defender. And Kobe the most selfish.

Who has been the most valuable this week it has been Dirk.
That being said here are my rankings:
1) KG
2)Dirk
3)Duncan
4)Shobe Kobe
5)AK 47- at this point he might be defensive player of the year. The Jazz are one of the suprise teams in the league.

[4cwebb]

About the only left for KG to acquire is a consistent shot from the perimeter in the key area...he's pretty deadly from the baselines, but his game is lacking if he isn't attacking the basket from the wings.

The same can't be said for Dirk, as you point out. And, matching Dirk's offense against KG's defense has always come out in Dirk's favor, relatively, which I have found surprising in the past (since it'd be difficult to draw up a better physical specimen to try to guard Dirk). It's almost as if KG has become comfortable patrolling the paint, and forgets that Dirk doesn't move like most of the tall, lanky white guys he guards that play for teams other than the Mavs.

[rakesh.s]

Originally posted by: jayC
Do you make your teammates better? Are you a leader on the court? And third do you win?
Dirk is the most unstoppable player in the league. Except this season he has become a more complete player. KG is the most versatile defender in the league able to guard 2-5. Duncan is the most dominant in the paint and is the best post defender. And Kobe the most selfish.

Who has been the most valuable this week it has been Dirk.
That being said here are my rankings:
1) KG
2)Dirk
3)Duncan
4)Shobe Kobe
5)AK 47- at this point he might be defensive player of the year. The Jazz are one of the suprise teams in the league.

you're giving kobe way too much credit...he's just a scorer on a mediocre team...look at their record

they're .500 and the teams they've beaten so far are new orleans,atlanta,houston without mcgrady and the awful denver nuggets(who i thought would be great this year)

[sike]

Dirk would have to average at least 6-8 more points a game to make up for the extra 4-5 rebounds that KG and TD grab....I think Dirk is getting much closer to TD, but still has a ways to go to make up for KG's assists...
For the season thus far, hes in my top three: KG, TD, Dirk, Kobe, Lebron