Dallas Mavericks Offseason Thread - Page 101 - Dallas-Mavs.com Forums

dalmations202 · 07-07-2009, 02:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jthig32

KG is the presence sorely missing from this thread (and others).

I hope he starts posting his thoughts once a few of these moves become official.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Flacolaco

My basketball opinions are at a 2nd grade level.

I like to read what thig says and nod enthusiastically.

Quote:

Originally Posted by sike

please.

I like to poke him with a stick and watch him whimper like a beaten dog.

I totally agree with the first two quotes. (Flac, you said it, I just agreed with it...LOL)

Sike: well, let's just say it wouldn't be the same without ya.

sike · 07-07-2009, 02:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tcat075

Don't know how serious you are, but as someone who frequents basketball courts and gyms...let's just say this site is very mild.

Personally, as a drug dealer, I'm used to naughty language...so it doesn't bother me too much.

tcat075 · 07-07-2009, 02:49 PM

post #4000 in this thread

edit: damnit sike.

sike · 07-07-2009, 02:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tcat075

post #4000 in this thread

edit: damnit sike.

you just a boy...you ought not to talk like that!

tcat075 · 07-07-2009, 02:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sike

you just a boy...you ought not to talk like that!

herein lies the problem of telling my age.

sike · 07-07-2009, 02:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tcat075

herein lies the problem of telling my age.

you ought not to talk that way...you just a boy!

"herein"???

tcat075 · 07-07-2009, 03:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sike

you ought not to talk that way...you just a boy!

"herein"???

sike, there's no reason to be jealous just because I know a word you don't.

tcat075 · 07-07-2009, 03:14 PM

http://www.dallasbasketball.com/fullColumn.php?id=1810

Quote:

The DB.com Crystal Ball is afire. In recent stories we’ve guessed right on nailed Kidd staying, Cuban’s “Nuclear Winter,’’ Cristal Taylor’s background, Rodrigue Beaubois as a Thriller, Marcin Gortat as a beloved Mavs target, Dallas’ disinterest in Big Baby, Del Harris leaving Chicago, no Josh for the Wiz’ No. 5 pick, The Varejao Farce, and now, very notably, Shawn Marion for 'The Stack Chip' in Sign-and-Trade talk. (You watch, we’re gonna be right about everything from Carlos Boozer to Curtis Jerrells, too. That’s the way we roll.)

So, you naturally want to know what we think the Mavs will/should do next, right?

This might surprise you:

They absolutely, positively, cannot, should not, must not trade ... Erick Dampier.

Fast forward to around July 15. Jason Kidd and Marcin Gortat are set as Mavericks (looking solid as we write this). Let's say Ryan Hollins gets re-signed in the interim as well. The Mavs will have two centers, will have zeroed in their use for The Stack Chip, and will be solidifying the roster.

At that point, will it be time for the Mavs to actively solicit offers for Erick Dampier's expiring contract? Our surprising analysis …

We've previously alerted you to the fact that in the summer of 2010, Dampier's deal will be "Stack-like." Many fans already understand the concept, but for those who don't, here's how it works: The Mavs can currently trade Jerry Stackhouse and his $7.25M salary to another team and under the trade rules take back from them up to $9.16M in salary. When they get him, the other team can simply waive Stack and per the terms of his unusual contract, only be required to pay him $2M rather than the contractual amount of $7.25M. That would save them up to $7+M in payroll from the $9+M they sent to Dallas and perhaps just as much in luxury tax obligations. We've labeled this type of deal an "instant expiring" to highlight its desirability to a team in great need of instantly erasing payroll for budget or luxury tax reasons.

Dampier's contract next summer will be similar, and could be even more marketable than Stack's, because on Damp's there is no buyout required to waive him, and his contract will be about twice as big as Stack's is. Double the contract can equal double the savings for the other team.

But while San Antonio was able to utilize two similarly-structured but smaller "instant expiring" contracts (Oberto and Bowen) in landing Richard Jefferson, we haven't yet heard of any teams beating down the Mavs' doors offering prized talent for Stack as we had hoped. And because Dampier is already an expiring deal, and at the trade deadline will still be an expiring deal, we've been pondering whether the best route would be to go ahead and swap him as soon as any sort of an upgrade is offered, using that expiring-contract angle to get something of value sooner rather than later.

The old "bird in the hand" approach. Makes sense, yes? Well, no. Unless some team is offering a top star, the Mavs definitely need to keep Dampier this season.

Why? Because in the Summer of 2010, when there will be top free agents everywhere, Dampier's contract will have tremendous value if the Mavs want to do a Sign-and-Trade. In fact, it could be THE difference-maker in landing a superstar to play alongside (and perhaps ultimately take the baton from) Dirk, and we're calling it The Dampier Ultimate Sign-and-Trade (DUST) Chip, because once it's used, it vanishes like dust.

The DUST Chip.

Here's how it would work.

Next summer Sammy Superstar decides he wants a new team because he feels his old team will never be able to surround him with enough talent to win a title. (Did anyone read D-Wade's comments in that vein earlier this week? Has anybody been following the Chris Bosh saga?) In that summer, unlike most, there will be teams everywhere with enough cap room to give him a max contract, and his old team will know they will be losing Sammy Superstar in free agency while getting nothing back at all.

Meanwhile teams without cap room will try to woo Sammy while persuading his old team to do a Sign-and-Trade. Given the dollar volume of the Kidd and Gortat deals, if Dallas wants Sammy they will have to be one of those Sign-and-Trade teams.

In that process, teams offering Sign-and-Trades will face a huge obstacle. NBA rules require that in getting Sammy via S-and-T they will have to send the old team fairly equal salary. That matching salary may include a lot of talent, and Sammy won't want to come to a crippled team. Meanwhile, the old team won't want to accept and pay the salary for junk. Also, once they lose Sammy they might simply prefer to turn around and shop in the summer of 2010 free-agent pool, and matching salary would hinder that greatly. (For an illustration of how that works, see this summer where Orlando is losing star forward Hedo Turkoglu to free agency, yet is not willing to consider Sign-and-Trades because of the salary they'd have to add to their payroll.)

But Erick Dampier's contract – The DUST Chip -- simply erases all those problems for Dallas.

By using it for the salary match, the Mavs will not gut their team, because his "instant expiring" contract can trade-match a salary up to $16.4475M. One player and done. In addition, the old team merely waives Dampier once the trade is done and ends up with $0 added to their payroll. Dallas of course includes a sizable "tip" to the deal (such as picks and/or cash) along with the DUST, and the old team ends up netting picks and/or cash for a player they were losing anyhow, without any of the normal cap increase that accompanies sign-and-trades.

This could even be an afterthought deal. The old team sees Sammy Superstar ready to sign with another team and says to Dallas, "Hey, we're about to lose Sammy for nothing. We don't want any of the S-and-T offers we're getting. Send us That DUST Chip, and we'll help get him to Dallas."

What's in it for Sammy? A lot. In that scenario, he can be added to a Mavs team that's 100-percent intact and that can pay him significantly more money than any of those pure free-agent offers. For example, with LeBron, Wade, and Bosh, a Sign-and-Trade can be six-years and $125.1 million, while an offer from a team with cap space could only be five years and $96.1 million.

Heck, if the Mavs need him, they might even re-sign Dampier once he's been waived!

Sammy Superstar wins by getting more money and going to a better team. The old team wins by getting picks and cash instead of nothing. Dallas wins by getting Sammy and adding him to an intact team.

Everybody wins.

Thanks to the possibilities made possible by The DUST Chip … You're losing your star, and want to start over as cheaply as possible with cap space, some extra picks and some cash to rebuild with? Call Mark Cuban.

Couldn't the old team leave all their cap space intact anyhow, just by letting Sammy walk? Of course. But why turn down something for nothing, if he's walking anyhow? Let him walk to Dallas, and add some assets for your rebuilding efforts. It literally costs nothing.

Would every team with a star free agent want such a deal? Of course not. It's obvious that Sammy's old team might find a preferable Sign-and-Trade offer with sizzling talent in return. But keep in mind that Sammy will be choosing the destination, so often it's not who can offer his old team the most, but rather who can find the best way to balance the old team's interests and also those of Sammy. The DUST Chip provides just such a way.

Just as importantly, this angle wouldn't have to work on every star free agent in 2010. It only takes one. In the supply-and-demand equation, there will be lots and lots of free agents and only one DUST Chip available to be used on only one max-salary deal. If it doesn't work on Sammy, how about LeBron or Dwyane or Chris or Joe or Amare or Rajon or Paul or Kobe or LaMarcus or Rudy or Josh or Brandon or Manu or Carlos or Mehmet or Steve or Ray or Shaquille or ... Also, it doesn't have to be reserved for a totally-maxed player, it could be used on any free agent Sign-and-Trade the Mavs wanted to pursue.

Next year might not be another Summer of Nuclear Winter. But there will be plenty of products on the shelves.

How much flexibility would The DUST Chip offer? Plenty. It could be used to match a first-year salary as big as $16.4475 million. For use on a player like LeBron, Wade, or Bosh who will be eligible for deals starting at $16.569 million, it simply takes a tiny addition and the matching requirement is all done. In fact, if the Mavs sign a minimum-salary player this summer to a two-year deal with the second year non-guaranteed, there's the rest of the matching on such a player, and it's all instantly erasable.

In addition, there still remains the option for The DUST Chip to merely be one part of a Sign-and-Trade, with some valued talent also being sent by the Mavs. In such a deal, DUST is still highly advantageous, in that the other team would only need to accept whatever talent they prefer, without any extra salary landing on their payroll due to NBA mandates.

There's one other argument for waiting that can't be ignored. Dampier is still a very useful center and has a well-defined role for the Mavs, especially defensively. If he's traded, unless it's for a better defensive center, the Mavs will be pinning their hopes in the middle against the Duncans and Howards and Shaqs of the world (all of whom they've been very successful against in recent years) on the lightly-tested Gortat and perhaps Hollins. That seems foolish – especially when it’s so unnecessarily.

If there's a superstar being offered right now, and Dampier's contract needs to be part of the deal, then of course the Mavs should pull the trigger. Otherwise, let Dampier's trade value grow into The Dampier Ultimate Sign-and-Trade Chip – The DUST Chip -- for use in the free agent bonanza of 2010.

interesting.

jthig32 · 07-07-2009, 03:15 PM

With perfect timing, DLord just posted an article on Damp's contract. This was being discussed in another thread and should be continued here.

Beaten to the punch by Tcat! Well done sir!

dalmations202 · 07-07-2009, 03:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jthig32

With perfect timing, DLord just posted an article on Damp's contract. This was being discussed in another thread and should be continued here.

Beaten to the punch by Tcat! Well done sir!

I am late to the party because I was reading it over there.

I must admit..... I am more inclined to think they keep Damp around a little longer right now.

sike · 07-07-2009, 03:20 PM

great stuff. I think I still say that JJ is about as close to "Sammy Superstar" as we could get.

but would LOVE to be proven wrong.

chumdawg · 07-07-2009, 03:29 PM

I think it's a bit overly optimistic to expect all those things to fall into place. I just don't see the chances of Damp bringing back a sign-and-trade guy being all that good. Damp will be in highest demand for a team that is desperate to instantly slash a ton of *already existing* payroll so that they can join the derby next summer.

Look for guys under contract that no longer fit with their team, for whatever reason.

sefant77 · 07-07-2009, 03:37 PM

The Marion for Stack and Gortat for MLE deals become even more important because then we dont have to trade Damp this year to have a quality team...

purplefrog · 07-07-2009, 03:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sike

you just a boy...you ought not to talk like that!

"I like them French fried potaters."

dude1394 · 07-07-2009, 03:43 PM

Keeping dampier next year makes sense to me anyway. I don't feel that secure having hollins backing up the c position.

tcat075 · 07-07-2009, 04:13 PM

Beaubois has officially signed with the Mavs, according to DB.com. Not really news, though. Nobody was concerned with the money aspect of Beaubois.

GermanBlitzkrieg · 07-07-2009, 04:20 PM

OK, if I understand French at all, and I'm not sure I do, is it Boo-boy or bow-boy?

Or Boo-bow (as in "bow and arrow")?

Just want to know...

tcat075 · 07-07-2009, 04:21 PM

I think its Boo-Bwah

SMC0007 · 07-07-2009, 04:31 PM

boob wahh

TheMaverick · 07-07-2009, 04:55 PM

where has alby been?

Thespiralgoeson · 07-07-2009, 05:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sike

great stuff. I think I still say that JJ is about as close to "Sammy Superstar" as we could get.

but would LOVE to be proven wrong.

Actually, I don't think D-whistle is out of the question. Still probably a long shot though.

Zki41 · 07-07-2009, 05:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thespiralgoeson

Actually, I don't think D-whistle is out of the question. Still probably a long shot though.

If D-whistle can actually co-exist with Dallas ... I would love to help him. We could have a line up of Kidd/Wade/Howard/Dirk/Gortat (resign Howard) which would be ... amazing. We could always use our MLE that year to look for another back up center as well and then continue to "like our team." Hopefully that would render Terry obsolete and we trade him.

ShaggyDirk · 07-07-2009, 05:45 PM

I resign..

Thespiralgoeson · 07-07-2009, 06:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zki41

If D-whistle can actually co-exist with Dallas ... I would love to help him. We could have a line up of Kidd/Wade/Howard/Dirk/Gortat (resign Howard) which would be ... amazing. We could always use our MLE that year to look for another back up center as well and then continue to "like our team." Hopefully that would render Terry obsolete and we trade him.

Co-existing doesn't even enter the equation IMO. The only reason I'm calling it a long shot is because I think if Miami is looking for a S&T, other teams will offer good players and/or draft picks, as opposed to just salary relief alone.

jthig32 · 07-07-2009, 06:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thespiralgoeson

Co-existing doesn't even enter the equation IMO. The only reason I'm calling it a long shot is because I think if Miami is looking for a S&T, other teams will offer good players and/or draft picks, as opposed to just salary relief alone.

Keep in mind, as DLord has pointed out more than once, in a sign and trade, the PLAYER chooses where he goes, not the team.

Thespiralgoeson · 07-07-2009, 06:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jthig32

Keep in mind, as DLord has pointed out more than once, in a sign and trade, the PLAYER chooses where he goes, not the team.

That I did not know. Interesting. Not sure if that hurts or helps us.

iella · 07-07-2009, 06:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tcat075

Beaubois has officially signed with the Mavs, according to DB.com. Not really news, though. Nobody was concerned with the money aspect of Beaubois.

New York Times thinks it's news.

Quote:

Mavs Sign Draftee PG Beaubois

DALLAS (AP) -- Mavericks point guard Rodrigue Beaubois is jumping right into the NBA.

Beaubois, who has played professionally in France, took part in his first summer-league practice Tuesday and signed his rookie deal with the club.

As the 25th overall pick, he's slotted to receive almost $896,200 this season and $963,400 next season, with a $1.03 million option for his third year.

Beaubois actually was drafted by Oklahoma City, then was sent to Dallas for the No. 24 pick (B.J. Mullens) and a second-rounder.

Beaubois has athletic ability but is considered a raw basketball talent. Whether he's ready to back up Jason Kidd and J.J. Barea remains to be seen, but that's why he'll be part of the Mavericks' summer league team in Las Vegas.

mkat · 07-07-2009, 06:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GermanBlitzkrieg

OK, if I understand French at all, and I'm not sure I do, is it Boo-boy or bow-boy?

Or Boo-bow (as in "bow and arrow")?

Just want to know...

it should be pronounced Bo-bwah.

jthig32 · 07-07-2009, 06:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thespiralgoeson

That I did not know. Interesting. Not sure if that hurts or helps us.

Obviously the teams has to be willing. But if Wade decides he wants to be a Mavs, the Heat can either take whatever we're offering or let him walk for nothing.

Thespiralgoeson · 07-07-2009, 06:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jthig32

Obviously the teams has to be willing. But if Wade decides he wants to be a Mavs, the Heat can either take whatever we're offering or let him walk for nothing.

Right. Since we can offer Wade a max deal then it should just be a matter of whether or not any other teams can offer him both max money and the chance to win a title. I have to say I think he's as likely to land here as anywhere else. Although I think New York will probably try to court him as soon as they realize they're not getting LeBron.

mavs777 · 07-07-2009, 06:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tcat075

I am told I am a very good writer in school. I had one teacher say about one of my essays that it was senior-level writing. And I enjoy writing, and I write a lot. Heck, one reason I'm so good at writing is because I post on message boards. I probably have over 10,000 posts on various boards. Plus, I've written short stories and other stuff.

But thanks for he compliment. I try not to act like a kid, because its obxious. I think I've done a pretty good job, perhaps besides my infatuation with Gerald Green and his dunking.

seriously?

mavs777 · 07-07-2009, 06:32 PM

As long as their isn't 10 year olds here I think the profanity is obviously fine. I am pretty sure we all know what all the means and what it is meant to mean in context. Plus I am sure all the teenagers cuss at school and

Thespiralgoeson · 07-07-2009, 06:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mavs777

As long as their isn't 10 year olds here I think the profanity is obviously fine. I am pretty sure we all know what all the shit means and what it is meant to mean in context. Plus I am sure all the teenagers cuss at school and shit

Fuckin' A.

mac222b · 07-07-2009, 06:46 PM

No idea how likely or unlikely it is Wade ends up here. There are teams like GS w/talent to burn but would Wade want to go there? As with the situation w/ Kobe and the Bulls, does the "star" think he can win with the gutted team? Chicago would go hard after Wade too IMO. They have quite a bit they could offer(Noah, Hinrich or Deng, Miller expiring(?),picks) whereas we could offer J-Ho, Damp... Calathes, R.B. & picks?

DevinHarriswillstart · 07-07-2009, 06:48 PM

Is all quiet on the Brandon Bass front? I haven't heard anything about him in a while.

Underdog · 07-07-2009, 06:52 PM

My balls are sweaty!

(I makes good contributions to boards, yes?)

Thespiralgoeson · 07-07-2009, 07:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mac222b

No idea how likely or unlikely it is Wade ends up here. There are teams like GS w/talent to burn but would Wade want to go there? As with the situation w/ Kobe and the Bulls, does the "star" think he can win with the gutted team? Chicago would go hard after Wade too IMO. They have quite a bit they could offer(Noah, Hinrich or Deng, Miller expiring(?),picks) whereas we could offer J-Ho, Damp... Calathes, R.B. & picks?

Yeah, Chicago's a likely candidate too. If they don't have to give up too much in the move so that they have a good enough supporting cast around him to contend in the east, I could easily see him winding up there.

FINtastic · 07-07-2009, 07:42 PM

Man, Rose and Wade in the same backcourt would almost be unfair. That would have to be one of the most athletic backcourts ever.

MaVs 41 BaLler · 07-07-2009, 08:01 PM

With a lineup of:

Kidd
Howard
Marion
Nowitzki
Gortat

We would be pretty beast defensively and hide Dirk's weak shirt tugging defense.

sefant77 · 07-07-2009, 08:15 PM

When i heard Cuban talking about that "flexible" for 2010 i always thought about some crappy moves like 1 year deal for Kidd, no MLE signing for more than a year and not to execute the team option from Josh to get under the cap in 2010.

But after reading the Damp article i think Cubans "2010" plan was always not to try to move Dampiers contract in a trade. I also think they are targeting allready Bosh since he is from Dallas and he is able to be the after Dirk franchise player.

Bosh will walk away from Toronto for sure. There are also rumours he will walk with James to soon-Brooklyn since they can sign now 2 max players. NY is great city, Dallas is his home town. There he will be always "one of the guys helping James to get the ring the king deserves", in here he will the coming franchise player. In both teams he has great chances to compete several years for a ring. In Dallas he get more money.

So Bosh can tell the Raptors he will either go to the Nets as UFA (creating a team in the own conference the Raptors wont even slightly beat for the next 6-7 years) or they can S&T him to Dallas picking up 3 mio cash, 1-2 future draft picks and maybe a Gortat after his breakout year in Dallas (10/10 in 28-30min) giving them their future starting center beside Bargnani.

Ummm, i wanna add Bosh in 2010

PS: I do not want Wade. He and the other whistle pussy Chris Paul are the reasons i have to throw up too often in these years watching NBA and the refs.