J.J Barea Coming Back Next Season - Dallas-Mavs.com Forums

clutch#41 · 05-11-2010, 05:48 PM

http://www.dallasnews.com/sharedcont...e.4014709.html

I don't see any positives in this.he lacks defense and not only that.. what about roddyb?? idk if i can do another...

kidd/barea/roddy
Butler/Jet/

next season...what you guys think?

Maringa · 05-11-2010, 06:09 PM

It just the beginning...A panic extension of Damps contract after Haywood decides to leave, Jet's upgrade to starting role after Caron decides to leave....

ribosoma · 05-11-2010, 06:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Maringa

It just the beginning...A panic extension of Damps contract after Haywood decides to leave, Jet's upgrade to starting role after Caron decides to leave....

I can read the future, too. I see much fail for you. Go ahead and jump and get it over with.

Maringa · 05-12-2010, 08:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ribosoma

I can read the future, too. I see much fail for you. Go ahead and jump and get it over with.

LOL...I know...sometimes I get tired of my pessimism myself...oh well...Hope Mav's don't continue their trend over the last 10 years...I am hoping for something completely different.

Putting homerism aside, you got to keep in mind that if you go the the other 28 teams' messageboards, you will see identical threads like ours regarding their hopes for landing Lebron, Wade, etc...There are 28 other teams that are competing for their services...Some have better chances than others, some teams are more creative than others in making deals, and some markets are just simply more attractive than Dallas. Cuban has money, and that is just about it...If there wasn't such a thing as salary cap or collective bargaining agreements, I would be more hopeful. I just thing there are more attractive situations for Lebron, Wade, etc. than Dallas. Dallas is going to have to come up with a miracle, and quit being used as a bargaining chip (Mourning, Redd, etc...)

BGMaverick9 · 05-12-2010, 07:18 PM

http://www.dallasbasketball.com/fullColumn.php?id=3024

Quote:

DONUT 3: Those of you who don’t dig JJB: Simmer down.
Of course Dallas is picking up his option. A real live NBA rotation member who makes $1.8 mil and is expiring? What else is there to do? (And if your answer is something like, ‘I don’t care, just get rid of him!’, your Amateur GM membership card is hereby revoked.)
Do not, however, confuse "picking up his option'' with "he'll definitely be a Mav next year.'' If you know what I mean.

Underdog · 05-12-2010, 07:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BGMaverick9

http://www.dallasbasketball.com/fullColumn.php?id=3024

Yep.

mavs777 · 05-11-2010, 06:12 PM

he is here to possibly help match salaries, I highly doubt he will be a mav next year

jthig32 · 05-11-2010, 06:22 PM

No matter what you think of him, he's proven he can at least be a backup PG for 10 minutes a night. For 1.8 mil, that's a steal. There is literally no downside to exercising a 1.8 mil extension on JJB.

mavs777 · 05-11-2010, 06:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jthig32

No matter what you think of him, he's proven he can at least be a backup PG for 10 minutes a night. For 1.8 mil, that's a steal. There is literally no downside to exercising a 1.8 mil extension on JJB.

I disagree, I think he hurts teams more than he helps us

LonghornDub · 05-11-2010, 06:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mavs777

I disagree, I think he hurts teams more than he helps us

This really isn't true, but even if it was, it's also not the relevant question. The relevant question is whether there is an alternative out there who is a greater net positive (or less of a net negative) than JJB and who would cost comparable money. I'd like to know who that person is.

BGMaverick9 · 05-11-2010, 09:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LonghornDub

This really isn't true, but even if it was, it's also not the relevant question. The relevant question is whether there is an alternative out there who is a greater net positive (or less of a net negative) than JJB and who would cost comparable money. I'd like to know who that person is.

I think it still goes back to this...

grndmstr_c · 05-11-2010, 07:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jthig32

No matter what you think of him, he's proven he can at least be a backup PG for 10 minutes a night. For 1.8 mil, that's a steal. There is literally no downside to exercising a 1.8 mil extension on JJB.

How this simple and indisputable truth eludes so many in this thread is beyond me.

Thomas86 · 05-11-2010, 06:34 PM

I wouldn't be suprised if he's still traded.

Kidd Karma · 05-11-2010, 06:45 PM

In Cuban's book 1.8 million to a guy who play 10-20 minutes a night is a bargain.

clutch#41 · 05-11-2010, 06:47 PM

the money is cheap and literally to me thats all JJ Barea is worth anyways.i jus dont see this as a positive unless hes a throw-in for a starting SG!

Kidd Karma · 05-11-2010, 06:58 PM

....bargain, but for continued early exits, I'd cut ties with him. Force RC to use Roddy.

clutch#41 · 05-11-2010, 07:00 PM

ya what u think roddy is thinking right now? ima work my tail off, play in the summer league and come back next year and ride the bench again??
what does that do for his confidence?

mavsfan1000 · 05-11-2010, 07:04 PM

I already heard about this. Carlisle has different plans for Barea than Cuban does though. I wouldn't be surprised to see Barea starting if Butler leaves.

Bayliss · 05-11-2010, 07:44 PM

Quote:

How this simple and indisputable truth eludes so many in this thread is beyond me.

Because JJ Barea didn't play "just 10 minutes a night as the backup PG."

In the regular season he averaged 19.8 MPG. JJ Barea in the playoffs averaged 17.5 MPG. And yes, those 7.5-10 minutes as him being the SG next to Kidd or the PG paired with Terry is the killer.

jthig32 · 05-11-2010, 07:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bayliss

Because JJ Barea didn't play "just 10 minutes a night as the backup PG."

In the regular season he averaged 19.8 MPG. JJ Barea in the playoffs averaged 17.5 MPG. And yes, those 7.5-10 minutes as him being the SG next to Kidd or the PG paired with Terry is the killer.

You still don't let a cheap asset walk for no reason. If they're tired of the way Rick uses him, they'll trade him. And despite what some people on this board would think, there would be more than a handful of teams willing to take on JJB at 1.8 mil.

fluid.forty.one · 05-11-2010, 10:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jthig32

You still don't let a cheap asset walk for no reason. If they're tired of the way Rick uses him, they'll trade him. And despite what some people on this board would think, there would be more than a handful of teams willing to take on JJB at 1.8 mil.

There's a handful of teams that would be willing to take JJB for MORE than 1.8 mil too.

grndmstr_c · 05-11-2010, 07:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bayliss

Because JJ Barea didn't play "just 10 minutes a night as the backup PG."

In the regular season he averaged 19.8 MPG. JJ Barea in the playoffs averaged 17.5 MPG. And yes, those 7.5-10 minutes as him being the SG next to Kidd or the PG paired with Terry is the killer.

Whether it makes good asset-management sense to pick up JJB's option, and how JJB might be used next year *if* he isn't traded this summer are two completely separate issues.

AO41 · 05-11-2010, 07:51 PM

Great news

not

Bayliss · 05-11-2010, 07:51 PM

Quote:

You still don't let a cheap asset walk for no reason. If they're tired of the way Rick uses him, they'll trade him. And despite what some people on this board would think, there would be more than a handful of teams willing to take on JJB at 1.8 mil.

Hopefully there will be "a handful of teams" willing to take JJ Barea because if the Mavs use him as the SG next year like they did last year... the Mavs are already behind the 8 ball.

CadBane · 05-11-2010, 08:03 PM

JJB is NOT a good deal at any price. He's a detrimental player. Period. Other spare PGs at least don't have guaranteed flaws (lack of height and defense) that will always be exposed everytime they step on the court. I'd take guys like Marcus Banks over JJB in a heartbeat. He's simply the type of guy you do not want on your team.

Bayliss · 05-11-2010, 08:03 PM

Quote:

Whether it makes good asset-management sense to pick up JJB's option, and how JJB might be used next year *if* he isn't traded this summer are two completely separate issues.

Well, that's not what Jthig said, now was it?

He said:

Quote:

No matter what you think of him, he's proven he can at least be a backup PG for 10 minutes a night. For 1.8 mil, that's a steal. There is literally no downside to exercising a 1.8 mil extension on JJB.

So that's not a steal when you factor in that JJB is not the backup PG for the Mavs. JJB is the defacto SG on most nights. Hell, he is the SF on some nights when they go with the 3 guard lineup.

And let's not even get into the "he is what he is" and the Mavs already have a young PG/SG who can defend better than him, rebound better, and shoot better. And having JJB may definitely hamper that player's development.

So there is definitely a **downside** to JJB staying. And how this simple and indisputable truth eludes so many in this thread is beyond me.

grndmstr_c · 05-11-2010, 08:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bayliss

Well, that's not what Jthig said, now was it?

He said:

So that's not a steal when you factor in that JJB is not the backup PG for the Mavs. JJB is the defacto SG on most nights. Hell, he is the SF on some nights when they go with the 3 guard lineup.

And let's not even get into the "he is what he is" and the Mavs already have a young PG/SG who can defend better than him, rebound better, and shoot better. And having JJB may definitely hamper that player's development.

So there is definitely a **downside** to JJB staying. And how this simple and indisputable truth eludes so many in this thread is beyond me.

1) I'm well aware of what jthig said. I'm so aware of it that pretty much all I've done in this thread is argue in favor of his analysis of the Mavs decision to exercise the option on his final year

2) JJB playing 20 mpg next year would be either a failure in coaching, a failure to fill the need at SG this summer, or both. Picking up the option on his final year guarantees neither, and may prove helpful in working a trade for a deserving starter.

3) Giving an inexpensive player minutes in excess of his pay grade doesn't make that inexpensive player less of a bargain. That's just silly.

4) Booby might not be here next year.

5) JJB might stay a Maverick next year, but it'll be at least a couple months before we get any clear indications about that one way or the other. The (non)news that the Mavs are exercising the option on his contract does not qualify as a clear indication.

Usually Lurkin · 05-11-2010, 08:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by grndmstr_c

1)
3) Giving an inexpensive player minutes in excess of his pay grade doesn't make that inexpensive player less of a bargain. That's just silly..

It's all about whether you trust RC to learn from his mistakes or you think that Cuban and Donnie should be making some decisions for him. Personally, I trust RC exactly as little as Roddy played (or I mistrust RC about as much as Roddy didn't play), which is to say, not enough to get our team out of the first round.

BGMaverick9 · 05-11-2010, 08:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Usually Lurkin

It's all about whether you trust RC to learn from his mistakes or you think that Cuban and Donnie should be making some decisions for him. Personally, I trust RC exactly as little as Roddy played (or I mistrust RC about as much as Roddy didn't play), which is to say, not enough to get our team out of the first round.

Unfortunately that's a situation that nobody can answer until the ball is tipped and its time to make an actual decision.

Ultimately like grndmstr_c said, they're just covering their bases and still have flexibility.

Usually Lurkin · 05-11-2010, 08:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BGMaverick9

Ultimately like grndmstr_c said, they're just covering their bases and still have flexibility.

While Cubes has shown himself to sometimes be perhaps too flexible, RC has shown himself to be absolutely inflexible. As you said, the downside is minutes played. If Barea is on the bench next year, he won't be there enough.

BGMaverick9 · 05-11-2010, 08:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bayliss

So that's not a steal when you factor in that JJB is not the backup PG for the Mavs. JJB is the defacto SG on most nights. Hell, he is the SF on some nights when they go with the 3 guard lineup.

And let's not even get into the "he is what he is" and the Mavs already have a young PG/SG who can defend better than him, rebound better, and shoot better. And having JJB may definitely hamper that player's development.

So there is definitely a **downside** to JJB staying. And how this simple and indisputable truth eludes so many in this thread is beyond me.

The system is flawed...that's not the issue. The issue is whether it was good or bad in picking up the option. You just said he can play SG and SF as well as PG. For someone who can do that and it only costs you 1.8....
...
????

The only downside i see is from a minutes management standpoint, that's up to Rick to figure that out.

Any backup PG is going to have their flaws, when it comes down to it, whether it's right or wrong: if nothing radically stands out, you're going to go with what you know. The FO knows JJ and what he can do. It takes a lot less time dealing with him instead of having to spend the time incorporating what another PG does and if it actually meshes with your system. That is something that can easily hamper a player's development as well.

jthig32 · 05-11-2010, 08:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bayliss

So there is definitely a **downside** to JJB staying. And how this simple and indisputable truth eludes so many in this thread is beyond me.

Please point me to the post where I said there was no downside to JJB staying.

Usually Lurkin · 05-11-2010, 08:11 PM

I very much agree with Bayliss and Maringa here. And I'll add that Dirk will find a way to leave this summer.

LonghornDub · 05-11-2010, 10:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Usually Lurkin

I very much agree with Bayliss and Maringa here. And I'll add that Dirk will find a way to leave this summer.

Then I would venture to say that you are wrong on multiple counts.

mavsman · 05-11-2010, 08:33 PM

I don't like the guy at all, but I'm pretty positive that, once dealt, he'll be coming back, haunting us big time, Steve-Kerr-wise.

Usually Lurkin · 05-11-2010, 08:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mavsman

I don't like the guy at all, but I'm pretty positive that, once dealt, he'll be coming back, haunting us big time, Steve-Kerr-wise.

Ha. YEs! That's an awesome level of pessimism. I like the cut of your glib.

Bayliss · 05-11-2010, 08:44 PM

Quote:

Any backup PG is going to have their flaws, when it comes down to it, whether it's right or wrong: if nothing radically stands out, you're going to go with what you know. The FO knows JJ and what he can do. It takes a lot less time dealing with him instead of having to spend the time incorporating what another PG does and if it actually meshes with your system. That is something that can easily hamper a player's development as well.

Well, JJB radically stands out because he is the 3rd wheel in the 3 guard lineup. And that would be fine if the other two guards were great defenders and/or have size. But neither one of them do as well so it gets even more magnified.

Quote:

2) JJB playing 20 mpg next year would be either a failure in coaching, a failure to fill the need at SG this summer, or both. Picking up the option on his final year guarantees neither, and may prove helpful in working a trade for a deserving starter.

I agree that it will be a failure if he plays 20 MPG next year. Of course we all said that at the end of last year too.

Quote:

3) Giving an inexpensive player minutes in excess of his pay grade doesn't make that inexpensive player less of a bargain. That's just silly.

And just because he is cheap doesn't make him a bargain either.

Quote:

4) Booby might not be here next year.

If they trade him, the Mavs won't have to worry about PG problems because they will have attained a high quality player in return

Quote:

5) JJB might stay a Maverick next year, but it'll be at least a couple months before we get any clear indications about that one way or the other. The (non)news that the Mavs are exercising the option on his contract does not qualify as a clear indication.

But don't tell me that there isn't a "downside" to the move. There is clearly a downside to it.