2017 NBA Draft

[EricaLubarsky]

Originally Posted by DevinHarriswillstart

I'd love to have Frank, but people are going to have to be patient with him...including the coach.

Tons of articles about how the Knicks are obsessed with Frank and they have a 97.2% chance of drafting before us.

But yeah, I love the idea of Frank. I can see him playing really well with Curry. I think he may only take two seasons, particularly with how far he's come just this year alone.

I think we have one of the following drop to us and we take the one player who is there:
Fox, Smith, Ntilinka, or Monk.

Bad news? We don't get to pick which we want. Good news is that there's a great chance that one of them will be available.

[SMC0007]

Originally Posted by EricaLubarsky

Tons of articles about how the Knicks are obsessed with Frank and they have a 97.2% chance of drafting before us.

But yeah, I love the idea of Frank. I can see him playing really well with Curry. I think he may only take two seasons, particularly with how far he's come just this year alone.

I think we have one of the following drop to us and we take the one player who is there:
Fox, Smith, Ntilinka, or Monk.

Bad news? We don't get to pick which we want. Good news is that there's a great chance that one of them will be available.

Can Monk be an NBA PG? Seems fairly Roddy B-ish to me.

[saclare]

Originally Posted by SMC0007

Can Monk be an NBA PG? Seems fairly Roddy B-ish to me.

He doesn't possess the handles necessary for the NBA level, maybe not even elite college level. He's as pure a scorer in this draft, though, and I'd argue the most athletic. He's also up there in terms of shooting ability.

[DevinHarriswillstart]

Monk would have the immediate impact some of you are looking for, but he isn't going to be a superstar. But I think CJ Mcollum is certainly a comparison of his ceiling so star potential is there.

[EricaLubarsky]

Originally Posted by saclare

He doesn't possess the handles necessary for the NBA level, maybe not even elite college level. He's as pure a scorer in this draft, though, and I'd argue the most athletic. He's also up there in terms of shooting ability.

Yeah, he can't be an NBA lead guard without someone bringing it up and initiating, but he's a killer SG prospect. He's basically Tony Allen with better offense or McCollum with better defense. Great D, amazing range, and just a pure scorer in every respect.

If he fell to us, he'd put us in a bind: on one hand, he's an amazing talent and we'd have to take him, particularly if Ball, Fultz, Smith, Fox, and Ntilinka are gone. On the other, he doesn't address our primary need (PG) and plays the same position as Curry, so we'd need to make a hard decision on that.

[Underdog]

Originally Posted by EricaLubarsky

Tons of articles about how the Knicks are obsessed with Frank and they have a 97.2% chance of drafting before us.

But yeah, I love the idea of Frank. I can see him playing really well with Curry. I think he may only take two seasons, particularly with how far he's come just this year alone.

I think we have one of the following drop to us and we take the one player who is there:
Fox, Smith, Ntilinka, or Monk.

Bad news? We don't get to pick which we want. Good news is that there's a great chance that one of them will be available.

Yeah, I have the patience for Frank, but if he gets snatched up, then that definitely means someone is going to fall... Smith, Fox and Monk aren't bad consolation prizes at all.

And I agree with the above posts that Monk isn't a PG, but Curry might be (and would probably be forced to find out if we drafted Monk).

[yahyes]

Originally Posted by Underdog

Yeah, I have the patience for Frank, but if he gets snatched up, then that definitely means someone is going to fall... Smith, Fox and Monk aren't bad consolation prizes at all.

And I agree with the above posts that Monk isn't a PG, but Curry might be (and would probably be forced to find out if we drafted Monk).

Cubes... PG can be determined at the draft or free agency.

https://www.mavs.com/mavs-to-place-p...=INSIDE_REPORT

[Underdog]

Originally Posted by yahyes

Cubes... PG can be determined at the draft or free agency.

https://www.mavs.com/mavs-to-place-p...=INSIDE_REPORT

Draft, yes... Free agency? Good luck finding anyone with more upside than Yogi (and/or Curry) after Noel is maxed out. The days of veteran rentals are behind us, and big fish don't ever have as much interest in us as we have in them... Cuban is a man of desire, but desire and reality rarely align (see the last 6 seasons for reference).

[yahyes]

Originally Posted by Underdog

Draft, yes... Free agency? Good luck finding anyone with more upside than Yogi after Noel is maxed out. The days of veteran rentals are behind us, and big fish don't ever have as much interest as we have in them... Desire and reality aren't always on the same page.

Well if the talks about Ibaka are floating around then it means Mavs want to try to get into playoffs next season. Why not try to double up on a forward spot in the draft and then sign a free agent PG? Being how the draft picks end up before the Mavs pick.

[EricaLubarsky]

Originally Posted by yahyes

Well if the talks about Ibaka are floating around then it means Mavs want to try to get into playoffs next season. Why not try to double up on a forward spot in the draft and then sign a free agent PG? Being how the draft picks end up before the Mavs pick.

Why not sign a PG? Because money and facts.

Do you know our cap position?

[yahyes]

Originally Posted by EricaLubarsky

Why not sign a PG? Because money and facts.

Do you know our cap position?

Could free up some more through certain moves. While keeping most of the core from last years rookie contracts together.

[Underdog]

Originally Posted by yahyes

Could free up some more through certain moves. While keeping most of the core from last years rookie contracts together.

If by "certain moves" you mean dumping Wes for something that brings back zero salary, then yes... But good luck with all that.

[mac222b]

Originally Posted by Underdog

If by "certain moves" you mean dumping Wes for something that brings back zero salary, then yes... But good luck with all that.

Yes the dumping Wes ship may have sailed. Should have sold high when we may have gotten something of value back. After FA and some teams strike out we could feasibly move him. But with out bad salary coming back- doubtful

[mac222b]

Originally Posted by DevinHarriswillstart

Monk would have the immediate impact some of you are looking for, but he isn't going to be a superstar. But I think CJ Mcollum is certainly a comparison of his ceiling so star potential is there.

McCollum is a good offensive comp. Monk is way more athletic so the hope would have to be he works on his defense and can guard PG effectively eventually. I do think he'll be way better than the Jamal Crawford comps I've seen and could score 25+ per in a few years. If he's there take him and worry about fit later

[yahyes]

Originally Posted by Underdog

If by "certain moves" you mean dumping Wes for something that brings back zero salary, then yes... But good luck with all that.

Maybe. Or I thought moving Powell and Devin could free up the same combined.

[Underdog]

Originally Posted by yahyes

Maybe. Or I thought moving Powell and Devin could free up the same combined.

1) Devin might retire if he gets traded because he's buddies with Dirk and loves/lives in Dallas -- no reason he'd play for anyone other than GSW, CLE, SAS (none of which require his services enough to give up assets for him).

2) Devin retiring could provide cap relief to whoever trades for him, but...

3) Powell probably can't be moved on his own since he's even more overpaid than Wes, so you'd have to package him with Devin to sweeten the deal -- but Powell kills any sort of cap relief that Harris provides as a result.

Summary: trading Devin & Powell separately would be a lot harder than trading them together, but there's almost zero motivation for anyone to take them together... Not enough talent for the price, no cap relief. Trading Matthews would probably be easier (which isn't saying much).

[Bryan_Wilson]

I personally think McCollum is better than Lillard, or is going to end up being at the least. So if someone is telling me Monk is in the mold of McCollum I'm all over that. I have not watched any of his clips after Curry became a starter and was thriving though.

[Underdog]

Originally Posted by Bryan_Wilson

I personally think McCollum is better than Lillard, or is going to end up being at the least. So if someone is telling me Monk is in the mold of McCollum I'm all over that. I have not watched any of his clips after Curry became a starter and was thriving though.

I still like Smith Jr. best out of anyone who could conceivably fall to us, but if Monk's ceiling is CJ McCollum, then I'd take him without hesitation and worry about a permanent solution at PG next season (because that's what rebuilding is all about -- good teams draft for need, bad teams take the best player available... And we're not a good team right now).

[sefant77]

Do not draft Ball if we jump into the Top-3 and he is the BPA. Its not worthy.

Lavar is going to clash with Cuban over business and his stupid Big Baller Brand and he is going to clash with Rick over playing time, plays for his son etc

They just launched Lonzos first shoe. 495 Bucks. After getting a shitstorm for the price his twitter answer was:

Lavar Ball
Big Baller's loose! If you can't afford the ZO2'S, you're NOT a BIG BALLER! ��
8:44 PM - 4 May 2017

I do not want this tool anywhere near my franchise. Pick someone else

[saclare]

Originally Posted by mac222b

McCollum is a good offensive comp. Monk is way more athletic so the hope would have to be he works on his defense and can guard PG effectively eventually. I do think he'll be way better than the Jamal Crawford comps I've seen and could score 25+ per in a few years. If he's there take him and worry about fit later

This. If he is the best available player, take him.

[saclare]

Originally Posted by EricaLubarsky

Yeah, he can't be an NBA lead guard without someone bringing it up and initiating, but he's a killer SG prospect. He's basically Tony Allen with better offense or McCollum with better defense. Great D, amazing range, and just a pure scorer in every respect.

If he fell to us, he'd put us in a bind: on one hand, he's an amazing talent and we'd have to take him, particularly if Ball, Fultz, Smith, Fox, and Ntilinka are gone. On the other, he doesn't address our primary need (PG) and plays the same position as Curry, so we'd need to make a hard decision on that.

Not necessarily, IMO. You would give an extended look with Curry at the point. At worst, you have Curry as your 6th man or part of a strong bench.

[EricaLubarsky]

Originally Posted by sefant77

Do not draft Ball if we jump into the Top-3 and he is the BPA. Its not worthy.

Lavar is going to clash with Cuban over business and his stupid Big Baller Brand and he is going to clash with Rick over playing time, plays for his son etc

They just launched Lonzos first shoe. 495 Bucks. After getting a shitstorm for the price his twitter answer was:



I do not want this tool anywhere near my franchise. Pick someone else

Yeah the entire package is completely unappealing. I'd rather get a hard-working and devoted undrafted guy who is busting buns just to make the league than a cocky, whiny player with terrible baggage.

[DevinHarriswillstart]

Kenny Louis‏ @kclouis 13h13 hours ago
Replying to @SLAMonline

Nothing says "big baller" like peeling paint on concrete.

[saclare]

Originally Posted by EricaLubarsky

Yeah the entire package is completely unappealing. I'd rather get a hard-working and devoted undrafted guy who is busting buns just to make the league than a cocky, whiny player with terrible baggage.

Hmm I dunno about cocky/whiny on the player's part, though he's done nothing to stop his dad. Though it would be hard, I'd have to tell my dad to shut the hell up eventually. Absolute train wreck that is being allowed to continue. It's really sad since he is a really good player.

[saclare]

Originally Posted by DevinHarriswillstart

Kenny Louis‏ @kclouis 13h13 hours ago
Replying to @SLAMonline

Nothing says "big baller" like peeling paint on concrete.

Apparently grossed over $2MM overnight, so he should have the funds now lol

[BPo001]

Originally Posted by saclare

Apparently grossed over $2MM overnight, so he should have the funds now lol

According to who? His pops? Because if he said he made 2mil I'm calling BS.

[EricaLubarsky]

Lonzo Ball's shoes r $495/if he plays in the @NBA like he did vs. BBN De'Aaron Fox, they'll go for $4.95

@DickieV (Dick Vitale)

At $495, Lonzo Ball’s ZO2 Sneakers Have Tastemakers Saying No Thanks.

“I wouldn’t buy those,” said T.Q. Jones, who wore Nike Prestos as he waited in the consignment line.

Haitham Khan — who was rocking a Comme des Garçons hoodie, a Supreme bag and blush-colored Common Projects sneakers — made a bold statement: “I can answer your question: No one’s going to buy them.”

This conclusion matched those of industry experts, who nonetheless marveled — through laughter — at what Bob Dorfman, a sports marketing expert at Baker Street Advertising, labeled “the brazenness, the audacity, the ego” of LaVar Ball, the father.

Matt Powell, a sports industry analyst at NPD Group, estimated Big Baller Brand would sell 10,000 pairs, which he described as a “rounding error” given the 400 million pairs of shoes Nike made last year.

“If you did it in snakeskin and pixie dust, it might cost $500,” Powell added.

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/05/05/s...-zo2.html?_r=0

[DevinHarriswillstart]

Well 10k of sales would still net them 5 million. They might not be a mega company but the fact that you can still make millions off that garbage is shocking.

[saclare]

Originally Posted by BPo001

According to who? His pops? Because if he said he made 2mil I'm calling BS.

There was a report out but Darren Rovell is saying it was misleading. The total number shy of 5,000 units was apparently for all items on their site, including apparel and miscellaneous items.

[sefant77]

Originally Posted by BPo001

According to who? His pops? Because if he said he made 2mil I'm calling BS.

and create a fake hype by telling they are sold out and need 1-2 weeks delivery...

So obvious...

[EricaLubarsky]

Originally Posted by DevinHarriswillstart

Well 10k of sales would still net them 5 million. They might not be a mega company but the fact that you can still make millions off that garbage is shocking.

With design, manufacturing, and retailer share, I wouldn't be surprised if they lose at least 2 million if they only sell 10k. Designing, implementing, and starting manufacturing with something as complex as a sports sneaker can be cripplingly expensive. It's also-- as the article says-- really hard to design a modern sneaker with all of the technologies that are standard and then to find a manufacturing facility willing and able to do it. Even harder if you're ordering 10,000 instead of 500,000-1,000,000.

I can't find the article, but someone was scolding Nike for the price of their shoes after manufacturing in the third world, but they came out and said that it took them 4million to get a sneaker into production and then $45 a shoe to get them to the store and places like Footlocker take 30% for selling them. They only made about $50 on each sneaker, so had to sell 80,000 pairs of each sneaker to break even.

If that is to be believed and Ball's shoe is the same, then they'd make $350 for each shoe, but would need to sell far more than 10,000 shoes to even break even. Nike also gets a HUGE discount for bulk manufacturing. Ball may be paying $75-90 a pair to produce a smaller order, meaning that he could have to sell closer to 500,000 to a million pairs to break even.

[saclare]

Originally Posted by EricaLubarsky

With design, manufacturing, and retailer share, I wouldn't be surprised if they lose at least 2 million if they only sell 10k.

They're not doing any of that, though. It's all pre-sales, I think 6 months out.

[DevinHarriswillstart]

I actually had never watched or heard his father interviewed. Holy hell is the guy a nut job. It's one thing to read tweets or quotes, but try watching even a minute of this...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pGhEyWjnwik

[EricaLubarsky]

Originally Posted by saclare

They're not doing any of that, though. It's all pre-sales, I think 6 months out.

How do pre-sales change the equation? sure they get they money now vs. when the shoe is delivered, but if it costs $4.4 million to make a batch of 10,000 shoes and they only get 3.5 million from the sales, then they're losing money.

If they sell direct-to-consumer, then yeah they pay more for S/H, but they also don't give Footlocker their cut. It still doesn't change the fact that developing a shoe is expensive and starting production is expensive. Once you're going, your best friend is bulk and 10,000 units is minuscule when you're talking about foreign manufacturing and tariffs for importing.

Can't lie-- I still want one. Not because it will be a great shoe or because I like Ball. I want one like I want a Delorean in my garage-- just to own a catastrophic bust.

[sefant77]

Ah the only "proof" is someone posting a screenshot with the order number of #4418. Thats all. And some idiot did the math 4418x495.

But its the STORE order-#

Maybe they sold 100 sneaker and 4300 stupid shirts for 50 bucks...

[EricaLubarsky]

Draft is in 11 days.

[BPo001]

Originally Posted by EricaLubarsky

Draft is in 11 days.

The lottery is in 11 days. The draft isn't until late June.

[EricaLubarsky]

Originally Posted by BPo001

The lottery is in 11 days. The draft isn't until late June.

The lottery is in 11 days.

[Underdog]

Originally Posted by DevinHarriswillstart

I actually had never watched or heard his father interviewed. Holy hell is the guy a nut job. It's one thing to read tweets or quotes, but try watching even a minute of this...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pGhEyWjnwik

Lavar Ball for POTUS in 2020?

Originally Posted by EricaLubarsky

I want one like I want a Delorean in my garage-- just to own a catastrophic bust.

A flying Delorean, on the other hand...

[yahyes]

Could be sooner if all these series could have been sweeps.