trade dirk? - Dallas-Mavs.com Forums

aexchange · 09-25-2002, 10:53 AM

what players in the league would you trade dirk for?

duncan?
shaq?
mcgrady?
antoine walker? [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-wink.gif[/img]

i think the only player i would trade dirk for is a healthy shaq. forget showbe, forget tmac, forget the answer, gimme shaq diesel and the cleveland cavaliers, and the mavs would be your new nba champions. otherwise, dirk is untouchable.

i digress, is there anybody you would trade dirk for?

Rhylan · 09-25-2002, 10:55 AM

Duncan and Shaq, only.

Otherwise, you never trade big for small... and those are the only big guys with better talent and/or potential than Dirk.

Hoopsmeister · 09-25-2002, 11:21 AM

Shaq--though only after a thorough physical and a long conversation about his plans and goals. Dirk has another 10-15 years in the league. I'm not at all sure that Shaq is going to stay interested and willing to take the physical stress for much longer.

Duncan--I'd have to think about. Duncan is clearly better now, but Dirk still has the potential to catch him. So I would also figure in team composition. For the Mavs though, with their overall weakness down low, I would definitely take Duncan--we have guys who could take up the slack on the perimeter.

Everyone else--no. Like Rhylan said even if the player is arguably better now, I'm not sure that will be true in a few years, and none of them are 7-footers.

Base Line Guy · 09-25-2002, 11:44 AM

NO ONE! Duncan will be a FA soon, and Shaq has very limited years upcoming with the bad toe.

DIRK is KING!

BLG

DIRK BRASIL · 09-25-2002, 12:14 PM

No Way!
DIRK IS THE BEST!

irontoad · 09-25-2002, 12:59 PM

The only player worthy to trade Dirk for would be the one and only...

GREG OSTERTAG!!! Yeah baby!!

[img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-happy.gif[/img]

Evilmav2 · 09-25-2002, 01:08 PM

I think Shaq, Duncan, or Garnett would be the only guys Nelson and Cuban would ever think about, but I wouldn't want him traded for anyone...

jacktruth · 09-25-2002, 01:10 PM

At what price do you want an NBA championship?

I don't want Shaq at any price. I want to beat Shaq with a unique team of players I like. I like the Mavs because of the players. I want to see my favorite players win a championship. If we trade our favorite players, what enjoyment do we get out of a championship?

I'm not a Mark Cuban fan (although I think he is the best owner).
I'm not a "fan" of Dallas,TX (although I like it here).
I'm not a fan of the Mavs Logo (again, I like it).
I don't get significant enjoymet or monetary gain from a championship won by any of these things.

I get enjoyment from watching my favorite players win games, and eventualy win a championship.

I don't like Shaq because aside from his size, he doesn't have outstanding basketball skills. Dirk, however is an awesome, and exciting player who is not pretentious, cocky, or greedy.

I wouldn't trade Dirk for the entire Laker's squad, because as a Mavs fan, I fundamentally hate the Lakers and would get no enjoyment out of watching them play here.

Bottom line,
I don't trade Dirk for anything because he is my favorite player in the NBA.

Fidel · 09-25-2002, 01:11 PM

I wouldn´t trade him at all.
Shaq won´t be playing much more years.
Dirk will catch Duncan and be at least on the same level with him.
Anyone else: no way.

irontoad · 09-25-2002, 01:14 PM

Yeah, Dirk will definitely be at the same level with Duncan soon, I believe. If he continues to improve, he'll be much more versatile, too. (being able to hit the 3, dribble the ball the length of the court to score, etc.)

MavsManiac · 09-25-2002, 01:56 PM

I can't help sitting here reading all this Dirk talk & wondering what the Milwaukee Bucks are thinking about now, having been on the "giving up" end of a Dirk Nowitzki trade already...

Where IS Tractor Traylor playing, now, anyway?

Can't stand Shaq, can't stand Duncan, & I like the "win with YOUR players" attitude of jacktruth's

I'd like to see this team stay together & bring us more rings than the Cowboys have!!

DTL · 09-25-2002, 01:59 PM

<< The only player worthy to trade Dirk for would be the one and only...

GREG OSTERTAG!!! Yeah baby!! >>

following the principle of never trade big for small, i was thinking maybe Dirk for that really tall guy Bradley.

oh, you mean we already have him on our bench?

Base Line Guy · 09-25-2002, 02:01 PM

"F" MIL! Tractor over Dirk, I love it!

BLG

nowitzki_prophecy · 09-25-2002, 02:06 PM

i wouldnt tradem dirk for 1990 michael jordan plus 1965 "wilt the stilt" plus 1960 jerry west plus 1970 "pistol pete" plus 1980 lary and magic.
the man would be in a couple of years the best player in the league and one of the 50 best playerss ever,trade?trade?!!!!!if i hear again the word trade and one of the big three in the same sentence somebody will feel my anger!!!
dont test me aex!!!and how the fuck did you got antoine over there?!the man suck!

aexchange · 09-25-2002, 02:17 PM

<< dont test me aex!!!and how the fuck did you got antoine over there?!the man suck! >>

slow your roll big wheel.

notice the [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-wink.gif[/img] by antoine walker.

[img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif[/img]

Drbio · 09-25-2002, 02:19 PM

No way I trade Dirk for anyone in this league.

Rod1975 · 09-25-2002, 02:28 PM

word Doc

southern_sweets · 09-25-2002, 02:55 PM

No one! Dirk will be a Mav forever.

FilthyFinMavs · 09-25-2002, 02:58 PM

I love Dirk dont get me wrong but I would trade him for Shaq and Duncan anyday. I would probalyt rade him for Duncan being Duncan has the more years. Duncan does exactly what the Mavs need. Will Dirk ever get that far? I dont believe so and I hope he proves me wrong. The Dirk I see right now doesent have that one thing that u need to win a game with. Duncan and Shaq Kobe and TMAC have that. I dont trade him for a guard because we have that already.

MFFL · 09-25-2002, 03:38 PM

I'd trade Dirk for Duncan simply because Duncan can play the pivot on a regular basis. Duncan would be the 2nd best center in the league immediately and would be the best after Shaq retires. Duncan also rebounds better and is a much better defender. Dirk is a better outside shooter, but inside play is more valuable in the playoffs and Duncan has the decided edge there.

FilthyFinMavs · 09-25-2002, 04:01 PM

<< I'd trade Dirk for Duncan simply because Duncan can play the pivot on a regular basis. Duncan would be the 2nd best center in the league immediately and would be the best after Shaq retires. Duncan also rebounds better and is a much better defender. Dirk is a better outside shooter, but inside play is more valuable in the playoffs and Duncan has the decided edge there. >>

Yea I agree is there anythign u can honestly say Dirk is better than Duncan in? Other than shootin 3's?

Hoopsmeister · 09-25-2002, 04:51 PM

<< Yea I agree is there anythign u can honestly say Dirk is better than Duncan in? Other than shootin 3's? >>

Shoot free throws. Shoot the mid-range jumper (i.e., shoot, period). Ball handling--when did you ever see Duncan actually run the brake himself?

I'd trade for Duncan myself at this point because the Mavs have 2 all-star perimeter players and so can make up for the fact that from 18' out Duncan is a clear drop-off from Dirk, while from 18' in, where the Mavs are weakest, Duncan is still clearly superior to Dirk.

FilthyFinMavs · 09-25-2002, 04:55 PM

<<

<< Yea I agree is there anythign u can honestly say Dirk is better than Duncan in? Other than shootin 3's? >>

Shoot free throws. Shoot the mid-range jumper (i.e., shoot, period). Ball handling--when did you ever see Duncan actually run the brake himself?

I'd trade for Duncan myself at this point because the Mavs have 2 all-star perimeter players and so can make up for the fact that from 18' out Duncan is a clear drop-off from Dirk, while from 18' in, where the Mavs are weakest, Duncan is still clearly superior to Dirk. >>

Yea I agree and whats hwat I was trying to say. He can shoot better than Duncan but everything else I feel Duncan is superior but hey Duncan is a superstar and honestly I think he is the best player in the NBA and Shaq is the most dominate.

David · 09-25-2002, 05:17 PM

If I was Dirk, I would have someone make me a Duncan video with his entire array of inside moves, that he had when he came into the league, and perfect those moves. THEN Dirk would be the better player. Those inside moves, and they are excellent, is ALL Duncan has over Dirk. I wouldn't trade Dirk for Duncan because Dirk does some things Duncan can't and I think Dirk CAN learn to play the post like Duncan because Dirk is a student of the game and works to get better.

FilthyFinMavs · 09-25-2002, 05:28 PM

<< If I was Dirk, I would have someone make me a Duncan video with his entire array of inside moves, that he had when he came into the league, and perfect those moves. THEN Dirk would be the better player. Those inside moves, and they are excellent, is ALL Duncan has over Dirk. I wouldn't trade Dirk for Duncan because Dirk does some things Duncan can't and I think Dirk CAN learn to play the post like Duncan because Dirk is a student of the game and works to get better. >>

Gotta disagree with u there. Im not bashing Dirk but I dont think he will ever be the player Duncan is. Dirk as of right now is a better shooter than Duncan which doesnt mean much becuase Duncan can shoot the ball just as Dirk inside the 3 point line. People always talk about Dirk improvin his game but if u guys havent noticed Duncan is also improvin his. He went form a 50% free throw shooter to a 80%. And the guy just started playing ball at 18. If we have Duncan I think ther is no question that Mavs are probaly NBA champs with there roster. Right now they still have a chance but there are questions that need to be asked.

aexchange · 09-25-2002, 05:38 PM

dirk will never be the defender that duncan is, but duncan at the same time will never be the ball handler/shooter that dirk is.

can dirk pick up the low post moves that duncan has? of course. will he be as effective as duncan? eventually yes. while i dont think he would ever be as good as duncan on D, i do think he can become a servicable defender, and a mega star.

do i trade him for duncan? at this point, probably not.

Hoopsmeister · 09-25-2002, 06:32 PM

<< Gotta disagree with u there. Im not bashing Dirk but I dont think he will ever be the player Duncan is. Dirk as of right now is a better shooter than Duncan which doesnt mean much becuase Duncan can shoot the ball just as Dirk inside the 3 point line. People always talk about Dirk improvin his game but if u guys havent noticed Duncan is also improvin his. He went form a 50% free throw shooter to a 80%. And the guy just started playing ball at 18. If we have Duncan I think ther is no question that Mavs are probaly NBA champs with there roster. Right now they still have a chance but there are questions that need to be asked. >>

First, you keep saying that it is 'only' shooting and ignoring that Dirk is also a better ball-handler than Duncan. Dirk can break down guards off the dribble. He can not just run the fast break but can lead it himself. There is no other 7-footer in the league who is close to Dirk in this category and its one of the reasons he is unique.

Second, no, Duncan doesn't shoot it better than Dirk inside the 3 point line. Not even close. Duncan *does* shoot it better within 4 or 5 feet of the basket--and that is because he has such great footwork down in the paint which is what David was pointing out Dirk should study and learn. If he does, and there is no physical/talent reason he can't, then Dirk will score as well around the basket as Duncan does and continue to score better from anywhere else on the floor.

And Duncan's 'improvement' from 60% to 80% on the free throws was largely just making up ground he had lost due to some sort of psychological hump. The year before he shot 60% (the worst of his career), he shot 76%. That's why people focus on Dirk's potential more than Duncan's. The Big Fundamental's stats, skillset, etc has not changed significantly in the last 3 years (except for the one year dip in his free-throw shooting). Dirk has markedly improved all 3 years and at the Worlds looked like he had taken yet another step. Once Dirk spends a year at about the same level as the previous year, then we can talk about him plateauing and compare him to Garnett, Duncan, etc without adding potential on Dirk's side. But until that happens, the potential nod goes to Dirk over guys who have plateaud.

Chiwas · 09-25-2002, 07:15 PM

<< trade dirk? >>

NEVER.

<< what players in the league would you trade dirk for? >>

No one.

Sorry, axchange, but I think Nowitzki is glued to Dallas with epoxy.

FilthyFinMavs · 09-25-2002, 08:53 PM

True hoopmeister, but on ur team would u want the better defender and reboudner or the better ball handler? Yea he is the better ball handler but Webber is a better ball handler than both would u say that Webber is better than them? Im aware that Duncan shot 61 percent the season before and the season before that he shot 76% and he is in his 80's now. Duncan is a superstar as of right now I honestly dont think Dirk will never be better than Duncan. Its not just stats that make him betters its Duncan being a leader. Duncan leads his teams to victorys. When I watch Mavs play I see sometimes Nash leads then sometimes Finley. By the way Dirk is a small foward and Duncan is a center/power foward. What Big MAn do u know can dribble better than a small foward?

aexchange · 09-25-2002, 08:55 PM

i'm sorry FFM, but i dont think webber is a better ball handler by any means than dirk. he may look more graceful coming down the floor dribbling a ball, but he isnt a better ball handler.

grbh · 09-25-2002, 09:46 PM

I take Duncan. Don't get me wrong I love Dirk, he is a freak, but....

When they both peak here is what I see.

1. Dirk is a better shooter outside of 15 feet, and can hit the 3

2. Duncan will likely always have a better post up game. To those who argue that Dirk is learning and will get better .... that may be true but remember Duncan has the best moves in the paint of anyone in the NBA.

3. Duncan will always play better D

Dirk is great, and I hope I am wrong, but I trade Dirk for Duncan today.

FilthyFinMavs · 09-25-2002, 10:35 PM

<< I take Duncan. Don't get me wrong I love Dirk, he is a freak, but....

When they both peak here is what I see.

1. Dirk is a better shooter outside of 15 feet, and can hit the 3

2. Duncan will likely always have a better post up game. To those who argue that Dirk is learning and will get better .... that may be true but remember Duncan has the best moves in the paint of anyone in the NBA.

3. Duncan will always play better D

Dirk is great, and I hope I am wrong, but I trade Dirk for Duncan today. >>

I agree grbh this is what I was trying to say. Well I dont know I always see Webber handling good for his size. 3 big Men that coem to mind who can do it is Webber, Dirk and Duncan but hey Kings think Webber is the better player and Mavs fans think Dirk is so im not sure what to say.

David · 09-26-2002, 05:35 AM

What can Duncan add to his game that he doesn't already have? Duncan is a finished product, from what I can tell. He had four years of college and learned his craft well. I don't see Duncan becoming a three point shooter.

Dirk had NO high school ball and NO college ball. He has shown some kind of major improvement every year. I think Dirk is a work in progress. He's going to get better.

Duncan is better right now. I think Dirk can catch him. The difference is not that great.

dude1394 · 09-26-2002, 06:42 AM

I'm a huge dirk fan but I take duncan as well. Duncan took that sorry San Antonio team and just put it right on his back. He can do that right now and will get better. He doesn't need to shoot threes, he goes to the line like crazy and now hits his free throws.

Duncan is the second best player in the league and very aguably the best. If Shaq were forced to play by the rules and not allowed to bullrush everyone, duncan would easily be number 1.

Usually Lurkin · 09-26-2002, 06:47 AM

yep. trade for duncan.
but ask me again mid season.

kg_veteran · 09-26-2002, 09:07 AM

I don't trade Dirk for anyone either.

Shaq is obviously better, but like Hoopsmeister said, Dirk has 10-15 years left, and Shaq could decide to hang it up at any point.

Duncan is the only forward in the league that I can look at and say that he's better than Dirk, but like David noted, he's a finished product. Duncan's not going to get appreciably better. Dirk probably will. And even if he doesn't, I don't really like Duncan and I love Dirk, so pitch that idea out the window. [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-wink.gif[/img]

As for McGrady, Kobe, and Iverson, I suppose you could argue that any one of those guys was more talented than Dirk. But I don't think you could argue that by inserting them on to the Mavs roster and taking Dirk off that the Mavs would become a better team. In fact, I think it's obvious they would be worse. Plus, give me the freakish 7-footer over the freakish guard any day. Oh, and did I mention that I can't stand any of the three named above?

You can have who you want. Give me Dirk.

digit · 09-26-2002, 09:43 AM

Just watched an interview with Holger Geschwindner and Dirk on German TV...
The reporter asked Holger, if there is something regarding Dirk`s game one should watch out for in the upcoming season. Holger said, there is something special, but he doesn`t want to tell it, yet. He said, that Dirk is already capable of doing it, but it depends on Dirk`s trust in it to actually use it in a game......gotta be, one of the "monster moves" Dirk wanted to learn till he returns to the U.S.
Dirk said, that the upcoming training camp will consist of defense, defense, defense...

BTW Here`s a nice number...during the Worlds, Dirk shot 94%!! from the FT line in nine games...

MavsManiac · 09-26-2002, 10:26 AM

No question Duncan's a stud who can completely take over games, but the question is not who's a better player, it's who would you trade for Dirk?

Would you realistically give up a guy like Dirk who seems to be some freakish robot that Holger keeps adding parts to in the offseason for ANYONE?

Ask this question again in 5 years, when Dirk's winning MVP's & Mavs are winning Championships

Once we see what Dirk can truly evolve into, it would be absolutely crazy to even think of trading him...

Besides, it's so much more satisfying to draft a player, watch him grow & win with him than it is to constantly recreate your team just to win, mostly with guys you've been HATING on opposing teams in previous years.

Dirk_Dunking · 09-26-2002, 01:17 PM

I wouldnt trade Dirk for anybody in this league. may be DUNCAN is better right now but that doesnt really mean that DIRK cant ever be there. I know DUNCAN is really improved on his FT attempts. But look at what DIRK improved? all the places! anything u name it. HE is getting better every day. And he has some charms that no other NBA players have, let alone boring DUNCAN in this case. DIRK and DUNCAN both can do great things and that is why they are both super star of this league. only things that is lacking from DIRK's game is his defense. but in every other case, he is better than DUNCAN or atleast on te same floor.

And..most importantly, DIRK is our main integer to fuel NASH ans FIN. HE is one of our chemistry guys. Without DIRK is like going to war with a gun. YOu have soldier like NASH who can make plans and soldier like FIN who can take the slack of aggresiveness. but it all depends on the main shooter. and in our MAVS , this is no other than DIRK. I dont wanna see any other player practice 41 times before gamse in our court other than DIRK.

BUt...i respect DUNCAN..and about the best player..i think it is still KOBE.

Base Line Guy · 09-26-2002, 01:21 PM

I've changed my mind, TRADE DIRK! Do you think the Clipps would part with Boykins for Dirk straight up? I know the numbers might need to be crunched, but did you see what Boykins did to the Mantis last time he was in town?

BLG