WCF Game Four: Mavs at Thunder - Page 3 - Dallas-Mavs.com Forums

alexamenos · 05-23-2011, 11:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kirobaito

1) I'm lazy

2) Mavs game tonight

3) My boss is out sick today.

It really isn't even fair.

The bad news is I am the boss.....

true story, fifteen minutes ago I was interupted from my sports-jonesing....I'm pretty sure I gave the go ahead to a supervisor to fire somebody.

Kinda sad that somebody may lose their job because I didn't adequately consider matters in my haste to return to sports-jonesing.

Kinda sad, but f--- it.

Go Mavs!

LonghornDub · 05-23-2011, 11:49 AM

"Superior Thunder," hahahaha.

iella · 05-23-2011, 11:53 AM

Game 4 provides stiff test of OKC's resolve in playoffs

Quote:

Normally an easy interview with witty replies and an easy smile, two-time NBA scoring champion Kevin Durant wore a scowl instead. He answered questions with brief, two and three word answers and refused to elaborate on any details about what was discussed in Sunday's film session.

"We just don't want to lose," said Durant, who insists he will be the aggressor against Mavericks defenders that took the fight to him in his 7-for-22 shooting effort in Game 3.

"It's simple," Durant said. "[I've got to] be more aggressive. Be more aggressive before and after I get the ball. We've got to be first hitters. We've got to come out more aggressive no matter what. And that starts with me."

Tonight, the Thunder will be playing frustrated and desperate. Hopefully the Mavs will take advantage.

dude1394 · 05-23-2011, 11:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Folterkammer

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yX39J_YyKbs

Damn..that was nuts..

thunderfan · 05-23-2011, 12:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MascisMan

If the discrepancy is that bad it will be because the action is really fast and refs aren't perfect....according to Thunderfan

Well 200 to 1 would be a little different. I give refs the benefit of the doubt. It's not an easy job. No two games are called alike. You have to adjust to how the game is being called I think. As with anything else, you have your shady characters - ie the ref with the gambling problem, etc, but that's just life. The best team usually prevails, especially in a 7 game series. The refs will not prevent the best team from taking home a title.

iella · 05-23-2011, 12:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by thunderfan

The refs will not prevent the best team from taking home a title.

2006 Mavs say hello.

SMC0007 · 05-23-2011, 12:34 PM

Jury duty sucks!! Go Mavs! Redeem this day!

41mvp · 05-23-2011, 12:47 PM

Go Mavs!!!

MascisMan · 05-23-2011, 12:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by thunderfan

Well 200 to 1 would be a little different. I give refs the benefit of the doubt. It's not an easy job. No two games are called alike. You have to adjust to how the game is being called I think. As with anything else, you have your shady characters - ie the ref with the gambling problem, etc, but that's just life. The best team usually prevails, especially in a 7 game series. The refs will not prevent the best team from taking home a title.

What about 3 to 1? Is that different?

Kirobaito · 05-23-2011, 12:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by thunderfan

Well 200 to 1 would be a little different. I give refs the benefit of the doubt. It's not an easy job. No two games are called alike. You have to adjust to how the game is being called I think. As with anything else, you have your shady characters - ie the ref with the gambling problem, etc, but that's just life. The best team usually prevails, especially in a 7 game series. The refs will not prevent the best team from taking home a title.

You sound like someone who didn't watch much basketball before 2008.

thunderfan · 05-23-2011, 01:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MascisMan

What about 3 to 1? Is that different?

Dallas is 21st in the NBA during the regular season in FG attempts from 3-9 feet. Dallas is 28th in the NBA during the regular season in FG attemps inside 3feet. Dallas is 26th in the NBA during the regular season in FT attempts per game. Dallas is a perimeter jump shooting team. OKC generally is not a good outside jumpshooting team. As a result, they generally have to use their speed and quickness to get to the rim. The drastically different way in which these two teams play is going to lend itself to a disparity at the free throw line. How is this not obvious to anyone?

Underdog · 05-23-2011, 01:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by thunderfan

Dallas is 21st in the NBA during the regular season in FG attempts from 3-9 feet. Dallas is 28th in the NBA during the regular season in FG attemps inside 3feet. Dallas is 26th in the NBA during the regular season in FT attempts per game. Dallas is a perimeter jump shooting team. OKC generally is not a good outside jumpshooting team. As a result, they generally have to use their speed and quickness to get to the rim. The drastically different way in which these two teams play is going to lend itself to a disparity at the free throw line. How is this not obvious to anyone?

This isn't the regular season - Dallas has been attacking the paint with regularity in the playoffs, especially Dirk.

We're being aggressive, but the refs aren't rewarding us for it like they should.

thunderfan · 05-23-2011, 01:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Underdog

This isn't the regular season - Dallas has been attacking the paint with regularity in the playoffs, especially Dirk.

We're being aggressive, but the refs aren't rewarding us for it like they should.

They don't have the stats for the playoffs. I would venture to guess they are consistent with how they played in the regular season. A team doesn't play 82 games and then get to the playoffs and revamp its offense and go away from what got them to the playoffs in the first place.

Dirkadirkastan · 05-23-2011, 01:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Underdog

This isn't the regular season - Dallas has been attacking the paint with regularity in the playoffs, especially Dirk.

We're being aggressive, but the refs aren't rewarding us for it like they should.

More importantly, we've been keeping opponents off the free throw line all year.

Dirkadirkastan · 05-23-2011, 01:23 PM

I remember D. Crawford officiating Game 3 against the Spuds last year, but Game 4 was the true officiating debacle when McDyess was allowed to grope and claw and yank and shove and molest Dirk all he wanted.

Edit: I just looked it up. Turns out both Bob Delaney and Scott Foster officiated both Game 4 of that series and Game 3 of this one.

Sportstudi · 05-23-2011, 01:26 PM

Business trip is over... couldn't watch game 2 & 3, but now I'll be back on board

MascisMan · 05-23-2011, 01:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by thunderfan

Dallas is 21st in the NBA during the regular season in FG attempts from 3-9 feet. Dallas is 28th in the NBA during the regular season in FG attemps inside 3feet. Dallas is 26th in the NBA during the regular season in FT attempts per game. Dallas is a perimeter jump shooting team. OKC generally is not a good outside jumpshooting team. As a result, they generally have to use their speed and quickness to get to the rim. The drastically different way in which these two teams play is going to lend itself to a disparity at the free throw line. How is this not obvious to anyone?

Stop using rankings.

During the regular season OKC averaged 29.3 FT per game. DAL averaged 22.6. Doesn't seem like a 3:1 ratio to me.

In fact it is 1.29:1 ratio. Given this ratio (since you want to use the regular season stats to explain absurdity ) DAL should have received 28 free throws in game 3.

That is 16 more than what they "earned." If they hit 13 of the 16 we win by 19.

Just for reference, in game 1 the ratio was 1.19:1 in favor of OKC (which is right at the regular season average). Game 2 was 1.08:1 in favor of OKC. This is why people said nothing after the first 2 games and had a LOT to say after game 3.

1.19:1
1.08:1
3:1

thunderfan · 05-23-2011, 01:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MascisMan

Stop using rankings.

During the regular season OKC averaged 29.3 FT per game. DAL averaged 22.6. Doesn't seem like a 3:1 ratio to me.

In fact it is 1.29:1 ratio. Given this ratio (since you want to use the regular season stats to explain absurdity ) DAL should have received 28 free throws in game 3.

That is 16 more than what they "earned." If they hit 13 of the 16 we win by 19.

Just for reference, in game 1 the ratio was 1.19:1 in favor of OKC (which is right at the regular season average). Game 2 was 1.08:1 in favor of OKC. This is why people said nothing after the first 2 games and had a LOT to say after game 3.

1.19:1
1.08:1
3:1

It's 1 game. You need a larger sample size for statistics to have any significance. Thus, my use of the regular season - large sample size - makes the statistics more meaningful. There's always those games that are above and beyond the norm.

I'm not using rankings, I'm using statistics. You sort these statistics to see how one team ranks among its peers. This gives you an indication of the way in which a team operates on the court.

MascisMan · 05-23-2011, 01:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dirkadirkastan

I remember D. Crawford officiating Game 3 against the Spuds last year, but Game 4 was the true officiating debacle when McDyess was allowed to grope and claw and yank and shove and molest Dirk all he wanted.

Edit: I just looked it up. Turns out both Bob Delaney and Scott Foster officiated both Game 4 of that series and Game 3 of this one.

Scott Foster also officiated game 5 of OKC/DEN when OKC shot 42 free throws to DEN's 21.

thunderfan · 05-23-2011, 01:35 PM

Where are you getting 3:1? Okc took 36 to Dallas's 18 free throws in game 3, right?

MascisMan · 05-23-2011, 01:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by thunderfan

It's 1 game. You need a larger sample size for statistics to have any significance. Thus, my use of the regular season - large sample size - makes the statistics more meaningful. There's always those games that are above and beyond the norm.

I'm not using rankings, I'm using statistics. You sort these statistics to see how one team ranks among its peers. This gives you an indication of the way in which a team operates on the court.

I used the season statistics as well to prove how strange and absurd game 3 was....am I missing something? Are you saying game 3 was not abnormal?

Dirkadirkastan · 05-23-2011, 01:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by thunderfan

Where are you getting 3:1? Okc took 36 to Dallas's 18 free throws in game 3, right?

Six were off intentional fouls. Nice try.

MascisMan · 05-23-2011, 01:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by thunderfan

Where are you getting 3:1? Okc took 36 to Dallas's 18 free throws in game 3, right?

Wrong. Dallas took 12 earned free throws (the last 6 were in the last minute when OKC was forced to foul, 2 from Terry, 2 from Kidd, 2 from Dirk). The final number of 18 is inaccurately padded.

Just like how Dirk's free throw number from game 1 (that some people thought was absurd) was actually 20 (not 24). Four were given to him when OKC had to foul. So really, Dirk had 20, Durant had 19, and Westbrook had 18.

thunderfan · 05-23-2011, 01:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dirkadirkastan

Six were off intentional fouls. Nice try.

It wasn't a "try". It was a simple question. I was not thinking of the intentional fouls.

thunderfan · 05-23-2011, 01:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MascisMan

Wrong. Dallas took 12 earned free throws (the last 6 were in the last minute when OKC was forced to foul, 2 from Terry, 2 from Kidd, 2 from Dirk). The final number of 18 is inaccurately padded.

Ok, got it. Yes, Game 3 was out of the ordinary. It happens. You could say that OKC was shooting so piss poor and Dallas was pressuring them so well on the perimeter, that driving was their only option to put points on the board.

vinylstar · 05-23-2011, 01:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by alexamenos

The bad news is I am the boss.....

true story, fifteen minutes ago I was interupted from my sports-jonesing....I'm pretty sure I gave the go ahead to a supervisor to fire somebody.

Kinda sad that somebody may lose their job because I didn't adequately consider matters in my haste to return to sports-jonesing.

Kinda sad, but f--- it.

Go Mavs!

I was just let go thanks to you.

MascisMan · 05-23-2011, 01:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by thunderfan

Ok, got it. Yes, Game 3 was out of the ordinary. It happens. You could say that OKC was shooting so piss poor and Dallas was pressuring them so well on the perimeter, that driving was their only option to put points on the board.

Um, yeah, I guess that is one thing that you could say.

Rick41 · 05-23-2011, 01:44 PM

Has thunderfan realized she's on a Mavs board yet?

DirkFTW · 05-23-2011, 01:45 PM

nm, you finally figured it out.

Rick41 · 05-23-2011, 01:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by thunderfan

Dallas is 21st in the NBA during the regular season in FG attempts from 3-9 feet. Dallas is 28th in the NBA during the regular season in FG attemps inside 3feet. Dallas is 26th in the NBA during the regular season in FT attempts per game. Dallas is a perimeter jump shooting team. OKC generally is not a good outside jumpshooting team. As a result, they generally have to use their speed and quickness to get to the rim. The drastically different way in which these two teams play is going to lend itself to a disparity at the free throw line. How is this not obvious to anyone?

This is the WCF, not the regular season buddy.

You can GTFO now.

CGM · 05-23-2011, 01:48 PM

Let's cook the OKC kids as Puerto Rican blood sausages (morcillas)!

MascisMan · 05-23-2011, 01:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CGM

Let's cook the OKC kids as Puerto Rican blood sausages (morcillas)!

thats gross

thunderfan · 05-23-2011, 01:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rick41

This is the WCF, not the regular season buddy.

You can GTFO now.

I'm completely unaffected by anything anyone has to say to me. I choose not to show people that kind of disrespect. I'm sorry you have to reduce yourself to that simply because I have different viewpoints and like a different basketball team. Ignored.

MascisMan · 05-23-2011, 01:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by thunderfan

I'm completely unaffected by anything anyone has to say to me. I choose not to show people that kind of disrespect. I'm sorry you have to reduce yourself to that simply because I have different viewpoints and like a different basketball team. Ignored.

At least your post count is up now

LonghornDub · 05-23-2011, 02:00 PM

Every other post from this thunder guy is some sort of bizarre self-affirmance. Just weird stuff.

thunderfan · 05-23-2011, 02:02 PM

Well I'll let this rest. Enjoy the game.

thunderfan · 05-23-2011, 02:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LonghornDub

Every other post from this thunder guy is some sort of bizarre self-affirmance. Just weird stuff.

Hmm. I'm really really not someone that's into myself. Pretty much an anassuming, modest person. I guess I say some weird crap though, I don't know.

Mav Addict · 05-23-2011, 02:09 PM

Thunderguy sure do know how to fuck up a GDT....messed up the last GDT....out of all the threads to spew thunder nonsense in

Seriously the GDT is like contains our gameday mojo and is considered to be very sacred

Blackspider · 05-23-2011, 02:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by thunderfan

Hmm. I'm really really not someone that's into myself. Pretty much an anassuming, modest person. I guess I say some weird crap though, I don't know.

And yet you post again after saying you will let it rest. Typical troll you are.

alexamenos · 05-23-2011, 02:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by thunderpoon

Dallas is 21st in the NBA during the regular season in FG attempts from 3-9 feet. Dallas is 28th in the NBA during the regular season in FG attemps inside 3feet. Dallas is 26th in the NBA during the regular season in FT attempts per game. Dallas is a perimeter jump shooting team. OKC generally is not a good outside jumpshooting team. As a result, they generally have to use their speed and quickness to get to the rim. The drastically different way in which these two teams play is going to lend itself to a disparity at the free throw line. How is this not obvious to anyone?

Relative rankings |= raw numbers.

To the extent the regular season is at all indicative of what we might expect to find in the post-season, the ratio of fta / fga is indicative of the amount of time a team spends driving and drawing contact versus shooting pull-up jumpers. There are other factors, yes, but this is an nba fan forum and I have a full-time job where I have to pretend like I'm working.

This regular season Dallas shot 6463 field goal attempts and 1850 ftas, a ratio of .286 fta / fga; OKC shot 6656 field goals and 2401 ftas, a ratio of 0.363 ftas / fga.

Over the course of the series Dallas and OKC have shot 235 and 216 field goals, respectively. Using their regular seasons as a bench mark we'd expect Dallas and OKC to have shot 67 and 78 ft's respectively.

Let's repeat this: allowing for differences in style, one would expect the Mavs to have shot 67 fts and OKC 78 thus far in the series. In fact, the Mavs have shot 78 (+11) and the Thunder 105 (+27!!!). Advantage thunder, by 16 free throws. At any 82% free throw clip, you're talking about a 13 to 14 point advantage for the Thunder.

But wait, that's not all.....

While OKC may have been the better team at getting to the line, Dallas is actually the better team at not letting the opposition get to the line (Dallas Opposition = 0.275 ftas / fga, OKC Opposition = 0.307). At these rates we'd expect Dallas to have shot 72 free throws and OKC to have 59 -- again, the actual free throws relative to expected from regular season stats tilts substantially in the favor of OKC.

But wait! There's even more...

These teams did meet in the regular season, and while the personnel may have changed some the styles of play haven't. In three games the Mavs shot fts at a rate of 0.266 per fga and OKC shot fts at a rate of 0.291 fts per fga.

Those rates would translate to ft attempts of 63 for dallas and 63 (!) for OKC. Again, actuals in the series are a big advantage for OKC after allowing for disparities in the style of play.

So, to answer your question:

Quote:

The drastically different way in which these two teams play is going to lend itself to a disparity at the free throw line. How is this not obvious to anyone?

It is obvious that differences in style of play lead to disparities in free throw attempts. Equally obvious is that the difference is far greater than can be explained differences in playing styles. You would be able to recognize this if you weren't such an obtuse homerfied homosexualized troll.

/reshun