Dirk vs. Kobe... the playoffs - Page 4 - Dallas-Mavs.com Forums

Dark Cuban · 05-01-2011, 05:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thespiralgoeson

Nor do I have the patience for people who misinterpret a grammatically correct sentence and then purport to know something about sentence structure that the rest of us don't. I sure as hell don't have the patience for trolls who post on rival teams' message boards for no other reason than to annoy the regular posters, especially when said trolls offer no kind of intelligent debate or insight of any kind.

So since neither of us has the patience for the other, our discussion should end here. But before you enter the previously unoccupied territory that is my ignore list, let me at least bid you a proper farewell.

F*ck you and your mother and your sister. If you have kids, I hope they die in a car fire. Goodbye forever, troll.

Now that folks, is Dallas class.

C'mon man. It's a bunch of really tall millionaires in shorts and tank tops running around. It's not that serious.

As the Joker says in Batman, "Why so serious?"

And hey, isn't he your avatar?

Dark Cuban · 05-01-2011, 06:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thespiralgoeson

Nor do I have the patience for people who misinterpret a grammatically correct sentence and then purport to know something about sentence structure that the rest of us don't. I sure as hell don't have the patience for trolls who post on rival teams' message boards for no other reason than to annoy the regular posters, especially when said trolls offer no kind of intelligent debate or insight of any kind.

... and hold on there, tiger.

Did you just refer to the Mavs as a Laker "rival"? Really?

The Spurs? Yes. The Celtics. Definitely.

The Mavs? I think you're confusing "trivial" with rival.

Murphy3 · 05-01-2011, 07:22 AM

Dark Cuban, actually, Dirk's efficiency stats should SUFFER becuase he plays with an inferior lineup to Kobe. But that's not the case. Dirk is actually a more efficient scorer from 2pt, 3pt, and FT% than Kobe despite lacking the same assistance that Kobe has in LA. That's where your theory has a huge hole in it.

JeffViggiano · 05-01-2011, 09:03 AM

dirk this year will prove he is the best player in this league.go dirk go mavs

xrobx · 05-01-2011, 10:50 AM

honestly kobe doesn't even worry me. it's bynum, gasol, odom, and the other role players that i'm worried about.

nowhereman · 05-01-2011, 11:21 AM

Mavs got the best player in the series. Problem is that the Lakers have the 2nd, 3rd, and 4th best players and the better coach. Our guys better step up.

snackdaddy · 05-01-2011, 12:55 PM

Its really not fair to compare the two. Totally different types of players on different types of teams. Dirk is a much better shooter, and a lot taller. Kobe has other intangibles. Part of is persona is his personality. His value is his leadership. The way he pushes and demands more from his team. Anyone really think they win the last two titles if he was just a passive player who went about his own business? Probably not. Dirk is not that type of person. If I were to sit down and have beers with one, it would be Dirk, not Kobe. I think I would enjoy his company more. Like someone said, he's a better peson. But if I want to win a championship, I would take Kobe and not have beers with him. Sorry Dirk fans, thats just the way it is.

Murphy3 · 05-01-2011, 01:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by snackdaddy

Its really not fair to compare the two. Totally different types of players on different types of teams. Dirk is a much better shooter, and a lot taller. Kobe has other intangibles. Part of is persona is his personality. His value is his leadership. The way he pushes and demands more from his team. Anyone really think they win the last two titles if he was just a passive player who went about his own business? Probably not. Dirk is not that type of person. If I were to sit down and have beers with one, it would be Dirk, not Kobe. I think I would enjoy his company more. Like someone said, he's a better peson. But if I want to win a championship, I would take Kobe and not have beers with him. Sorry Dirk fans, thats just the way it is.

I think that if you asked the players in the Mavs clubhouse, you'd find that they consider Dirk a leader. I also think that if you asked Kobe's teammates throughout the years, you'd probably find that he's viewed as less of a leader as you're making him out to be. I'm not saying tha the's not a leader at all.. Just saying that I don't think the chasm between their leadership abilities is nearly as wide as you think.

spreedom · 05-01-2011, 02:13 PM

I love Dirk, he's my favorite NBA player of all-time, and I think he should have won the MVP this year... but that said, he isn't as good as Kobe. No way.

mac222b · 05-01-2011, 02:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Murphy3

I think that if you asked the players in the Mavs clubhouse, you'd find that they consider Dirk a leader. I also think that if you asked Kobe's teammates throughout the years, you'd probably find that he's viewed as less of a leader as you're making him out to be. I'm not saying tha the's not a leader at all.. Just saying that I don't think the chasm between their leadership abilities is nearly as wide as you think.

And also that Kobe is the kind of guy to make a big show about his "leadership", whereas Dirk is not. Kobe's the kind of guy to pat himself on the back and publicly "coach" his teammates(often leading to an uncomfortable "get me out of here" look on said teammates face as they try to walk by).

Was it after the Miami game earlier this season when he held his after game personal practice session? As i think Simmons pointed out he could've done it on the Staples practice court. But then of course some in the press dutifully reported it as "the passion of Kobe". He's a calculating child-star type twat who's every move is scripted(except for the faggot thing).

Dirk on the other hand is sincere and deferential. I suppose if Dirk had made a bigger show about destroying the Blazers after Chris Johnson's foul, whooping it up and taunting them, it may have made a Sportscenter highlight. Class and efficiency and quiet determination doesn't sell.

LonghornDub · 05-01-2011, 04:32 PM

They're dropping like flies. Love it.

mpb319 · 05-01-2011, 04:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by xrobx

honestly kobe doesn't even worry me. it's bynum, gasol, odom, and the other role players that i'm worried about.

Absolutely correct!
I actually would even lower that to Bynum and Odom.
Odom actually does a very good job defensively against Dirk because of his size and speed and he is sometimes very dominant on offense for the same reasons.

The Mavs have not had a real answer for Bynum since he has emerged.
We only advance if we can control or at least neutralize their advantages in the paint.

DaMuleRules · 05-01-2011, 08:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nowhereman

Dirk > Kobe. 5 rings mean sh*t when you can't play without Phil Jackson/Shaq/Pau and get more than 37 wins a season. Kobe = overrated trash.

So an "overrated" player scored 62 points by himself against a whole Mavs team lead by Dirk?

Logic then dictates that Dirk<than an overrated player.

I actually like Dirk. He seems like a good guy. He's a fine basketball player, just not one who has the mentality to take his skills to that next level.

You can dislike Kobe because he's a Laker or you've let the media convince you that he's a tool.

You can even be foolish enough to embarrass yourself by saying that he has no role in his success playing for the greatest and winningest franchise in US professional sports.

But you are in complete denial if you attempt to diminish his skills as an athlete or basketball player.

I know no one can be clueless enough to actually believe that Dirk is a more skilled basketball, though I can see why some would selectively ignore that knowledge to make themselves feel better about Dirk's lack of success.

Bryant's dedication to, passion for and immersion in the game of basketball clearly eclipse Dirks by magnitudes.

Kobe's killer instinct and emphasis on winning should be obvious even to those who are dedicated to not liking him personally for whatever reason "valid" or not.

Dirk's complete lack of such instinct and dedication should be obvious even to those who are Dirk's most ardent fans.

Kobe finds way to close out opponents even on his least productive of nights.

Dirk's record of disappearing when the pressure mounts even on his good nights is undeniable.

There is plenty of Mavs history against the Lakers (or other teams) in Dirk's career to make that completely clear to anyone willing to be intellectual honest.

Dirk>Kobe? No one can truly believe that, no matter how much in their heart they want to.

81 points in a singe game; multiple streaks so of 40 and 50 point games; multiple record for 3 pointers in a game or successively; highlight dunks/moves/game winners almost uncountable; Out scoring YOUR Mavs WITH Dirk over 3 quarters; Rising in the ranks of all time leading scorers; Closing on Jordan for 6 rings . . .

Anyone who says Dirk>Kobe clearly has not paid any attention to NBA basketball for the last decade and a half.

Dirkadirkastan · 05-01-2011, 08:30 PM

What a sickening display of every fallacy and misconception of both Bryant and Nowitzki that there ever was.

DaMuleRules · 05-01-2011, 08:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LonghornDub

They're dropping like flies. Love it.

I like Caron. One of my favorite former Lakers of years past. He's a friend of Kobe, and like Kobe, I was really disappointed when the Lakers traded him.

But Caron knows what's up. He knows what Kobe and the Lakers are about. He's been a part of it and seen it first hand.

He knows he's just whistling through the graveyard when it comes to talking tough about facing the Lakers.

DaMuleRules · 05-01-2011, 08:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dirkadirkastan

What a sickening display of every fallacy and misconception of both Bryant and Nowitzki that there ever was.

No misconceptions here. Just facts.

Kobe 62 - Dirk AND the Mavs 61.

Not a misocnception.

But if you have meaningful information to dispute the facts, by all means attempt to put me in my place. But breaking out ridiculous accusations of "misconceptions" in response to historically obvious observations doesn't even remotely come close to doing so. Which I am sure you realize, which explains why you didn't attempt to do otherwise.

Reading this thread it is extremely obvious that there are a lot of Mavs fans who only watch the Mavs and only the Mavs in the post season when the Mavs are in it and stop the second they are eliminated - as they routinely are.

Dirkadirkastan · 05-01-2011, 08:57 PM

Facts? One regular season game in 2005? I'm sure Josh Howard, Marquis Daniels, and Jerry Stackhouse are quaking in their boots in anticipation of having to guard Kobe in this series.

mac222b · 05-01-2011, 09:32 PM

David Thompson had 73 points in a game once.

ribosoma · 05-01-2011, 10:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dirkadirkastan

Facts? One regular season game in 2005? I'm sure Josh Howard, Marquis Daniels, and Jerry Stackhouse are quaking in their boots in anticipation of having to guard Kobe in this series.

Good God, this is genius.

chumdawg · 05-02-2011, 12:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DaMuleRules

No misconceptions here. Just facts.

Kobe 62 - Dirk AND the Mavs 61.

Not a misocnception.

But if you have meaningful information to dispute the facts, by all means attempt to put me in my place. But breaking out ridiculous accusations of "misconceptions" in response to historically obvious observations doesn't even remotely come close to doing so. Which I am sure you realize, which explains why you didn't attempt to do otherwise.

Reading this thread it is extremely obvious that there are a lot of Mavs fans who only watch the Mavs and only the Mavs in the post season when the Mavs are in it and stop the second they are eliminated - as they routinely are.

That was a hella nice game by Kobe, that one. But of course, we would be wise to look at more than just the one or two best games the player ever had.

What I would like to talk about is performance in closeout games--either way: win to advance or lose to go home. I believe that Dirk has a quite solid record in that regard. The one game that I will always remember of Kobe's--as long as we are picking just one game to talk about--would be the Game Seven against the Suns, when Kobe threw his teammates, his coaches, his fans, and the entire franchise under the bus when he refused to play.

That's an image of Kobe I'll never be able to forget. Jordan would never have done such a thing. Nor, of course, Dirk.

Kobe has done a lot of great things and deserves tremendous respect in most areas. But he's got a little too much "me" to him for my tastes.

fluid.forty.one · 05-02-2011, 01:01 AM

I'm very glad I clicked on this thread. Thank you, chum.

Mavsfan4ever · 05-02-2011, 01:13 AM

I'm a Dallas Cowboys fan and I feel the same way about Kobe as I do about Michael Irvin. I respect him as a player, but despise him as a person I feel both men are selfish greedy individuals.

nowhereman · 05-02-2011, 01:19 AM

Kobe hasn't even been the best shooting guard in the NBA for the last 5 years. Iverson, Tmac, Wade have all been better during kobe's 'prime'

twelli · 05-02-2011, 02:26 AM

Dirk is the best Mavs player ever. One of the best forwards in the history of the game. He's my hero. That's enough for me. Who cares about Kobe?

It's funny, though, that both of them seem to have a huge respect for one another. Kobe is one of the few of those superstar players who would name Dirk as one of his favorite players. Never heard that from Shaq, LeBron, Wade, Anthony or whoever else.

Murphy3 · 05-02-2011, 09:01 AM

Actually, Shaq has always said that he would absolutely love to play alongside Dirk.. And when he was available via trade from LA a few years back, he said that he had absolutely no interest in being in Dallas if Dirk had to go back to LA in the trade.

Murphy3 · 05-02-2011, 09:04 AM

I'll be honest. I don't like Kobe. I don't like him off the court. I think he can be selfish on the court at times. I think he came into this league with everything being 100% about him. With that being said, the point of starting this thread wasn't to trash what Kobe has done on the court. He has been an amazing player throughout his career. He has been great in the regular season and solid in the post season. It's just my point that Dirk's numbers are actually better almost entirely across the board in the playoffs than Kobe's. It's not a knock on Kobe. I respect him as a player. There's a very good chance that he might almost single-handedly win a game this series. The guy can be absolutely amazing. I am not going to come on this site and say anything that is not true about Kobe. I love the Mavs, but I also pride myself on my ability to tell it like it is. Kobe probably fits into the top 10 all time greatest players in the league. If Dirk wants to get into that stratosphere..well, he still has some work to do.

bobbyfg7 · 05-02-2011, 10:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DaMuleRules

No misconceptions here. Just facts.

Kobe 62 - Dirk AND the Mavs 61.

Not a misocnception.

But if you have meaningful information to dispute the facts, by all means attempt to put me in my place. But breaking out ridiculous accusations of "misconceptions" in response to historically obvious observations doesn't even remotely come close to doing so. Which I am sure you realize, which explains why you didn't attempt to do otherwise.

Reading this thread it is extremely obvious that there are a lot of Mavs fans who only watch the Mavs and only the Mavs in the post season when the Mavs are in it and stop the second they are eliminated - as they routinely are.

I love this. This wise and ever-knowing basketball analyst has graced us with a barrage of facts. Alluding that we as Mavs fans are being nothing more than homers and not even good ones. But friends, friends...do not speak ill of this obviously deranged Laker/Kobe fan. Lack of oxygen does destroy brain cells and we can all agree that it can be VERY hard to breathe inside Kobe's rear-end.

Here's some thoughts about the upcoming series: Dirk will be guarded by few All-stars. However, Kobe will have to somehow struggle to get his points against the formidable defensive efforts of Terry, Stevenson, Kidd, Marion, and *gasp* JJ Barea. And when he does score 30 points on 10 of 26 shooting we will praise him for having the will to win and going to the line and having that killer instinct. If only Dirk had such an instinct to kill. Those of us who watch ONLY Mavs games know that Dirk only has the instinct to kill those free throws in the closing seconds. Simply not enough.

Ok, I'm boring myself with the sarcasm but you get the point. Also, since you like talking about past achievements, correct me if I'm wrong, because I only watch Mavs games, but I believe Dirk made it to the Finals as the only All-Star on his team. And I believe Kobe made it to the Lottery as the only All-Star on his team.

muzak · 05-02-2011, 10:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bobbyfg7

If only Dirk had such an instinct to kill. Those of us who watch ONLY Mavs games know that Dirk only has the instinct to kill those free throws in the closing seconds. Simply not enough.

Aside from the first 2 games in Portland, in the Portland series, he did have this. And if he continues to have a killer instinct, we will beat the Lakers.

dude1394 · 05-02-2011, 11:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mac222b

David Thompson had 73 points in a game once.

David Thomson > kobe

sike · 05-02-2011, 11:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dude1394

David Thomson > kobe

Sheryl Miller once scored 105pts in a game thus Sheryl Miller Greater > Wilt > Kobe > Jordan, etc, etc.

dude1394 · 05-02-2011, 12:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sike

Sheryl Miller once scored 105pts in a game thus Sheryl Miller Greater > Wilt > Kobe > Jordan, etc, etc.

As the man said..."No misconceptions here. Just facts." Can't refute them...

sylvestian · 05-02-2011, 12:42 PM

i really think that nearly no one likes this dude 1394 guy, no matter how hard you try...

Murphy3 · 05-02-2011, 12:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sylvestian

i really think that nearly no one likes this dude 1394 guy, no matter how hard you try...

I've always enjoyed his posts...

xrobx · 05-02-2011, 01:35 PM

gary payton once had 150 points at halftime, got traded to the other team in the middle of a game, and scored 100 points for the other team in the second half for a total of 250 points. this was on mtv's rock n jock basketball but it still counts, what now bitches