Clifford Robinson to the Mavs ? - Dallas-Mavs.com Forums

aidzhsiah · 07-24-2003, 06:11 PM

I was reading Fanball and this came up :

Quote:

According to ESPN.com, the Pistons are on the verge of signing free agent center Elden Campbell to a two-year deal worth roughly $8 million. Per the report, the move could precipitate a trade of Cliff Robinson to the Mavericks in exchange for Avery Johnson. The thinking is that Robinson would be expendable and getting Johnson would free up cap room for next year.

Has anyone else heard this ? Is this for real ? And what do you all think ? Personally, I think it's a pretty decent move for the Mavs, if it happens.

FilthyFinMavs · 07-24-2003, 06:16 PM

I never did understand why did the Pistons re up on Cliff. They would've had capspace to sign a pretty good free agent this offseason instead they resigned him. For AJ I was looking for a young player who a team couldn't afford or didn't want however I think this trade is pretty good. You basically get Cliff Robinson for nothing. I don't believe AJ would've ever played a minute for the Mavs this off season.

Blonde Bomber · 07-24-2003, 06:23 PM

I agree...get Robinson here now. He game fits this offense.

CwDogg · 07-24-2003, 06:26 PM

[img]i/expressions/brokenheart.gif[/img] Oh great ,a washed up player

Blonde Bomber · 07-24-2003, 06:29 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by: CwDogg
[img]i/expressions/brokenheart.gif[/img] Oh great ,a washed up player

What kind of player do you expect for Avery Johnson?

FilthyFinMavs · 07-24-2003, 06:30 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by: CwDogg
[img]i/expressions/brokenheart.gif[/img] Oh great ,a washed up player

You wanted Jermaine O'neal or Brad Miller huh? I think in order to get those guys we might have to trade AJ and a draft pick. You get what you can get for AJ. You aren't getting a superstar for him.

Rhylan · 07-24-2003, 06:53 PM

Cliff would definitely strengthen the bench, although he doesn't fill many holes. He's only got two years left on his deal, this year just under $5m, next year just over $5m.

Either way, we're not have any shot at cap relief without a major trade, so adding a moderately priced role player doesn't bother me. He'd help our second unit offensively.

MavKikiNYC · 07-24-2003, 06:58 PM

Definitely more than Popeye.

With any luck, could be a cut above Walt.

jayC · 07-24-2003, 07:57 PM

The mavs have improved marginally with howard instead of griff, and know Robinson? instead of AJ. Yes Id do the deal. Bradley for Thomas maybe but I am not so sure I want thomas over raef.

LordOfTheMavs · 07-24-2003, 08:34 PM

In all the years that Cliff Robinson has been in the league he has been one thing and one thing only... a scorer. That guy can put up points like nobody. I don't think he can do anything else though. He would be like Walt but better. If we get him cheap, I say go for it. We are not gonna get a marquee big man, might as well keep on getting dangerous scorers. And this guy is dangerous. He can score from anywhere in any way. He's been doing it for years. He won't have any problem fitting into the system and from game one should be able to offer the team something, which is better than our FA acquisitions from last year.

JoshHoward5 · 07-24-2003, 08:37 PM

AJ for Cliff? I'd do that in a second.

FilthyFinMavs · 07-24-2003, 08:39 PM

My only problem with getting Cliff is that we trade AJ who is really our only last piece of trade bait outside of the Big 4. I want to trade AJ and trade him wisely if I plan not making any deals for the Big 4. With that being said this deal might suit me but I want to make sure no other team is willing to give up a better and younger player for AJ. I don't expect a All Star in return however I think it is a possibility we can grab a younger guy for AJ. A guy who is overpriced and is causing that team to be over the cap. Maybe throw in a pick or two with AJ.

Mavs_Rule2003 · 07-24-2003, 08:51 PM

He is just another Walt williams i would say. but loosing his touches in recent years. i like Kurt thomas deal. He has 13 PPG and 8 RPG. what we have been hoping Reaf would for us from last season. I would rather use AJ and Esh to get Kurt thomas.

Just211 · 07-24-2003, 09:14 PM

Mavs_rule, why would NYK do that deaL?

Just211 · 07-24-2003, 09:17 PM

hers' hoopshype bio on Cliff
HOOPSHYPE

apparently he can defend.

CwDogg · 07-24-2003, 09:28 PM

It's just that he's a 45% shooter who shot 39% last season. Then he shot 30% in the playoffs and added 2.6 boards in 31 min.
At age 37 I think he has officially "fell off". People complained about Horry; Cliff was worse than he was last year.

Just211 · 07-24-2003, 09:38 PM

i think he'd be nice off the bench, but i'd be hesitant using AJ's expiring contract on him. I'd explore all other options first.

LordOfTheMavs · 07-24-2003, 09:41 PM

Thanks for the stats CwDogg. I didn't realize that he has fallen off that much. I just remeber him being a pure scorer from anywhere on the court.

Chicago JK · 07-24-2003, 09:44 PM

I don't know how much he has left, but I would take him for AJ no doubt. He would probably be a nice bench player who would probably play pretty well in the Mavs high speed high octane attack.

Does anyone remember RCF beating his drum that Dirk was intimidated against Cliff during a game against the Pistons two years ago? He made this the center of his argument that Dirk can't play against physical players and can be taken out of his game. Man, I miss the good ole days of RCF[img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif[/img]

BTW, Cliffie was a second team all defensive player for at least one year...maybe 2. So the poster saying he is just a jump shooter is not correct.

uberfan · 07-24-2003, 09:46 PM

Please no, this is not a solution. Walt Williams gives us the same production without using a potential trade asset at the trade deadline in AJs contract.

Rhylan · 07-24-2003, 10:10 PM

Dayumm.. I thought he was about 34 or 35. Disregard my previous comments. I'd rather have AJ's expiring contract, too.

one long blue sock · 07-24-2003, 10:19 PM

I would trade with Detroit, is if it involved Nick and Finley, or Ben Wallace and Co.

Dooby · 07-24-2003, 10:35 PM

If you folks want Marquis Daniels, then you want AJ moved. Simple as that. AJ won't contribute more than Daniels to this team in any meaningful way on the court, get what you can and move on.

Tony tha Mavs fan · 07-25-2003, 12:03 AM

i don't know bout trading AJ for Cliff Robinson, sure Cliff Robinson is a good player, but he's really streaky, and isn't a strong rebounder. I'd rather hold on to AJ and trade him to a team who is lookin to dump contracts and get a better player in return . I wouldn't be upset at a trade like that but i think the Mavs can do better.

Tony tha Mavs fan · 07-25-2003, 12:03 AM

OOPs i double posted.

MavsFanFinley · 07-25-2003, 09:13 AM

I'm not sure what I think about the AJ/Robinson swap either. For me to like it, I think they'd have to swap NVE for Brian Grant or do the Raef for Kurt Thomas deal as well.

For those holding out for something better using AJ, have we had any takers this off season? I keep hearing that other teams would want his contract, but are we having to wait until February for those teams to come out and say so?

Stressboy · 07-25-2003, 10:19 AM

Heres the deal, if you move NVE, you have to have scoring off the bench and Cliff would provide that (if he is not finished). If you want to trade AJ for younger and bigger, you have to take someone's big contract.

Jerome Williams
One of the overpriced big guys for the Sonics.

See where I am going. All of these guys have 4-5 years starting at 5mil. Just how much are you willing to take on. If we could do the Raef/Esh or Raef/resigned Popeye for KT and Ward, then you would have 10-12 mil in expiring salaries in AJ and Ward. Then you try to get a good overpriced player like AD or Ratliff or maybe you go after a team trying to clear cap for 04.

Stressboy

FilthyFinMavs · 07-25-2003, 10:30 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by: MavsFanFinley
I'm not sure what I think about the AJ/Robinson swap either. For me to like it, I think they'd have to swap NVE for Brian Grant or do the Raef for Kurt Thomas deal as well.

For those holding out for something better using AJ, have we had any takers this off season? I keep hearing that other teams would want his contract, but are we having to wait until February for those teams to come out and say so?

I just have a strong feeling that Cub wants a stud for AJ and teams aren't biting. I'd take Jerome Williams from the Raptors for him. I'm not sure if thast the one your talking about since you said he played for the Sonics.

Bayliss · 07-25-2003, 10:40 AM

FFM, I think he means Jerome James of Seattle. That 7'1" long armed center they have.

AJ, NVE, and LaFrentz should be traded. Get Thomas and Ward from NY for LaFrentz. Trade NVE for someone that is a decent 4/5. And trade AJ for whatever you can get for him.

And before people cry about no backup pgs.... Ward and Daniels would easily fill that 20 minutes a game.

FilthyFinMavs · 07-25-2003, 10:46 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by: Bayliss
FFM, I think he means Jerome James of Seattle. That 7'1" long armed center they have.

AJ, NVE, and LaFrentz should be traded. Get Thomas and Ward from NY for LaFrentz. Trade NVE for someone that is a decent 4/5. And trade AJ for whatever you can get for him.

And before people cry about no backup pgs.... Ward and Daniels would easily fill that 20 minutes a game.

I'd hate for when the playoffs come around Nash continues his "I am tired" attitude that he has done 2 years straight and when he does it we have to bank on a undrafted rookie and Ward to take over the team. If we are trading Nick this guy better be not only young but can come in and provide. I liked Donnell Harvey at that position but I guess Mavs have no interest in him. I liked Jerome James a year ago. I thought he showed somethign against Duncan in the first round about a post season ago.

Bayliss · 07-25-2003, 10:50 AM

Quote:

I'd hate for when the playoffs come around Nash continues his "I am tired" attitude that he has done 2 years straight and when he does it we have to bank on a undrafted rookie and Ward to take over the team.

FFM. But NVE doesn't come in to relieve Nash. He comes in to play with Nash. So what does it matter if Nash is worn down? He'll still be on the court.

MavKikiNYC · 07-25-2003, 11:10 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by: Bayliss

Quote:

I'd hate for when the playoffs come around Nash continues his "I am tired" attitude that he has done 2 years straight and when he does it we have to bank on a undrafted rookie and Ward to take over the team.

FFM. But NVE doesn't come in to relieve Nash. He comes in to play with Nash. So what does it matter if Nash is worn down? He'll still be on the court.

Exactly. It's as if people think that NVE is a fallback for Nash. He's not. He's a player who's 6.1, who's being used as a shooting guard. 2 years now, and the Mavericks still don't have a backup point guard.

Maybe Daniels this year. Maybe not. Ya veremos.

FilthyFinMavs · 07-25-2003, 11:17 AM

Well what hit has to do with Nash beign worn down is lets say Nash is tired and isn't performing like he should be which happened last post season. What did the Mavs do? They subbed in Nick at the 6 minute mark for Nash. You can't depend on Nash to take you another step further in the playoffs when he isn't going to play all star caliber which we are all accustomed too. So lets say we end up with Ward. This is the guy you want to take over the game if Nash is hurt or is playing like his usual self in the playoffs? I don't.

kg_veteran · 07-25-2003, 11:19 AM

Just walking through all the moves that Bayliss suggested, assume the following:

Trade LaFrentz and Eschmeyer for Thomas and Ward
Trade Van Exel for Grant
Trade AJ for Robinson

New roster:

Grant - Bradley
Nowitzki - Thomas - Najera
Robinson - Howard
Finley - Bell
Nash - Ward - Daniels

You're shorter, but you're stronger inside than you were, by quite a bit. You're better defensively, but your bench can't score as much.

I might actually do it. I'll get back to you on that...

FilthyFinMavs · 07-25-2003, 11:27 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by: kg_veteran
Just walking through all the moves that Bayliss suggested, assume the following:

Trade LaFrentz and Eschmeyer for Thomas and Ward
Trade Van Exel for Grant
Trade AJ for Robinson

New roster:

Grant - Bradley
Nowitzki - Thomas - Najera
Robinson - Howard
Finley - Bell
Nash - Ward - Daniels

You're shorter, but you're stronger inside than you were, by quite a bit. You're better defensively, but your bench can't score as much.

I might actually do it. I'll get back to you on that...

And we aren't even sure abuot resigning Bell. We get better with a bunch of 30 year old guys and we know they aren't going to play 40 minutes a night so who is going to back these guys up? The roster isn't to bad though my only fault is having to deal with Ward as Nash's savior in the playoffs. That is not going to cut it. To be honest this roster looks like a poor attempt of trying to compete with West teams. It looks as if the Mavs just tryed to do something just to see new faces in town.

Murphy3 · 07-26-2003, 02:02 AM

why in the hell do i hear crap about it being the "big 4"
if anyone's buying into that crap, we're in for a long season

JDA · 07-26-2003, 04:16 AM

AUBURN HILLS, Mich. -- Elden Campbell will become a Detroit Piston, the Detroit News reported on its Web site Friday night.

Pistons spokesman Matt Dobek said the team would hold a news conference Saturday to announce the signing of a free agent, but he would not confirm or deny the player to be introduced was Campbell.

Campbell has averaged 11 points, 6.2 rebounds and 1.7 blocks over his 13-year career, which included an appearance in the 1991 NBA finals as a member of the Los Angeles Lakers.

The 7-foot, 280-pound center averaged 6.1 points and 3.2 rebounds playing for Seattle and New Orleans last season. He scored 14 points and grabbed seven rebounds per game in New Orleans during the 2001-02 season.

Campbell would provide Detroit with more options in its frontcourt, which includes Ben Wallace, Mehmet Okur, Cliff Robinson, Zeljko Rebraca and Darko Milicic, the second pick overall in June's NBA draft.

ESPN-Link

It looks like the Mavs are going to have to make a trade if they want to get the big man they need. I don't think AJ is really going to get the Mavs a quality big man. I think they will have to trade Fin, Nash or NVE. Even if they want to trade one of those three, most GM's don't want to trade small for BIG. As of right now I'd rate the West as follows: Lakers, San Antonio, Kings, Wolves, Mavs, Phoenix, Portland, G.S. or Houston.

JoshHoward5 · 07-26-2003, 10:22 AM

We need someone bigger than Cliff if we are going to trade. Although AJ for Cliff would be a great trade.